I took it for what my doctor called situational depression after my mom died. I was a young mom so it was not age related loss of good chemicals but the result of the chemical loss is the same regardless. I found it very helpful and had no negative side effects. It's not instantaneous as I'm sure you know, and there are ways to be pro-active and help the medicine do its work. All the typical things that relate to good mental/physical health - diet, exercise, involvement with friends, helping others, spirituality in whatever way is meaningful to you, good sleep habits etc. work hand in hand with the medicine. Whether it's situational, age related, or whatever, combining meds with therapy is a good thing IMO. It can help you sort out things you may not even realize need to be sorted out.

Patty, if your doctor in whom you have confidence prescribes a medication, you should take it, and unless your daughter is also a qualified MD I would not reduce the prescription dose on her recommendation.

I took it for a couple of years; prescribed to help with "willpower for weight loss." Decent drug -- had no problem with it. Did not affect libido.

I'm not a doctor.

However, I think you're instincts are right. I'm am very nervous about "brain drugs" as I call them as they often have very negative side effects including suicide. (Full disclosure, my father committed suicide during the time they were adjusting his brain drugs.) They also don't know the long term effects as they simply haven't been around long enough to know. There are also doctors who are psychiatrists who are very concerned about medical doctors not trained in psychiatry who unnecessarily prescribe this stuff to little benefit but with exposure to risks. I'm linking to a summary on the Dr. Oz show on this.

Especially if I were having only mild symptoms of depression, I would not start with "brain drugs". Instead I would try other approaches first that have proven positive effects with little/no/beneficial side effects, such as:

• repetitive motion exercise such as jogging seems to relieve depression. See this article

• yoga. See this article

• meditation. Seethis article

• sleep. Make sure you are getting complete and restful sleep. See this article on sleep deprivation and depression.

• diet. Make sure you are getting adequate protein and a balance of fats in your diet as the feel good chemicals in your body are made up of fats. See this article

• same time each year? If you are getting the blahs at the same time each year, you may have SAD or seasonal affective disorder which can be cured by exposure to full spectrum light each day. See this article

• start a gratitude journal. Expressing gratitude each day has been shown to alleviate depression. See this article.

• check your thyroid and vit d and vit b levels. See this article on thyroid and this article on Vit D and this article on Vit B 12 and folate

• eliminate wheat. Celiac and gluten have been linked to depression. See this article.

If none of these approaches help, or if your symptoms worsen despite your efforts, the brain drugs will still be there. But the above recommendations are good for your overall health anyway, so it can't hurt to try.

Here is a link that might be useful: Dr. Oz panel on antidepressants

Wow annie. Thanks for taking the time to make that very comprehensive list.

I've also had age related depression the last couple of years. My husband found a study done by a local researcher on this phenomenon and the drug he suggested was Welbrutin. Although like Annie, he suggested you try non-medication alternatives first (and was in fact doing the next stage of his research into finding a non drug solution).

My doctor prescribed fluoxetine (prozac?) at half the usual lowest dose (10 mg). I only take it 10 days before my period as I was getting worse mood swings as I got older. The effect seems to last even after I stop it. It also helps with sleep. I've noticed that it doesn't just help me control my mood swings, but has helped to lift me out of the funk, so that I can do more to even further improve my mental health. I now have the motivation to exercise, eat better, etc.

I tried most of what Annie listed above, plus more (turmeric, calcium/mag, self hypnosis, mediation, etc.). But I am really happy I took the risk and tried the drugs (I am usually the sort of person who thinks twice before taking any pills - even tylenol). I know it's not for everyone, and I've also lost a good friend who was trying new brain drugs and committed suicide, so don't want to downplay that aspect at all.

One other thought is to have your doctor check your thyroid. That is part of the regular blood tests my doctor runs every year-lo and behold, my numbers this time were high which meant my thyroid was low (yes, that is right-ha). He has started me on the lowest dose and we will tweak as necessary until it is right. I seem to be feeling a little better, with a little less tiredness, less "blah" feeling, and more ready to actually get off my duff and do something. I figure if the minimum doasge helps, then once the dosage is at a perfect level, I will be back to my old self (too bad it isn't as easy fixing these creaky knees and lousy eyes). Worth checking if you haven't already done so.

I also agree that you either take meds as prescribed or don't take them. If you aren't comfortable with taking them, talk to your doc.

Whatever you do, hope you start feeling better. I know how awful it is to feel like that.

Regarding the suicides while on "brain" drugs, one must keep in mind that there were issues present that make the MD prescribe the meds. Unfortunately, the patient might have committed suicide without the drugs as well.

As with many of these meds, one must take them consistently and for a period of time for them to be therapeutic.

If you choose to take the drug, you should be familiar with the side effects, especially those that require medical attention.

From drugs.com:
If any of the following side effects occur while taking bupropion, check with your doctor immediately:

More common
Anxiety
dry mouth
hyperventilation
irregular heartbeats
irritability
restlessness
shaking
shortness of breath
trouble sleeping

Less common
Buzzing or ringing in the ears
headache (severe)
skin rash, hives, or itching

Rare
Confusion
fainting
false beliefs that cannot be changed by facts
having extreme distrust of people
seeing, hearing, or feeling things that are not there
seizures (convulsions)
trouble concentrating

Incidence not known
Actions that are out of control
anger
assaulting others
attacking others
being aggressive
being impulsive
chest pain or discomfort
fast or pounding heartbeat
force
inability to sit still
need to keep moving
sweating
talking, feeling, or acting with excitement

Some bupropion side effects may not need any medical attention. As your body gets used to the medicine these side effects may disappear. Your health care professional may be able to help you prevent or reduce these side effects, but do check with them if any of the following side effects continue, or if you are concerned about them:

More common
Abdominal or stomach pain
constipation
decrease in appetite
dizziness
increased sweating
trembling
weight loss (unusual)

Less common
Blurred vision
change in sense of taste
drowsiness
frequent need to urinate
sore throat
unusual feeling of wellbeing

Also, from RXList,
Wellbutrin FDA Prescribing Information

SIDE EFFECTS

The following adverse reactions are discussed in greater detail in other sections of the labeling:

Suicidal thoughts and behaviors in adolescents and young adults [see BOXED WARNING and WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]
Neuropsychiatric symptoms and suicide risk in smoking cessation treatment [see BOXED WARNING and WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]
Seizure [see WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]
Hypertension [see WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]
Activation of mania or hypomania [see WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]
Psychosis and other neuropsychiatric reactions [see WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]
Hypersensitivity reactions [see WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]

I've linked the RX list website below

Here is a link that might be useful: Wellbutrin side effects

This post was edited by AnnieDeighnaugh on Tue, Oct 7, 14 at 22:29

Something that has really helped me with mood issues is fish oil. When I don't take it I can get really down, but feel much better when I take it again. I first noticed the effect a few years ago when I started taking it for general health reasons. After about a week I realized that I had been in a really good mood. I realized that it corresponded to when I started taking the fish oil, so I googled fish oil + mood and found that there have been several studies pointing to it being a mood booster. I don't think that it was a placebo effect because I wasn't looking for an increase in mood when I started taking it.

I recently had to stop it for a couple of weeks prior to a medical procedure (fish oil is a blood thinner), and I was really down in the dumps. As soon as I got back on the fish oil I felt much better and had more energy.

What I learned is that you want to get a minimum of 1000 mg of EPA. I buy the Nature's Bounty brand at Costco which has 647 mg of EPA per capsule, so only two are needed per day.

I don't know anything about the Welbutrin, but I was going to mention fish oil too. Terriks is right about the 1000 mg. I take Nutrigold Triple Strength Omega 3 Gold. It's IFOS 5-star certified. 1250 mg fish oil with 1000 mg EPA +DHA per softgel.

Here is a link that might be useful: Nutrigold

Hi Pattycakes,
I am on Welbutrin and have been for at least 5 years. You are wise to be careful about taking an antidepressant. On the other hand, if you just can't shake it after doing the great suggestions above; (They are really spot-on) don't feel bad about useing it. I thank God that these meds are out there. Without them, I would have no life at all.
Depression runs in my family, and I seem to have been hit hard. Before I finally contacted my Dr. , I "lost" almost 2 years to depression. When it finally got to the point to where I couldn't even drag myself out of bed, I finally sought help. Prozac was about the only thing out there at the time. Thankfully it did help me very much. After about a year, I stopped taking the Prozac.( with dr.supervision). I was ok for a year or so and then it returned. That's been the pattern for the past 25-30 years. I'm not saying it will go the same with you. In fact, it's very unlikely. I can only share how it was for me.
As far as side effects, I don't notice any anymore. But, both times that I began taking Welbutrin, I did have a few. They lasted about 3 weeks, and I also started feeling my depression lift at about 3 weeks. During the first few weeks I had a strange headache. Not very painful, just this weird annoying feeling. My ears also rang. I needed to urinate more often, especially the first few hours after taking it. I had increased sweating as well. I felt a little edgy, or would up, very similar to drinking too much coffee. I had some insomnia for the first week. It sounds like that shouldn't be a big issue for you, as you are just prescribed 150mg/day.(in the AM, I'm guessing). I am taking 150 sustained release twice a day. My side effects are gone now, and it has helped me very much. Oh I forgot, I lost my appitite for the first few weeks as well.
I hope this helps a little. Only you and your Dr. can decide if the benifits outweigh the risks. Remember, it will get better. Sometimes on its own and sometimes with meds, but it won't last forever. I'll pray for you. Elizabeth

I take 150 every morning for the last few years. I have no side affects. If I am reading correctly you broke the pill in 4 parts and took 1/4 ? I don't think that is useful.
I come from a long line of people suffering from depression. My grandmother almost never left the house. My dad slept away the hours when he was home. My first cousin, not medicated attempted suicide last spring. And more.
I wish my grandparents and aunts and uncles had anti depressants. They would have had happier lives.
Be careful and pay attention to possible side affects.
Good luck. Life is much better without the monster hanging over you.

If it is xl or sr, which it probably is..take the pill whole. Don't cut it.

Take it in the morning because it does have a bit of an energizing effect. After 3pm or so it could interfere with your sleep.

It is a good drug. Trust your Dr. On this one not your daughter.

Take the pill whole, every day and see how you feel in a couple of weeks.

Read the side effect profile and call the office if you notice the more serious side effects.

You have gotten great advice. I think life is too short to be unhappy if it can be fixed! But like you, I am apprehensive taking medicine like that. My blood work was tested and I came back low in B12 and D which I started supplementing.
In addition to those supplements, I used a book called the Mood Cure. I had symptoms similar to yours, but not as severe. You basically take a quiz and then it recommends supplements after it determines your need. My supplements are mainly amino acids, less carbs, and fish oil. When I am consistent with it I do feel a lot better.
Here is the link if you are interested.

Here is a link that might be useful: The Mood Cure

Something to consider when reviewing a medicine's side effects...

I am in a Phase III clinical trial for a substance to help suffers of Huntington's Disease. I am to report everything that happens to me during the two year period I am involved with this. If I can't sleep; if I sleep too much; if I fall and break my leg, etc.

The doctor said that is why medicines have so many, and often contradicting, side effects. Because they are required to report everything that happens to people who take the drugs during the initial trials. So with what I'm taking, it could possibly say side effects are insomnia, sleepiness, or balance issues.

Knowing what possible side effects are is important but can't be taken as gospel.

Although I don't know you, I am sure you and your doctor did not immediately jump to medication as the solution to your problems. While everyone's advice is well meaning, exercise and diet and all the other non-medical approaches can't solve everything.

I started having anxiety attacks out of the blue last year. To make a long story short, I came to realize that they were tied to my monthly cycle because the worst ones happened when I had PMS. I felt like I was going to pass out and/or die at times. I even went to the ER after calling the doctor with my symptoms, and I was treated as a potential heart attack patient. I think the anxiety attacks are related to perimenopause because they seem to follow a cycle and I never had the problem prior to this stage. I went on a low dose of Celexa and it made a world of difference with no side effects at all. I hated the idea of being on mind-altering medication, but the alternative was feeling miserable (the worst panic attacks were during a certain time of the month, but I was having smaller attacks almost daily).

I know a couple of people who have taken Wellbutrin without any side effects, FWIW.

patty_cakes - In the fish oil thread, there is some info about fish oil and depression. My daughter takes it for adhd and pms but the name of the supplement she uses is Omega 3 mood. It has nothing in it except fish oil but it supposedly has the optimum EPA to DHA ratio for mood.

Here is a link that might be useful: Omega 3 mood

I can't thank you guys enough for your opinions, sites for fact finding, alternative mood elevators, etc., etc., etc.! I had already read several sites re:side effects, and heard of the fish oil theory. As I said in my opening thread, it's the lack of motivation, and don't have the typical symptoms of someone in a depression~crying, sleeping, lack of appetite~ but want to feel that zest for life and living which seems to have been lost. As the dr said, depression can take many forms, and could or could not be from a chemical imbalance, and am willing to take a drug if it can hopefully push me back to the land of wanting to do the things I want to do, and be excited about doing them. FYI, I took the second 1/4 of the pill today. I'm using my own rationalization of:the smaller the dosage, the less side effects, and don't have expectations of feeling a change~I 'have chosen' to get the drug in my system, gradually, rather than one big dose. My depression isn't major, and I look at it as being 'out of sorts' and needing a jump start.

I've not become housebound, enjoy the company of friends/family, have vacationed in Richmond, New York, Charleston, New Orleans from May until August, and just returned from a 21 day vacation in Illinois with my best friend of 50+Years. I was feeling 'in the funk' before I left, but when you're away from home it's all fun. I was actually excited to be getting back home when all the trips were over since I 'had plans' to do the things that needed doing. I seemed to fall right back into my rut, doing my day to day stuff, grocery shopping, visiting friends/ family, my life as I knew it, and watching way too much TV!

At 72, I feel I still have a lot of life to live as my energy level hasn't taken a nose dive. The only downfall is the lack of ambition , if you will.

From your description, it sounds a lot like boredom vs. depression. The funk you're feeling may just be a sign for you that you are not on the right path. You do have a lot to give, and maybe the ambition to do stuff would come if you had passion for the stuff you were doing...like traveling. (I find it hard to get passionate about laundry or grocery shopping!) Time to reach out to something different for yourself while you're not traveling....book club? volunteer activity? audit a course?

And, turn off the TV...nothing can sap energy faster than too much screen time...

And perhaps a more disciplined lifestyle would be helpful. I know DH is very disciplined about going to the gym 5 days a week and it has added much needed structure to his life. There is evidence that people with more self-discipline are happier than those without. I find that when I add more discipline to one area of my life, I find it reaches out into all areas of my life to beneficial effect.

I do disagree with taking the very small dose of the drug. It may be exposing you to some side effects with no beneficial effect at all. Before doing that, I would talk to the doc again as you are clearly uncomfortable with the drug treatment...either decide that you are not ready to try the drug, or if you are going to do it, do it properly so you have the best chance of improvement from it.

Here is a link that might be useful: discipline and happiness

A depression treatment I forgot to add to the list...probiotics. They have started looking at the impact of probiotics on the brain and there are some important positive effects.

Here is a link that might be useful: Probiotics

If you don't take the full dosage prescribed you will never get the actual loading dose in your system because of its half life. Those drugs take weeks and weeks to manifest the full benefit of that prescribed dose. There's really no point taking three quarters less than the therapeutic dose as it will not ever be actually therapeutic in the way intended. It's chemistry, not ethics.

Most of the time Wellbutrin is prescribed in the extended release form. Extended release medications (of any type) are not to be chewed, crushed, or cut.

Patty-I saw this on the NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness) website yesterday, and thought it might be of use to you.

Here is a link that might be useful: Depression Screening

Annie, really??? I'll go back and read. I'm still doing the Krill oil, too. Re:your previous post, yep boredom can be a real life sucker. It's just getting up the anticipation to do anything. I've done a bit of volunteering at a feline facility in the past, and emotionally I couldn't take it. I DO need more discipline, so that 's been my first step, and more exercise!

Kswl, believe it or not, with the small amount I'm taking I've had a bit of anxiety, one of the side effects. I hadn't experienced that before I started the meds. I've found I'm very susceptible to these type of drugs. My husband was killed in a car accident when I was 27 and left with 3 little ones. I sunk so low I never thought I would see the light of day. Maybe I have a predisposition, but the dr didn't give an indication that was the case. Back then there weren't many medications, and the ones prescribed made me worse. It took awhile, but amatryptline(sp)finally worked in a miniscule dosage.

Red, mine are not time released, but that's what
DD takes. If I continue with the medication, I may talk to my dr about it.

Thank you Anna. I took the test and 'my symptoms are not consistent with depression'. I don't think there are enough categories, especially one with re:to loss of interest, although it was one question in the first category, which is the only one I seem to fall into.

The only testing place in is Fort Worth. Austin is supposedly rated high on the list of cities with a high drinking per capita, so maybe that's how many deal with it here, or don't recognize it. It's may be difficult for many to talk to their dr about it since there are people who consider it a weakness. For me, it would be a weakness *not* to mention it to my dr! Life is too short not to be enjoyed every day, except for the occasional bump in the road.

Hi Gang!

Some of you may remember my postings on this "depression/similar-issues" occasionally. For ME...Zoloft, combined with CBT, was a revelation to me in 2012. I got my passion for doing things back, stopped feeling so "fearful", worries about health, etc., were put into perspective, & slight "doom & gloom" feelings are now 98% gone.

As others have said here, get up to your Rx'd dose. Dinkin' around with too small a dose is counterproductive. The full benefits never will really materialize. Not to sound harsh here, but the drug doesn't care about any preconceptions, theories, feelings, etc. that you or family may have.

I say this (fairly pointedly I confess!) because I care!
......aaaaannd because I recognize some of the smokescreens I used to tell myself...;-)

Faron

If you do not feel comfortable taking this medication you should discuss that with your doctor. If you are not already seeing a MD/psychiatrist, you may want to see one; they are the experts in prescribing these meds. In addition, you may want to see a therapist (non-MD/psychologist) for cognitive-behavioral therapy (AKA talk therapy). Meds combined with talk therapy seems to be the most effective treatment.

Wellbutrin is prescribed up to 450mg per day, by taking 1/4 of a 150mg pill you are getting 37.5mg - which is 8% of the max drug dose.

Taking a baby aspirin (81mg) for a headache would give you a higher percentage (13%) of the recommended dose (650 mg). Have you ever had a baby aspirin relieve a headache?

For some drugs, taking a lower than therapeutic dose can cause side effects - not seen in recommended doses, due to how the drug is metabolized.

Annie's list of non-pharmacological treatments is excellent.

However, I must respectfully disagree on one point. These meds do NOT ''often have very negative side effects.'' In the emergency department, I see MANY patients on anti-depressants, usually for things unrelated to their depression - most report absolutely no side effects, except for feeling better.

A serious complication of untreated or not effectively treated depression is suicide. The goal of treatment is to prevent this complication. Unfortunately, treatment is not always successful - just like any other disease.

Bupropion (wellbutrin) and SSRI medications are so much safer than many of the medications we used in the past to treat depression, far fewer and less serious side effects.

Pattyxlynn - you are absolutely correct. I have participated as an investigator in several clinical trials. The drug companies require we tell the patient to report and we record - every possible symptom. Many listed occur in only 1% of the patients,

Excellent post, Mdln!

Patty, if you are experiencing a side effect that is unacceptable to you, please talk to your doctor and try something else. As many have noted, you will not receive a therapeutic effect from your self-prescribed dose. Additionally, the perceived side effect you are experiencing may have nothing whatsoever to do with the Wellbutrin; since you are not taking enough to help, you are also not taking enough to cause any side effects, either.

Also, some meds like Wellbutrin have some initial side effects - weird dreams, mild anxiety, etc., that dissipate as your body becomes accustomed to the medication.

@kswl - thank you. I am grateful to so many on GW who helped me with everything from windows and kitchen cabinets to plumbing; areas where I had no experience. I took to heart a comment from the moderator to not only take information from GW - but also to give back. Hope some of my medical experience helps someone.

While I agree with the comments here about the benefits of anti-depressant medications for many people, they are absolutely not appropriate for everyone. They can cause serious side effects. I developed a life-threatening Serotonin Syndrome from a single SSRI pill while taking no other meds. It is rare, but it happens. Please discuss your concerns with your doctor, especially if you are experiencing any sort of significant discomfort. And be extremely careful about mixing multiple serotonin meds, as this increases the likelihood of an adverse reaction.

mdln, thank you for posting your information and experience. It is helpful. I appreciate your mentioning psychological therapy, especially CBT, as a non-drug treatment for depression. It is one I left off the list...my bad.

My fear and experience may have led me to overstate the side effects of SSRIs, which are, as you say, supposed to be better than earlier generations of drugs. But then again, from the NIH

However, questions about the safety and tolerability of SSRIs have emerged with their continued use. For example, in the original placebo-controlled clinical trials of fluoxetine in depressed patients, sexual dysfunction was reported in 1.9% of trial participants receiving fluoxetine. However, postmarketing clinical trials have reported rates of sexual dysfunction as high as 75%.

Given that these drugs are

• viewed as relatively safe and efficacious

• heavily marketed by drug cos

• prescribed to larger populations including even preschoolers

• prescribed for use beyond depression

• prescribed for longer periods of time

• preferred by insurance cos as cheaper than therapy

use of these drugs has skyrocketed. According to the CDC, antidepressant use has increased 400% from 1988 to 2008. Moreover, less than one third of those taking a single antidepressant have seen a mental health professional in the prior year.

Add to that evidence that these drugs may not as effective as purported to be...

Altogether, there were forty-two trials of the six drugs. Most of them were negative. Overall, placebos were 82 percent as effective as the drugs, as measured by the Hamilton Depression Scale (HAM-D), a widely used score of symptoms of depression. The average difference between drug and placebo was only 1.8 points on the HAM-D, a difference that, while statistically significant, was clinically meaningless. The results were much the same for all six drugs: they were all equally unimpressive. Yet because the positive studies were extensively publicized, while the negative ones were hidden, the public and the medical profession came to believe that these drugs were highly effective antidepressants.

Moreover,
...he observed that even treatments that were not considered to be antidepressants -- "such as synthetic thyroid hormone, opiates, sedatives, stimulants, and some herbal remedies" -- were as effective as antidepressants in alleviating the symptoms of depression. Kirsch writes, “When administered as antidepressants, drugs that increase, decrease or have no effect on serotonin all relieve depression to about the same degree.” What all these “effective” drugs had in common was that they produced side effects...

See The Epidemic of Mental Illness: Why?

So, IMHO, what we have are drugs with potentially serious side effects, of questionable efficacy being prescribed for mental health conditions and other conditions by non mental health professionals at increasing rates for longer periods of time. Especially when there...

Annie - I agree! There is research that shows non-psychiatrists are more likely to prescribe psychotropic meds, than psychiatrists.

As much as I would like only psychiatrists to prescribe these drugs, patients encounter barriers to psych, including long waits to get an appointment and lower insurance coverage for mental health issues.

If non-psych docs prescribe these drugs, pehaps patients should also see a therapist - with more experience than one rotation through psych during med school/residency.

As with many conditions (e.g., common cold) it is easier to prescribe a med, than explain why they are not getting an Rx and teaching a pt how to manage their symptoms. Many patients come to the emerg dept with common cold symptoms looking for an antibiotic prescription. Antibiotics do nothing for viruses, other than increase the incidence of drug resistance. OK, time to get off my soapbox. :-)

Mdln, we are definitely on the same page!

And the more medicine understands the mind/body connection, the better. But it also means the patient needs to understand the mind/body connection too, and that sometimes the cure is within the pt's own mind and body, not in a bottle.

We are becoming a soma nation...

"..there is always soma, delicious soma, half a gramme for a half-holiday, a gramme for a week-end, two grammes for a trip to the gorgeous East, three for a dark eternity on the moon..."