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nuieve_gw

Cost per square foot woes...

Nuieve
12 years ago

Trying to build a home here... Drew my own design, 2-story with full basement and 2-car garage 2500 sq ft, with stucco. Initial (detailed for bank) quote for construction were in 185-200k range from two contractors and included everything (even utilities hookup). That's about 75-80/sq ft. Which seemed reasonable. We added some necessary extras and quickly ran out of budget.

Then we decided to build a smaller home. Found a 1600 sq ft plan we liked. Showed it to a contractor. He quoted us 235k for the house. 40% smaller than previous house that somehow ended up costing more per sq.ft. This time he explained that unfinished basement will cost about $30/sq ft and garage about $45/sq ft on top of $1600 living area footage. And then stucco, at $30 000.

Again, out of budget. We used to think, cost per sq ft ALWAYS includes basement and 2-car garage (as 99% of new houses have them). So 1600 aq ft with a basement and 2-car garage should cost $80x1600sqft=$128000.

What do you think, are they double dipping with their estimates?

Comments (13)

  • worthy
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    cost per sq ft ALWAYS includes basement and 2-car garage (as 99% of new houses have them)

    Basements are not standard across the continent.

    Your best move is to get firm competitive quotes based on complete specs. It's very possible you're not comparing pineapples to pineapples.

    I can't comment on prices, as they are absurdly cheap for upscale homes in our area. My cost, as a builder, is $150 sf+.

  • mydreamhome
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Cost per square foot varies based on size of home, # of stories, lay of the land you're building on, area of the country you're in, & finish level to name a few. For example:

    -A 3 bd/2ba home @ 2000 sq ft on 1 level will likely cost more than the same specs on a 2 story home--it's cheaper to build up than out.

    -A 3bd/2ba home @ 2000 sq ft will typically only cost marginally more than a 3bd/2ba home @ 1600 sq ft--each home has the same high ticket items--1 kitchen, 2 baths, 1 HVAC system, etc. The additional square footage in family rooms, bedrooms, sunrooms, etc that make up the extra 400 sqft are very cheap by comparison.

    -A 3bd/2ba home @ 2000 sq ft on the main level and another 2000 sq ft in basement will typically add approx 1/3 the cost per sq foot of the going rate for a single level home with no basement with same finish level (at least in my area).

    -A 3bd/2ba home @ 2000 square feet on a lot that requires retaining walls, alot of backfill, or crossing a creek to access the buildable portion of the lot will cost more than the same house on a level lot with driveway access that only requires a small diameter culvert.

    -A 3bd/2ba home @ 2000 sq ft with granite countertops, hardwood & tile floors, heavy crown & base, upgraded lighting & plumbing fixtures will cost significantly more than the same house finished with laminate counters, carpet & vinyl floors, skinny crown & base, and builders' grade lighting & plumbing fixtures.

    -A 3bd/2ba home @ 2000 sq ft with porches will cost significantly more than the same home without the porches.

    -A 3bd/2ba home built in NC will cost significantly less than the same home built in NY or CA.

    -A 3bd/2ba home @ 2000 sq ft with vinyl siding will be more cost effective than Hardi Siding which will be more cost effective than brick which is usually more cost effective than stucco (at least in my area).

    Worthy is right--your best move is to get firm competitive quotes based on complete specs. A side note here: alot of builders will give you a better price point if you build a house they have in their design arsenal that they've already built before vs. using a custom plan--the custom plan typically has too many variables that could go horribly wrong so they inflate the price to protect themselves from potential loss. Don't expect to recoup that money if things go well with the build--he'll just pocket it with a smile & you won't ever be the wiser.

    Starter homes in my area (vinyl siding, vinyl windows, builder grade everything) start around $100sq ft in my area in a "good neighborhood". You can get the same house for about $80 sq foot in the more "undersireable neighborhoods" (i.e. you make sure your car is ALWAYS locked at night & you definitely make sure you are home & safely locked inside before dark).

    Midlevel homes in my area run around $120 sq ft--Hardi Siding or combination siding & brick/entry level faux stone, hardwood in family room, maybe builder grade tile floors in bath, upgraded lighting fixtures in family room & dining area. maybe level 1 granite in kitchen, beefier crown & base in common rooms.

    Upper level homes in my area run $130 sqft and UP. Brick or brick/stone combination or real stucco, hardwoods in common areas, upgraded carpet in bedrooms or hardwood, tile floors in baths and laundry, tile tub & shower surrounds, granite in kitchen & baths & sometimes even laundry, beefier crown & base in all rooms, upgraded lighting fixtures, & upgraded plumbing fixtures (we're talking Kohler/Grohe/Hansgrohe level and above).

    Hopefully this gives you a better idea of what you need to compare when talking with the different builders and helps you get a better idea of what you can expect to get for your money so you can better decide which direction to go with your build.

  • booksandpages
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    $80/sf is cheap. We had a couple of ballpark estimates at $150/sf, but it looks like we'll be able to get it done for a little over $130. We got rid of a jog in the foundation and made a minor adjustment to the second floor that saved some money on the roofing.

    Sounds like you should go back to your original design, take it to a preferred builder or two, and ask them what suggestions they can come up with to eliminate $X from the cost.

    Good luck!

  • brickeyee
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Why are you so fixated on cost per square foot?

    It is only a coarse estimator.

    Since the cost of rooms is not the same per square foot (kitchens and bathrooms are more than bedrooms) reducing the size by removing lower cost areas will raise the apparent cost per square foot of what remains.

  • Nuieve
    Original Author
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks everyone for your posts. Big thanks for dreamhome for his detailed post. Our lot is in old, mixed neighborhood. We have a 400k property adjacent to ours, we also have 150-200k properties next to us. Overall, we think of our neighborhood as "nice", not upscale by any means, but not ghetto either.

    However I don't really understand what does neighborhood has to do with cost of construction. The construction process and cost of materials should be the same for any neighborhood, right? (we do own the land already)

    Our first house was fully custom - everything in it was custom, floor to ceiling windows,open staircase, heated floors etc... Unfortunately, in my town everybody was just scratching their heads when I showed them elements of the house I wanted to build, and they said "uhhhhhmmm, never done this before, don't know how much it will cost, need one month to research". I forgot I don't live in major metrolpolitan area where people are used to something more than Walmart.

    I looked over at least 50 000 stock house plans, every single house plan site on the first 100 pages of google, exclusive plans and so on... I checked local construction firms plans, we found one plan that was very pretty outside, while offering all the space we need in a small square footage package, and we fell in love with it (we're very picky) and we want to stick with it. It's a pretty stock plan that doesn't require anything fancy, and we don't want hardwood floors, carpet is fine with us.

    Two-three years ago my cousin built their own house (2300sq ft) for 120k. Now they were fighting for every dollar of course, getting competitive quotes for everything, really getting the best deal for every single service and material... and in the end they built their house (pretty decent house dare I say) dirt cheap. Which makes us wonder if we should just forgo hiring greedy contractors altogether and just... do it ourselves. I have the winter coming, good time to read construction books and educate myself...

    I will of course have my select contractors bid against each other, but if they don't go down in their quotes much...

  • live_wire_oak
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Trying to estimate how much a home will cost by using an "average" per square foot is like trying to buy a car by the pound. It might correlate very roughly, but it's the wrong methodology. A 1200 square foot house with basement and lots of angles and rooflines can cost twice as much a a 2500 square foot square box Colonial with a second floor. The important differences are in the details that aren't about square footage. How many jogs does the foundation have? How many different rooflines? Changes of interior level?

    I'd suspect that your first plans were "bid" seriously low and would have required massive change orders. I live in a low cost area of the country, and the only way to have a home built for $70 a square foot would be to DIY cash build all of it or buy one of the subdivision cracker box houses stamped out by the hundreds by a production builder. Or, buy a new house trailer. Normal builds run $100 sq ft+. Which is why no one is building right now. (Add in that the bank requires actual arms and legs to finance a build!) You can buy an existing 3000 square foot home on 2 acres for 250K in my community.

    Why don't you take a look at existing homes and see how far your money will go there.

  • SpringtimeHomes
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Great posts. Price per sqft goes up as you build smaller.

    If youre getting bids on stock plans, I hope you have all the details spelled out. Expect some work and possible hardship to get the builders to meet those details without change orders all over the place. I suggest finding a builder who's work you like and trust and doing cost plus.

    Keep us posted if you choose to owner-build. Horror stories can be a entertaining if they arent too sad.

  • robin0919
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    What part of the country are you building in? That makes a HUGE difference.

  • david_cary
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    We paid about $20 a sqft for our unfinished basement in an area that doesn't typically have basements. It was daylight which meant excavation was easier and no dirt was hauled away. Also meant that 1/3 of the walls were framed and not concrete.

    There are lots of things that going into pricing other than $ per sqft..

    I am part way thru a very basic 2000 sq ft house. NC.
    Basically costs about $200k plus markup. This is on pilings which is a lot cheaper than a basement (about $12k) and it is a perfect rectangle 2 story house (no jog or gable). Vinyl siding. Markup is $50k. So $125 a sqft. There are things that aren't "normal" about this house but that amounts to $15 or so a sqft.

  • sierraeast
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    "Horror stories can be a entertaining if they arent too sad".

    Same can be said when folks have an incompetent builder/subs!

  • worthy
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I don't really understand what does neighborhood has to do with cost of construction

    It doesn't. (Except in the sense that some trades or gc's may try to milk out a premium in an expensive area if the homeowners are gullible. However, unless they won a lottery or inherited wealth, owners of luxury homes don't tend to be dumb.)

    Trying to estimate how much a home will cost by using an 'average"'per square foot is like trying to buy a car by the pound. It might correlate very roughly, but it's the wrong methodology.

    But it's one you're stuck with as a builder when prospects insist on rough estimates without building plans. And it's one I use myself with great accuracy when I'm building on my own account. And, if necessary, along the way I can trim the costs to meet my estimate. As opposed to many do it yourselfers or clients who come down with "candystoreitis," i.e., inability to say "no" to all the tempting extras.

  • SpringtimeHomes
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    "Same can be said when folks have an incompetent builder/subs!"

    Sooo true. I bet this happens most often when choosing the lowest bidder on incomplete plans and specs.

  • sierraeast
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    So many variables on a build way before even breaking ground