Right there with you.... on our second child too, and very different...

We toured Emory in Atlanta with our older student (DS), and loved it. He didn't go there, but one of his best buddies did, and just loves it. Very strong business program. My son lived in Atanta last summer and really enjoyed that city.

We toured Syracuse last winter. Seems like a good place, but like you, I worry that the city isn't the best.

Northeastern may be on DD's list too. Penn State is on her list, and she has toured it. She likes the campus and town very much, and for a girl who doesn't have any idea what she wants to do, it offers lots of options. We have two neighbor girls (who are similar to my DD) attending there, and they are having a great experience. Has your son considered Tulane? We just toured it a few weeks ago. Very impressive. It's in New Orleans, which I loved, but gives me pause safety wise, but we know a number of recent grads who all loved it.

Has he taken SATs yet? We use CollegeProwler a lot to try to match up DD's SAT scores with the mid-50th of target schools.

This post was edited by bestyears on Wed, Jul 10, 13 at 19:08

My midwest roots will show with this one but the first thing I thought of with your list - business, big school, large city, not hot - University of Michigan at Ann Arbor. It doesn't get much bigger than that, has a top tier business school, people bleed blue for the foot ball team (M GO BLUE), and it won't be hot! Ann Arbor is not a really large city but over 100k and spitting distance to Detroit. I know, I know...... Detroit. I haven't been there in ages but a friend just moved to a suburb and loves it - Detroit, as they say, is coming back.

sueb-

I sent you an email, I have lots of info on 2 of the schools.

sandyponder

I'm from Pittsburgh, and attended the University of Pgh. for undergraduate and graduate studies. Pittsburgh is a really nice city, not too big or too small, and the school has an excellent reputation for academics, research, and of course, Division 1 sports! Looking back, I have a renewed appreciation for the school--they also have an honors college, which wasn't there at the time I attended.

My DS will be entering his third year of college. He has already changed his major (after 1st year) and now is changing colleges. Everyone of his high school friends have either changed their major and/or changed schools except one.

Hope you and your son keep this in mind. Its OK to change mid stream. They are so young to have to make decisions affecting the rest of their lives. I say this only because I know how stressful it is picking a major and a school. Hopefully you son will hit it right the first time.

My son now is really excited about the new school and his future. He needed though to go to the first school, take some classes, and mature a little before he found his niche. The 1st school wasn't a mistake just a stepping stone.

Now my DD has to wade through a pile of college material that has arrived at our house. She is very confused but hopefully by the end of summer she can narrow it down a little.

Good Luck!

UVM is in the "city" (cough, cough) of Burlington. Nice place, but it's a very small city. Very outdoor (ski)-minded place. I was there (on campus at UVM) last winter and the campus is pretty bleak and exposed feeling. I wouldn't call UVM a big school (sort medium, at best) in a big city, especially for a kid who's used to the Boston Metro area. UVM kids go to Boston when they are feeling the need for an urban/city pick-me-up.

UVM has a rep as a fraternity-minded, party school, and it is pretty expensive for out of state kids, I believe.

My DH is an alum, as are other members of my family, including current students.

(I am UMass/Amherst, a BIG school in a smaller "city"/larger metro area, but you are familiar ith the area from your Hampshire adventures.)

What about Union College in Schenectady, NY smaller school, but in the larger area of Albany /Capital District (with lots of other colleges nearby). Definitely big on rugby at Union. Half the distance of Syracuse. (How did you ever do that trip in just 5 hours? Mass General to my house north of Albany is a hard-driven 3 hours 45 min and it's at least 2.5 hours to Syracuse from here on the Thruway?)

Other possibilities (though farther away) : UPenn (their Wharton School of Business, though a grad. school, probably elevates the level of business teaching at the undergrad level) or Carnegie Mellon in Pittsburgh

HTH

L.

I'm biased, but would like to second the suggestion for U of Michigan. It's a fantastic school all around and Ann Arbor is a wonderful place to live for any student.

To this day, employers comment on the fact that I went there for ungrad years ago, because it has such a great reputation.

If he's considering U of Chicago, has he looked at Loyola University Chicago? DS majored in Business and International Finance, then went to DePaul for his MSF.

Drexel in Philadelphia has a great business school, and Philly is big enough to be interesting, but not overwhelming like NYC.

DH was a visiting prof at Syracuse. The one thing I remember is that there were 10 foot poles tied to the street signs, hydrants, and other street "furniture". That's because Syracuse gets 180" of snow in an average year.
However, if your son is at all interested in communications, Syracuse is a great place to go.

Have you looked at Princeton Review? You join for free and then you can put in schools that you are interested in. My favorite part is that they have quotes about what the students say, in their own words. They are spot on.
Looking at what you wrote, I don't think your son will have a problem getting into a top tier school. However, it does happen.
I am sure you have the guide to the top 300(and something) schools. Look through that.
I would not put total stock in what they say are the minimum requirements. They will take a less qualified student if there is something about them that strikes a cord. My youngest was an average student and got accepted to all the schools she applied to. Technically, they should have all been considered reach schools.
You need to first figure out small, big, medium school and what this means to your son. For example, UVM has 8,000 students and considered medium. I consider that small. Does he want an active school in the city, or a school in a small town? Is he interested in Greek life?
Each year there was a "buzz" school. Does he want diversity? Was he so happy with his high school that he wants to repeat the same environment in college?
Is he wants Business, then of course narrow the schools down that way.
Apply to at least ten schools. You are led to believe that you get "extra points" for actually visiting a school. After a few visits to schools, both my daughters decided to wait and see which they were accepted in to and then visit those schools.
For my oldest, she handled the entire process alone. My youngest needed help, so we went to a college coach. She was terrific and was able to tell me which school would be the safety and that there was no need to pay for more than one. She agreed to all on our list and we added Syracuse as a nod to her alma mater!

Allison -don't want to hijack, but would you mind sharing more of your son's experiences at DePaul? It's recently come up for us, and nobody we know has any experience. Also, does he have any input regarding undergrad there?

I don't have kids that age yet, but I have a different take, based on several years working at a senior level in investment banking and managing a large group.

Based on the kid you describe, I would assume he will go on to graduate school and get an MBA, or else be recruited into a large training program.

If that is the case, his undergrad training need not, and I would argue, should not, be in "business". It could be in almost anything if he is a good student, but hard sciences might be nice.

Just my .02

We have just gone thorugh this experience 2ce now. One large question you are not addressing is if you can afford full price at these schools. $60K/year for 4 years is a big pill to swallow. So, one serious question is not only where can he get in, but where can he get merit aid. You maximize merit aid by being in the top 25% of the SAT/GPA ranges published by the school. The best resource for looking this kind of information up, as well as a lot of other information concerning a particular school is by googling "common data set XYZ university". Look carefully at section C. It will tell you whether your son would be in the running for Merit aid. Of the schools you are looking at Syracuse does not give a lot of merit aid. Neither does U Chicago. Financial aid is a totally seperate issue. However, the best situations are when you find that "sweet spot" with financial and merit aid.

The best advice I can give you is to find a safety that your son loves. Safety is defined by both academically and financially. A school that he is guarenteed to be admitted AND that no matter what, you could afford. Find that school first, because after that everything else is gravy on top. Good luck with your search!

Has he considered Northwestern? It's not technically in a big city, but Chicago is so close, and Evanston is so lovely! Several friends and family members are graduates and had very positive experiences.

I second the suggestion of Northwestern. It's in a beautiful location, and even though Evanston is outside Chicago's city limits, it's all one large metropolitan area. Going down to the Loop is just a matter of a train ride. And Northwestern's reputation as a top tier school is as solid as ever.

The University of Chicago (from which my dad had his M.A.) is for brainiacs, with very demanding courses of study and a lot expected of the students. A degree from the U. of C. will definitely open doors, but, although the campus is lovely and its neighborhood - Hyde Park - is interesting, a parent should consider that this school is in the South Side, a very difficult area. But I worked there as an administrative assistant many decades ago and loved it.

Ah, college apps, I have gone thru the process twice with 2 sons. It's both a trying and exciting time. From my standpoint, the better the student, the more stressful the process. And then, THE MONEY!! My 2 college age kids at 2 very selective schools cost us over $100 K per year-that's after tax people. As for advice,look at lots of schools. Like houses, it becomes clearer to the student and you. The more effort you put into looking at schools now,the less likely a transfer is later. You didn't say what state you live in, but consider how far away he really wants to be. If it involves an airplane ride, the student will probably not be home for a weekend visit,just school breaks. Another website to check out is College Confidential.

I attended UM Ann Arbor undergrad and Penn State grad. Both good schools. Big cities - not so much. AA is all about UM. Penn State IS State College, i.e., the cities sort of revolve around the schools.

If I were looking for a large school now, big city, not NYC, not too far south (and Mom wants closer to home), I would choose Philly or Pittsburgh both of which have some great schools. Worked in both cities and love what they have to offer.

Having gone through this grueling process 3 times, I'd like to suggest the website College Confidential. There are forums for each school, and parent forums as well. You'll get honest info there.

The most important advice I can give you is to make sure your son has a safety school he really likes. The process has become extremely competitive. My daughter had a 4.0, lots of AP classes, captain of a sports team for 2 yrs, etc., and was wait listed at most of her top choices. She was accepted off the wait list at one of them, but had she not been, she would have been at one of her safeties. In the long run, she probably would have been fine there, but her HS class was so competitive (18% went to Ivy League schools), she wanted a "name" school.

I also suggest that you look at the transportation costs to and from the colleges, because unless your son never wants to come home and visit, those costs can really add up.

Can you tell I have 3 kids in college? ;-) Hope this helps!

mtnrredux -could you say more about the students recruited into training programs? Which schools and majors do companies look for, in your experience?

And jshore, I agree with you. It's much more competitive than people realize these days. Someone here mentioned Northwestern in Evanston. We toured it and LOVED it, but unless you have straight 700s (or better) across your SATS and are in the top 10% of your class, it is hugely unlikely you'll be accepted. Even with those stats, it's a challenge. Their admittance rate is below 20% I think...

This post was edited by bestyears on Thu, Jul 11, 13 at 8:35

Thanks for all the info from everyone. Just to clarify a few things...

These are not the ONLY schools on his list. There are others, including safeties. And we have toured a lot of them. But these, I think, are going to be his 4 favorites.

I was honestly just seeking feedback about these specific schools -- if people had direct experience with any of them. I do know about all the online resources and have looked at many of them including College Confidential and Princeton Review. We have found Naviance to be helpful, too.

I don't want to get into detail, but money/tuition is not really a determining factor.

It would take too long to address all the other college options people have mentioned but many of them have already been considered. We went to Philly last year -- he just didn't really like it. Not sure why, but while is is an easygoing kid, he gets certain gut feelings about things, and he didn't like Philly.

Oh, and just to mention one other specific school, Northwestern was on the list of potential schools, then he visited (not on a college tour but with his HS band) PART of the school and said, "eh, I don't think I'm interested" but if/when we go to Chicago this fall, we will do an official tour there because I still think it could be a good option for him. For a while, he just took the whole city of Chicago off his list, but now that U of Chicago is back on the list, NW should be on it too.

mtn, I totally get what you're saying, and that is why I think it's good that he's looking at bigger schools with lots of options for majors. Like I said, he could easily change his mind. Right now he thinks he's interested in business and market research. Based on what, I have no idea. I think he could just as easily decide to go into some kind of engineering or psychology or who knows what. As I said, for years he wanted to be a teacher. Then he decided he wouldn't make enough money teaching. I have tried to talk to him about it multiple times, because I think he'd be a wonderful teacher -- he has worked at an afterschool program since he was in 6th grade. So his mind is still slightly open to teaching. So every time we tour a school, I point out the education dept. to him!

What else... oh, I know I said big city. But I should have maybe said, fun city or college-oriented city. I understand that Burlington, VT, isn't a "big city" but we toured Champlain w/ our older son and we felt like Burlington would be a fun place to go to school. We do live near Boston but we live in a small town and DS is coming from a relatively small high school (~250 kids in his class) so a school of 8000 will be "big" to him. He is mainly interested in UVM because he thinks the honors program might be for him, and quite a few kids from our HS end up there every year.

I really think if he gets into Northeastern, he will go there, because as much as he SAYS he wants to branch out, he is a homebody at heart. We'll see... If he doesn't get into Northeastern, I think he'll end up at Syracuse (if he gets in). Something about that school really sparked him.

Yikes. Sorry this was so long. I just had my coffee.

I'm originally from a suburb just outside of Pittsburgh and I also went to the University of Pittsburgh - undergrad and grad school. Even though I live near Philadelphia I still have great fondness for both Pitt and the city and I can easily recommend them. We still visit family there and I try to stay abreast of happenings in the city (other than their 6 Super Bowls wins).

Carnegie Mellon is a great school too especially for science/technology or performing arts. On a side note - Carnegie Mellon is pronounced Kar NEH gee or Kar NAY gee
with the accent on the second syllable. It's not pronounced with the accent on the first syllable as in Carnegie Hall (KAR nuhgee) even though it's the same fellow.

Check out U of Penn and Drexel too. Drexel also offers a work/study program if you're interested. Philly is much more active at night than Pittsburgh, both schools are within walking distance of Center City while Pitt and Carnegie are in the Oakland section of the city, which is a bus or trolley ride away from downtown Pittsburgh. Oakland is active at night but the downtown business area isn't.

My son graduated from UVM. He loved it and he wasn't a skier. But he loved Lake Champlain, the mountains and the city itself. He didn't join a frat but it's not the kind of school where you feel left out of things if you don't join. They don't have a football team which might be important to some students.

My other son went to Bucknell University in Lewisburg, PA. It's a smaller, highly ranked, liberal arts school in PA, about 40 minutes from Penn State. He majored in economics and international relations and went on to earn his MBA. He had quite a few friends from the Boston area.

We've been through this 5 times and I am ever so thankful that we're finished with college and grad school applications. My youngest graduated a few years ago and unfortunately since she applied I think the process has become more difficult for both students and parents.

If you're concerned about travel between home and school you can check to see if there are convenient bus, train or airline connections. My son flew home from UVM for Thanksgiving but drove back for winter break. Their airport is small but has a decent amount of flights.

Syracuse is a great school for communications as mentioned. However getting into Newhouse is more difficult than regular admission to the University. My brother just moved from that area and he does say that the city is declining.

Good luck - it's a stressful time. Just remember that transferring is common.

This post was edited by maire_cate on Thu, Jul 11, 13 at 13:22

The drive from Syracuse to Boston is tedious and often dangerous in the winter. If he does end up at Syracuse, look into having him take the train from Syracuse to Albany for visits home. It's only $29 and about 3 hours. Then you can pick him up in Albany and save quite a bit of driving.

I know this is a "hot" area, but I am going to suggest U of Miami. Lots and lots to do, not really hot over the school year, mostly in the summer, great business school and lots of startups have begun from their campus incubator. There is always something to do on campus or off campus. My son, a rising sophmore there, says the student body is happy and engaged. He doesn't hear or see that from lots of places his friends went to school. He is not a business major, but several friends are and they are happy. Also might want to look at Univesrity of Rochester or Binghamton. Bing has a very strong business element. Good luck on the process!

I went to Syracuse, although many, many years ago. I've been back to visit since then. The city really has declined and it appears that all social life centers around the school itself. Fraternities and sororities are a very big deal there, so he should think about how he feels about that. It gets tons of snow and freezing weather. I remember my hair froze after a swim class once. Still, the students seem to love the place, have a good time and end up with a good education. The size is good, too, probably half the size of the big state schools.

SU has a very different vibe than say Penn, where I used to work. Penn's students have a great time, too, but the entire city is their playground. The frat system is not so prevalent and the student body is much more diverse. The kids seem to look beyond the boundaries of the campus while they are there, but I guess that is typical of an inner city school. There are some really sketchy neighborhoods nearby, too. However, it is an Ivy League school located in Philadelphia, so it probably isn't for him!

He should also keep in mind that he will be on campus from September through May, so he will not be there for the heat of summer. That may help him to look at schools farther south.

I remember my son went to look at Bucknell, said, "I'm not going to school in the middle of a cornfield" and got back in the car. He chose Boulder, which turned out to be a huge mistake.

Good luck!

liriodendron, thanks for recommending Union College, a small, tight-knit school with a strong sense of tradition.. My bright, driven, well-grounded son spent four terrific years there, met a bright, driven, well-grounded gal, whom he recently married. They both have good jobs, being able to compete in a tough job market..

My son blossomed at Union. Is Union still on a trimester system? He found that made for more intensive course work, but he liked that you could cover more ground over the year. Union stays in session until June, longer than most schools, and has a long break from Thanksgiving until January. Winter weather can be gloomy in Schenectady, but there is good access to winter sports, & the campus is teeming with activities. My son used to come home exhilarated but exhausted -- so much stimulation from so much going on.

Easy access to the Amtrak station too.

I grew up in NYS, and Syracuse is a smaller city and definitely economically depressed. Like ded said, life revolves around the school. Plus, they actually get more snow than Buffalo, seriously.

Speaking of Buffalo, SUNY Buffalo has excellent business programs and the out-of-state tuition for SUNY campuses is very manageable. There are a lot of students from the NY/Long Island area.

Virginia Tech is also great for business and engineering. It is a college town and it is pretty geographically isolated similar to Penn State. Even though it's the South, the weather is mild because it is at elevation. It is a gorgeous campus, and the views are amazing. They do get snow, but not that much. Also, out of state tuition has always been very reasonable. Despite the campus shooting, it is probably one of the safest places to send your son/daughter to college. I lived there for 12 years (obtained doctorate and worked as research faculty), and I had left before the shooting.

Sueb, I don't know your exact location, but are there any instate schools that are a possibility?

May I ask where you are located?

Dd started out in accounting and changed her major to Entepreneurship.

St. Louis University. Awesome school in a wonderful city. Not too big...not too small. It is not a large school but it is selective and provides a great education with a terrific study abroad program if he is interested.

Dd spent a semester in Australia at Bond University.

Sounds like you have a great kid with lots of opportunities.

As I said, we live close to Boston. In-state schools are a possibility but he has been saying all along that he doesn't want to go to school in Boston because he "already knows Boston." However, I made him tour Northeastern and he was open minded and suddenly, it was his first choice. I think it still is, but even though his scores and grades make it look like he should get in, they have gotten record numbers of applications in the last few years, so it's certainly not a guarantee.

We will also look at BU. We looked at BC, he said no thanks. We looked at Babson, which he liked but the curriculum is limited so if he changed his mind about business, he'd most likely have to transfer. Plus, it definitely didn't meet his "city" requirement! I think in terms of curriculum, Bentley would be fantastic for him, but it is also in a suburb very close to home. He won't even look.

He is not interested in any schools in Amherst. We've been there enough times -- older DS went to school there...briefly...dropped out...agh.

The others we've seen? Skidmore: nope. I figured as much, but we were in the area. Brown: oh yes, loved it, would never get in. That was a year ago when I still had hope that his GPA might take precedence over his social life. We toured UNH. He didn't really "see himself there" and really, neither did I.

We are looking at Providence College this summer. And UVM, as I said. (I don't think he'll end up there, but I'm sure Burlington is nice in July.)

And finally, yes, I have pointed out that Sept-May is not that hot in any of the "warm climate" schools. In all honesty, I don't even think he really wants to be in Chicago because it's too far from home. I think he wants to be someplace we can drive to/from, because even though we travel a lot, he doesn't like to fly.

Big school - small town - great college experience: Purdue University

Boiler Up!

Here is a link that might be useful: Krannert School of Management

He really can't go wrong with Northeastern. With their co-op program, he is practically guaranteed a job when he graduates, because of the paid internships provided. Plus, I don't think there's a better place to go to college than Boston! My daughter is at BU, and she loves living there. As a matter of fact, she rarely comes home. Since you live near Boston, you already know how easy it is for students to get around to the many things there are to do. Good luck, and have fun with your son. I really enjoyed visiting all the different areas with my kids, it was a special one on one time.

Bestyears, he started working after graduating from Loyola - company he did a short internship his senior year. So he was going to DePaul at night for 2 years to get his MFS. About 6 months after, he was hired by an enormous French owned company and has gotten a promotion and raise at least once a year since. He'll be able to work from anywhere in the world, and has already talked to his 2 bosses about moving back to AL next summer. So far, it's a go, and this won't prevent him from getting future promotions. He travels some now and will about the same if/when they move.

Of course education plays a part in his success, along with personality, work achievements, etc. But his experience at both Loyola and DePaul Kellstadt grad school were both positive experiences. He actually transferred to Loyola after a year at Columbia College - did not feel he was getting a good education and his direction changed so their programming wasn't up to par for him.

Thanks so much Allison!

sueb20,
Our youngest graduated from Northeastern last year. Like you, we are in a Boston suburb and she thought it might be too close to home. She applied early and received a merit-based scholarship that was too good to refuse (not a full ride). She loved it there and we rarely saw her, unless we went in to take her and her roomies out to dinner. She graduated debt free and continued at NEU for her masters. She is now gainfully employed as a CPA in Boston for one of the "big 4".

NEU is my alma mater, but as I like to say "this is not your mother's Northeastern"! It has always been know for the health programs, accounting and engineering. Now most departments are strong and thriving.

We also have a daughter who graduated from BC (I know you said your son isn't interested, but again, we rarely saw her).

Our middle daughter went to college in CT about 3 hours from home. That was perfect for her and the drive wasn't too bad for us.

I do not have personal experience regarding NU vs U of C, but based on friends and family. . .

NU is, in comparison, far more of a "party" school (more social). No one I knew who went there had issues with feeling like they fit in because it is more diverse, on many levels, than U of C. This is not to say, of course, that this is universally true, but something to consider.

The people I know who graduated from/had a good experience at U of C are generally more confident in their direction in life than the average person at the undergrad level. It does not seem to lend itself well to finding onself there. (Completely anecdotal, but a friend of mine attempted suicide from the pressure she felt as a student.) Grad school is a different story-- perhaps because people are in a different phase of their lives, but U of C does not seem to have the same psychological impact at that stage.

Just wanted to pop in again and say thanks to everyone for all the info! I do appreciate it.

Hi Sue,

I'm joining the party late here but I wanted to let you know that my daughter graduated from NE this May. She absolutely loved it there.

She received a really excellent education and the co-op program was wonderful.

Whether he will like it depends on exactly what your son is looking for. It's not a frat/ sorority football type school. I think it is much more academic.

My daughter entered as a transfer student sophomore year. She spent her freshman year at Univ of SC getting a great GPA and proving herself. That may also be an option for your son if he does not get in.

She really had a great experience there. We live in southern CT so Boston was a great choice for us.

Dawn

Sueb, has he looked at any of the Canadian schools? For example, McGill in Montreal? McGill has an outstanding international reputation and it's in Montreal - what more needs to be said! The Canadian schools are often overlooked by US applicants, but there are many really excellent universities and they welcome US students. McLean's magazine publishes rankings of them, which are available online.

My daughter went to University of Guelph for one year (then she changed her major and transferred elsewhere) and it was an excellent experience for her.

If your son is interested in international business (and what business isn't international nowadays?) it will help expose him to a different, although not totally "foreign" culture. My daughter loved the fact that she could practice her French in social situations.

I know we've veered away from your original question, but I did want to mention these schools, if he hasn't already considered them.

Hope you're still checking this page. Another great suggestion--Virginia Tech! It meets all his requirements except for being in a big city. Small town and the university is pretty much the center of life. Still, it's about 3x the size of UVM. Great business school and well ranked programs in other disciplines if he changes to something else.

We did look at McGill briefly (web site) but his GPA isn't quite enough to get him into their business major. I also think, perhaps, with only about 13% (I think that's the number I saw) US students, that may be a little too far outside his comfort zone. He is really a homebody, hasn't even gone to sleepaway summer camps except for a week during two separate summers...which is why I can't quite believe he's looking at Syracuse! Of course, he IS growing up and seems determined to spread his wings to some extent. Perhaps not all the way to Canada, though?

Virginia...he seems determined not to go south.

At the moment, he is really loving both Northeastern and Syracuse. Really, if Syracuse had the coop program that NU has, he would be done looking and he'd apply early decision to SU. But he really likes the idea of that coop, especially because he's working as an intern at an investment firm this summer and really liking it. We are visiting both schools, for the second time, within the next few months, and he may yet decide to apply early decision to Syracuse. At least that's what he's thinking right now. We are visiting UVM in a few days but he says he is only interested in UVM if he gets into the honors program there.

It's an exciting time but also stressful and a little sad because I can't imagine DS not being here every day!