LOL! Nicole! I am determined to help make this work for you! I was soooo happy I finally found something that worked and I stopped getting the flat pancake cookies. I did make some CCCs just now. I'll upload pix I took along the way just to see if that helps you at all in terms of what mine look like. Today, I had repair folks in and out all morning and I wasn't as focused as I would have like to have been. I did NOT put the cookie sheets in the fridge before baking, though I wanted to! I had so many interruptions, I was afraid the dough was too warm. Anyway, the cookies came out same as usual, pretty thick. So, I don't think the fridge would have mattered too much.

Oh...I use the handmixer all the way up until time to add the chips. I fold in the chips by hand.

I stuck an instant read thermometer in the butter just as I started. It was 74 degrees.

Here is the creamed butter and sugars:

Here is what it looks like after adding each egg, separately,

Here it is at 71 degrees after adding flour:

After adding the chips:

On the cookie sheet:

Just so you can get an idea of the size of the dough blobs:

Just out of the oven!! They're about 3/4 inch thick:

I hope this helps in some way. I was a mad woman determined to find a bakery-style CCC that worked for me...so I feel your pain!! :)

Those are some pretty big dough blobs...that could help with the bigger, thicker cookies plus I wonder if that mat helps too. I just discovered parchment paper...everyone needs it! HA! Love that stuff, where's it been all my life!?

Something else I had forgotten to mention when I said how my cookies turned out. I do not use any name brand butter, or sugar but I was using the Gold Medal Flour (AP). I can't use the hand mixer for the dough, it's too heavy for my particular mixer and I don't feel like dragging out the big mixer.

I too cant find the one I like,I tried them all.I like the chochlate chip cookies ,not thick,chewey,mine are always thick cake like.I think part of the problem is the stove,my daughter hates my Aga.

Oh Mom, you are a doll for doing all of that! I really appreciate the pics. If anything my batter was a little colder - our thermostat is set to 69* and the kitchen is a little colder than the rest of the house, too.

I think a big difference between yours and mine is that your blobs are bigger. I use a scoop for uniformity and they are like golf balls with a flat bottom. It just occurred to me that because mine are so rounded that might explain why yours are so much more seductively craggy? Also, would my rounded dough be more apt to spread? Maybe that is the answer...

Thanks again for your tutorial! I might try again tomorrow. I'll let you know what happens!

Nicole

Have to add, I just showed your pics to DH the engineer. He thinks the difference is the Silpat. Something I never thought of! I actually have a Silpat but use parchment because I can throw it away when I am done - LOL! I have a dozen unbaked cookies still in the fridge. I will bake them tomorrow and see if...

A- The Silpat makes a difference
B - Chilling makes a difference
C - If size makes a difference

In the meantime, DH is all excited to test his theory...

Thanks again Mom, you have been so helpful and the pictures are great!

nigel, I want to reiterate that my cookies come out looking exactly as the picture posted by Tracey OH, with that said, I use a cookie scoop also so they will be all perfectly the same size. I think mine is considered medium size. I do not flatten them down either. My cooking sheet is a nice heavy duty jelly roll pan from Chicago Metallic with a sheet of parchment paper. My cookies aren't as fluffy looking as momto4's are. Speaking of that, I also heard that cookies should be baked on pans without sides...don't ask me where I read it but I did but I'm not going to run out and buy even more pans...HAHAHA!!!

Nicole! Anytime! There are only 4 cookies left from today's 2 dozen! Grrr! I expected them to last at least 2 days!!

Arkansas Girl...I've heard that, too, about no sides! I don't use the heavy duty jelly roll sheets for these either. I just use cheapo cookie sheets (no sides) that I've had for years.

I used to use parchment paper. I find, even though I loathe washing them, I prefer the siplats. Maybe the silpat keeps them from spreading so much?? Plus, I'm trying to quit using so much stuff I have to throw away! I know my former pancake cookies were crispier...but I attributed that to their flatness vs the parchment paper, but who knows!

I'll bet the chilling will make some difference...but maybe it's the size that makes a bigger difference. I have tried and tried to use a scoop and I can't get the dough out of the doggone thing. So, I put the cookie sheet w/siplat on my kitchen scale and weigh out 2 oz blobs, not flattened. Those are big blobs! I get 24 blobs, leaving about 1 - 1/2 cookie's worth in the bowl...I will sometimes pull out another cookie sheet and bake the remainder. Usually, however, 5 of the 6 of us polish off the leftover cookie dough! :)

Let me know how the next adventure goes!

Cook's Illustrated has a CCC recipe that's supposedly "the best" (well of course it is!) but a friend of mine vouched for it and sent me the recipe. I haven't tried it yet, but it's similar to the one attempted in this thread.

Okay.

So I did this big experiment making the cookies different sizes and used both Silpat and parchment. I took lots of pictures and have been waiting for DH to show me how to put them up. But I'm going to tell you the results without pictures because I have a new development to share regarding the flat cookies.

The results of the experiment were... Nothing impressive. There was virtually no difference in the spread and/or thickness between cookies baked on parchment or a Silpat.

I scooped some of my cookies, and hand shaped some so they had a rough and bumpy texture when raw. After baking, no difference.

I made some cookies golfball size (the size of my scoop) and some twice as big (momto4kids' size). This made a difference. The big ones were bigger all around, and definitely thicker. Not as thick as the photo with the recipe, but thicker than the golfball ones.

All of this dough was chilled. I think it gained me about 1/2' in thickness over the unchilled ones, which were pancakes. To me, that is still not acceptable.

So after all that the only thing that made a difference was the size. The bad thing about that is that I don't want a huge cookie.

Then something interesting happened.

Yesterday my oven started acting strange, I won't bore you with details. I called the repairman who came out today. Long story short, it turns out that a sensor is not working correctly, and my stove that claims to be heated to 350* is really only getting to 300*! And the strange thing is, I have an oven thermometer as well, and IT was also reading 350*. They are both wrong. I have been cooking everything 50* too cool.

So the first question Pat the repairman I ask is not how much it will cost to fix, or how long it could take. No, the first question I ask is if that is why my cookies are flat. He said absolutely.

I am very encouraged by this! I will try the famous recipe, above, tomorrow and see if things are now any better. Crossing my fingers...

Nicole

Huummm...that could be, I actually bake mine at 375 so maybe even that's a difference? We never even discussed the temps...HA! I have two thermometers in my oven...I know one thing about my oven is it sure does take a long time to heat to temp. A good 20 minutes for 375 which seems absurd to me! :(

LOLOL!!! Haha!! Ohmigoodness..yeah, I would think that makes a difference! Too funny! I can't wait to hear how it turns out when you have the right temperature! You know what, I need to make cookies for my son's road trip (first trip scouting colleges, yikes!). I'm going to make some my "normal" size and some smaller to see how that affects thickness of the finished cookie. I started making them "bakery" size because the kids were taking about 10 at a time and I was horrified! (Not that the 4 larger cookies they now take is less cookie by weight!).

Arkansas Girl...my oven does the same thing...seems to take an inordinate amount of time to warm up. Not a problem when I'm being pokey, but a pain when I want something that matters to go right in!!

The repair-dude and I were discuss pre-heat times today. He said that regardless of brand of stove, they all need at least 20 minutes to heat up. It doesn't matter if the oven beeps after ten minutes to let you know you have reached your temperature, it is lying. You must give it at least 20 minutes. At least.

Mom, we are doing our first college visit next weekend! My DD is a junior, is your son a junior as well?

Nicole

So they are all slow to heat up? You'd think that little space of an oven wouldn't take so long...HA! Anyway, that's good to know, also good to know that it's normal for an oven to beep when it's not really at temp. My oven does this after about 5 minutes...at first I thought it was wonderful how fast my new oven heats but then I got wise to it's deception! HEEHEE!

About ovens.... when the "beep" sounds, you've heated the air in the oven to temp. Open the door and out it goes. You want the oven to heat, not just the air, the oven sides and top and bottom and all surfaces. Then, when you open the door and lose hot air, it'll regain temp a lot faster.

Sushipup...yes, that makes sense!! :)

Okay...first, Nicole, yes, he's a junior! Good grief, wasn't he just in 6th grade last week?!

I made a batch of CCC this morning. I let the butter get too warm, didn't refrigerate the dough (for the 2 oz CCCs) and YIKES!!! FAILURE!! I got pancake cookies! Holy cow! So, FOR ME, temperature of the dough matters!!

Also, I made a sheet of my usual 2 oz size dough balls (not refrigerated, resulting in flat CCCs) and a sheet of 1 oz dough balls (golf ball size). I did refrigerate the golf ball sized CCC dough for about 10-12 minutes. Okay, FOR ME, size matters! I was shocked at how flat they came out!

Moral of my story...for me...make 2oz cookies and if I think the dough is too warm...IT IS!! Haha!

Don't forget also about adding some more flour to the dough and making a good stiff dough. I certainly don't think it could hurt to try. I know that my dough is so thick that I cannot possibly use a hand mixer or it will bog down. I have to use either a heavy wooden spoon or my hand to mix.

I made the chocolate chip cookies exactly like the recipe.
They're delicious, but they're very soft and not crisp on the outside. My husband likes them crisper on the outside, and I really have no idea what makes cookies crisp or soft.

What did I do wrong????

Thanks in advance for any light you can shed on this.

Check your oven temps.

Thought I'd add this to the mix, if you are having total fits with your CCC going flat, try one of the CCC recipes that call for milled oats(put rolled oats in the processor till fine ground). The Neiman Marcos cookie tastes very good, in fact it's the last CCC I made for my husband and he loves them. These should not go flat on you at all. Yes they taste a bit different but they are GOOD! There's also one called the Governer's Mansion Cookie I think it is. Below is a link of an example of those cookies(My niece swears by them). The Neiman Marcos one doesn't have coconut though. It's available by google searching too.

Here is a link that might be useful: Texas Governer's Mansion cookie recipe

The Texas Governer's Mansion recipe looks like what I make, except that I like to substitute granola for the oats and reduce the sugar a bit, since the granola is sweeter than just oats. Granola makes them come out crunchy - I prefer crunchy cookies to chewy ones in general. I tend to buy CCCs at Trader Joe's rather than make them any more because I love the ones I get there. I also tend to make very small, dainty cookies - bite-size at most.

Lars

FINALLY! David, the CC cookie expert, has declared that the cookies are "right".

Crisp on the edges, chewy in the middle, not too thick but not raw in the center.

I used 1 3/4 cup of dark brown sugar to 1/4 cup white sugar. Upped the flour to 3 cups, and used all butter. Beat the butter and sugars for 3 or 4 minutes, then added the rest of the wet stuff, flour and dry ingredients last, stirred in the chips by hand so I didn't develop the gluten after the flour was added. Chilled the dough overnight and stuck the pans out in the garage too, so the pans stayed cold. Dropped the dough by the scoop and did not flatten them. Baked for 12 minutes at 375, no longer, and left the cookies on the pan for about 10 minutes so they didn't fall apart while taking them off.

Wow, it didn't used to be the complicated to make CC cookies...

Annie

So a friend of mine just posted this on FB... It made me chuckle...

A very old man lay dying in his bed. In death's doorway, he suddenly smelled the aroma of his favorite chocolate chip cookie wafting up the stairs.

He gathered his remaining strength and lifted himself from the bed. Leaning against the wall, he slowly made his way out of the bedroom, and with even greater effort forced himself down the stairs, gripping the railing with both hands. With labored breath, he leaned against the door frame, gazing into the kitchen. Were it not for death's agony, he would have thought himself already in heaven. There, spread out on newspapers on the kitchen table were literally hundreds of his favorite chocolate chip cookies. Was it heaven? Or was it one final act of heroic love from his devoted wife, seeing to it that he left this world a happy man? Mustering one great final effort, he threw himself toward the table. The aged and withered hand, shaking, made its way to a cookie at the edge of the table, when he was suddenly smacked with a spatula by his wife.

"Stay out of those," she said. "They're for the funeral."

Thanks for the alternate recipes!! I was disappointed in the smaller cookies I attempted with the recipe I use now. Lars, I like the smaller, dainty cookies for me! I don't want one of those big honking cookies...usually I just want a bite or two. If I break a cookie in half, the kids won't eat the other half. Somehow it doesn't taste the same to them! :(

I'm baking tons of cupcakes today, but I'm going to try these other recipes. It doesn't hurt to have more than one in the arsenal!

Momto4kids, I like them small too. I made 5 dozen cookies about 2 inches in diameter.

I started making them that size because they were just the right size to dunk into a glass of milk. If you dunk a broken half cookie, you get crumbs and Ashley did NOT like that, LOL.

Annie

I haven't made the Toll cookies in a while, I don't want to waste my time on them again. lol. But I got to thinking. Years ago when butter was taboo, I used margerine all the time. The cookies turned out excellent.

I've been cooking with butter for 15 years now unless a recipe specifically calls for margerine.

I'm wondering if margerine is what makes a better Toll house cookie?

I'm definitely going to try the OP's recipe. Thanks!

oakleyok, I found that the fat was one of the culprits and when I switched to all butter and more flour, it worked better.

I'm sure, somehow, that the manufacturers have "cheaped" the margarine by adding more air or more water or something, because I always used Blue Bonnet and they turned out just right. Now they don't.

Annie

annie 1992: Are the alterations you did meant for momto4kids's recipe on this post?

momto4kids...please give your SCALE measurements for both
flour and sugar in Grams.

Sue Ellen

lizbeth, my alterations were to the Toll House cookie recipe on the bag of chips. The way they "were" is the standard that my family uses to judge chocolate chips cookies, so that's what I was looking for.

Annie

Thanks annie. I've never been a C.C. cookie lover--grew up with soft cookies w/raisins and black walnuts, still my favorite, but tried a batch for a niece and had the same experience as other posters. So thinking I had done something wrong, I made a second batch, only to have them look like pancakes. Now it's bugging me. I've got to "get them right". (Grandkids also like them.)

lizbeth, CC cookies have never been a favorite of mine either, I like molasses cookies much better, but my girls have always loved CC cookies, go figure.

Annie

momto4kids...
Do you consider one cup to be 140 Grams?

1 cup or 8 oz is about 225 grams. 454 grams in a lb....

I want momto4kids take on flour gram conversion
as she found a recipe that works....

I want to follow her recipe....

thank you
sue ellen

whoops, sorry Sue Ellen!

Sorry Sue Ellen! I didn't see this!

I do weigh out my ingredients (using a salter digital scale) vs using measuring cups, but I use ounces. I just measured out the sugar and flour as I do with ounces and pushed the "gram" button to convert to grams....this is what I got:

flour, 3 cups = 15oz = 426g
sugar, white, 1 cup = 7oz = 200g
sugar, brown, 1 cup = 8oz = 228g

I hope that helps!! I'll check my measurements again in the near future as I seriously make these doggone cookies once or twice a week now!

momto4kids....

Thanks for the information!
From what you have posted and other reading, the dough
temperature is very important for the desired texture.

Sue Ellen

I still must stress the importance of having enough flour in your cookies. At another forum, this discussion came up and it was concluded that the main reason for flat cookies is the flour they are putting out there for sale these days. They say it's much different than the flour of yesterday. So if nothing is working, be sure and try adding some more flour and see how that goes. I have never chilled my CCC dough and have never had pancake flat cookies, my dough is very stiff and I mix it with my hands.

SueEllen...hope it works!

Arkansas Girl...I really need to remember this hint!! If I do add more flour because the dough doesn't seem stiff enough (and it usually is...but I know what you mean now that I think about it)...will it make the cookie "cakey?"

My cookies aren't cakey at all.

Momto4kids, I made this tonight. Well, I made half a recipe because I know how we can be with chocolate chip cookies and if they didn't come out right for my oven and temps and measuring, I could always give them away.

I preheated for 5 minutes, used parchment paper in a sheet pan, baked for 15 minutes, cooled on a rack. I didn't weigh anything and I didn't chill the dough before baking. They came out so good! I used King A. flour because that's all I had.

YUMMY!

I doubt they'll last long enough to do the *still fresh days later" test.

It's a keeper recipe, halves beautifully for a smaller batch and THANKS for sharing!

Smiles,
Sooz

momto4kids... thanks so much for posting the cookie recipe! I made them today...done "things" wrong for sure, like melted the margarine, added nuts and used half white chips & baked them closer to 15 minutes...and they turned out GREAT!! Crisp around edge and chewy in center..YUM!!

Followup: Cookies all gone!
Yup, goners less than 24 hours later... yesterday, hubby decided he'd try them "warm" and did the MW zap for 10 seconds...that was all it took--cookies all gone! :O)
Smiles,
Sooz

Yay Sooz and Mary! Thank you so much! Yes, my kids *zap* them, too, and swear they taste fresh out of the oven! Haha! I'm so happy to finally be able to contribute a recipe, albeit not my own, that others have enjoyed after I've had years of enjoying others' recipes!! :) Thanks again!

If you think I'm going to click on a post about chocolate chip cookies when I'm trying to eat fewer cookies, you're wrong wrong wrong o poop I clicked on it.

Cookie time! :)

I tried this recipe and I love it. I, too, was getting the 'pancake' nestle cookies by using their recipe. Now I am having the problem of them spreading out. Other than that,they taste great and I like the texture. I just need them to spread out some. I wonder if baking them at a higher temp would help?
here are my pics

My advice would be if they aren't spreading enough then there is a bit too much flour. Try cutting down 1/4 cup and do a test cookie, if it's spreading too much then add a bit more flour until you get it how you like it. Betty Crocker cookbook has this tip in their old cookbook. I think most people are trying to figure it out when it's really just as simple as too much or not enough flour that affects the spread of the cookie. Try not to over-think it so much.

EDIT TO ADD: The cookies in the picture look good though...they don't look like they didn't spread enough to me. Here's a thought too, why not use a round cookie scoop to form them and flatten them out a bit with the bottom or a glass or something?

This post was edited by arkansas_girl on Thu, Dec 27, 12 at 10:31

Cookie cutter sounds like an excellent idea. Thank u! I'm def. making these again in the next few days! Before I tried this recipe, I tried another recipe that called for buttermilk. That gave me a cake like texture. My feelings were hurt. But I got it now!!

A cookie scoop is what I was talking about, you know those little scoops that look like a small ice cream scoop. Then flatten them so they won't be as high in the middle. Basically like you do a peanut butter cookie only not with fork tongs.

I made the OP's recipe yesterday and my cookies turned out like her photo. I did find however that there's not enough salt in the recipe. I would increase it to a full teaspoon. Isn't that about right for 3 cups of flour?

I came across this article about chocolate chip cookies on the NY Times. They interviewed some of the NYC bakers to get their secrets. One of the bakers said that the cookies are better after the dough is allowed to sit 36 hours. I made two cookies after 4 hours and today after 24 hours, and today's cookies did have a better texture and appearance than yesterday's. I made them fairly large--about 2 tablespoons of dough just spooned onto parchment, more flat than rounded.

Here is a link that might be useful: NY Times Chocolate chip cookies

When I make half a recipe, they always come out thick and chewy. (I don't need 5 dozen cookies.)

We old folks remember when a bag of Nestle semi-sweet morsels was only half the size of the current bag. Sometimes doubling the recipe just doesn't work. The Toll House Cookie recipe was designed for a small batch of cookies.

I also make a few other substitutions for my half recipe - 1/4 cup - 4 oz. butter, 1/2 cup - 4 oz. Crisco, 1/2 cup Splenda brown sugar and 3 T egg substitute. Of course if I'm making them for "the public" I use the real stuff.

Either way, they still taste great.