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Salad Master cookware question

Posted by Millie_36 (My Page) on
Fri, Oct 22, 04 at 9:10

I missed this forum in the past, but would really like to know if anyone has been to one of the Salad Master cookware "parties"? If so, you have seen them take the guests' cookware and boil some baking soda water in it...then comes the shocker with the taste test. According to them, every other cookware can and does leach metals into the food. Does anyone know if there is a sales gimmick at work here, and if so, what it is? Some pretty outrageous scare tactics were used against all other cookware.


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Anything sold by a "party", infomercial or direct MLM sales is suspect in my book, and generally grossly overpriced. And usually nothing you need in the first place.

Yes there are sales gimmicks at work here, and I don't even need to see or hear details to know it. If it were the truth, someone would be getting a Nobel prize for chemistry and cooking equipment as we know it would overnight be changed.

Save your money. Buy individual pieces of good equipment as you need it.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Fairegold, I agree with you....only went to help out a friend who needed a certain number of bodies present, but now I want to know how they made the "soda water" taste so metalic in all the other cookware. The pan I took was an expensive piece of 304 stainless. I had never even heard of this brand and beginning to wonder if anyone on the forum has, either.

I have an assortment of pots,pans, and skillets that I bought open stock to fit the way I cook and what I cook. I have never seen a "set" of anything that has exactly the pieces I want.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

They are wrong on one claim. I tried this on the stainless pan that I took with me that night...and, yes, it did leach a metallic taste into the soda water. Then I tried the same thing with a Scan Pan classic, which has Ceramic/Titanium non-stick finish. It tasted of nothing but baking soda and water....so the claim that no other cookware can do this is false.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Good for you to test the claims. I'll bet that the person doing the demo knows exactly which pans the 'guests' brought to actually use for the test and which ones to ignore!

What other sorts of scare tactics did they use?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

He stressed the "this is the same grade of stainless that is used for pins and appliances placed in the human body, so no adverse reactions"...etc. "Enamel ware is something like melted glass...if you tap a spoon on the sides, it chips off in your food, and if you get holes in it, them metal is exposed". "All non-stick is hazardous to your health"... blah, blah, blah. The only thing he didn't attack was Cast Iron, and the finish on Scanpan...I guess because no body knew to bring them. Darn, I wish I had been smart enough to take a piece of the Scanpan ware along. I am sure he would have claimed that the ceramic titanium finish would break down eventually. This guy was slick.

I haven't tried it, but wondered if baking powder wouldn't give the water a bit of a metallic taste...that was what I suspected that he had done. I still can't figure how he managed to get the soda water from Enamel ware to taste metallic. I don't have any, so I can't test it.

The claims went way beyond "doing no harm" all the way to curing your ills. ;) So much so, that only two of us did not shell out the $3000.00.


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what?

$3000???? I wish you were kidding, but I know you probably aren't. I sure hope that the people there didn't have any real bills to pay. And I wonder how many people woke up afterwards and cancelled their orders.

What a bunch of BS!

Thanks for sharing!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Next time you see this guy he'll probably be flogging Rexair Rainbow vacuum cleaners at $2000 with many of the same health claims unless he's already moved on from that to this cookware.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

All the cookware made by Regal (Salad Master, Cordon Bleu, Kitchen Craft, Royal Prestige) is made with surgical stainless steel grade T-304 That is why they do not taste metallic. Most people do not have surgical grade cookware in their homes. The $3,000 is way way too high, $1,200 to $1,400 is more like it. All Clad sets sell for $700-$900 in WS but are not near as good as any of the Regal stuff.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Wow, I have an old beat-up set of "waterless" ss cookware that I bought at a party/demonstration more than 30 years ago. I don't remember for sure, but it is probably Regal. I DO remember that I got a Regal electric skillet for hosting a party, and it was about the best small appliance I have ever owned. I would still be using it today, except that one of the legs on the pan broken off, and when I tried to replace the borken piece, it was just too much of a hassle. I have burned rice and beans in these pans until the food itself turned totally black, and the pan survived and cleaned up great.

Pam will leave gunk on your cookware, but occasionally I use it on my ss skillet--a light spritz carefully placed just on the bottom of the inside of the hot pan--followed with a tiny spoonful of oil, and I am set for a perfect omelet.

I love my old cast iron skillets as well, but they never go into a dishwasher, and you have to know how to temper them. I have learned that the best way to temper an iron skillet is to use it to cook a big batch of pancakes (always with just a tiny amount of canola oil, never margarine or butter). I can usually cook a whole batch without adding more oil. (Usually if you are having problems with your pancakes, the heat is too high.)

I am planning on buying a few new pieces when I finish my kitchen remodel, but I don't think I will get rid of what I have. Another of my favorites is my old, very heavy aluminum pressure cooker from Presto. The rubber gasket in the lid is gone, but it still functions well for any dish that requires a steady, even temp. I deep fry fish in it, and also use it for making candy and popping popcorn.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Luisfont2, actually they have upgraded to T-316 surgical. He did admit that their older cookware was 304. One gal brought a piece of it and it reacted to the soda, also.

PK guy, don't know where he went, but he was driving a Mercedes to get there. ;)

Jeannieo, that sounds like my kitchen. I have my old favorites from way back and a few newer pieces. I love my old Cast Iron from 45 to 50 years ago when it was still milled out super smooth. The only way I will buy it now, is to search the flea markets for the old stuff. I agree that making pancakes is a good way to season a griddle, but it is easy to do just wiping on very thin layers at a time and letting it cook on over a med-low heat. I read once that beef suet was the best for seasoning Cast Iron.


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I have my Salad Master cookware that my Mother bought for me 23 years ago and I believe she paid around $500.00 at that time. They are the the surgical stainless steel T-304 and I have been using them since. They still look as good as new. Since I just remodeled my kitchen I have been adding new cookware to go with my new kitchen.


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I also bought Salad Master pots and pans about 28 years ago and it still is performing great. Believe me, I did not spend $3,000 on it, guess it's gone up! ha I do like mine, but also own other brands of various pots and pans that I love equally as well or better. I do really like my Salad Master electric skillet, it is probably my favorite piece of the stuff. It does hold up well.


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Salad Master is really good cookware! I don't think I'd pay that for it though. My mom has had hers for 35 years and it seems she told me she paid about $400 for it. They still look really good-I love the lids to them!

I just bought a 7pc set of All-Clad SS at Williams-Sonoma for $469.00 and got two free pans with it. Don't know if that was a good price or not, and really don't care-I just wanted them-LOL!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Salad Master is really good cookware! I don't think I'd pay that for it though. My mom has had hers for 35 years and it seems she told me she paid about $400 for it. They still look really good-I love the lids to them!

I just bought a 7pc set of All-Clad SS at Williams-Sonoma for $469.00 and got two free pans with it. Don't know if that was a good price or not, and really don't care-I just wanted them-LOL!


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My husband got two Saladmaster electric skillets...one about 11 inches and the other about 9 inches, and 11 inch regular skillet with lid, a 2 quart steamer with insert and lid, a 1 qt sauce pan with lid and a couple other pieces that I can't think of right now for $300 at an estate sale. They are in excellent condition and I absolutely love cooking in them. They clean up so well too. I have been looking at them on Ebay to fill in my set but man they go much much too high for me. I would like to have a 4 qt or 6 qt roaster but I think I'll probably have to keep wishing. LOL. I just sold a whole set of Magnalite aluminum cookware on ebay that I have been using for several years. The saladmaster is just prettier.

Nanahanna


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

There's another Saladmaster thread now, so I'm bringing this up for all the good info on it.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I just posted to the other saladmaster thread, and someone in this thread answered at least one question that I had...that old 304 can leach. Anyone with old saladmaster 304 go back and retest?

I'll add here (again) that my enamelled cast iron DID react to the test, Staub brand. (I am heartbroken.) Anyone test their Le Creuset? Now that so many of these products are being manufactured in China (of the lead-painted toys!) I am wondering about enamelled cast iron that is made there, too.

Interesting about the Scan Pan, something to look into. In general, I try to stay away from non-stick, because I can't believe it won't corrode and chip off eventually, but it would be worth testing to validate someone else's results...the question, too, is how long does the finish hold up?

One more thing (here I put myself in danger of being considered a spammer, lol!), the saladmaster rep told me that he recently sold a new set of 316 to someone who had had their set since mid-century or so, and gave her credit for what she paid on the old set. In case anyone is in love with saladmaster, and doesn't want to go through the hassle of selling on ebay, and is planning on getting the new stuff, anyway, that piece of info might be worth some serious change. That isn't an endorsement, it's just second hand information!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Just to clarify some information about stainless steel alloys, both 304 and 316 are considered "surgical" stainless steel. The usual 18/10, 18/8 and 18/0 are all varieties of type 304 stainless steel.

Type 316 adds some molybdenum to the alloy, which does in fact reduce its chemical reactivity.

I suspect that the "baking soda" test is probably dramatically more reactive than anything one is likely to ever be cooking. So I'm not terribly concerned about 304 steel.

Nonetheless, there is a factual basis for their claims about 316 stainless steel, and it would seem that it would in fact would be a benefit to someone who is sensitive to whatever reacts out of 304 steels. I don't have the medical knowledge to even begin to guess how much of an issue this is in real life. Remember that these these metals tend to be present in the minerals that are naturally present in the water we drink.

A note on the Saladmaster cookware: As I understand it, their cookware was made from 304 stainless (just like practically everyone else) until quite recently, at which time they switched to 316 stainless.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I'm done "guessing" when it comes to my health. As an RN, BSN, I wasn't given much training in heavy metal toxicity beyond warnings about lead paint. Nor were the doctors that I have seen over the years, (you know, the ones who couldn't figure out what was wrong with me). They could only suggest ways to mask symptoms. It took a lot of learning and perseverance and finding a useful MD, and finally lab confirmation to find out I had toxic loads of some heavy metals and an assortment of 'cides. I do have a vested interest in all my questions about cookware safety, because the answer may give me another way to take a few more steps toward being healthier.

It didn't occur to me consider cookware as a source of toxins until the child of an acquaintance ended up in the Emergency Room with what turned out to be Nickel poisoning, and the source was apparently narrowed down to the family's cookware. Yes, it was definitely an "issue" in that family's life! They changed cookware immediately.

The trouble is, we aren't just getting toxic metals from our water, which is bad enough. Anyone who ate American produce grown in the 1990's in the USA has probably ingested a number of dangerous toxins, because legislation at about that time allowed companies to dispose of their heavy-metal laden sludge to intermediaries who basically called it fertilizer, and sold it to unsuspecting farmers. This stuff even found its way into some "organic" fertilizers sold by unscrupulous dealers. There was a complete legal loophole that allowed that to happen, and the loophole has not been adequately closed by any means, even now. A Nobel prize was awarded to the journalist that brought this story to light, and the complete story is in book form, now, in "Fateful Harvest."

There are other sources of toxins. Many of us have had plenty of canned tuna in the past, before it was generally known that it was contaminated with mercury and other toxins. (And some of us kept on eating it anyway.)

Whatever the source, we have been accumulating (and are probably continuing to accumulate) toxins that have very long half-lives, and do a lot of damage both on its way into our bodies, and on its way out.

My thought is this - if indeed cookware is contributing to the the heavy metal load in our bodies, it would be good for people to know the facts so that they can decide for themselves what they want to do about it, if anything.

Now, I have not heard one whiff of discussion of real research on cookware. There may be real research, possibly on pay-only sites, but I'm not finding mention of it, or not of useful applicable information for the everyday cook. And no one is quoting it in ways that allow me to track it to a specific study for verification, as far as I have found thus far. Accusations are present on the internet, (some of them very convincing) though, so the absence of response (besides opinions of "of course its safe" or "yeah, its' awful") suggests that there hasn't been a really good financial incentive to fund any research that could cripple any branch of the cookware industry. However, we have some pretty interesting anecdotes that something happens when people change their cookware to the new saladmaster, and in people who cease using cookware altogether.

Isn't anyone besides a few of you curious to find out at least the next step, which is "does my cookware give off toxic substances, and if it does, in what circumstances?"
The question of "does my cookware hurt my health" is quite a few steps down the line. But common sense would suggest that if the stuff leaches into your food, it is going inside of you when you eat it, and to the best of our knowledge, ingesting toxic substances can slowly build-up in the body. We also know that doctors that specialize in heavy metal toxicity warn patients to avoid deep cleansing diets and fasts because of the dangers of releasing these toxins back into the bloodstream.

If I accomplish nothing else, if one person realizes that heavy metal could be part of their health problems, and is able to confirm it and be successfully treated for it, and experience a big improvement in their health as a result, then all this rambling will be worth it. For me, this all started with simple exploration, but hey, if it helps someone, that's great.

I was really hoping for plenty of stories about people and their saladmaster products, I was especially hoping that there would be a few who were curious enough to test some of their different types of cookware, and give feedback that would suggest whether or not the baking soda test really affected all cookware the same way.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

"I was really hoping for plenty of stories about people and their saladmaster products, I was especially hoping that there would be a few who were curious enough to test some of their different types of cookware, and give feedback that would suggest whether or not the baking soda test really affected all cookware the same way.

1. Stories don't prove much--remember the "placebo effect."

2. I agree that it would be interesting to see the results of some tests. However, "the baking soda test" isn't a test, it's a stunt. A "test" would be something like this: In a large glass vat, prepare some soup for cooking. Place equal amounts in a Pyrex pan, a Salad Master pan, and whatever pans you have that you want to test. Cook said soup on as close as possible to equal simmer levels, for the same amount of time. Transfer samples of each to a blender, and puree to a liquid. Test each resulting sample for heavy metal content. Report PPM levels of each heavy metal found.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

This discussion has gotten me to wondering...

I wonder what happens if you repeat the "baking soda test" more than once in a pan? I have a suspicion (unsubstantiated at this point) that what you're really doing is removing some crud from the surface of the pan that has accumulated through use. Which you then compare against a perfectly clean Salad Master pan. I suspect that the "Brand X" pan might come out much better if you repeat the test a time or two to clean off its surface.

One thing this would explain is why enamel cookware also fares poorly in this test. It too would have old cooking junk on the surface, unlike the spanking-clean, unused Salad Master pan.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Basically the baking soda "test" or "stunt" is the starting point for asking all these questions. I want to know what is causing the yukky taste, and what is in the water/food. I like the additional questions and ideas. I totally agree that controls and a wide variety of testing pots be used, as well as a variety of testing "solutions" as it were including real food, since that is what Im concerned with.

I wondered about the effect of repeating the baking soda test on the same cookware, too, it will be interesting to see what the results will be. I had not thought of the idea that food residue might be responsible for the off taste. If it is, it is time to start testing the food before it goes into the pot!

I thought it more likely that a soap residue might be responsible for the off taste.

I wonder, though, what substance that tastes metallic is likely to build up on the surface of a cooking pot that is used for food? The only thing that comes to mind is an excessive use of a metal scouring pad, which may simply peel the surface down below the steel to the aluminum/whatever levels below. I suppose that any cookware that cleans easily - for whatever reason - is likely to fare better over time if it doesn't require lots of scrubbing.

As for the enamel cookware test, I used two different ones: one was brand new, just bought but handwashed in a very mild soap to remove any coating from the manufacturing process. The other was a pot I had been using for over a year. Same yukky results. The build-up theory doesn't pan out, at least not in my test, unless it is a soap build-up. I am looking for testimonials, folks, that your enamelled cast iron doesn't release yukky flavors!

As for the placebo effect, it works because our minds do have a powerful effect on our physiology. Psychoneuroimmunology is a fascinating branch of medicine, and there are lots of interesting stories of how people change their physiological markers by doing simple things like smiling at themselves in the mirrors, positive self-talk, etc. However, it is rare for a complex disease to disappear quickly and completely by means of the placebo effect. However, there is plenty of clinical research showing that getting rid of heavy metals is associated with people being cured from a number of complex diseases, going back a good 70 years. We haven't heard so much about it since the FDA got picky about it. Last year when I was having chelation at my doctors office, I met a man who was having chelation for cardiovascular problems. He hadnt expected his varicose veins to disappear, he said. Medical history shows that chelation helps with atherosclerosis, so it isnt an unusual finding and not likely a placebo effect, as he wasnt expecting that result.

As for anecdotes, like the one given by the person whose IBS went away after using saladmaster, I have mentioned somewhere that I know of people who have gotten rid of IBS on a raw diet: I felt that two possible reasons for her recovery might have been that she reduced toxins that would naturally disrupt her digestion, and that her food was not cooked at a high enough temperature to make it a burden on her body. IBS is due to a disordered bowel environment, usually including candida overgrowth, Now, because lowering fat in the diet helps short-circuit candida overgrowth more quickly than simply lowering dietary sugars alone, I realized that there is a third possible component in the story of the blogger who said her IBS was cured...it may be that she was able to use less fat in her cooking because of her cookware. If that was the single factor that resulted in her healing, she could have accomplished that without the cookware. I know she could have accomplished it on a raw food diet that minimized fat for at least a few weeks because I know a walking and talking person in the pink of health who overcame a severe version of this 15 + years ago, and has been a raw vegan all that time, and is strong, tan, athletic and the picture of health. But hey, if you can accomplish the same goal and get to eat commonly acceptable food that tastes great, woo hoo!

If the lower temps in saladmaster are a key in healing, as Johns Hopkins research suggests, and if (as people say who claim to have tested different kinds of waterless cookware) only saladmaster keeps the food temp under 190 degrees, then to get better she would have either had to use saladmaster or to be very careful to eat raw or undercook her food, watching the pot every minute. This one is outside of my scope right now, I've got my hands full with my current research questions! Anyone else willing to take on testing the temps inside their non-saladmaster cookware?

If the non-reactivity of saladmaster, vs. the reactivity of whatever her current cookware was, was the key, then in order to get better she would have needed to either stop cooking, or cook with a non-reactive piece of cookware, either saladmaster or one of the high quality 304s on the market that do not react. This is based on the theory that the baking soda test is a true indicator, of course, something that has yet to be proved.

If lowering fat was the key to getting rid of her IBS, then she could have achieved that with low-fat cooking in any pot, or without cooking her food at all. It is a big lifestyle change to learn how to prepare raw food in ways that provide for ones nutrition completely, (including learning the lacto-fermentation and/or sprouting of vegetables, and/or grains, so that important foods that one wouldnt normally eat raw could be incorporated into the diet in a healthy way), and it isnt an easy change to make for most people. Waterless cookware, in general, has the reputation of providing better tasting meals without fat.

Those are three possible and sensible cases against the placebo effect. There may be more I dont know about. For example, she claims she didnt make any big changes in her diet, it may be that did make more changes than she realized to go along with her new cookware, new recipes and new cooking techniques. It may be that there was a toxic food source among her fats and oils that was no longer being introduced into her meals.

Thanks for those of you nice enough to ponder these questions along with me....


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

The baking soda test is nothing more than a sales gimmick designed to make the unwary consumer believe that something is wrong with their cookware. Don't fall for it.

A common demonstration by cookware hustlers is to heat baking soda and water in various pots, including the brand being sold. Often cheap aluminum pots are used for the demonstration. When the customer tastes the water from the other pots in the demonstration, a strong metallic taste is noticed. The electrolytes contained in the baking soda solution grossly amplify the metallic taste. On the other hand, the water solution from the demonstration pot simply tastes like baking soda.

This is a strong selling point for the hustler's brand. However, this is absolute non-sense as it pertains to real life. It has no scientific basis whatsoever and it's a totally meaningless test. Who in the world cooks with strong alkaline solutions??

Baking soda in water is highly alkaline (high pH) and readily reacts with aluminum to create the metallic taste in pots that contain that metal. It also reacts somewhat in iron pots, but it does not react with NEW stainless steel......important that you notice I said NEW STAINLESS. SCRATCHED stainless will usually fail this test too.

Sometimes the salesman will ask the customers to include their own stainless steel pots in the test. When stainless steel has been USED and scoured with steel wool or another metallic pad, the SCRATCHES allow nickel to leach into the baking soda solution. This implies to the unwary that the brand for sale is superior to other stainless steel pots.....which is absolute non-sense. Likewise, scratched Enamelware will allow traces of iron to leach into the soda solution giving it a metallic taste.

Although this demonstration is dramatic, keep in mind that it is merely a sales tool....a clever one at that. 100% of the foods that we prepare in our cookware IS NOT as highly alkaline as baking soda, and seldom--if ever--would you cook with any baking soda at all. On the contrary most of the foods we cook in our cookware are slightly acidic (lower pH) and not alkaline. That's not to say stainless steel is not a superior metal to use in some applications, just don't pay a premium for it and don't throw out perfectly good cookware because of this hype non-sense.

Plumfield: Saladmaster items are great for holding SPAM!!

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

techie, thanks for your feedback on repeat testing of your SM stuff. That's 50 times better than what I could guess at an SM demo, though it's barely a drop in the bucket when it comes to the lifetime of a piece of cookware. I hope you will keep testing it every few months or so and keep us posted.

Little update on my research project...
Though a little frustrated that bulk amounts of multi-metal test kits seem to be "out of stock" at the various places I tried to order them, I did manage to get a couple of single-test kits, biting my tongue at the price. My water is clean as a whistle (better be, after all that filtration!), and either the baking soda has heavy metal in it, or salts in my soft water skewed the test somehow, or metals really did come off of the first and only pan I have tested so far. I tested a pan that had boiled dry and sustained some surface damage. It's a heavy 18/10 piece that came as a set with a taller pot and a pressure-cooker top, that I purchased off of an infomercial. It tested positive for mercury, of all things...not at all what I was expecting. One thing it did NOT do was stay "green" for "no metals present." Fortunately, I just found out that a family friend is in the lab testing supply biz, and will look to him for some advice on reliable testing supplies, as well as sources for the same. Hopefully, I'll have the right tools for the job so I can do repeat testing using distilled water, making sure my alkaline solutions are as mild as the alkaline foods that I cook, etc, etc. I may be busier than I expected in October, but I hope to have some further results to post in time, God willing and if the creek don't rise.

For those who think I'm off my rocker, I'll just add that there is a fair amount of anecdotal noise suggesting that food from some cookware tastes more metallic than from other cookware and I think that someone ought to find out how safe our cookware is in our increasingly toxic society.

If you haven't read "Eric is Winning" by Eric Edney, you might find it an enlightening read. He's a real person who, last time I checked, had survived and even improved his condition dramatically over a period of 14 years, especially after doing therapies to remove heavy metals from his body. His condition? Lou Gehrig's disease. He should have been immobilized and then dead about 12-13 years before I read his book. He should certainly NOT have achieved any improvements in his condition. (I know. I've studied the disease and I watched an acquaintance slowly die of that disease...unfortunately, I didn't know there was hope until it was too late.)



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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Hach test kits are readily available from any laboratory supply house. Test kits are designed to test metals in relatively clean solutions because they are based on colorimetric methods of analysis. To accurately use these test kits one must know a bit about possible analytical interferences (both positive and negative) otherwise test results are absolutely worthless. One cannot draw meaningful conclusions from either bad data or a poorly designed experiment. I know a bit about this because I am an expert of 34 years in the field of analytical chemistry.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Toxins, Toxins, Toxins.................BS.
What toxins are you Salad Master advocates talking about?????? ...............please be specific.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Humans are more at risk from the "TYPE" of foods that they choose to eat than from how their foods are prepared or from what materials of construction are used in their cookware. It's non-sense to believe we have a toxic cookware problem in this country. What we have is a diet and exercise problem.

Salad Master is not the answer to improved human health.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

again, I agree with you. It is just one step to a healthier way of eating, but of course you have to put the right food into any pot in the first place. the typical american diet is exactly what is killing us and giving our children heart problems before they turn 20. Exercise and the proper nutrition and proper hydration are the foundations for good health. There is no one particular or definitive answer to improved health, it is a combination of mind, body and spirit along with eating whole foods, drinking pure water and preparing them properly.
This forum started out with a question about Saladmaster and I simply responded to with my opinion of the product. I don't understand how that got misconstrewed as the be all and end all of health and nutrition.
The simple fact of the matter as that we live in a society who wants instant gratification through pills, and fast food and that is where they are going wrong.
If this is a forum where people are looking to bash others or think the worst of others, then I want no part of it.
I was simply responding to the forum which reads: RE:saladmaster cookware question.
If it were a question of overall nutrition or the state of the problems with our society my answer would have been completely different and would surely not have included the cookware I choose to use.

as far as the nonsense you speak of, I only invite you to research it for yourself and see what you find. and while you are at it see what is in the carpets we lay on our floors and the mattresses we lay on. you will find toxins all over the place and certainly cookware wont solve that problem either.

My approach is to keep the things that will make me sick to a minimum while maximizing the healing effects of food and water and exercise along with meditation and breathing techniques.

I hope I have completely explained myself this time as it seems you just aren't getting it!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

"...they are banned as of 2009 because they are so harmful."

Call For References on that.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I was alittle off on the dates

Phaseout of Teflon Is Rare Win Against Chemical Companies


On Jan. 25, health advocates and environmental groups celebrated a rare victory when eight chemical companies agreed to a partial phaseout of a harmful chemical used to make Teflon and other nonstick products.

The deal to reduce the use of perfluorooctanoic acid (PFOA) was the result of pressure from the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, an extremely rare example of government muscle applied to big business in an otherwise regulation-averse Bush era. DuPont, which was fined $16 million in December for hiding evidence of PFOAs health dangers, and seven other companies have agreed to voluntarily reduce use of PFOA in products by 95% by 2010, with a full phaseout by 2015.

Studies have linked PFOA to cancer and birth defects in animals; studies have also determined that the chemical is present in the blood of 95% of Americans, including pregnant women. The phaseout of PFOA will affect the lives of millions of Americans, eliminating or significantly reducing the amount of the chemical in countless household products including stain-resistant finishes, weatherproofing materials, waterproof clothing, phone cables and even pizza boxes and microwave-popcorn bags.

The settlement is unfortunately only a small victory for consumers, who are faced with an ever expanding list of inadequately tested chemicals in common consumer products. Less than 10% of the more than 80,000 chemicals in use nationwide have been tested for their effects on human health. In the three decades since the landmark Toxic Substances Control Act (TSCA) became law in 1976, the EPA has banned only five chemicals or chemical categories: polychlorinated biphenyls (PCB), fully halogenated chlorofluroalkanes, dioxin, asbestos (though this ban was overturned in 1991), and hexavalent chromium. The pesticide DDT, which was banned in 1972 (before TSCA was enacted), is still being found in peoples bodies today.

The settlement announcement was especially surprising in light of the Bush administrations close ties to the chemical industry. The American Chemistry Council, the main industry lobby group, has made $21 million in campaign contributions since the beginning of the 2000 election season, $900,000 going directly to President Bushs campaign coffers.

More predictably, the administration has broadly opposed regulation of environmental health issues and is currently trying to halt comprehensive legislation on chemical policy in Europe. In December, European health advocates suffered a serious blow when REACHa progressive chemical policy reform bill pending in the European Parliamentwas significantly watered down after heavy lobbying by the U.S. chemical industry. As secretary of state, Colin Powell did the industrys bidding to help fight REACH, instructing diplomatic posts in Europe to oppose REACH regulation. His cable to the posts was essentially a paraphrase of industry statements opposing the legislation.

The administration is also expected to quash comprehensive policy reform in the United States. One such reform, the proposed Kid Safe Chemicals Act, is being introduced by Sens. Jim Jeffords (I-Vt.) and Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.) and Rep. Henry Waxman (D-Calif.). The act would be the first reform of federal regulations in 30 years and would require manufacturers to provide detailed health and safety information about the chemical ingredients of consumer products and to disclose such information prior to introduction of products. The bill has attracted several high-profile co-sponsors, such as Sens. John Kerry (D-Mass.) and Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.).

Predictably, the American Chemistry Council immediately opposed the bill, saying it duplicates existing regulations. This position ignores a Government Accountability Office report last July indicating that TSCA fails to identify health and environmental risks before chemicals are used in consumer products. As health advocates wait for the predictable GOP moves to kill the bill, they are looking elsewhere for actionto state capitals nationwide.

Last July, Maine passed the Lead Poisoning Prevention Fund, which will add a 25-cent-per-gallon tax on all paint sold. Revenues from the tax will be used to educate homeowners, renters, renovation contractors and the public about leads harmful health effects. And last October, after a bitter fight between environmental health advocates and cosmetic industry lobbyists, California passed the Safe Cosmetics Act of 2005, which requires cosmetic companies to report carcinogens or reproductive toxins in their products to the state Department of Health Services.

But on Jan. 19, Californians suffered a discouraging blow with the defeat of a bill in the Legislature that would have banned bisphenol-A and phthalates from products for babies and children. These chemicals, which have been linked to birth defects, cancer, early puberty onset and abnormal genital development in boys, are commonly found in plastic items such as baby bottles, teething rings, toys and numerous other products that frequently end up in childrens mouths.

The bill fell one vote short in a state Assembly Appropriations Committee vote when Leland Yee, a San Francisco Democrat who normally is a supporter of consumer rights and environmental causes, changed his vote to "no" at the last-minute.

Yee justified his switch by claiming that the scientific evidence about bisphenol-A and phthalates was inconclusivedespite a decision in December by the California Department of Environmental Health Hazard Assessment to recognize two of the phthalates listed in the bill as reproductive toxins. Environmental Health Perspectives, a peer-reviewed journal of the U.S. National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences, reported that 94 out of 115 published studies found concerns about low-dose effects of bisphenol-A. While more than 90% of government-funded studies surveyed have reported significant adverse health effects from bisphenol-A, industry-funded studies have found no significant effects.

Yees switch illustrates how strong the tendency is for many legislators and government officials nationwide to ignore scientific findings about chemical dangers.

Important fights are underway in other state capitals, such as these:

In January, a bill was introduced in Maryland to ban phthalates and bisphenol-A in childrens products and personal care products.
In Washington the state Department of Health and Ecology is asking the Legislature to ban a class of flame retardants, commonly found in mattresses, seat cushions and computers and other electronic equipment. The chemical has been linked to learning and developmental disabilities, as well as other health concerns.
Massachusetts lawmakers will vote in early February on a ban of mercury in products such as thermostats (14 states have already passed laws to restrict or ban certain mercury uses).
These state-level efforts fill in some gaps in federal regulations and help build a base of supporters for larger policy reforms. On their own, these state-level reforms will not adequately protect humans from the thousands of chemicals introduced into consumer goods and the environment each year. Perhaps the greatest value of these recent reforms, successful or failed, will be the beginning of a wide-ranging debate about public healtha debate which will hopefully cause politicians to value the health of Americans over chemical industry profits.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

..."and the cancer causing agents that come from using nonstick surfaces. You only need to google nonstick surfaces to find out they are banned as of 2009 because they are so harmful."

Not exactly. One of the chemicals used in the manufacture of Teflon, PFOA, is being banned. (PFOA is burned off during the manufacturing process.)

But, Teflon (PTFE) itself will not be banned anytime soon...


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I feel sorry for those of you who after falling for that ridiculous baking soda test feel that you have wisely paid a premium for cookware that will reduce the TOXINS in your life. But the fact is........other cookware is available that will perform just as well as Salad Master for a lot less money.

Modern day analytical techniques allow the detection and quantification of specific molecules (i.e. toxins) down to the parts per billion level or lower. That means analyst can find one molecule of a specific Toxin in a pile of one Billion other molecules and measure its quantity very accurately. It is because of these extremely sensitive measurement techniques that traces of toxins can be found in many things tested. Just because it is detected, does not mean it is necessarily harmful. In the case of metals, what matters is the concentration of the metal AND its chemical valence state AND the amount of the metal that is consumed over a specific length of time.

Did you know that blood anemia was unheard of until cooks switched from cast iron cookware to other metals such as aluminum or stainless steel. It is factual that cooking in cast iron is actually healthful for you.....it can prevent anemia. Salad Master's baking soda test would have you believe that nasty tasting trace of iron is a bad thing for you health wise............again non sense.

Let me rephrase my question in a manner more specific to Salad Master....... what specific TOXINS does Salad Master eliminate from your diet that other cookware products do not??? Please identify those toxins so that we can then take a look at the Material Safety Data Sheets for those toxins and see what the scientific experts have to say about it.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

My husband and I just had a saladmaster demo tonight. We'd never heard of it before. We HATED the pitch, but loved the product. I've been looking on line and found at on epinions that there are lots of affordable waterless cookware sets for under $300, for instance, Chef's secret. Also see Waterlesscookware.com. I've been a health foody for a while, but really did taste a difference in the waterless set, so think I'll purchase a more affordable version. As far as the toxins go, I've been reading a bunch on 304vs 316, and wondered if our resident chemist, could help us out. (Thanks, Dan). From what I could gather, the 316, is better for a marine environment, or inside the body. So does that have any bearing on our cooking? I also wonder about all this toxin stuff. I have a chronic health problem, and spent WAY too much time afraid of the air, water, food, and beauty products I used. Now, I'm finding that stressing less about it and enjoying life more has done wonders for my health. Does anyone know of any good websites that give a unbiased opinion based on scientific research on chemicals and toxins. I've found CHEC (Children's Health Enviornmental Coalition) to be helpful, and "Toms of Maine" for beauty product stuff. But still wondering about all of this stuff. I have a problem with the argument that things that are toxic in high doses are toxic in low doses. Just about anything would be toxic in high doses. The metals issue makes me wonder to. Are some people just more suceptible to it then others? One of the largest cancer studies I know of was the "nurse study" where they followed RNs for something like 10 or 20 years, and found basically that diet and exercise cut cancer risk in half. So after 10 years of trying every alternative thing, I've found that the only thing that consistently improves my health is diet, exercise , the right sleep and stress management/enjoying life. However, I am sensitive to chemicals and perfumes, so try and keep those to a minimum, for me at least.


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More questions about cookware

I just found a site the discusses pros and cons of different types of cookware: http://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheets/HGIC3864.htm
Two more questions for our resident nurse and chemist
1) Is anonyzed aluminum better than stainless steel?
2) I've heard of the health benefits of cast iron, but can it harbor bacteria as it isn't ever really cleaned?
3) Does either the 304 or 316L completely inhibit metals leaching into food?

Thanks,

Valerie


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Valerie,
I would be more than happy to answer your questions. However, let's not limit this discussion to just me and our nurse. There are a lot of knowledgeable people on this forum who will further enrich this discussion. I'll jump right on in after we hear from our nurse. Perhaps we'll hear some results on his or her cookware research project.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware questions

Valerie,

In answer to your questions:

1) Is anodized aluminum better than stainless steel?

Both alloys have an oxidized-metal protective outer coating that limits metal corrosion (leaching). Neither alloy will ever leach toxic levels of any metal into any foods that are cooked in this cookware. The amount of metals that actually leach from cookware into food is dependant on several variables. The most important being the alloy composition and the pH & total acidity (or total alkalinity) of the liquid cooked in the pot.

There are some other corrosion mechanisms that may kick in as well. I have attached a listing of corrosion mechanisms for 300 series stainless steel below. Galvanic, erosion, and pit corrosion may occur......how much metal actually leaches from this type corrosion into your food depends on the condition of your pots, how you clean them, and what type of spoons you use to stir, etc.

Which metallurgy is better is a matter of choice. Aluminum and stainless have very different physical properties and cook very differently. So "better" depends on your style of cooking.

2) I've heard of the health benefits of cast iron, but can it harbor bacteria as it isn't ever really cleaned?

When cast iron is PROPERLY seasoned and cleaned it will not harbor any harmful bacteria. There is a lot of misinformation out there on the seasoning and care of cast iron. Perform a search function (on my username) located at the bottom of the page of this forum and you will bring up several posts that I have written on this subject.

When cast iron is seasoned properly it is perfectly OK to clean your pans with antibacterial Dawn liquid detergent. It is just an old folk lore to not use soap to clean cast iron. Soap and detergents simply CANNOT remove the seasoning from a cast iron pan. It would defy the laws of chemistry if it did.

3) Does either the 304 or 316L completely inhibit metals leaching into food?

The typical laboratory tests used for monitoring metals in aqueous liquids is extremely sensitive. The techies out there know these methods to be Inductively Coupled Argon Plasma (ICAP) and Atomic Absorption Spectroscopy Graphite Furnace. These methods are so sensitive to the detection of metals that they will pick up trace amounts of metals in many things tested.......even the water used for cooking. Cooking water picks up metals through the distribution system to your home.....not harmful.

In practice, the hardest part of the analysis by these test methods is in the preparation of the glassware to perform the test and in finding/preparing a suitable zero metal reference material (i.e. ultra pure water and reagents). The only metal that I know of that would completely inhibit leaching into foods would be platinum.

However, rest assured that neither of the 300 series stainless steel will ever leach toxic levels of any metal into any foods that you cook. Any leaching would be orders of magnitude below any toxic level.

I hope this information helps. Great that you are seeking out the facts and not responding to those TOXIC fear tactics. Everyone needs to ask the question, "if the cookware is so great........why the need for the Baking Soda test?" If it were so "toxic free" relative to other cookware, please present the data. The analytical data could easily be determined as we have a whole host of other analytical methods that could be used to determine both organic and inorganic toxins.
But that won't ever happen..........because both grades of stainless steel are perfectly OK to use for cookware.

In this instance, leave toxins and fear out of the decision making. Brand Name is irrelevant....choose basis warranty, customer support, aesthetic appeal, and cost.

Contrary to what the Baking Soda test is trying to imply......We do not have a toxic cookware problem in this country. Enjoy your new cookware whatever you decide.

Don't worry....be happy!!!

Dan

Here is a link that might be useful: Stainless Steel Corrosion


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Do not buy saladmaster cookware. This is OVERKILL! It is ridiculously priced at $2000 to $5000. While it is true that 316 stainless grade is used in food and surgical equipment, think about this:

It is used in food processing plant where they process food at bulk to make tv dinners sold at groceriy stores. Do you cook food that way, like a food processing plant?

It is used in surgical equipments and these are sterilized at high temperature. Does your cookware have to be cleaned this way to really get a a 316? Thats why 316 is used in surgical equipment and they are used too often in surgical procedures.

Now if you don't cook food like a food processing plant and your kitchen is not like an operating room, why do you need a 316 cookware? 304 stainless cookware just works and cook just fine and still good for our health. Now tell salasmaster salespeople we aren't stupid. If you can afford it, go ahead, good for you. But this is just OVERKILL.. who's with me?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

There is no doubt Salad Master makes quality cookware. But as you have found out, it is way overpriced. Other companies manufacture quality cookware too.....at much cheaper prices. The reason for Salad Master's high prices is not because of the materials of construction; rather, it's overpriced to pay the commissions for all the people who are in the Multi Level Marketing chain between you the customer and Salad Master the manufacture. The only way they can get people to buy at those high prices is to fool them into believing it reduces the toxins in their life.

The next time you see one of those MLM representatives pitching their "Baking Soda" test.....ask them to test their baking soda solution in an empty soft drink aluminum can. And if the test fails, ask them to explain the significance of that failure. If the test purports to test for those nasty toxins, how can it be that both soft drinks and beer continue to be sold in aluminum cans.

Each day many, many millions of people worldwide consume countless soft drinks and beer in aluminum cans. In all cases these beverages contain high levels of carbonic acid and in each case that beverage was stored for a lengthy period of time in the aluminum can before it was consumed.
If an empty aluminum can fails the Baking Soda Test and consequently is bad for humans, why haven't the many Governments of the world moved to ban the use of aluminum for these acid containing beverages?? We would then have all the evidence governments needed to ban beverages in aluminum cans.....afterall, it failed the baking soda test in a MLM demonstration!!!!

If it a fact that most humans consume hundreds of times the quantiy of acidic beverages in aluminum cans than the foods they consume that was cooked in aluminum cookware. Aluminum cookware in not toxic to humans and neither is stainless steel or cast iron.

We do not have a toxic cookware problem that pricy Salad Master products will solve for us.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

mlm comes with a lot of hallelujah, and people defend their 'mlm lifestyle' as strongly as they would a religion

danish and norwegian tv have laboratorytested the metal in the saladmaster pots. comclusion: good pots, but only equally good to pots that are sold through normal retail to a fraction of the cost.

in mlm the sellers are usually also the buyers.

saladmaster is mlm.

your saladmaster salesperson probably also had a little spiel about why this pots are not sold in normal retail, right? and he probably said that these pots are just so much better that people wouldnt be able to do educated purchases just by viewing them in the store. but the truth is that there is no real market for these pots at these prices in normal retail. divide the price in 10, and they could sell in stores... but then the mlm scheme wouldnt work...

Here is a link that might be useful: learn about mlm


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Did anyone have a test w/ copper cookware? I only ask because I attended a "dinner" tonight & was very apprehensive about the baking soda test. The sales rep said he had one in the car, but he left it at home. Is there a different health risk w/ copper that I am just not aware of? Copper was not on the list of cookware in the sales presentation. Maybe I am just missing something. Thanks.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Tin coated copper pans can leach toxic amounts of copper into foods depending upon what is being cooked (i.e. it's pH) and the condition of the tin plating. A small amount of copper in one's diet is necessary for the manufacture of bodily proteins. However, excess unbound or free copper leads to liver problems. On the other hand, copper clad cookware will not leach any toxic amount of any metal and poses absolutely no health risks. Both type pans can fail that bogus baking soda test.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I inherited a SM set from my MIL that she spent over $3000 on. While I like the cookware a lot, it is very good quality, I would not have paid that much for it. We are building a new home and are having induction installed. I am happy that the SM cookware will work with induction.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I had posted the following information on another thread. I'm adding it to this thread as it seems appropriate information for those searching Salad Master or the Baking Soda Test.

"We all eat more aluminum than we realize and other metals too. Aluminum is really all around us in many chemical forms.

It exists in a relatively high concentration in our soil. Some soils have more aluminum in it than others. For example, certain Jamaican soils are so high in aluminum content that it is predominately composed of the ore we know as Bauxite. Bauxite ore (i.e. Jamaican Dirt) is the raw material used in the manufacture of Aluminum. Aluminum is a major component of all clays.....and soils high in clays are high in aluminum content. Some of the dust we breath in has aluminum in it. Aluminum is used to remove suspended solids ( i.e. dirt) from water in some water treatment plants. Natural water picks up aluminum as it moves over soil or through earth's strata. It is found naturally in many of the foods that we eat. It is part of the metal containing minerals that we consume with our foods. It is the metal which holds our beer and soft drinks. When analyst calculate the aluminum content in our diet and it is calculated in its most common chemical form......i.e. Al2O3 (or clay).....it amounts to pound per year. It is not harmful to humans.

We humans consume a lot of other metals too as a natural part of our diet and medicines.......and that's a really good thing!! To name a few..........Sodium, Calcium, Iron, Potassium, Magnesium, Zinc, Selenium, Copper, Manganese, Chromium, Iodine, Lithium, Thallium, etc. Many of these metals are very beneficial to us and we would become unhealthy without them. For example:

1) Iron keeps us from getting anemic and keeps us strong.
2) Lithium keeps us from going nuts.
3) Sodium makes things taste salty and is a necessary electrolyte.
4) Magnesium is used in water softeners.
5) Potassium is used in our body cells to transport energy.
6) Calcium is in our bones.
7) Aluminum is used to clean water. It is in our
antacids. It is in Pepto Bismol. It holds our soft drinks and beer.
8) Copper is healthy, at least according to those
who have the bracelets. It is necessary in our diet for the manufacture of certain bodily proteins.
9) Zinc is in antiperspirant.
10) Iodine is required to prevent certain deficiency
diseases such as goiter
11) Thallium is required for certain brain functions.
12) etc.

However; if we consume too much of these metals, we may become unhealthy. Some metals may become toxic at high concentrations. So what are we to do?

Eat a balanced diet with everything in moderation. Take a vitamin & mineral supplement and exercise regularly. And most importantly.... we need to stop worrying about TOXIC cookware. That problem simply does not exist in this country. It is fraudulent for anyone to claim otherwise.

We need to focus more on removing the stress out of our lives rather than removing the metals out of our diet. The real threats to our health come from stress, food choices, and lack of exercise.

Don't worry......be happy (with your cookware)!! ......goes a long way to making one healthier than worrying about non-existent toxic aluminum, cast iron, or stainless steel pots and pans."

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I went to a Saladmaster party last night. There were three couples there, and by the end of the night, I saw one of my friends filling out the financing forms. I cringed. That guy was so full of you-know-what. No wonder he's the top salesman in 5 states.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

We have now moved into our new home. Our Saladmaster cookware has been in storage for 2.5 years. Our new cooktop is induction. My MIL paid a large sum for a big collection of Saladmaster. Only ONE pot works on my new induction cooktop. Could someone respond regarding their experience with SM and induction.......


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

If a magnet won't stick to the bottom of a pan, it generally won't work on an induction hob...


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

First off, this is a pretty interesting (and long running) discussion on Saladmaster. I'm a little curious why Dan is so anti Saladmaster though, and spends a lot of time trying to give information that substantiates his own cookware, but I would also say that there is equally as much evidence that is contrary to many of the ideas he has presented. So, here are my thoughts on the matter.

Is Saladmaster quality cookware? Yes, without question. No one would have a problem using it (including Dan) if you didn't have to buy it.
Is it expensive? Definitely, and probably more than it should be. Is it worth the cost? Depends on your own financial status. There are lots of quality cookware sets available that don't cost as much. If you have to go into debt to buy it, don't.
Does it have advantages over other cookware? Yes, the ability to cook at low heat without water definitely maintains more of the vitamins and minerals in your food. This is factual and has been proven over and over. The 316L stainless steel is a bonus, but I agree that the baking soda test is more for the reaction than it actually proving anything. I do believe that food cooked in stainless steel tastes better than food cooked on other surfaces, but that is an opinion.

There are lots of other things that I could say, but most of them have been said already. So the big question is whether its worth the purchase. I bought Saladmaster for several reasons-1. I needed some new pots. 2. I could afford them. 3. I liked the low heat, no water, low salt idea. 4. I know Stainless Steel is safe to cook on. I don't think anyone can honestly say that they are sure that their teflon, aluminum, and other types of cookware aren't putting things into their bodies that they might be harmful. I have little kids, and knowing that I'm definitely not giving them chemicals in their food is worth it. 5. When I figured the long term cost of replacing pots and pans every 10 years or so to the cost of SM, it didn't really seem that bad.
Overall, just think about the purchase and if it is worth it to you for the things you know it will provide. If it isn't, then there are lots of other good choices out there.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

matt95,

You have developed a very practical view of the matter, so good for you.

But let me pick on one of your points: "3. I liked the low heat, no water, low salt idea." You do realize you can do this with any of the better stainless steel lines of cookware (Demeyere, All-Clad, etc.).

By knocking down that argument, SaladMaster has very little else to stand on. You agree the baking soda test is bunk, you know that a Demeyere pan is going to last as long as a SaladMaster pan, and you know it's cheaper to buy through channels other than MLM.

So, why would anyone consider SaladMaster then? Just because you needed some new pans and, hey, there's a guy holding a cookware party so I'll just buy 'em from him?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

"I'm a little curious why Dan is so anti SaladMaster..."

I'm not anti SaladMaster at all.......I'm anti misleading information and anti deceptive MLM sales practices that border on FRAUD (AKA the baking soda test). Giving people the low down on those MLM sales practices and that bogus Baking Soda test allows consumers to purchase cookware based on fact and performance rather than out of fear and emotions.

I've said it several times in my posts, SaladMaster makes good cookware; however, there are other brands of cookware a lot cheaper and which have equal functionality and performance to SaldMaster. When given the facts, why would anyone want to purchase SalaMaster cookware from a MLM representative is beyond me.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

This is a very informative thread. I appreciate every one's views and oppinions.

My wife and I attended a SM dinner last night. Our host told us how much she paid for her starter set and we knew going in we weren't buying. But hey, it was free food, so we went.

I was very skeptical of the baking soda test. I knew it was some kind of scam but wasn't sure what. It makes sense that it's as simple as a chemical reaction. As the lady was putting together the "test" I thought to myself, who would ever cook with that much baking soda? I'm not one to be rude so I didn't call her out on it or ask a lot of questions. I played along, made a funny face to give everyone a laugh but I felt strongly that it was bogus.

As far as SM being superior to other cookware regarding the taste and flavor of food...I wasn't impressed. It didn't taste any better to me than what my wife cooks in our stainless Revere Ware. I was told that, "This will be the best fried chicken you'll ever eat." It wasn't. It was good. But certainly not $3000 good. The fact that it's oiless certainly means it's healthier, but does not make it taste better. Somebody back me up on this...fat tastes good. Healthy -NO! Tastes good - YES! I'll put my Mom's chicken, battered and cooked in Crisco in a cast iron skillet in a taste test against chicken cooked in SM any day. There is simply no contest, Mom's will taste better.

Others have already said it best, if you want SM and can afford it, by all means get it. I still think there are other factors, genetics, daily food choices and other factors that are more important to a person's health than what you cook your food in. It's not for me though.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

To answer some of these questions. First off Saladmaster is owned by Regal Ware. They also manufacture other lines of cookware. One made with 304 Stainless and another made with Aluminum. If they were so concerned with our health why do they manufacture what they call toxic cookware? Next 316 Stainless was made for contact within a corrosive environment. They also told me Titanium is a major part of this nontoxic pan. 316 Stainless contains .5% Titanium. I would not say this is a major part of the pan. Next Teflon was not banned in Canada, what was banned was a chemical used in manufacturing Teflon. The process for selling these pans was to scare everyone into thinking their cookware was poisoning them. If they were selling on value and competition these pans are worth 10% of their selling price. Its to bad that they have to use lies and fraud to extract money from people that just want to cook healthy. By the way 316 is only better in a corrosive environment over 304 at over 800 degrees. I dont think that is low temp cooking. Chicken was good but as for no oil cooking. I would have chosen the breast meat not the highly oil laden thigh meat but at that point there would be no flavor. Were any of you told microwave ovens have been banned worldwide? I was told they were first banned in Russia where they were invented. This was to give credence to low temp cooking. Microwaves just make food toxic. Microwaves were invented by Raytheon I dont know when that was a Russian company. I have to wonder if Saladmaster as a company knows how their products are sold. All info on stainless steel, Teflon, Microwaves and other metals and food prep can be easily found on Internet. It did do one positive thing. I learned quite a lot about cookware and cooking processes.
I didnt buy the pans. I took the money and bought a new car. How knew cars and pans cost the same.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

It's funny. The first "waterless" cookware was aluminum marketed back in the 1920s. Some of it even had the little pop-up steam valve. The big switch was cooking in covered pans with small amounts of water to preserve vitamins instead of boiling foods in large amounts of water in uncovered pans. In that time, what we call saucepans were called "boilers," like "double boiler."

Many brands of cookware, including Club Aluminum, Magnalite, Wearever, Revere and Farber were sold as "waterless" during the 1950s, when "waterless" was a big marketing tool. All of them had you wash vegetables, allow the water clinging to them to go with them into the pot, cover and start on low heat. For potatoes and other starchy vegetables, sometimes a bit of additional water was added.

"Vacuum Cooking?" I think what you are trying to say is that once the production of steam exhausts the air out of the pan, the food cooks surrounded by steam with no oxygen surrounding the food. Pressure cooking involves the same principle, but it's not a vacuum, or more correctly a partial vacuum, until the sealed vessel cools and the atmospheric pressure inside is reduced because the higher volume steam condenses and contracts into water. That is why the instructions with cookware that forms a vapor seal, even including the original design of Cuisinart cookware, mentions that if a pan cools without having had the lid opened, the resulting partial vacuum can make the lid hard to lift. Placing the pan over heat will eliminate the vacuum seal.

I never use metal spoons, spatulas, mashers, etc in any of my cookware. I have Farberware, Revere Ware, Corning Ware, Le Creuset, Copco, Dansk, Von Roll and other pieces that are more than 35 years old with no scratches in the cooking surface; likewise newer pieces of Kuhn Rikon, WMF and Silit stainless steel. I use melamine, nylon and now, silicon cooking tools. None of them are left in the foods as they cook. After washing the stainless steel, I use the acid cleaner, if needed, to remove the white film left by some foods. Quality cookware, if cared for, will last and look good for decades.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

whether, cast iron, aluminum, stainless steel, teflon or whatsoever, to me, it doesnt really matter. Its all up to you. You have all the faciities to check whether the salesman or the MLM person is telling the truth. The point is, it is uncalled for to say that ones' opinion or belief is wrong. This forum is not intended for argument.

Its all up to the person what principle of cooking that she/he wants to embrace. Be it an oiless, waterless, or full of flavor, salty, bitter or whatsoever, give her/him the freedom to choose. Just dont claim that you have the best cookware or better cookware than others. Im sure you wouldnt believe in me that I have the best wife in the world better than your wife?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I would like to know if anyone out there has purchased the Saladmasters ultimate set and how much was it, just curous thankyou....


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Just looking at the pieces on the website, they look flimsy. Do they have an encapsulated bottom or cladding? They don't look any better quality than Regal Ware (scorchware).


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I want to know what food you might cook could possibly have the Ph of the bicarbonate of soda solution in that infamous test?
I can't think of any high PH food...am I overlooking something? Do I need to get some litmus paper and see what I can find?
Linda c


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

danab, could you give me one example of advertising anything that is nothing more than a hyped up bunch of bologna?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I loved all of the opinions posted on SM. I recently had a dinner and invited a couple. At first I was apprehensive and wondered where this was going to lead.

The sales rep made her pitch and overall, I was impressed with the food, the ease of preparing, and the time. I am a bit of a health nut and try to improve on my health everyday. I was impressed with the pots. The first thing I did when I saw her put them on the stove was lift it up to see how heavy it was to judge the quality of them (that does not tell of the overall quality, but it is one way I to evaluate cookware that I am going to buy.

I am thinking about getting them, but was researching SM and stainless steel, to see if it is worth the money. About the baking soda test, I am still not quite sure of the benefit of the test, but I do know that drinking from the SM tool( as they call it), it tasted better than the three variations of cookware I used.

I loved Dan's postings, he does not seem biased to me, just giving facts and his opinion.

Oh, the couple I invited loved it and see all the values of having the SM tools and thought it worth the money. I value the husbands opinion, be cause he is frugal, a skeptic, and does not spend a bad penny. So, as you may guess, I was surprised when he expressed how he loved it. One thing that I did like is the food processor. :-)


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

"This is a strong selling point for the hustler's brand. However, this is absolute non-sense as it pertains to real life. It has no scientific basis whatsoever and it's a totally meaningless test. Who in the world cooks with strong alkaline solutions??"

People who cook vegetables, that's who.

The 'baking soda test' is not a gimmick. Just science. Baking soda is a common substance that represents the sodium rich vegetables that we eat. It is a concentrated example of the chemical reaction that takes place between your food and your cookware. Of course there are acidic solutions too, and everything in between. There is no regulation on cookware to speak of. And there is really no need ( or requirement ) to spend the money on 316L or 316Ti, except for a company that has a drive to provide a way, way, way above average product. Yes, there are such companies and Saladmaster is one of them.

Don't knock it, just check it out for yourselves. All you really have to do is do some research ( and you won't have to do much ) on who else uses these highly corrosion resistant metals and why they do so.
You will find some excellent reasons. Even water reacts with lower grades of stainless ( 304 etc ) and 316L MUST be used in Pharmaceutical applications with water and even it's transport! ( otherwise the water gets contaminated! Yes, CONTAMINATED and unfit for use. WATER! Not things with higher or lower pH's. Neutral water!! ( also why Saladmaster pots make a mean cup of T or coffee! )

Here is some technical data. Perhaps too much science 'jargon' yet isn't that why Saladmaster is criticized? For it's extremes? High quality, high safety, high price .... but so 'green' it's basically silly NOT to pay attention.
That said, only those who don't have it, seem to be the ones who knock it.

"By virtue of its molybdenum content, 316Ti has resistance to pitting corrosion
by chlorides (found in things such as table salt (NaCl)) that is markedly better
than basic austenitic stainless steels such as Type 304. This can be shown by
comparing the Pitting Resistance Equivalent (PRE) of 316Ti to that of 304 (Note: PRE
is a relative measure of pitting resistance used by the metallurgical community.) The
nominal PRE of 316Ti is ~23.0, whereas the nominal PRE of 304 is ~19.0. Another
comparison which clearly shows the superior pitting corrosion resistance of 316Ti is
that Type 304 stainless steel is considered to resist pitting corrosion in waters
containing up to ~100 ppm chloride, while 316Ti is considered to resist pitting in waters
containing up to ~2000 ppm chloride.
All in all, the alloys used for this new material exhibit outstanding metallurgical
properties, that, when fused together to form the Solutions Ti material, provide
Saladmaster with the basis for excellent performing cookware."

( in english, that means incredibly clean flavors - like comparing 'well water' to RO water. Putting safety, health interests & money aside, which would you RATHER drink? )

I bought my set in 1995. I sat there with my arms folded challenging the guy to prove to me why and how a set of pots can make such a difference let alone help me save money. Then I decided to shut up and see what was up. I sat there, watched, listened and tasted. It wasn't until about 30 minutes later - I noticed that I felt really, really, really great after I ate ( my digestion was ...'delicate' you might say). It's hard to describe, but isn't that what drives the skeptics wild. Crazy statements - yes, too much to believe! You just have to experience them for yourselves. I'm just glad that I got the pots - it was a rediscovery of food and FLAVOR. It's just super clean taste. Isn't that what eating is all about?
And you betcha, now I tell everyone about the 'magic pots'.
And you betcha, I even 'show and tell' them. I've been changing minds and lives, and stomachs, and tastebuds, and carbon footprints and even helping people save a few thow ( to say the least! ) on food and energy over the last decade or so.

Call us all crazy, but we have the magic pots ( and you don't!).

Scientific? You betcha it is!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Posted by marmar-2008 (My Page) on Sat, Dec 29, 07 at 17:54

Dear Marmar - 2008.

Looks like you just signed up to join the bash in.
Looks like you don't own any of these pots.
Looks like you, for some odd reason, don't want any one else to either.
Looks like this is SPAM according to others who jump all over 'newbies' on this site.
Looks like it simply bothers people when a company has been around for over 60 years and provides an insane product that the owners love.
Sounds like there is something more to this stuff than just many, many easily misled people who don't have any common sense.

Let's face it - you can cook in a tin can after the coffee grounds are all used up. You don't need plasma televisions or high speed internet. You don't need a cell phone - especially one that plays video's or music- and you certainly don't need a phone at home too. You don't need more than one pair of shoes at a time, you don't even need more than one car or bike, or television.

The fact is that technology breaks barriers and things evolve through science. Saladmaster is based on science, physics and facts. And it is rediculously expensive to manufacture let alone purchase.
The technology is maybe overkill for some, but obviously not for those who don't want to 'overkill' dinner or put 'off' flavors and odd reactions into their families' food. Of maybe it's all about the faster and healthier lifestyle it offers. No, could it be that just the speed of cooking, the insane ease of it all and the energy efficiency would be enough to make Saladmaster so popular?
Say it isn't so!
Cooking is science. It is all about sodiums, acids, proteins, minerals, enzymes and natural chemicals in food. They absolutely do cause reactions - otherwise a tomato would never cause a stain, nor would tea taste different depending on the cup it was poured into ( let alone wine ). If foods were not 'chemical' in nature - you would not have to worry about eating grapefruit when you are going through chemotherapy. Cabbage or peppermint would not help digestion, nor would the pot that you cook in affect the taste that you get or the salt that you need to 'fix' whatever it is that you prepared.

The dinner presentation, the cooking classes, the repeat dinners that one can have, the opportunity to experience this system over and over again to see what is what and to find out how the Saladmaster magicians secretly get people to invest in these so called "ordinary pots", for more than 6 decades now.... you would think it would make most think that there is something more to these pots than just a good stage trick or two.

One thing is for sure, if you don't put food or even water in your cookware you will reduce chemical reaction!
'Safe' levels determined by various agencies is what should be questioned.
I was told that chemotherapy was safe too, and teflon, by a doctor...basically in the same sentence. ( he also basically told me that vitamin c was a toxin ).

We all have our opinions. Some have cookware envy.


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RE; RE: Salad Master cookware question

Dear ronny_2008
( looks like you just signed up..... some on here would call you SPAM! )

Saladmaster is not an MLM product. It is called Direct Sales.
The business model is just like a corporate business ( even MacDonalds actually ) - in the way one can start new and grow with a company.

The Norwegian testing ( even the Danish testing ) was absolutely conclusive that the steel was certainly 316L and NOT lower grade plumber steel ( 304 ).
BIG price difference ( ask any blacksmith who makes even dairy equipment!!! )

The energy testing was mind blowing. In Canada, if cookware fell under 'appliance' category, Saladmaster buyers would be offered a generous rebate for it's 70%- 86% energy efficiency.

No claims need to be exaggerated when the proof is in the pudding.
But facts are facts and stainless steel certainly is reactive. What comes off in a reaction depends on the 'recipe' of the steel. That is why certain steels have certain applications.

It's really easy to be an arm chair critic of other people investments.
You really should consider collecting all of the facts, attending a few dinners or interviewing at least a few owners, to really see what is up.
What looks the same isn't.

But MLM it is not - THEN it would have to be expensive!
( generally, retail companies spend 20-50% of every dollar on advertising. Direct Companies spend about 5%. Yes, the demonstrator makes more money than the person standing and waiting to serve you in the nice big posh store - which you are paying for with your purchase ).


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Re:E: Salad Master cookware question

For those of you who are really looking for a reason to NOT buy Saladmaster, well that is easy. Money.

For those of you who are really looking for a reason TO invest in Saladmaster, well that too is easy, Money.

Energy efficiency alone - it will pay you back over, and over, and over again.
If you use it!

So if you like them, and you would be excited to get them ...and if that is all that it did, was to get you looking forward to cooking real food a few nights a week well would that be so bad? Who do you know is even the least bit excited about going home after a long day of work to cook dinner? THAT is why the pots are so amazing - they almost do it for you!

They are expensive, yet they don't cost a thing.
They do what you saw and way more.
If you get them, in a short while you will wonder why you wondered about not buying them and then a little longer down the road you will wonder how you used to cook before without them. Kind of like life without computers and email and these blogs.

Have more than one dinner - ask more questions. Ask them to cook something that you want to see be prepared. The dinner is for YOU.
Go to a cooking class... that is for you too.
Are you kidding, they want you to ask, and ask and ask. There is nothing to hide - especially the price. The more you see it, the more impressive it is.
And the more impressive it is, the more attention it gets, the more people will try to find something wrong with it.

Good luck though.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I just came across this page when researching cookware - I am wanting to invest in something that will last, I am tired of buying new pots every few years. I love cast iron but also need some stainless steel pots for things that are not best in cast iron (I make a lot of yogurt, for example). Can anyone tell me what I should expect to be presented with as far as a price for saladmaster? And do you have to buy a whole set, or can you just buy the pieces you want? One more thing... are the prices negotiable? In my experience, most things like this are not a set price... they give you a price and then you can work them down. Is that how this works?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I notice that the post immediately above me does not include a member's name but only an e-mail address.

Can any knowledgeable forum members tell me how someone posts without having a nic? Is just including an e-mail address an option here?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I have read all these posts and it seams to me that the only people who think it is a scam are the people who dont own it and the people who own it are raving about it.

maybe if you cant see the benifits to your health and reduction in fuel costs you should buy a set I am not an owner but having read all this stuff I wish I was.

It seams to me to be technology moving on we accept it in every other part of our lives so why not the cooking pans?

makes sense to me I wouldnt like a black and white tv and an outside loo.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Nidda, many of the people who claim this product is wonderful are actually sales people for the product. And many others are rationalizing the extremely expensive purchase (see link for more about rationalizing).

Here is a link that might be useful: rationalizing and cognitive dissonance


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Your response to Nidda is spot-on. And I might add that I find it curious that she registered here today to post what she posted. I'm just sayin'. :-)


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I haven't visited this thread in many months and see that some things don't change. The Salad Master advocates are still trying to justify people paying a premium price for their cookware when other quality brands are available at a much cheaper price. . Since when has paying too much for an item become an INVESTMENT?

A couple of months back I purchased an 8 qt. Kitchen Aid 5 ply SS dutch oven from TJM for $80.00. It is of 316 stainless construction and it is strongly magnetic so it can be used even on induction burners. The plys on this particular pot provide for "full body heat distribution" and the lid is designed to provide a good seal. It is an excellent cooking pot of very high quality.

Would one of you Salad Master advocates please tell me what a comparable sized Salad Master Dutch oven would cost. Also, please tell me specifically what the Salad Master equivalent dutch oven would do better than this relatively cheap Kitchen Aid product. How have I wasted my $80 by not INVESTING in the Salad Master product?

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I love the posts that say "after I ate food cooked in Saladmaster, I felt healthier! That proves it's superior cookware!"

Well, yeah -- if you've been eating fat laden cr@p for years, a nice, light meal composed of delicious veggies & small portions of quality meat WILL make you feel better, as will cooking from scratch instead of eating pre-made, processed factory food. The pots & pans have nothing to do with that, though.

"Baking soda is a common substance that represents the sodium rich vegetables that we eat." LOL Sandypots! Vegetables aren't sodium rich -- only the canned stuff. Look at WebMD or the Mayo site on how to reduce sodium in one's diet -- by eating more fresh or frozen veggies (fruit too). Perhaps you mean using Saladmaster to cook salty canned vegetables in? Hardly health food, let alone the issue of whether they contain enough salt to react to a stainless steel pot (doubtful).


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how to retain nutrients in vegetables

Looks like microwaving is best:
Rodale

NYTimes


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Sandypots,

A couple of months back I purchased an 8 qt. Kitchen Aid 5 ply SS dutch oven from TJM for $80.00. It is of 18/10 stainless construction and it is strongly magnetic so it can be used even on induction burners. The plys on this particular pot provide for "full body heat distribution" and the lid is designed to provide a good vapor seal. It is an excellent cooking pot of very high quality.

Would you please tell me what a comparable sized (or smaller) Salad Master Dutch oven (i.e. Magic pot) would cost? Also, please tell me specifically what the Salad Master equivalent dutch oven would do better than this relatively cheap Kitchen Aid product. How have I wasted my $80 by not INVESTING in the higher priced Salad Master product? Why would the foods cooked in the Kitchen Aid pot not be as tasty or as healthful as foods cooked in the Salad Master Magic Pots? How will I put my heath at risk by cooking in the cheaper Kitchen Aid product? Why would the Kitchen Aid pot not realize the same energy savings as the Salad Master equivalent?

Seems to me that if one is solely interested in energy savings while cooking on a completely non-reactive cooking surface, one should "invest" in that other cheaper, very energy efficient, waterless cooking device known as the CROCK POT. Or, why not "invest" in a real cheap, extremely energy efficient, microwave vegetable steamer? Why does it take an EXPENSIVE, metal, Salad Master "magic pot" to do these simple things?

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I think we have deviated from the main point.

This is my first time posting here, and I came upon this site while attempting to research Saladmaster and the other companies who claim just as much.

Well to be honest, every review area has the "Good" and the "Scam". "Good" reviews include individuals trying to sell me the product (Saladmaster in particular for this post), while the "Scam" reviews only further explain why society remains in a cyclical bout of ignorance. I do not take sides in these situations as I feel this only furthers a feud and a road better left untraveled. However, I feel everyone should learn and understand what they purchase, no matter what type of cookwear it is.

I find that "Good" reviews give me the same information over and over. The Pros of "Easy", "Fast". It just screams "Now!". A classic notion, and one used so uninterruptedly in this language of ours. I also see 316 grade metal floated around a lot, and yet no one seems to grasp its meaning. After reading countless posts and reviews I concluded that not too many people understand what they bought.

On the other side of this, the "Scam" reviews also give me the same information. Repetitive statements of "Overpriced" with no viable explanation other than that something else is cheaper. Something is Always cheaper. But again, this is understood in respect to the prices I researched.

So for anyone who is concerned or wishes to widen the loads in their brain, here are the facts.

To understand the differences, understand the product itself.

This is not to say, "Oh well that sales rep said..." No. And it is also not to say, "But the price tag is ridicu--" No.

Learn what you are cooking on. I have read up on all of Regalware's products (Classica, Lifetime, Saladmaster, etc.), All Clad (which include a good portion of your Endorsed products from Chefs on television), Healthcraft, and Various others that I have found (although I realize are not nearly as popular).

Let's start with the grade of the metal:

You cannot lie about this. That would be illegal. Because of this gift of the law it is easy for consumers to compare but they are easily swayed by promotional language. Metal is metal, end of story. There are different grades of stainless steel and different ply numbers. One can look over at the product's "About" page or "History" (anything related to that). Here the product will state the grade of metal it uses and how many ply numbers.

304 grade is the highest quality of metal I found for all of these companies except Saladmaster, However all of the products perform the same functions. No oil, no water, (and more but you understand the direction). Well if they all perform the same functions why is one company, which mind you is owned by Regalware who manufactures Classica and Lifetime in 304 grade (more economical), producing cookwear that does the Exact Same function for a Much more expensive price?

It is no wonder people get frustrated because the 316 Ti factor keeps coming up. It is the only difference. Well if you really want to understand the difference between them, do some basic chemistry and metallurgy look ups. 316 is ten times stronger than 304. Despite the "Surgical Steel" marker used to endorse 304 grades, 316 is used in hip replacements. This is just one example I personally know of considering I got to watch a hip replacement in an Anatomy and Physiology course I took in my third year. I only touch on this, I urge you to read for yourself.

Does this Sole difference account for their price increase? According to simple macro economics it does. According to the low demand because of expensive manufacturing costs, 316 is not something used in excess. Therefore, when a company is able to get a hold of it, they must compensate for this increase. If 316 was used more often, demand would rise, price would fall, then finally even out. The cookwear would cost less, but due to inflation numbers will obviously change regardless.

Want to know Why 316 is better than 304? As I said before. Look. It. Up. Educating yourself about the basic chemical components of a substance in order to make a purchase or "Save Your Family's Health" (no matter how pathetic and oddly threatening that sounds). It is worth it to understand what you are dealing with.

This applies to the "Good" reviewers who feel the need to preach of something they do not fully understand (whether or not it is their own fault) and the "Scam" reviewers who believe the grade of the metal is irrelevant.

The purity of the metal is a testimony to itself. Not only that but the examples also prove that in this case, Saladmaster is correct in their claim. Toxins don't leave the metal for decades, and their warranty apparently accounts for this.

I do wish to add that there is a dire need for individuals to get their facts straight. I notice errors all over where people decide whether or not something is worthy of a purchase based on a claim they heard falsely or interpreted incorrectly. Again, make sure that what you read you not only Understand but also Comprehend. For instance, I have seen reviews where people did not purchase Saladmaster (again the product I am evaluating for myself) simply because it did not work in their oven. With a few more minutes of digging I found that the knob on the lid is removable, and the cookwear is completely oven safe.

So again, we come to the main difference (with all the little petty ones aside), as being the grade of the metal.

This reason may or may not be important to you, and either way it does not matter. This was simply a post to shine a light that not everything (Saladmaster and every other company) is exactly as someone tells you. This is why I don't go into major details of each product. I implore You to do the research. Crack a book or use that handy internet (properly).

But I do have tons of answers to any questions as about four hours of my life has recently been devoted to tons of research here. I like to take care before making purchases that I deem unnecessary, but I'd like cookwear that would last.

-M. Locke


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Question to M. Locke: Why didn't you sign up here instead of just providing a link to contact you via e-mail?

I want cookware that lasts, too. And I know that I don't need to spend the megabucks to do so, despite your specious lecture on metals.

Sorry, but your fancy words do nothing to dispel my strong suspicions regarding your motive here.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I'm a skeptic and a new SM owner. The baking soda test bothers me.
I tried to reproduce the same results with my Mom's Cuisine art ware and got some interesting results that I wish others would verify or discredit.
First, care must be taken to not cross-contaminate samples with a tainted spoon. This is easy to do.
Second, I noticed that the SM cookware - true to its ability to disperse heat well - doesn't boil as hard and therefore doesn't reduce as much. Could the concentration difference be all there is to this demo!? Well, I seriously doubt it as that would definitely put this test in the "scam" category and I think others would have blown the whistle long before now. I hope others will be inspired to do a careful test and measure the amount of liquid left in each of the tested pots. I will too, although identical heat application was easier on my mom's electric stove than on my propane. (I used 1 C water and 2 t NaCO3 - as per my sales guy, boiling for 8 minutes)
Third, when I let the SM cookware boil dry and then added water it had the metallic taste - plenty of it. My parents' reactions told me I wasn't just imagining it. Please try this experiment too. I don't believe this could have been due to scratches as someone mentioned long ago here. My SM pot has only been used 2 or 3 times. Regardless of how I did it, I definitely got the metallic taste from it. Twice. Maybe it was contaminated somehow...?
All that said, I love the stuff and do believe it will help my health in some small way, maybe a large way. (Perhaps more than cheaper cookware used with the same care). For years I sold natural meats and have a small understanding of the food/health connection. Yes, the price I paid is an embarrassment but I understand it and can afford it. I paid much more to have mercury fillings removed. So I was easily predisposed for health reasons to listen to the amazingly disarming salesman and buy a set.
The sodium bicarbonate test just sticks in my craw and I was hoping to find out more here. I hope some of you SM users and sales people try to reproduce my tests and post again.
Cheers,
David


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

If you want to help your health in a measurable way, invest in some cast iron pans. Use the $$$ you save to purchase cooking lessons and quality ingredients. Say good-bye to anemia, over-hyped cookware, and processed foods.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

All of you did me a real service today. I was all churned up on this Salad Master cookware question. I attended a Saladmaster sales presentation/free dinner two days ago (Saturday March 20) and found myself wanting the cookware. My husband did too.

I called my sister, who bought a set of Saladmaster recently, and talked with her and her husband to see if they were still happy about their decision. They are.

I spent hours online Saturday and Sunday and today searching for chef recommendations, independent reviews, prices and competitor considerations without getting any satisfaction. Then I found all of you discussing it up and down and all around. What a mind opening experience to read all of your viewpoints. Dan was a favorite . . .

The "churned up" feeling of wanting Saladmaster has calmed down at last. Rational thinking is back. Funny, to see myself go into an emotional state over this cookware decision.

Thank you very much for taking the time to share your experiences and research and opinions and wisdom.

The lady giving the Saladmaster demonstration told me she will bring me a free pair of kitchen shears on Wednesday. I think we get the shears because my husband and I both stayed for the whole presentation. My friend, the hostess, told me these scissors will cut through chicken bones. Nice. I saw a pair and they look good.

I did not sign up to buy anything, though I wanted to quite badly. Instead, I agreed to hostess a dinner. Hostessing a dinner has the potential of giving me a cookware item for free, maybe one of their electric skillets. Apparently the Saladmaster company wants "qualified" guests who are adult couples with income. If I understand correctly, when too few people show up or if the guests leave early, I might not "earn" the skillet.

I am reconsidering about hostessing. Not sure I will.

If my guests can get a free pair of above average kitchen shears (are they top quality?), and a free five course dinner, is that worth the price of 3 hours of their time? Some of that time was spent watching the demonstrator explain the product line using a flip chart.

Maybe it will be worth it to my friends, maybe not.

If they get churned up like I did and buy the set, and regret it later, am I a lousy friend to have invited them into that situation?

My husband and I discussed the question of whether or not to buy the Saladmaster cookware and elected to sleep on it. In the morning, we discussed it again and at this point we are agreed that we will get rid of our no-name Made in China 18/10 non-stick set. It was a gift and is a few years old and is looking pretty bad now, inside and out.

Now that you have all calmed me down, I am actually very glad I was invited to the presentation. It was especially fortunate my husband attended. He listened well and learned a lot and liked the food, and now is very supportive of improving the equipment I use in the kitchen. What a wonderful shift.

He no longer wants our Made in China set. Hurray!!! I knew about health concerns regarding non-stick surfaces on cookware many years ago and told him several times and then this non-stick set was given to us by a loved one (a much better cook than I am), so I saw my options and used it.

I WILL get new cookware as a result of attending the demonstration.

Thank you.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I'd think long and hard about subjecting your friends and neighbors to a 3 hour high pressure sales presentation. You will have some friends who will attend because they like you, but they won't trust a future invitation from you. You'll have people like me who will refuse to come and will tell you so. If you don't tell people what to expect (a high pressure sales pitch loaded with misleading information), you might lose some friends. Maybe you have some free-loaders who will show up, but they may walk out ASAP.

Friends do not "invite" friends to sales "parties".


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I appreciate your thoughtful response and powerful cautions.

The demonstrator I met on Saturday was a soft sell kind of person. When she heard me say I wanted the biggest set called the Chef Set (something like $7000), she talked me down from that and suggested I choose a smaller set like the "Essential" set for $2500 or something like that, and then buy additional pieces gradually.

She said if I became an "owner", I could refer/introduce someone to Saladmaster and the company will keep the relationship in a database. If the person I refer ever buys a set, the company will give me $100 in spending credit. She said she got to spend $500 recently that way.

She also took our "no" very easily. She did not mention any reasons to buy at that point. Just let us go.

My friends know me and trust me. I don't trick them or leave out pertinent information.

What you said about the misleading information from the demonstrator is a very good point. She made a lot of statements during the 3 hours that basically said, your cookware is harming your family. I really do not like her doing that to anyone. She didn't actually condemn all cookware on the planet, but I took it that way, basically.

She said there are one or two other companies making cookware as good as the Saladmaster (316 surgical steel with titanium). She did not name them.

I don't remember if the Saladmaster cookware she was selling is 316L or 316Ti or something else.

She passed around a metal slice of a pot to let us see the layers, but I didn't hear her identify each layer. I think there were seven layers. Several times she said "316" "surgical steel" and "titanium".

I heard her say something about cast iron being less harmful than some of the others.

Now, after all my reading, I comprehend that even though she didn't say so, she might, if challenged, admit the 304 steel cookware is alright even though it did fail the baking soda test on Saturday OR admit she considers the older Saladmaster 304 steel pots harmful too OR have a nifty exception for the old Saladmaster.

It tore my cooking heart into shreds when the impact of the baking soda test sank in. To believe All-Clad, Farberware, stainless steel Calphalon, Le Creuset, Corning and Pyrex and everything Julia Child used in her television demonstration were all leaching metals into our food . . .

Agony.

Whatever she said that is not factual . . . is a serious consideration. Thank you for reminding me. When she said them to me, it messed up my emotions and thoughts and time. I spun into a time consuming research/shopping effort. Very good point. . .

I know people who like going to sales parties.

Since you don't, friends who understand that about you, certainly wouldn't place you in a situation that has made you unhappy or uncomfortable in the past.

I think some of my friends do like the sales "parties" but you know . . . I could be wrong. Maybe they have been too nice to say so and just pretended to enjoy them.

Another good reason to give it some more thought. I feel so much better. Thank you.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

lucyadss,

I am glad to hear that you found some of the information I've posted in this thread to be helpful to you in your decision making process. Enjoy whatever new cookware you decide to buy.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Went cookware shopping yesterday, hoping you found your Kitchen Aid item at TJ Maxx. You said TJM. I went to TJ Maxx and browsed through their cookware, then at Target. Wanted to find something that would identify itself as 316L or 316Ti. Will continue to keep my eyes open.

After reading all you and everyone else wrote here, I kept searching online.

In one place I learned that letting stainless steel pots soak in an acid/water solution, such as after fixing spaghetti sauce, was a great way to start the corrosion process. I think I heard that warning before and forgot.

Also got to thinking that the stirring utensils and cleaning tools had an impact as well. Lots to learn.

Everyone's comments helped me get through and OUT of the mental anguish, but yours did the most. I want to thank you for writing and responding to all those comments. What you communicated got through to me.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

It's been awhile since I've posted here, it's been interesting reading the ensuing entries. Anyway, I did finally get with a lab to obtain heavy metal testing kits to see what, if anything, came off of my cookware.

I used glass (heated in a microwave, as I could not use the stove) as my control. The water sample I used had a touch of vinegar in it, as I make bone-broths using water with a touch of vinegar several times a week...and sometimes it seems like I have the stock pot going continuously.

As expected, my vinegar-water-in-clear-glass sample (both cold and heated) was completely negative for heavy metals of any kind.

As I expected, my much-used 18/10 gave off some strong positive readings, including a Made in China pan that read high for mercury (per the indicator color), of all things! I wasn't expecting that particular metal, even though this poor pan had been subjected to burning food enough times to look pretty dreadful. It made me realize that, in China, bad things may be going into more than just the paint on toys at Walmart(lead) and into the formula that killed a number of infants in China (melamine).

The remainder of the cookware all showed some reaction, with the 18/10 and the enamelled cast iron Staub being the highest. However, my corning ware and green glazed crockpost also showed positive for mixed heavy metals, albeit a much less strong color change than the 18/10 and the Staub.

I repeated it with a light dilution of baking soda, to mimic cooking alkaline veggies, same results.

I wish I'd had some of the less reactive stainless steel pans to try out, whether 304 or 316, etc, but I didn't. I was not surprised that my damaged 18/10 pieces showed positives. I was really surprised at first at the positives in my enamelled cast iron (Staub, black matte surface)corning ware and crock pot, but then there might be a touch of cadmium or other toxic colorants in the glazes. They are allowed, although there is a ppm level to be observed by law.

SO...I have reason to believe that at least some cookware is more reactive than some people seem to think. From a clinical standpoint, not everyone's body is equally adept at disposing of these toxins. If you are, lucky you. If not, consider staying tuned until someone tests the higher quality cookware, or you can go raw and/or start eating plenty of cilantro, chlorella, spirulina, and fermented foods like sauerkraut and miso soup - these are great ways to mop up toxins in the body. Those who do not do well processing metals may be more susceptible to a number of different conditions. There is a small handful of doctors and clinics who are having success by providing these patients with enzymes they are lacking that help them deal with these toxins, among other things.

I'd like to test some of the higher quality pieces of cookware when I decide I can put some more money toward the experiment. If I do, I may be back.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

My post wasn't about Saladmaster per se, just a follow-up on something that I posted that I planned to do, and as a practical example that "studies" may not be as accurate in real life as they ought to be...possibly because products aren't exactly what they ought to be. The original poster was asking about the gimmicky baking soda test and scare tactics, and I'm trying to address my findings on that with tests on several different sorts of common cookware pieces in my kitchen, and yes, the results are not very nice.

One more thing. The topic of this thread is a brand of product. It seems a little unfair of some posters to automatically brand people as spammers if they like the product or have any sympathies for the product, simply because it is a high-priced product. I understand that spamming is a problem, but some people seem to have a knee-jerk suspicious nature about it. And again, if you are looking to share opinions and experiences about a product, and then bash people who like it, well.....I haven't hung around very much because I didn't like that sort of climate.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

plumfield,

I understand your concern and your search for products that leach fewer metals. However, one simply cannot rely on a home test kit to accurately determine the metal concentration of a baking soda wash. Nor can you be sure that what you are measuring is in fact the metal you are tying to determine. There are likely both positive and negative interferences with your test results....its just the shortcomings of the method that you have used.

Personally I do not have any problems whatsoever with Salad Master cookware. However, I do have a BIG PROBLEM with the manner in which it is marketed and it's high price. Comparable to better quality cookware is available in the marketplace at a much cheaper price. The baking soda test is pure baloney and has absolutely no correlation or relationship to the safety of any cookware product. For those hyper sensitive to trace metals of any sort....I would go with glass or a Corning ware type product. Also, I would not hesitate using a crock pot or slow cooker that was made by a reputable company. Those type products may limit the kinds of food that you can prepare due to the limited cooking techniques these glass products will allow. For higher temperature cooking, I would go with a premium tri-ply stainless steel pan. I assume that you do not use any canned product of any sort nor do you use regular metal knives, forks, and spoons as these items are sources of trace metals too. Similarly with all make-up, toiletries, medicines, toot fillings, coins, keys, jewelery, etc, etc.......as these are also sources of trace metals. Many people today are still walking around with mercury in their tooth fillings. Too much mercury affects the brain. Do you know that the old expression....."Mad as a Hatter" came about from the times when hats were popular. Lots of Liquid Mercury was used in the manufacturing of hats.....it was used to help develop the shape of the hat. Over the years the Mercury that the hat makers used in producing the hats........affected their brains. They acted like they had gone mad. True story.

Hope that you find something the works for you. I'm sure that it is tough being sensitive or allergic to things that are so common in our environment.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Plumfield,
I would submit the question of what are your symptoms of sickness that you referred to back in 2007? Heavy metals are possible causes of disease, but there are more common causes that doctors do not have much if any training in. If you would list just 3 of your most prevalent symptoms, I will respond to what I am referring to.
Since you are attempting to test metals in cookware, consider this factor: Stainless steel has open pores. If there is an attatched base to the pan, it is possible that the metals in the attatched base are exposed to the food. (the vinegar or soda) T304 is a grade of surgical steel as is T316. There are other grades of surgical steel as well. Surgical grade steel should not have any reactive metals or it would not be surgical grade! It is possible that the T304 pan that is dicussed earlier was not cleaned sufficiently, it may have had a base with aluminum, etc. It could have open pores although it is not supposed to have but it could so the applied base metal reacted to the soda. China makes pans of T304 steel, but China is not known for high quality control. I have doubts that it is always what it is stamped as. T304 may be on the pans outside, but T304 may not in fact be what is in the pan!
I have owned quality waterless cookware since I was 19 years old. When I lost it in a divorce, I bought another set. I don't want to eat out of anything other than surgical steel unless I have no choice. I watch the cooking shows at times and it amazes me the junk that is used out of ignorance. If it is not surgical steel, there will most likely be reactions to the materials that the cookware is made of. Salts are not the only things present in foods that can react to the materials used to make most cookware today. Meats have acids, fruit and vegetables have minerals. Minerals are salts (the flavor) and Vitamins (the color) and enzymes (the live part of any foods). Minerals, vitamins, and enzymes are what make food for the body. The fiber fills us up and helps clean the leftovers from our insides. To put each in order of importance, the enzymes are 1. the vitamins and minerals 2. and the fiber would be 3. Without the live part of the food, the enzymes, the vitamins and minerals would mostly go right thru and never enter the blood stream. The fiber makes us feel full, but also helps eliminate the waste. Microwaving keeps the vitamins and minerals for the most part, but kills the enzymes. Enzymes are destroyed by heat. If you are sick, juicing is the best way to eat because you get all the enzymes, vitamins, minerals and fiber. You can eat 5 lbs of carrots in about a quart of juice. If you cook food in most conventional methods, you lose all the enzymes! Microwave= 300+ degrees in 1 minute. Boiling= 212 degrees. Steaming=232 degrees. Oven baking is never less than 180+. I have not tested a crock pot= ?degrees? I list all that to say this: Enzymes begin to die at about 110 degrees. Most are dead by 165 degrees. We should get our enzymes or live food from fruits and vegetables as the body is able to matabolize those most effectively. Meats are a source, but for safety, we consider raw meats to be somewhat unsafe because of bacteria. Heat kills bacteria so we cook meat to certain temperatures to kill the bacteria. We often eat vegetables raw and that is good, but since we like to eat them tenderized so we cook them.
Consider this: What if you could tenderize the vegetables, not add heavy metals, retain 98% of the vitamins and minerals and still retain a reasonable amount of the enzymes? What you have is delicious and healthy food. Whether a soda test works with all the various cookware or not, I have yet to find a pan that can give the flavor, color, and ultimate taste to any vegetable, fruit or meat. Waterless cookware tops the list for ease of food preparation, food taste, food color, quality of texture of the food, and ultimately the health of those who use the system properly. I am 57 years old this summer and have had some serious stressful setbacks in the last 15+ years. At this time I am healthier than many 40 year olds. I try to eat healthy, I keep active as my life allows, and I watch my weight. I know that if I ate like most families do, I would be in the same frame of health as many families are. Just look around and see what the average families general health is like.
Our bodies are "living beings". We must eat live food to maintain our health. Boxed, canned, frozen and dried foods cannot create health. It can be stored for years in many cases. It has no enzymes! It is dead food! Basic health cannot be had by eating dead food.
If a person is sick, juice your foods. Get the food from the freshest sources. If a person is reasonably healthy, stay that way eating simple healthy foods from juicing to tenderized foods. If a person is already extremely healthy they are that way because they have been careful with how they prepare their foods and what they are eating, drinking, breathing and doing in general with their bodies.
Heavy metals are a consideration, but there is much more to the equation of living healthy. Everything in balance!
Sincerely,
Art


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Hmmm, well, I just turned 60, and I'm in excellent healthy myself -- thin, active, and no medical issues whatsoever.

I attribute this condition to not obsessing about cookware nor buying into nutty junk science.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Just so you all know -

316 stainless is 304 with molybdenum added - really - that's it. Also, 316 is not "twice as strong" as 304. Nope - not even close. Go to the link provided for the Nickel Institute and scroll down to the table - shows all types of stainless, the composition of the metal, tensile strengths, etc.

As for the claim that Regal makes the majority of metal pans, you might want to look at the Meyer Corporation (meyer.com) they make - Anolon, Circulon, Farberware, KitchenAid, Silverstone, and BonJour cookware.

The BonJour copperclad saute pan is a great piece.

Here is a link that might be useful: Nickel Institute


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I have done some research on metals leaching from stainless steel. Indeed iron, nickel and chromium do leach out. References:
Kuligowski,J & Halperin, KM, Arch Environ. Contam. Toxicol. 23, 211-215 (1992)
Kumar, R et al, Bull. Environ.Contam. Toxicol. 53: 259-266 (1994)
These scientists used mildly acidic (5% acetic acid = vinegar) or mildly basic (5% sodium bicarbonate) and found readily measurable levels of iron, nickel and chromium leaching.

I have run my own less than stringent tests of Saladmaster, Revereware and Kirkland (Costco) cookware using tap water and found that measurable quantities of these metals leached. The Saladmaster was similar to the Kirkland. The Revereware leached the least. Very old Revereware by the way.

Full disclosure: one of my brothers has started selling Saladmaster. He pitched me and I was not impressed with the sales pitch. However, I used one of the pans and was very impressed with the heat transfer and the cleanup. They are excellent pans but way overpriced in my opinion.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Has anyone heard of "Life time" cookware? My mom bought a set from a door to door salesman back in the 50's or 60's and I'm still using it today. She said she paid a lot of money for it, by making monthly payments. Is this anything like the SM?


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Heck, I have some of my Mother's old Revereware from the 50's and it's still just fine. And it was pretty cheap, compared to these other pricey things.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Has anyone heard of "Life time" cookware? My mom bought a set from a door to door salesman back in the 50's or 60's and I'm still using it today. She said she paid a lot of money for it, by making monthly payments. Is this anything like the SM?

Life time was one of a few SS cookware that was sold either door to door or through parties back then. My uncle owned Lo-Heet, and my dad was a salesman. I still remember sitting out in our car with my mom while he was in someone's home demonstrating this amazing new waterless cooking. :-) One of their selling points was that you could pile one pot on top of another to save energy (this was not too long after WW2). But yes, they are similar in that they touted their pots and pans as being more healthful.

Funny thing, my mom used and liked the pans, but never did she really master the "waterless" part. Anyway, sure, it was good. I have a complete set myself, but don't use it too much anymore. Modern methods of manufacturing high-end cookware has produced, IMO, better results.

I would never, ever consider spending huge amounts of money on any "marketing" type cookware that preys on people's fears through baseless claims.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

From Kuligowski,J & Halperin, KM, Arch Environ. Contam. Toxicol. 23, 211-215 (1992):

" It is very unlikely that the total amount of chromium leached from stainless steel utensils, even into acidic foods, exceeds 50 g/day i.e. an amount considered beneficial to health....Small amounts of chromium will leach from stainless steel utensils into food during its processing, storage and during meal preparation. Although it is conceivable that some of this leached chromium may be in hexavalent state, it is unlikely that this leaching will result in actual absorption of hexavalent chromium by the organism. No toxicity is to be expected from the chromium leached from kitchenware, it may in fact be beneficial to health, since the amounts of chromium in present Western-type diets are generally small in comparison to amounts considered to be optimal."

Not cited by JCStates, but newer research:
"Purity of food cooked in stainless steel utensils"
G. N. Flint; S. Packirisamy
Food Additives & Contaminants: Part A, Volume 14, Issue 2 February 1997 , pages 115 - 126

Abstract:
"An extensive programme of cooking operations, using household recipes, has shown that, apart from aberrant values associated with new pans on first use, the contribution made by 19% Cr/9% Ni stainless steel cooking utensils to chromium and nickel in the diet is negligible. New pans, if first used with acid fruits, showed a greater pick-up of chromium and nickel, ranging from approximately 1/20 to 1/3 and 1/20 to 1/2 of the normal daily intake of chromium and nickel respectively. This situation did not recur in subsequent usage, even after the pan had been cleaned by abrasion. A higher rate of chromium and nickel release in new pans on first use was observed on products from four manufacturers and appears to be related to surface finish, since treatment of the surface of a new pan was partly, and in the case of electropolishing, wholly effective in eliminating their initial high release."


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

The thread that won't die!!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Maybe this will kill it


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

HI, I tried to leave a message then got an account set up so I'm sorry if this is a double.

Like many other husbands I got "invited" to a meal at a friends house - yes I knew it was a pot's and pan's presentation, checked with the wife before we went and no we weren't in the market, just helping the friends son-in-law (a chef) out.

So, free food and a chance to talk to some old friends - I was in.

Sales presentation wasn't too bad, guy was funny and willing to take on all questions. He did catch my interested (was an Organic Chemistry major in college many, many years ago but not practicing any longer).

I've read most of everything here and elsewhere. I agree they are expensive but where does one find the quality and features (I like the oil fill, the tight lids and the removable handles) for less than a weeks pay (I said I wasn't a chemist anymore).

Please be specific, just don't say they are out there.

Thanks

Brad


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

If it's a cheap buy for you, go ahead. So why would you need specific features? And how do you expect your cooking to be any better with $3000 to $5000 worth of cookware? Spend your money on quality ingredient instead. But if you have money to waste, go ahead.


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on second thought

If you have that much money to spend on pots and pans, spend about $500 on a perfectly good set of anything and then sent the remaining $3000 to your local Food Bank or Meals on Wheels. You'll sleep better at night.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

You should really do the pot test yourselves. You will need a teflon pan, stainless steel pan, copper pan, cast iron skillet, aluminum etc.....also needed 1 cup water and 1 tablespoon baking soda, boil, don't stir because you don't want to contaminate the other pans from stirring pan to pan. Boil for about 5 minutes or
until you no longer see the baking soda. Some people say that, "I don't cook with baking soda and water"....well, actually we do, it's a natural mineral....it represents the minerals found in our vegetables. If you were to have a saladmaster pan or know of someone who owns some, ask them to use one of their pans...even if you don't know of someone who owns saladmaster still do the test....you will be amazed. The point is to show that there could be things in our food and we not know that they are there and are extremely harmful to our health.
For those of you thinking that the person doing the presentation must have done something to the baking soda or cherry picked on the pans to use.....TRY IT YOURSELF and I am sure that you will be floored with the experience. Saladmaster-316 Ti Stainless Steel is the highest grade of stainless steel and saladmaster is the only company to use it....What you put in saladmaster pans is exactly what comes back out. The Saladmaster tastes like baking soda....kinda fishy or salty like the ocean.......The copper tastes like cooper and metal, the stainless tastes like metal, the cast iron you don't even want to taste because the sight of it is so disgusting and the teflon tastes like chemical and plastic. YIKES! Try for yourselves and yep the price is pricy but I purchased it after she did the pot test and NOPE I don't have a lot of money but I sure do value my health and the health of my 10 year old beautiful little girl.
The people who usually gripe on this forum are because they can't afford it or are too stubborn and ignorant to listen to what the rep had to say. AND NOPE I'm not a dealer or consultant or whatever for saladmaster I am a nutritionist that works with the Cancer Institute.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

The point is to show that there could be things in our food and we not know that they are there and are extremely harmful to our health.

Interesting logic. BTW, could you specify both the exact name of this institute with which you work and exactly what work you have done for them?

And for what it's worth, it's a bit presumptuous to sign up here in order to insult others for being penniless and/or stupid.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

You might be a nutritionist that works with the Cancer Institute. However, I am a retired chemist & love to cook. I know a thing or two about chemical reactions, metallurgy, and cookware.

That silly Baking Soda Test is just a Con Artist trick designed to fool gullible people into buying very expensive cookware. It has absolutely no significance and meaning in helping one assess or decide between harmful or healthy cookware. NO ONE cooks any food with the high alkalinity of baking soda. It is absolutely ridiculous for anyone to claim that this dumb test represents anything remotely similar to what one experiences during normal cooking.

The Baking Soda test and subsequent sales pitch given to potential customers actually BORDERS ON FRAUD. I have other postings in this thread that you might find interesting to read.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I feel like we are going for the "# of posts" limit. I thought it was 150. Guess not!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Perhaps a few people are still finding this thread informative and useful to them. Maybe it shouldn't go off into never never land. I thought there was a 150 post limit too.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

It can still be informative, I just wonder why it isn't closed to follow-up post yet. I will still stay in the forum.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

In case the subject comes up again after the thread is closed, can one of you copy the relevant posts debunking the myths and save the material for possible future use? I'd do it, but am having computer issues now, and may be looking for a new machine soon.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I'll make sure that happens if this thread gets maxed out. I hate to see people getting ripped off or presented with a dumb test as a basis for their decision making.

Dan


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Does anyone know when the conversion to 316L took place, and what the cost is of exchanging? Thanks!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I swore this thread was dead already!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

OMG it's alive...........ALIVE


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Just wanted to throw in my 2 cents. I was searching the web for Saladmaster pots and pans just to see what the going rate is. I want a set because my grandmother has a set that she bought at a party in the 70's. She bought them for around $500 (at a time when you could buy a japanese care for $2000).

Anyway every time I've used them at her house, I've admired them. They're over 30 years old and still look and cook great. The metal is much thicker than any other pot I've ever cooked with and it seems to distribute heat much more evenly. I'd love to have a set, but even used a 21 piece is going for $1500.

Even before I read in this article about not leaching metals into food, I wanted them just for the quality.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Metal won't leach into your foods. Check out All CLad or Calphalon for good heavy cookware. It'll be expensive, but not nearly as bad as the over-hyped over-priced stuff.


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Saladmaster cookware question

Hello.

Does any one know how much saladmaster sales person pay for a $1000 pan and $4000 set? I've cheked ebay and they are selling much lower price than the price I was told at the cooking party. I have a couple of pots and pans from saladmaster( I got them all free by winning contest and doing party) and I really like them.

I would like to add more cookwares from Saladmaster and want to make an offer to the sales person I know. but I will never pay the full amount. I would like to know the price sales person pay so I can make an offer not too low.

anyone knows about this please help.
Thank you.


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Yet Another Entry Into This Neverending Thread!

I know you regulars are rolling your eyes that this post is still ALIVE, but I'm glad that it is. I wouldn't have had the slightest interest several years ago when it started.

Anyhow. A couple years back a very well-educated, fairly well off, frugile, rational skeptic friend of mine (along with his wife), bought a set of SM. I think it was one of the more modest sets - thinking they would build upon it.

They have a large family & are very much into healthful well-rounded living (healthful in all areas). My friend is not one to succomb to non-sense - he was blown away by this product = enough to begin selling it himself (only here & there, "really, as a community service"... lol), for a time.

He still swears by it. He began giving me the schpeal - which I found a bit insulting - given that I live on a disability income that simply makes the purchase of this product prohibitive. I kinda felt like if he believed it was so imperative to my health then why on earth isn't he forgoing his own commission to add a piece or so to my cookware? Not that he was obligated to me, but jeez, I once made great money, but after my car accidents I live on $700 a month. He, along with other sales people I ran across on FB really like to imply that NOT buying it means that I truly do not value my health or that of my loved ones - an implication I highly resent. I wouldn't even be able to get credit for such a thing - certainly wouldn't be able to make the payment. I love him, but thought it was insensitive, assine, & way out of touch with us "commoners" who live from dollar to dollar. He had the cash to purchase his OUTRIGHT! I'm happy for him, but didn't appreciate the guilt trip - even though I KNOW he meant well. (and I absolutely respect his opinion - enough so that I'm here researching it, even now)

I have read this entire thread. I arrived here because I've been doing research into SM & whether or not the claims are real. I happen to be highly suseptible to heavy metal toxins, many environmental concerns, many pharmaceuticals, food addictives, preservatives, etc, etc. My neurologist recommended to me to look into this notion of my fillings leeching into my system & other areas (such as cookware).

Hell, he's highly educated & he believes in it too. I wouldn't be so swayed if it were not for two people I highly respect & admire, not only telling me they believe but standing behind that claim & doing something about it.

Granted, they both earn enough to just buy the SM & not worry about whether or not it's at least partially a scam. I appreciated all the info & debate on the matter that I found here - even if I didn't always like the methodology.

Now, is anyone aware of the other options that basically offer the same thing as SM (quality, material, at least as good of a warranty - if not better, etc, etc) - but for a fraction of the price? I've completely altered my lifestyle because of health issues as a result of my MVA's... I eat organic, local, whole, healthful foods - as few additives & preservatives & GMO's as possible. I do the very best I can. I'm ready to have cookware that supports my healthful lifestyle.

Thanks for any positive input. And, sorry if it is annoying to you that this thread lives on... I'm grateful!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

For healthful being:
I have this cookware and love it. This is not spam, just trying to help out. I believe Ray has retired, but will help you out. He is truly a gem.

http://www.oklahomacookware.com/


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

For "healthful being", buy better quality foods, no processed foods, and learn to cook it yourself. The cookware won't matter at all.


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RE: Salad Master baking soda test

I repeated the baking soda test post salad master dinner party. I had taken a pot to the meeting - which had developed the metallic taste. Using another of the same pots I recreated the experiment using a disolved sodium bicarbonate solution 1 heaping teaspoon to 1 cup water. The pot developed the same metallic taste as in the demo. I also retested the pot that had been used in the demo. It did not develop the same metallic taste.

Hypothesis: the sodium bicarbonate interacts with hard water deposits (calcium, lime etc) from past water exposure to create the metallic taste. Sodium bicarbonate is an effective stain remover, after all.

If this hypothesis bears out, then the saladmaster test is a test of the last time you descaled your pots and pans using sodium bicarbonate


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

But only valid with hard water, I'd guess.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

healthful_being, if you're concerned about metals leaching into your food while cooking, why don't you save your pennies and get enamel coated cast iron? Le Creuset is very expensive, but if you do a search for it here in the Cookware forum, you'll see that Le Creuset owners absolutely love its cooking qualities. Happily, there are less expensive brands:

Lodge Enameled Cast Iron

Tramontina Enameled Cast Iron

Sure beats wasting thousands on that silly Saladmaster stuff.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

I attended one of these SM dinners this evening. While impressed with the quality (it's hefty, especially that shredder thingy) the price scared the the poo out of everyone. And because of the inflated price I knew I would be leaving empty handed, so the entire evening was spent worrying about how I would shirk the sales pitch.

Needless to say, I wasn't able to avoid it. I was cornered in the kitchen during clean up. I told him I thought it was over priced and of course he began his spiel about how I would get that money back on the "return" of my investment. *eyeroll* Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's great stuff. I get it.

THEN, what REALLY turned me off when I asked if they had a website that I could check out and possibly order from, he said that yes they had one, but the only way to get PRICING was to attend one of their parties, therefore I should order immediately! Bwahaaaa!

He claimed the food only cost $15. I'd love to know where he got all that chicken and vegetables for $15? Obviously it was low quality stuff, as my husband complained of a stomach ache afterward. I got gas pains. Yummy. Not that it matters because there is no way we (who buy organic produce and meat) could feed seven people for less than $20, unless, like their party, you didn't prepare enough for everyone. lol

And yes, the baking soda test. We were all rather impressed with it. However, my step-son noticed the SM pan was on lower heat than the rest of the pans. When he determined they had boiled enough, he turned off two of them and left the SM and other stainless pan on for a bit longer, claiming they had to catch up. O.o I do have to say the SM pan water tasted the best. But if it's like you guys say and it's that it's a new pan with no build up or whatever, then I'm rather less impressed.

My husband and I have decided, however, to trash our old teflon pans, which stopped being non-stick years ago. I figure that whatever was coating them is long gone, and only the black, useless pieces of what remains IS probably peeling off slowly and mixing in our food. Ick.

I've never been a fan of aluminum or stainless cookware, though. And cast iron is a PITA! I have one iron pan, which I use sometimes, but it's ruined I think. I tried seasoning it when I first got it, but it was annoying. I hate the thought of not cleaning my pans with soap...which I hear you CAN do with iron now? WTH! Anyway, too late for that pan.

Should I go with cast iron or a high quality 304? I HATE to burn stuff. I HATE when the food sticks. That stupid SM pan had stuck on chicken that he said would wipe right about with a paper towel. Uh, no it didn't. Then he retracted and said just a little bit of hot water would loosen it right up. Well, duh. A little hot water loosens anything up in a pain.

Anyway, glad I found this forum before I took the cookware plunge. Any recommendations? I don't mind paying a little more for good stuff, but when ONE 12" skillet costs $905 I have to seriously question the sanity of anyone selling or buying it.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Having had a demo in our house today, (and my husband was sold on the stuff) I am researching online to find things about it. One thing I've noticed is that I can't find any other cookware with a titanium coating.

The taste test was dramatic, to say the least. By FAR, my beloved Le Creuset pots were the absolute worst of the bunch. I'm going to repeat the test myself with plain water, or even peas or onion or some vegetable, to see if I get a taste difference without seasoning under normal conditions.

I have a friend who cooks in copper-clad stainless steel and her son had a very elevated copper level in his blood (he was being tested for heavy metals due to his health conditions).

We do all we can to try to minimize our exposure to things that leach-I feel like in this day and age humans are marinating in chemicals day in and day out-everything from the endocrine disrupting BPA in canned goods and register receipts to multiple toxins in pretty much everything with a fragrance, but I don't want to spend $4K on a small set of pots when I have others I love. I'm curious about extensive testing done on other brands of surgical grade SS and enameled cast iron, the links further up in this thread didn't work, if anyone finds out about studies done on leaching I'd love to know!


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

"Any cookware" (and I do mean "ANY"....even from China) made out of surgical grade stainless steel will never leach any harmful amounts of metal into the foods that are prepared within it. The same holds true specifically for Le Creuset enameled cookware. Given these FACTs, it is really silly for anyone to pay thousands of dollars for Salad Master cookware....or worst yet, pitch out perfectly good cookware. To fear using or to pitch out any Stainless or Le Creuset pot/pan based on that baking soda test is utter nonsense and behavior that is based on fear mongering, emotions, and definitely is not based on any scientific fact. And if anyone finds out about so called "scientific" studies done on metal leaching contrary to what I have just EMPHATICALLY stated.....I'd really love to see it. Hint hint hint.....you will not find such a study anywhere simply because both stainless steel and Le Crueset cookware are 100% safe to use......both absolutely WILL NOT "leach" any harmful quantities of metals into cooked food.

Dan
Semper Fi-cus


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Serum, whoever said you can't clean cast iron pans with soap is wrong. I scrub mine with soap pads every time I use it. It doesn't hurt it at all. The main thing is to make sure you dry it thoroughly. I also don't store it with oil rubbed on it, or ever spray it with Pam.

I passed up some Salad Master pots at a yard sale not long ago. Guess I should have bought them....they were cheap...so had to be the old ones. I have plenty of cookware though, so I didn't get them.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

Yes I went to a saladmaster dinner over 30 years ago and bought a few pieces of the cookware. It was about $800 for what I purchased. An electric fry pan, a small skillet, a 3qt saucepan, 1 qt saucepan, the tops to all, a pudding insert, and a steamer insert. Also got the vegetable chopper. I still reach for my saladmaster pans even though I have purchased 2 sets of non stick cookware since then. I would love to find some pieces at a garage sale and my non stick would be out the door.


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RE: Salad Master cookware question

"Yes I went to a saladmaster dinner over 30 years ago"

Are you now talking from afterlife or a script?

0.5% titanium to be exact! 316 benefit if you cook over 800 deg i guess it may be handy on mars :)

There are no health benefits in using this set over others.Any cast iron would be better! As fact this uses aluminium as it is cheap.

$5000 dollars for a set of pans which i guess cost lest then $250 to make i would say is the mother of all mark ups! In other words you have been truly ripped off :)

At 65% commission i am sure the sales man would be very happy!

This could only happen in the US of A

ps
for $5000 you could have provided a luxury box rather then a $2 dollar one from china :)


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