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Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Posted by Emptynesteralmost (My Page) on
Mon, Dec 2, 13 at 15:36

Hi -- We are just sitting down to the drawing board with Mitch Ginn Associates to make changes to the Shook Hill house plan. I would love to get some feedback on these changes, especially from people who have built a Shook Hill, but any input is fantastic.

We are building in the Northeast -- anyone know of any Shook Hill's near Boston?

� Enlarge Family room. Would like at least 24�x 25� range. Also all windows in room.
� Center fireplace in family with shelves on each side
� Windows, not doors in dining room.
� Enlarge mudroom to accommodate a staircase to the garage loft area.
� Put pantry where powder room is. (Hopefully enough room for a second fridge too?)
� Put powder room where pantry is in between dining room and kitchen
� Gas fireplace or built in dining room
� Enlarge master bedroom to end of porch and to bathroom wall (if looks okay and feasible)
� Widen kitchen to accommodate a bigger island.
� If possible, would like a corner professional style range.
� Wainscoting master, dining room and study.
� Walkout basement taking advantage of land contour
� House facing eastward � maximize sunlight for summer and winter seasons and angle of sun
� Should garage stay on right-hand side for maximum sun and view?
� Transom window above sink window for more light if room
� Enlarge bedroom above mudroom ?
� Add shed dormer to this bedroom to maximize view in back
� Extra storage upstairs? In forum
� Gas fireplace in master br.
� Want to make sure back porch doesn�t make family room too dark�.angle of sun prevents this?
� Is the upstairs maximum use of space? Little round top window in front � incorporate into closet? I read something on one of the house building forums and it was suggested that the upstairs space could utilize some of the extra area.
� Is there attic/storage space upstairs too?
� No windows in upstairs bathrooms � can we put a little round top window on the side above master bath for upstairs bath. Also would adding single, narrow dormer(s) in back for back bathroom � is this possible while maintaining the architectural balance of house? Or any other ideas?

Thanks!


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Can you link to the plan so people will have an idea what you are talking about?


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Sorry! I hope the link works.

Here is a link that might be useful: Shook Hill plan

This post was edited by Emptynesteralmost on Wed, Dec 4, 13 at 7:08


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

lazygardens--That was my thought also.

I'll add it.

OP--many of your "wants" require a much larger footprint for this house and will necessitate changes on the second floor and the exterior. Widening the family room and the kitchen will increase the size substantially.

Just a guesstimate, but do you need a 17 x 20 plus square feet master? That's huge.

For some reason I find the idea of the powder room between the dining room and kitchen gross. Sorry, but I'm being honest.

Porches will always make a house darker.

You might want to rethink the "corner" range idea if you mean the range is angled into a corner.

What is it that you like about this plan?

Here is a link that might be useful: Shook Hill


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

I like the plan for many reasons, but I think the house would fit into the landscape of our lot, which is a six-acre parcel of open fields that stretch to the riverfront. I love the layout and porches and think it would work with the land and take advantage of the views. We would position it with the house facing eastward in the back. would this allow for enough light even with the porches? As for the square footage--if that's the only family room, it seemed small. I thought the master could be a bit bigger to include sitting area but could live without it.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

That's funny you mention the powder room location...I moved it so it wasn't right off the kitchen/eating area. :) I didn't think of the dining room....


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Shameless bump of own post --

I got preliminary plans from Mitch Ginn firm and really like how he incorporated suggested changes. The powder room is actually in a hallway between the kitchen and dining room, alongside the laundry. It really isn't on top of either room.

My only concern now is that the square footage has grown from 3200 to 4100!

If most of the changes increase the foundation minimally and add no additional doors or windows, I would assume it wouldn't affect construction costs at the top end.

Any thoughts on the plan? I was hoping someone who had built a Shook Hill or liked the plan and perhaps saw one built would be able to add their input.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

can you put up the revised plan?


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Adding nearly 1000 sq. is going to increase the construction cost more than minimally. That is 1000 sq. ft of additional flooring, lumber and drywall to build walls and subfloors, etc.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

The revised plan is a PDF file, which isn't allowed on this site....not sure how to get it up here.

I think we whittled down some of the extra square footage by just extending the family room to the rear, thus the dining room and study will remain their original dimensions. We are keeping a master sitting area, which is even with the edge of the back porch. The lot has a beautiful view of a field that stretches down to the river so this will be a really nice room.

I will see if I can figure out how to post the proposed revisions. In the meantime, we are working on trimming some of the additional square footage -- rrah you are right in pointing out that it would mean subfloors, lumber, drywall, etc... closer to the original 3200 is quite spacious already!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

You might open up the pdf, take a screen shot and save it as a jpg if it's not in that form already.

You can also save a pdf as a jpg. Just go to file, save as and click jpg.

This is on a Mac with Adobe Professional, not just Adobe reader. It's been awhile since I used a PC, but it is a similar process.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

I have often wished we could have expanded our Shook Hill as you say you are doing. It should be gorgeous! The best piece of advice I can give is that it's your house - so if it works for you - you're going to love it! I will say of our Shook Hill - it is much darker than my previous house as a result of the porches. In GA, this is not so bad, because we run the A/C a whole lot! With the master bedroom even to the back porch, however, your porch may wind up dark. You may want to consider adding some recessed lighting into the porch ceiling. I'm adding a picture of the back of our house on a mostly sunny day so you can see how much light our porch gets. Our porch is southeast according to my compass (I'm directionally challenged!). Most of the light on the porch comes in from the corner where the master bedroom is.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Here's another picture of the back porch on a sunny day.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Last one! Hope this helps you out.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Still trying to figure out how to convert the PDF files...will keep at it. In the meantime, 2c2u2t2i2e Thank you very much for your input and photos. I think we'll have to accept some shade. I could forgo the outdoor fireplace, but I really like the idea of it. I will keep a potential open deck in mind, or perhaps skylights. Your advice and pics are very helpful.

If you don't mind, can I send you the preliminary floor plans via email? I am having Mitch Ginn Associates doing the final drawings now. We eliminated the larger dining room and study, but expanded the family room to the rear and widened the kitchen.

If you have more pictures to share, I'd love to see them. Did you keep the kitchen the original size? I wanted it a little wider to accommodate a bigger island. I kept the two openings to the family room. Do you find that you have enough room in the family room to arrange furniture?

Your house looks lovely, by the way. The house plan really is pretty in real life!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

I was wondering if you'd be willing to send me your preliminary adjusted plan as well? The Shook Hill is on my short list of plans I'm taking to my architect and the changes you're talking about seem to line up A LOT with the ones I want to make. I would love to see how you implemented the changes.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

I could -- hopefully I'll figure out how to get the plan up here, but if you'd like I can email you. How do I email people? What changes are you thinking of? There are a few other threads that have photos of completed Shook Hills. Also I found one in Southern Living's forum that has hundreds of pictures.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

We are almost finished with our Shook Hill. I have a lot of pictures on my phone, but uploading them all to photobucket to post here requires more time than I have available at the moment. If you'd like to email me cvazqu AT yahoo DOT com, I can send you what I have for your reference.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Now I'm thinking of eliminating the covered porch in back and making it an open deck with the outdoor fireplace....any thoughts?


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

With the help of my son, I converted the Shook Hill plan modifications to jpg. Here is the first floor. We've already trimmed some of the additional square footage from the dining room and study. The living room is only expanded to the rear.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Here is the second floor


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

And the basement.

I hope these are legible.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Kids are awesome! Whenever I can't "do" particular technology, they come to my rescue. Your plans look beautiful. As to the fireplace on the porch - keep it! Whomever built our house (we're third owners) took it out, and we've gotten quotes to put it in when we screen in the porch (we are making it a double decker fireplace - so there will be one on the basement patio level, and one on the porch). That means I'll have a shadier porch myself soon.

As to uncovering the porch - it depends on where you live and the weather. Too hot for GA.

As to the family room - at first I was completely panicked about the furniture and the size of the room, but I found I really like the coziness. In my previous house, we'd go down to the basement to watch TV because it felt more intimate than our large family room. In this house, we go to the basement living area when we have larger groups over. So I guess it depends on how many people you usually have in the room. I haven't found the perfect balance between spaciousness and coziness in any house yet, but we do tend to spend more time as a family than we do in large groups so I like that aspect of the Shook Hill better than my former house's. If I can find some pics, I'll attach them. As a note, I did have to part with a substantial amount of furniture when we moved to this house, but we found it an opportunity to bless others, and to remind us "stuff" is just stuff....

I'm not sure if the kitchen is the original size or not (I'll have to measure). My neighbor who has a Shook Hill swears my kitchen is bigger than hers, but if so, it's not by much. One of the first things we did was rip out the island in this house. I attached a picture of the new island we put in. Sorry it's a bit off focus.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Pic of the living room. Seating for 6 max. I have the couch about 3' off the wall (making a walkway behind it) as a matter of preference. The chair that looks striped swivels so it can face the tv (which also swivels) or the conversation area. One thing I should say from observing this pic - the covered back porch will also make your family room darker. Don't skimp with the lighting in this room. I'm a horrible photographer, so you're seeing it as it really is. BTW, the previous owner had a sectional couch that impeded one of the doorways to the kitchen. More seating, but would have bugged me.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

2c2u2t2i2e: Thanks for the pics. The family room is beautiful but you are right it is dark with the covered porch. I think our decision to go with just a deck with the fireplace will work well in New England. It gets dark here in the winter at 4 p.m. so all the natural light is welcome!
I love your kitchen -- It seems like the antique white cabinets fit this house well.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Just visited my friend's extended Shook Hill. Here's what's different from mine:

They extended the kitchen 3 feet. This makes a HUGE difference, and I highly recommend making this change. She has an island about the size of mine (without the seating table) that is turned 90 degrees from the way mine is in the picture.

They extended the living room 2 feet. This didn't make as much as a difference as I expected. It still "lives" like my living room, except the fireplace is much larger and nicer, and they have room for their Christmas tree (I don't!). If I could go farther than the 2' extension, I would.

They extended the master bedroom to the end of the enclosed back deck.

They extended the uncovered porch. It was awesome.

They enclosed the section of the front porch by the dining room and made it a huge pantry. It is a great idea, in my humble opinion, because my pantry is pretty small. This required a change to the facade. The small laundry window is gone. There is a "false" window on an even elevation to the other two windows which is covered with closed shutters (there is no window in the pantry - just on the outside).

All of these changes make the house even more spectacular than the original plan.

As a comment I forgot previously, the second owners of my house took out the dividing wall in the master closet and replaced it with a large, waist high granite topped island. There are 9 deep drawers on each side, and cubed shelving against the back wall. This allows for a coffee bar in the closet, which is one of my favorite features of the house.

As another note, the mudroom of the Shook Hill is too small, and basically useless as a mudroom. If you really want a mudroom, I'd recommend expanding it.

Hope all of this helps. Please post pictures of your build, as I originally started replying to this post on behalf of a guy who emailed me (not one of you). He's behind you in the design process, and I'm sure would appreciate your help.

Edit to this message: My gracious neighbor asked for the link to GardenWeb, so you may have direct access to the owner of an expanded Shook Hill soon!

This post was edited by 2c2u2t2i2e on Wed, Jan 1, 14 at 13:34


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Thanks for all the new detail! I love the idea of the coffee bar! I am a coffee addict and having some fresh coffee brewing in the a.m. right in the master bedroom would be amazing. Plus it would have a flat surface for folding clothes. My kitchen is going to be larger and I think we're doing more than 2' to the family room.

We hopefully will be building in the spring, but we must first sell the house we are currently in now. Hopefully sooner rather than later, but winter has already hit us so I don't know how many buyers are out looking for a house in mid-December. I will be more than happy to post photos if it helps another Shook Hill build-to-be.

You have been incredibly helpful and it is reassuring to know the changes I am incorporating work out in real life!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Hi, again! Love the pictures, 2c...
I'm excited to see your Shook Hill's progress, Emptynesteralmost!
Because several people have emailed me about the pictures I mentioned earlier, I uploaded what I have on my phone to an album here:

http://s67.photobucket.com/user/cvazqu/library/?sort=3&page=1
I'll try to update that album later this week.

Here is a link that might be useful: Our under-construction shook hill


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Thanks so much for sharing your photos! You must be so excited to move in!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Emptynesterslmost: I love your changes in the modified plan. Could you tell me the dimensions for your sitting area and the bonus room as well as the dining room and kitchen? When I zoom in the numbers become to blurry. Also just to weigh in on the darkness of the family room. I wonder if leaving off the coffered ceiling would help? Just my thoughts. We have had this plan for years and hope to start building it soon ourselves.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

mfowler -- Hi. I think I've seen some photos of the Shook Hill associated with your name! He's working on the final draft and I can give you the dimensions. We scaled back a bit because the changes added 1000 square feet on the first floor!
I love the coffered ceiling though....David said that leaving off the covered porch might change the look in the back because there is a jog in the roofline for the eating area. He suggested skylights in the porch ceiling.

Did you modify the plan at all? It's great to see finished Shook Hill's -- it helps to visualize.

I love this house -- hopefully we can build in the spring.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Emptynesteralmost we ordered the shook hill plan right after seeing it in southern living magazine many years ago. Have sat on the plan so to say all this time and I have saved every picture I have ever came across. I couldn't imagine building without "visuals" Thought about modifying the kitchen, dining room and living room dimensions. Kicked around the bonus room idea as well. When I saw your modified plan I realized you had addressed lots of our wishes for modifications. That's a lot of square footage to add though so can't wait to see your "compromises."


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

mfowler -- what changes have you thought of? It is awesome to see pictures -- helps so much to get the feel of the house. Have you seen the photos on the Southern Living forum? I think the guy that posted them built a Shook Hill so there are lots of the construction and also some of other Shook Hills.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

I need a larger dining room to accommodate my table. I would love to have a butlers pantry and also I would like to have room in my kitchen for large range like Chilibeans. I am loving her kitchen layout so I think that addressed that issue. We only need 2 of the bedrooms upstairs so we are thinking of using the third as a den space for our everyday tv watching and lounging. We just looked at a home that we may buy if we choose not to build that had this and it was a wonderful idea. You had a more cozy den area that you just don't get with a massive bonus room feel ( just my opinion) So that's where I am at the moment. Trying to give myself a deadline of January 31 to buy the home we looked at or build the shook hill I have been envisioning for many years now!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Mfowler -- let me know what you decide. What is the home you are looking at like? I'm anxiously awaiting the final plans that are being drafted right now! I can't wait to start building, but I will have to be patient.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Well emptynester we were outbid on the home we were looking at (couldn't justify paying full price for a home that wasn't 100 percent what we were looking for). The home was built to resemble an old southern colonial style home. Hope to incorporate some of those things to shook hill. Tall doorways tall windows and some transoms over interior doorways. What exterior style are you going for? We keep going back and forth between stone and brick. Love the look of Chilibeans with the brick but I love stone. Definitely planning on white hardi with black shutters for exterior.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

That's too bad you were outbid, but maybe it was for a reason! I think we'll go with stone on the exterior. I haven't decided yet on the exterior color -- probably we'll match it up with the stone and see what looks good. I have always wanted a yellow house, but not sure what it'll look like. I've been searching on Houzz and have all sorts of ideas for the stone and interior finishes. I love transoms --I think they would look great in the Shook Hill design. I'm waiting for the final plans from Mitch Ginn and then it'll be time to do site surveying. Still waiting to go full speed -- need to sell my house first! Maybe we'll build at the same time. That'd be neat.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

@ 2c2u2t2i2e does your home have stone or brick on the front wall as specified by plan? If not can you send me a front exterior picture. We have gotten our bid back and are having some sticker shock. Trying to visualize the plan without the accent is hard. I have the rendering chilibeans had but would love to see a real live photo without the accent and it's hard to find one. Also what are your porch floor materials? The bid alone for the pavers called for in the plan were $9,000 material/labor for the stone pavers. Trying to figure out the things that aren't musts that can save us $!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Mfowler did you eliminate the false chimney? According to the cost estimator that was $11000!
We're thinking if stone on side of walkout is too pricey we will use stucco.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

That's interesting @emptynesteralmost! I have searched through the bid and I am still not sure if the faux chimney is in there or not! I know the total for the stone and labor was right at $20,000. That's with a crawlspace just for estimating purposes. We are planning the walkout as well so that is why I am fretting over the costs at this point of the stone. The chimney was supposed to be included but I am going to have to double check with builder and make sure that stone price included those as well. Our builder said this would be an expensive plan to build so that's why we are still just in the planning stage with this general bid which is supposed to be for as the plan is drawn. Trying to decide also if we are better of purchasing a different lot and abandoning the basement idea and our sloped lot.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Here's the front of the house. I'm the third owner, and had nothing to do with any of the design. Not sure what the plan called for on the front originally. I do have a stone floor on the front porch, and stone on the side porch as well. Hope this helps you, mfowler. BTW, I had another woman ask to see my house, and then tell me she decided not to build the Shook Hill since it's such an expensive plan to execute. She told me there was a significant cost to the high ceilings....


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

@2c2u2t2i2e thank you! I love it just as well without the front stone accent. You have a beautiful home. This should definitely cut down on some of the cost of the exterior.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Skylights: Love them! They will definitely add to the natural light of the room/porch. Having had them in 2 houses, I will tell you, there will eventually be some sort of weather that will cause them to leak. Don't put anything you're overly attached to underneath them. Also, polarize them or use a flooring material / covering that will not sun fade, or you will have faded patches in the shape of the skylights on your floor or rug.

Another comment on my neighbor's awesome Shook Hill. She made the garage a 4 car, and extended the uncovered back deck along the back side of the garage. Her covered area is reduced because of the 2' living room bump out. When she made a pantry out of the "cut out" in the front porch (where the false chimney is), she eliminated the false chimney (and may even have saved money while getting more space!). She made her fireplace in the living room wood burning, so she has a functioning chimney extending from that, but it uses much less stone than the false chimney.

Real stone is expensive! Just got a quote of about $9000 to make our basement patio (the same size as the covered porch) stone...


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

2c2u--love the shingle siding look on your home. Is it fiber cement and if so which brand? Are you pleased with it?

Do you have another picture up close?

Thanks.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Good news - the guy that I'm pretty sure sold the siding to the original builder still has a siding company, and also happened to build the most gorgeous (and I mean it - because it's right across the street from me) Shook Hill!! He modified it and built it himself, and is a super nice guy who would probably answer questions. (This is a different Shook Hill than the other one I wrote about). If you can figure out a way to email me from this, I'll give you his name and number. Will have to take a pic close up and get it to you later. Crazy day!!!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Here is a shook hill listing I saw today online

Here is a link that might be useful: Shook hill


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Here's one thing I noticed from the listing that's also true in my house - the light over the breakfast table is in the wrong place. Completely aggravating - and on my list to fix for over a year now. For those of you who are building, measure out your table, and then figure out where you want the light :-)

By the way, the siding on my house is fiber-cement. I think it's a Hardiplank product.

Also noticed the Tyrone listing mfowler sent out doesn't have the false chimney, and still looks great (IMHO).


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Here's a link to that fabulous Shook Hill I mentioned.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/615-Keystone-Ct-Fayetteville-GA-30215/80844151_zpid

Notice the ice blue room - that's some of the "extra" square footage that some of you mentioned in previous posts. Check out the front of the house, and you'll see how he modified the roof in the front where that room is (it's the window to the left of the front door). They also have a bath for each upstairs bedroom. Not sure I remember how it works, but their upstairs is configured differently than mine. I have an extra room upstairs too, but not in the same place.

Looking from the outside, most people have said they don't realize that house and my house are both Shook Hills.

Her kitchen is configured differently than mine. She swears my kitchen is bigger, and I think her mudroom is bigger, so I'm not sure if it's perception, or actual differences.

That house shows 3800+ square feet. Think mine's 3500+. Think the normal Shook Hill plan is about 3200+. All of those square footage differences I know are on the second floor (i.e. how that "extra" space is used - and how the roof line is configured).

I sure hope all my chatter is helpful for those of you who come behind me. Life is better lived with no regrets, and if I can help you have one less, yippeee!!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

@2c2u2t2i2e thanks so much for all your advice on this thread. I agree about the tyrone house with no faux chimney. Slowly learning which things are a must for me and which aren't since unfortunately all things just aren't going to be in the budget. I think for anyone wanting this home this thread shows many different combinations for this plan which are make for a beautiful home!


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Such great info here! 2c2u: your house looks great without the stone facade. That helps a lot ehen trying to determine what is essential. I love stone but if costs are high it's nice to know the options. I'd love too see a few pictures of your neighbor's house.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

Mfowler may I ask what price range your builder's quote was in? I did a cost estimate with software and when we cut out the fslse chimney and a few other things it helped. We're going to GC it too, which saves a lot.
Also we will wait to finish the basement and bonus room.


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RE: Shook Hill Plan Modifications -- input please!

@emptynesterslmost send me an email please(I think I have that option available) and then I will discuss that with you through emails. I Would be interested in getting some numbers from you as well regarding the cost estimator you used.


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