Flu viruses are constantly mutating; it's the nature of the beast. Flu shots are formulated by the CDC to be effective against the varieties of flu which the epidemiologists think are most likely to appear the next winter. But they aren't effective against every flu virus. So it's quite possible to get a flu totally unrelated to the viruses covered by that year's flu shot.

Some types of innoculations give you a mild version of the illness; other innoculations don't work that way. But in any case, the innoculation involves introducing something foreign into your body, and your immune system will react to that to a greater or lesser degree.

To me, your 2-month gap between the flu shots and the problems seems to be too long a period for the problems to have been caused by the flu shots. A week or two later: yes. Two months later: no. But I'm not a doctor.

However, consider that you're probably taking the flu shots about the same time each year, and therefore 2 months later is about the same time each year. Is there any pattern in what you normally do at that time of year?

For instance: the holiday season. Lots of stress and overexertion trying to get everything ready, plus we're generally in contact with more folks (family get-togethers; workplace and neighborhood holiday parties; crowded malls; sometimes long-distance travel to see relatives or vacation in a warmer part of the world).

Plus the weather's usually awful, commutes are more difficult, and we’re always run-down. So it's natural to be sicker more and worse in December and January.

And if you have children -- or interact with children -- then you're also interacting with all the germs they get from their classmates (who have just returned from vacationing in Florida, visiting kin in Mexico, traveling two days each way on a bus full of band members to march in a parade, etc.).

Well, I looked up arthritis for you, and this article mentions bilateral symmetry in rheumatoid arthritis (nothing like that in the medical books I looked at 20-some years ago). Let me quote some of it:

"Rheumatoid arthritis is a type of chronic arthritis that occurs in joints on both sides of the body (such as both hands, both wrists, or both knees). This symmetry helps distinguish rheumatoid arthritis from other types of arthritis....

"It is an autoimmune disease, meaning the body's immune system attacks its own healthy tissues. Rheumatoid arthritis is two to three times more common in women than in men....

"The cause of rheumatoid arthritis is unknown. It is thought to be due to a combination of genetic, environmental, and hormonal factors. With rheumatoid arthritis, something seems to trigger the immune system to attack the joints and sometimes other organs." [During my problem, I had a blood test which indicated an autoimmune reaction in my liver.] "Some theories suggest that a virus or bacteria may alter the immune system, causing it to attack the joints....

"Once the immune system is triggered, immune cells migrate from the blood into the joints and joint-lining tissue, called synovium. There the immune cells make inflammatory substances that cause irritation, wearing down of cartilage ... and swelling and inflammation of the joint lining....

"All of these things cause the joint to become very painful, swollen, and warm to the touch."

http://www.webmd.com/rheumatoid-arthritis/guide/rheumatoid-arthritis-basics

Get some Barlean's Highest Lignan Flax seed oil. Make sure it's refrigerated when you buy it and keep it refrigerated. Take between 1 tsp and 1 Tbsp a day and see how you do. I have suffered for years with transient aches and pains, stiffness and gelling when I sit too long. The only thing that I've found that alleviates it is the flax seed oil...and it has to have high lignan or it doesn't help. Hope that helps.

Missing....thank you for taking the time to respond in great length. It does seem like the virus I had in January is causing this....maybe not the flu and pneumonia shots. Other than shoulders and arms and once the backs of both knees, I would say the pattern is more asymmetrical. One day my left elbow hurt...the next day elbow was fine but right ankle hurt...the next day that was fine but left wrist hurt. Some days both hands hurt, some days just one. Really no rhyme or reason.

Annie.....thanks for your tip about flax oil. Does it have to be ordered or can it be purchased at CVS, Target.....?

You might see if your dr can test your vitamin D level. I have struggled for years with joint pain and this past fall had begun doing physical therapy for my shoulder and neck. Wasn't seeing much progress and had a full blood work up done at the endocrinologist. My vitamin D came back very low, I started on a weekly high dose pill and within 3 weeks felt like a new person. I still have an occasional achy day, but no more physical therapy and I finally feel like I can move freely.

Joanie, interesting post that struck a familiar note with me. Three years ago I got a flu shot in October. Within a month my right shoulder started aching and became somewhat stiff. I thought it was a reaction to the shot as that was the arm that was used. The pain/stiffness was at its worst in the morning when I got up. By January the aches were also in my hips and knees. Getting dressed was a challenge. Sleeping became a nightmare due to hip and shoulder joints stiffening up. My husband would have to help me get out of bed in the morning. Symptoms would ease up during the day but return if I sat too long or at night when I went to bed. Saw a rheumatologist and was diagnosed with PMR - polymyalgia rheumatica - an autoimmune disorder that 'favors' older women. Prednisone relieved the joint swelling and pain and I felt like a new person within 24 hours. Unfortunately PMR can take 2-3 years to run its course and you have to stay on reduced amounts of prednisone to control the stiffness. Flare ups can return occasionally. After 2-1/2 years of taking pred (and dealing with its side effects) I've been off the med for 4 months now. My joints are relatively pain free except for one hip. And that is probably either arthritis or bursitis. Another doctor visit is in my future. I'm going to retire this year and would love to be pain free in order to enjoy it!

I had similar joint paint a number of years ago & also started using the flaxseed oil capsules. Since being on the flaxseed oil capsules, I haven't had it back. I get mine from Wal-Mart, they have worked for me.

And I keep the bottle refrigerated, too. I started with 2 capsules a day, 1 morning and evening. Now I take 2 in the morning & 2 in the evening. Also had hip pain on my right side, so much so that I could not lay on my right side for more than 10 minutes. Now, no problem with that hip. Life is good! My SIL told me about the flaxseed oil, her Doctor told her about it. Sure beats being on prescription meds.

Definitely will try flaxseed oil for my hip pain. Love this forum! Always learn something new!

I second the idea of having Vitamin D levels tested. I went through all kinds of tests, xrays and appointments before they finally thought to test for Vitamin D and I was way low. Went through similar high dose treatment as amyktexas and I finally felt like I was back to normal after being miserable for quite some time. Viruses, physical activity and all types of simple things such as vacuuming and yard work had such a negative impact on how my muscles and bones felt when my Vitamin D levels were insufficient. It was amazing to me that it ended up being something so simple. Wish it would have been discovered sooner and I would have saved a lot of time and money!

Oh boy, does the OP sound very familiar to me. It was me, about 3 years ago and I headed for the doctors. Thankfully she knew right away what it was. I have RA. She immediately got me in to see a rheumatologist and it is now controlled and no joint damage.

Do not wait, get to the doctors and have it tested. In some cased damage can set in fast so please do not wait.

I'm doing this "cleanse" diet now and our teacher suffered terribly with RA, but by going through the cleanse and learning which foods caused her problems...I think she eliminated gluten and dairy... and she is now med free and essentially pain free.

I have all the same symptoms as Joanie, except I have almost constant upper arm pain bilateral elbows, wrists & hands, sometimes the whole lower arms ache. Intermittent aching in shoulders, knees, etc. Mine have been going on a year. I recently had all the tests for inflammatory diseases (RA, etc) & an EMG for neuromuscular disorders. Everything was negative, thank goodness. I have a script for Vit D from my gyne which I forgot to have tested. I'll do that. If your taking Advil or another NSAID (Alieve, Ibuprofen, etc) make sure you are taking a Prilosec or Prevacid type of drug. Daily use of NSAIDS put you at risk for bleeding ulcers.
Edit: no flu shot

This post was edited by romy718 on Mon, Mar 10, 14 at 9:51

Update....my shoulder and upper arm pain has subsided, at least for now. I still get pain in different areas, not every day. I was fine yesterday, and then last night my right hand hurt. A few days before that, the backs of my knees, etc....it has become more intermittant. I will ask my dr. about it next month, but I am anxious to see how things are once this blasted winter is over. I am thinking it's just arthritis that maybe just happened to coincide with the flu shot/flu...or was triggered by it..or just getting old. The pain in my arms and shoulders was chronic for 6 weeks, so I am glad that is gone.

I was low on Vitamin D a few years ago and did the megadose for 6 months and now just take an OTC pill daily.

Haven't gotten around to purchasing flaxseed oil yet, but will definitely give it a try.

Thanks to all!

Joanie,
I have had migratory joint pain for at least 20 years. About eighteen-twenty months ago, I was diagnosed with PMR and prescribed Prednisone which immediately helped me. I am down to 1mg. alternating every other day with 2 mg., but am in the midst of the worst flare ever.

Saw my MD (rheumatologist) today, and my inflammation markers had risen significantly since checked about a month ago, so back to raising the Pred. again. I also have had a positive ANA this entire time.

Joint pain (migratory) is so elusive and difficult to diagnose, but I have refreshed myself this past week with articles online. I would encourage you to go to a good internist or rheumatologist and get a full blood panel, ANA, HLAB-27 genetic marker test, Sed Rate, C=Reactive Protein, RA testing, testing for Lupus to try to figure it out.

Don't let it go undiagnosed as I did for so many years. They originally thought ma I had fibromyalgia, but I don't, so I just went on with that diagnosis forever, but finally got some solid diagnostic help.

Good luck & let us know how you are etc. Liz

Also, are you menopausal age….sometimes hormone imbalances can cause joint/muscle pain.

Sorry this is long.
I found this message thread very interesting because over 3 and a half years ago I was diagnosed with Inflammatory Rheumatoid Arthritis. My doctor said it was 'triggered' by an antibiotic that I was given that I had an allergic reaction to.
In one month I went from hiking 8 miles and not breaking a sweat and doing climbing walls to being so disabled with pain and swelling in my feet, hands, my joints ached and sensations in my legs (needed to sleep on my back with legs up on pillows) that I had to get pants with elastic.
The doctor told me that I would be disabled and on meds the rest of my life. He could not explain to me sufficiently how this could happen in one month. I refused meds and toughed it out. The first month I felt sorry for myself and was a couch potato. Then I kicked myself and started to read. That was about the only thing I could do. This is what I found out and how I beat my diagnosis.
I found that when we reach around the age of 40 our body slowly diminishes it's production of our super antioxidant glutathione. This is a major player in the proper functioning of our immune system and regulates so many body systems that I am not going to list all of them here. The one I am going to mention is that it does regulate the hormones. When this is depleted via the severe immune response that happens when you receive a vaccination the body's cells and gut (80% of our immune system is regulated from there) is no longer protected because of oxidative stress. When the gut is compromised the body absorption of vit. D is diminished.
Now another thing to take into consideration is family medical history. Is there allergies or auto-immune disease in the family? If this is true then there is the possibility that there could be any one or more of these factors: 1) defective GSH (glutathione) gene; 2) elevated levels of free floating IgE in the body; 3) increased levels of histamine release from mast cells. These are the most important.
Because I found that RA was an auto-immune issue likely caused by my allergic reaction to the anti-biotic I had to deal with the inflammation and find how I could diminish this.
First I started with diet. What foods can cause inflammation and eliminate them? I eliminated all processed sugars and went to honey for a start.
Then I found what to add to my diet to increase my body production of glutathione (I was 58 at onslaught of RA). I added more fruits and green veggies (increasing my vit C & E).
As I researched further I found that whey protein helps intensify the C & E so I started taking a whey suppliment.
With the changes in diet initially I saw slow impovement in 1 month. When I added the whey protein I saw improvement in 2 weeks.
It took 2 years for my body to heal itself and I was pretty much symptom free and pain free.
The only problem I had left was my gut. I believe I had IBS (irritable bowel symdrome). I never went back to the doctor so this is my diagnosis of the symptoms that I had. My gut would feel funny (I called the five minute warning) and I would have to find a bathroom fast. Every store I went to I knew where the restroom was just in case.
Further research was done to find out that Autistic children are glutathione deficient and their gut problems diminished after going gluten free. Hummmmm I pondered this for about 1 day and decided to minimize my gluten and test the foods I did eat to see what reactions I would have. I no longer eat standard breads or pastas. I can eat rye bread and one bun with unbleached white bread for my hamburgers. (I love my food, sorry.) I can also eat the pasta that is labeled semolina pasta. Don't understand why but I can but I do not overdo it.
I have been reading labels for 2 years now and I am pretty much (money is a little tight) all natural foods, frozen veggies, etc.
As of one year ago I am now totally symptom free. Wohoo!
My only problem is that I know I will never be 100% ever again. I do have energy level problems so I do everything in moderation. I have to take a power nap every afternoon. I lost 35 - 40 lbs of muscle mass so I can't do some of the strenuous things I used to.

But the upside is that my allergic responses to seasonal pollens are next to non-existant. No flu or colds (this was a concern of mine). Over all with my auto-immune issue it is all under control and people are amazed that I ever had RA and was 95% disabled.
This is my story. Do your own research. If your doctor will not test for glutathione deficiency (warning: they will not) ask them to test for magnesium deficiency. Glutathione deficiency goes hand in hand with magnesium deficiency.
Foot note: Glutathione supplements do not work because the body does not absorb the glutathione. The best way is to get the body to produce more.

Here is a link that might be useful: Histamine

Cynthia....thank you for sharing your experience....I'm so sorry you had to go through that and it lasted so long. Glad to hear you are living a more normal life now.

It did not occur to me to post an update until the thread popped up again now.

I had a regular checkup last month and told my Dr all the symptoms I'd been having. She was emphatic that the flu vaccine was not the cause and suspected Parvo virus and tested for that....sure enough it was positive. In most people the joint and muscle pain lasts only 2-3 weeks, but in a small percentage it can last months, even years.

Around the time of the checkup I had flank pain on the right side. She thought it was muscular, said it could be kidney stones but she didn't think so but gave me orders for a renal ultrasound if I felt it was necessary(I only have one kidney). I waited a few days and the pain subsided and is pretty much gone now...sometimes a quick pain if I move a certain way...but almost never happens now. It was probably the Parvo.

I also developed stomach issues and was nauseous for about 24 hours straight. She agreed it could be an ulcer due to all the ibuprofen I was taking in Feb and Mar for the joint pain and told me to take Prilosec for 2-4 weeks. I did and the stomach is better.

I think the virus is slowly working it's way out of my system but I still don't feel 100%...maybe 90-95%. In July it will be 6 months so I'm hopeful that by then it will be gone for good!

Cynthia62, welcome to Gardenweb! That is a fascinating story! I hope others come back to this thread and read it.

Joaniepoanie. I'm glad to hear you are feeing better.

Joanie, glad to hear you're feeling better. I didn't realize parvo was a problem for humans...I thought it only affected our 4 footed friends...huh.

Cynthia, very interesting story. It fits right in with all the research they are doing now on the human biome and how our bodies are so much more like a garden that we have to treat well to grow the good organisms we need so they can fight the bad ones we don't. My neighbor is an acupuncturist and is into chinese medicine. I was talking to him about it one day and he said essentially that...that the chinese approach is to use diet, herbs, exercise, acupuncture, etc. to create the proper environment for the body to flourish and the rest takes care of itself whereas western medicine focuses on attacking a specific issue. Perhaps that's why so many with chronic conditions turn to eastern medicine for solutions.