Have you copied your recipe correctly? There are a couple of incorrect figures here....just using the brown sugar, for instance, 4 ounces is a HALF CUP, not a cup. Are we talking WEIGHT or STANDARD MEASUREMENT?

Yes, I have. I'm attaching a link to the web page. The "Optional Link URL" disappeared for some reason when I posted a short while ago.

When I made the cake I measured by cups. I didn't relate at all to the metric/ounces measurements.

Here is a link that might be useful: Tea Bread

I agree with redcurls, you've already doubled the amount of sugar if you used 1-cup.

Before eliminating sugar (or any ingredient for that matter) you need to consider what it does in the recipe (baking alchemy). Sugar is a tenderizer to the crumb and aids in browning, as well as helping to keep the bread moist. To eliminate it will alter the crumb drastically because the dried fruit won't contribute enough sugar, or the same type of sugar (fructose instead of glucose), to contribute to the crumb and browning.

Do you soak the dried fruit in the tea/sugar mixture several hours, or overnight? That's not an uncommon step in "tea" breads. This will distribute the sugar to the fruit and help hydrate the dried fruit to hold the moisture in the bread when done.

I make Irish "Tea Brack" that uses 1-1/2 c. brown sugar for about the same amount of other ingredients in your recipe. This is a type of bread that is supposed to be made in small loaves and very thin slices are served. It's not like typical quick breads.

-Grainlady

Yes, I soak the fruits overnight and on one occasion it developed into a 24 hour soaking because I didn't find the time to bake.

If I soak the fruits long enough and the sugar leaches into the tea - will it offset the detrimental effects of eliminating the half cup sugar? Did I understand you correctly? If not, please set me right, and thank you so much for the explanation.

Not answering WC's question, but re the sugar measurement, to play devil's advocate...

I can't remember the last time I saw brown sugar called for where it doesn't say "packed." Here it doesn't. On a whim I weighed a cup of unpacked brown sugar and wouldn't you know, right about 4 oz. Certainly close enough for a self-described imprecise recipe.

Give it a try without sugar and see if you like the results.

The natural sugars in the dried fruit may be enough to compensate for the brown sugar, but the type of sugar (fructose) is different than glucose in granulated sugar (brown sugar is granulated sugar with a little molasses added to make it brown), and the amount of sugar in dried fruit isn't consistent. You'll get different results due to the differences in the types of sugar (fruit sugar - fructose, and glucose in brown sugar).

If you eliminate the sugar, to insure the browning of the loaf, I'd add one or two tablespoons of honey or agave nectar to the recipe.

-Grainlady

FOAS - what you wrote made me realize I never paid any heed to the "packed" in "X cup(s) of packed brown sugar" in recipes. I always just pour sugar into a cup and dump it into the batter. Seems like my cakes already contained far less sugar than required by the recipes, but most of them felt too sweet for me all the same.

Grainlady - I'll give it a try. Perhaps I'll put a tbs or two of molasses. I love the bitterness of them. It'll contrast nicely with the sweetness of the raisins. The strong tea also gives the cake some bitterness.

I made a similar recipe recently and I used less sugar. The tea bread was certainly sweet enough so that next time I may just use 1/2 cup for this recipe:

Lakeland Tea Bread

1 1/2 cups hot tea - Breakfast, Earl Grey or other black tea
2 to 2 1/2 cups mixed dried fruits, diced (2 cups was plenty)
2 1/2 cups self-rising flour (or add 1 t. baking powder and a dash of salt to a-p flour)
1 t. English mixed spice
1 egg
1 cup light brown sugar (I only used 3/4 cup)
opt. grated zest of 1/2 orange and 1/2 lemon; can also add
1/4 t. grated nutmeg

Day Before:
pour hot tea over diced fruit in a bowl; let stand all day or several hours covered

Day of Baking:
Preheat oven to 325F. Grease a regular 1 lb. loaf pan (and can make 1 mini loaf too)
Beat egg in a large bowl, add in fruit and sugar, mix well.
Add in flour and spices, mix well by hand or in mixer.
Put batter in prepared pan, smooth with spatula.
Put in oven for 1 hr. 15 minutes (did not take this long, check at 50 minutes w/ toothpick)

This was quite good for such a simple recipe; I use whatever dried fruits I have on hand, dried apple slices (cut into bits), dried cranberries, golden raisins (sultanas), regular raisins, dried apricots (diced), currants, dates, etc.

Here is a recipe for the English Mixed Spice:

2 t ground allspice
2 t cinnamon
2 t ground cloves
2 t grated nutmeg
2 t ground ginger
1 t ground cardamom opt.
(1 t ground coriander opt.) [I omit]

Mix all well in a bowl or with a mortar and pestle.
Store in a small jar with a tight fitting lid.

note: I have several British cookbooks that often call for "mixed spice" so I mix up this recipe and keep it on hand. I use it for any baked good that calls for various dried ground spices.

Teresa

About ounces and cups: there are no equivalents that are the same for every ingredient. Some ingredients are heavier than others. (And liquid ounces are a different measure than ounces of weight.) A cup of flour is about 4 to 4 1/2 ounces, depending on whether it is sifted or stirred or not, and even on the kind of flour it is. A cup of sugar will never weigh 8 ounces.

About the sugar: you can't just leave sugar out of a recipe, and you can't replace it with flour. Sugar dissolves and flour doesn't.
It's best to try a different recipe that is formulated to use less sugar.

I always mess with recipes. Use 1/4 the sugars, salts, make it how i like it. Less sweet. But you can go too far. Brown sugar, the molasses, does give a certain flavor. Often spice can give that sugar replacement. Just like salt replacements.
My mother has taken it too far. Even cookies taste like chalk without some sugars and butter.
Her 'party mix', the chex thing from the 70's, the cereal fad mix, is just like eating out of the box these days. A bit more 'toasted' might help. But she just heats it a bit. (then hides it from my dad, lol)...I recently found a hidden vintage zip-lock bag in the guest bedroom closet. Rancid.
The recipe posted? I would use some brown sugar, though allot less, and maybe less fruit. I might toast some slices under the broiler for a crisp texture...

There are NO standards for converting from cups to weight - just a lot of charts with good (or bad) guesses, and a lot of "experts" who use one standard and another "expert" who uses another.

There are NO standards for the size for the manufactured volume for measuring cups or spoons in the U.S. If you have 2 or 3 different sets, they may vary a little or a lot - especially if they are really designed to be more decorative than useful (such as heart-shaped measuring spoons) or made in China and purchased at the Dollar Store.

I have one chart where all-purpose flour is 5 oz. per cup and another is 4 oz., and yet one more where it is 4-1/2 oz. Granulated sugar AND brown sugar - 1 cup = 7 oz., while another chart says white granulated sugar is 8 oz. per cup and brown sugar is 7 oz.

You can use the same cup and measure out a cup of flour 5 times and never get the exact same amount if you measure the amount on a scale, just because of how you fill it and level it. Add to that, flour doesn't weigh the same all year long. It may increase in weight from absorbing humidity in the air during humid months, and lose moisture during dry months.

So weights are generally considered the most exact method for measuring ingredients. But "exact" measurements don't take into consideration things like the amount of moisture in a dry product and how that changes with conditions.

You will, however, get more consistent results if you use a recipe designed for a scale instead of volume measurements.

-Grainlady

Yeah but the approximations are close enough to make people think she doubled the sugar! ;)

They thought she doubled the sugar because 4 *liquid* ounces equals half a cup. That's what measuring cups show. But the recipe is using weights, which fill different volumes depending on what is being weighed.

When a recipe calls for 1 cup sugar, I routinely go as low as 2/3 cup without noticing. I would try it that way to start. Or 1/2 cup with some additional molasses or honey. I love tea bread, I first had it in Wales at Christmas time. Thanks for reminding me to make some! I agree though, it's a moist spicy bread and I would think doing without sugar totally would affect the texture.

CC - Could be, but that's not how I read it. Packed brown sugar weighs out approximately the same as water.

Anyway, while I agree there doesn't seem to be a manufacturing standard for measuring cups, I don't think that's any different from scales. I replaced a name brand digital scale that wasn't accurate. There are standards for weights and measures, whether manufacturers calibrate to these standards is apparently a different story. Some tools are more accurate than others.

Grainlady, sure weights are more accurate than cups but most Americans and recipe users use volume rather than scales. We have to give useful, helpful info based on the facts presented, not the ideal way to measure for cakes. Winter, flour cannot sub for sugar and neither can raisins. That's the short answer, flour cannot sub for sugar. Cakes need sugar. And stumpy checked your brown sugar measurement as it compares to weights and your usage turned out to be correct.

You still need sugar, some.

OK, I just had to do it. I made Elery go into the basement and rummage through all the boxes to find his digital scale. As FOAS found, a packed cup of brown sugar weighed 7.89 ounces and an unpacked cup of brown sugar from the same bag weighed only 4.11 ounces.

Of course, I never bother to weigh anything and don't own a scale (which is why Elery's was still packed in the basement, because he never uses it either!).

My results are consistent enough for my purposes using volume, although my cups do vary in size, one half cup measure is closer to one third cup in another set. I tend to bake/cook by feel and appearance and get more consistent results by adjusting ingredients depending on texture or taste.

Wintercat, Westsider is right, you cannot just sub flour for sugar, they are completely different substances. Can you cut the sugar down? Yes, I think you can, but I don't think you can eliminate it completely without replacing it with a viable or similar substitute. I do have a Boston Brown Bread recipe that calls for molasses as the only sweetener and it's lovely and moist, so you might want to try using molasses along with just a bit of sugar, or maple syrup might be nice as a flavor too, even corn syrup or honey. With the tea and the fruit I don't think browning is going to be a huge issue, it's going to be a darker color anyway, not a light colored cake.

I tend to just try things and make notes as to what works, what I liked or didn't like about the finished product, I sub things willy nilly while still trying to retain the "science" that makes a final result what it should be, or at least close.

What is optimal for one isn't optimal for everyone. We can't all grind our own grain (like Grainlady) or raise their own beef (like me) or have access to produce year round like California or big city markets like New York. "Ideal" depends on our lifestyle, our income level, our location and our interests.

Since the OP didn't say there was a problem at all with the cake, other than being too sweet for her taste, I'm assuming the method of measurement isn't an issue and being more precise makes little or no difference. If the cake is too sweet I'd cut the sugar in half, add a good slug of molasses and see how it comes out!

Annie