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aimless07

Do I have a bone to pick, should I pick it, and who pays for it?

Aims
9 years ago

I had posted a little of this in the "How's your build going" thread. The windows have gone in and there were some errors. We were initially understanding of some of these errors, however I am starting to lose some of the understanding!

We decided to do casement windows in the front of house and double hung in the back of house. Hubby likes how casement look, but they are more expensive so we compromised. The building supply store accidentally ordered ALL casement windows but said they would charge us for what we had originally requested. A break for us, right?

They ordered 5 foot windows for our living room instead of 6 foot windows. We decided to just accept that. The ordered the wrong size window for the master closet and the wrong window for the garage. The garage window will be fixed, the master closet window will do.

With the windows being installed yesterday, we discovered that to 2- 5 foot windows and the large window in the dining room are fixed. So the only window in the back of the house where the kitchen/living room area are that opens is the small window over the kitchen sink. I am unsure if the window we have in our reading nook by the front door opens and closes. I am going to check that out today. So if we wanted to open windows in the kitchen because we had a lot of smoke or wanted to air out the house, the only window that actually opens is the kitchen sink window which is 2 1/2 x 2 1/2 feet. From the partial snippet of our kitchen I posted, the backdoor can be opened as well.

We originally chose double hung because they could open and shut and were budget friendly. My old piece-o-crap spec home from DR Horton had windows in the kitchen/living/dining/family room that opened and shut. During certain times of the year, we would open those windows to air out the house. Wouldn't even have to turn on the heater or air conditioner.

Builder said that this was the way with windows and that is what was planned. There is a bit of a disconnect between what we got and what we thought we were going to get. Push comes to shove, I could live with the dining room window being fixed. The windows in the living room not being able to open bother me. Even if one of the 5 foot windows could open, that would be an improvement over nothing.

1. Am I overreacting. 2. Can this or should this be fixed. 3. If so, who is paying for it? I don't feel like hubby and I should pay for it because the building supply store screwed up to begin with. Or are we going to be stuck paying extra to get this done to the way we wanted it to begin with.

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Comments (13)

  • User
    9 years ago

    'There is a bit of a disconnect between what we got and what we thought we were going to get. ''

    Should be no ''thought'' about it. What does the written contract say? What was in the architect's written window and door schedule? What does the order to the window supplier have in writing? Were the smaller windows framed for, or the larger?

    Until you know tbe answers to those questions, you're speculating fault. Even if you know the answer to hose questions, fault doesn't solve the problems. Get the windows you want ordered, and sort out who pays for it after that detail is taken care of.

  • jimandanne_mi
    9 years ago

    What kind of climate do you live in? We're in the north, and it turns out that we almost never open most of our operable casement windows during any of the seasons, since we have an hourly operating ventilation system with our HRV. Also, when it's really cold like last winter, we had less condensation on the fixed windows than the operable--we've changed the settings this year to have even less.

    BTW, we have 5'6" high windows in our DR, LR, & BKFast Rm, but 5' high in the 1st floor MBR. DH likes the extra few inches of the view. I would like the extra energy efficiency during the winter of another 6" of the ICF wall across the bottom of the 35' of windows in these rooms.

    Anne

  • zone4newby
    9 years ago

    I would get them changed. Who pays depends on where the error occurred. If the plan shows them as fixed and you didn't catch the mistake, then you pay. Otherwise, the builder or supplier pay, and you don't need to get involved in how they work that out.

    When you chose double hung, was that written down anywhere?

  • Aims
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I took pictures of the windows we picked out and I see casement that have the little lever to open and close and other windows. I honestly don't remember if it was single or double hung, but they would open and close which is what I wanted.

    The sales guy wrote down what I had chosen. He said the reason why we got 5 foot doors and is that it was wrote down as 6-0 or 60 or something like that and they took at that as 60 inches and not 6 feet.

    Climate wise, we pretty much experience all 4 seasons here.

    I guess I am going to go up to Stock and ask to see the order receipt.

  • Aims
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Here is the other picture.

  • Aims
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Hubby went up to the house and the library nook window is fixed. He said that would be okay with if it was okay with me. I'll work with it. He also noticed that one of the windows in our master bedroom and opens and one of them doesn't open which isn't right. Those were just done today.

    We are meeting with the builder tomorrow to get this sorted out.

  • User
    9 years ago

    The reason one window in the bedroom is operable is in order to meet the code requirement for an emergency escape and rescue opening in all bedrooms.

    I have many times advised homeowners on the GW to not allow a builder to use the cryptic convention of using 60 to mean 72" or 6'-0" on the elevation drawings. (By the way, in my experience, 60 means 72" as silly as that seems)

    All window sizes should be dimensioned in rough opening feet - inches for the benefit of the framer. All windows should be specified separately for the benefit of the supplier in a Window Schedule that shows the manufacturer, model, rough opening, glass type, color, mullions, hardware, etc. Otherwise you are asking for mistakes.

    You might ask the GC where the horizontal mullion/sash rail is in the middle of the windows that were ordered for the front of the house. Something stinks; I think someone is making you take responsibility for their unprofessional mistakes.

    I not only provide clients with window schedules, I insist on reviewing the order before it is submitted which is a tedious and thankless job since all manufacturers use different cryptic conventions for their order sheets. I have never checked an order where there wasn't a mistake and some of them would have been very expensive to correct after delivery. Sometimes a window manufacturer will make a mistake with a correct order but that can be corrected at no cost to the owner.

    The issue here is documentation. If the correct windows were documented all errors should be corrected at no cost to the owner with no debate.

    I should also add that in the past 40 years I've known only one GC to order through a lumberyard/box store instead of a wholesale window supplier and the resulting mistakes in that order were the worst I've ever seen.

  • graywings123
    9 years ago

    Just my opinion, but you are not overreacting. I would not want to end up in a house with non-opening windows. I understand this isn't a big deal for some people. But it would be a major deal for me.

  • nightowlrn
    9 years ago

    I could not live in a house with windows that don't open as you are describing. So - it would be a problem for me. As far as responsibility--I have no idea. Good luck.

  • Kmbdac123
    9 years ago

    I agree with hollysprings....you need to go back to architect's plans and to the contracts and see what was specified. There would be little question after that who is at fault and who is responsible for additional costs incurred.

  • millworkman
    9 years ago

    Between holly and Reno they are spot on. What the wording is on the plans is actually somewhat immaterial though as to what is on the order you approved and signed.

  • Jackie Kennedy
    9 years ago

    I agree with the other folks who have said to check your contract and have them make the adjustments. Do not settle or "live with it" for arguments sake. You'll regret it down the road. You wanted specific windows then that's what you should get. If they want to readjust the order to where you have the original double hung in the rear then by all means....do that as it was your original plan to begin with. All in all....I would never settle if I know I specified something. I just had to call out my builder because they had both master bath window openings framed for 4040 but then turned around and installed one 4040 and one 2040?!?! They WILL be fixing it. Good luck!

  • Aims
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Renovator, can you tell me a little more about "You might ask the GC where the horizontal mullion/sash rail is in the middle of the windows that were ordered for the front of the house. Something stinks"

    We walked through the house with the builder. He said that it was his fault for not telling us that the windows that were accidentally ordered were fixed windows. If we wanted to take out one of those 5 foot fixed windows and put a cased window that opened, it would cost about $450.

    So we have decided to order a back door and buy screened patio door that can help with air circulation.

    The window that was accidentally installed in the garage opens and closes so we are going to swap that and put it in the reading nook window at the front of the house which will be nice.

    I am still not particularly happy with the situation, but having the screened patio door will work.