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Would this uneven wall bother you?

Posted by threeapples (My Page) on
Thu, Feb 7, 13 at 21:20

I'm speaking of the area where the brick and stone meet, it appears to bulge halfway up its height and indent too much where it (the stone) meets the brick. How on earth can this be corrected? It happens to really bug me.

 photo 89B058F3_zpsdcfd17d5.jpg


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

yes.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

How can that be fixed?


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

This probably will have to be torn down and re-done from scratch.

There's also a problem with the door opening on the right - it looks like the stone is closer to the door on the bottom than on the top...


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

jrldh, the stone being closer to the door on the top is what I was inquiring about. What is the other issue that you mentioned? Is that whole wall bowed? What a mess.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Yes.

The best way to correct it is to not pay for that part of the work. Speak up. The good thing is, you don't need to know how to fix the wall and if you have a GC it doesn't matter much if the mason or other trade messed up--all you need to know is good vs. bad workmanship, and by posting you know the answer. Is the GC aware? Effect on the schedule will depend on the problem and solution. Good luck.

The other ways are to pay for it twice, or to plant a shrub in front of it.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I emailed our builder and architect. This is on the detached garage so redoing it will not impact our timeline at all, which is great. But, will taking this down ruin the stone, the brick, or anything else? We want this house to look old, but this is just shoddy workmanship.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I was referring to the double door on the right side of your picture. This is in addition to the wave/bow close to the other door.

This looks like real stone. It's probably much harder than the mortar and can likely be salvaged without damage to the rocks. Lots of work, though...


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Everything 200yrs ago on a house using natural stone wasn't perfectly strait.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Love the stone, but yeah, that wall would bug the stew out of me


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

To be honest, the bowing (on the left) itself doesn't bother me too much. What I can't look past however is the selection/placement of the individual stones on the left hand wall.

Unless my tired old eyes are deceiving me, about mid-way up, there appears to be a horozontal run of individual pieces about 10 stones long where they are all the same size. To my eye, that just doesn't flow naturally.

I'd wager the mason had a new guy work on that side and he just doesn't yet know how to mix and match his piece selections as he is building a wall.

Yeah, talk it over with the GC and the mason to see what can be done. If they argue, drop a plumb line from top to bottom to make your point.

Good luck,
Doc


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

It appear that it could be easily repaired.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Yes, this is real stone, not veneer.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Do you think they could just take out a section near the door and put thicker stones in toward the bottom?


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Yes it would bug me and I agree you have issues on both walls. The wall to the left of the double doors also appears to bow. It is just not as obvious because it is not abutting red brick.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I think they got really lazy and didn't care when they picked up a rock that was too thick. Laid it anyway.

How are they going to finish above the doors where the rock reaches the wood? Our house has a "pocket" where the stonemasons took the last/top rock behind the board into the "pocket."


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Natural materials have natural variation, though sometimes they end up the same size anyway.

I had a stone faced fireplace at one house that must have taken many extra hours to build.

It looked 'strange' at first until I realized it was perfectly symmetrical about the middle of the firebox.

Every stone had been sized and placed symmetrically.

The basement fireplace under it was not executed in the same manner.

Many people commented on how it looked 'different' until they realized the symmetry.

This post was edited by brickeyee on Fri, Feb 8, 13 at 16:51


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I have no idea what's going on above the brick. I'm waiting for the architect to weigh in.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

What type of detail is on the blueprints?


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

It appears the back of this garage has no moulding details specified by the architect. I'm going to bug the architect again since we have still not heard from him about this matter.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

We have a vaulted shiplap ceiling on our screened porch with a fieldstone fireplace - large irregular stones like yours but no mortar. The ceiling was put in place before the fireplace stones were placed. The stones at the top were cut so they butt up to the edge of the ceiling. This leaves for a very neat finish I think - no gap in wood or mortar issues.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Athensmom, do you have a photo I can show my masons? That sounds nice.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I must be missing something. If it was supposed to look rustic and irregular, they succeeded.

In any case, there seems to have been a lack of communication
amongst architect, owner and masons as to exactly how rustic it was supposed to look.

Tearing down a veneer wall and rebuilding it is not that big of a deal. One perfectionist masonry contractor I had ordered one of his guys to tear down a days worth of bricklaying to redo it to his satisfaction. I hadn't even noticed.

This post was edited by worthy on Sat, Feb 9, 13 at 12:33


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

worthy, i think building this wall bowed out like that is not really acceptable. i never told them i wanted things not plumb. after having to redo several sections of the brick when they did a pretty bad job on the house i would have thought they would be more mindful of these details.

the architect has not been involved at all and i communicated to the masons what i wanted. i said i wanted the stones staggered and not laid in a pattern. i told them the kind of mortar joints i wanted. i did not tell them i wanted otherwise straight corners to be curved.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

In our last house my husband did not like the mortar they used - as we specified (natural vs white for texas limestone). So they pulled it all down and redid the work with the mortar my husband wanted. Totally our mistake - but turned out to be not a big deal - did not cost us anything - I think if at this point they still can fix things fairly quickly. Try to get this fixed.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

i said i wanted the stones staggered and not laid in a pattern.

Staggered is a pattern, viz. "To place on or as if on alternating sides of a center line; set in a zigzag row or rows."

Perhaps you meant random. However, with so many roughly rectangular stones, I don't know how you do that.

As I said, poor communication. All this "telling"--and lots of waving of hands, I bet--isn't really effective. Draw or write down exactly what you are expecting them to do. Bring photos of similar work. Next try, if possible, stay on site awhile or drop by more frequently.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I don't think that this is a communications problem because it is highly unlikely that anyone would specify such sloppy work.

And no, it does not look "rustic".


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I gave them a photo, made a drawing, and stood in the mud in pouring rain many times watching these walls go up. This part went up the one day I couldn't supervise because it was not physically possible for me to access this area becauae of machinery behind thetent they put up to stay dry while laying the stone. Perhaps the lack of space to stand back and view things properly is their reason for acrwwing it up. Either way, a plumb line should have been used in order to conform to the straight and level masonry lines specified in our contract.
Yes, random is what I meant to type and, in fact, what I told them.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

This is an issue where your GC should be mediating between you and the masons.
It's fine to tell the masons what you want, but your GC should be hearing the conversation also. If he's not there for some reason then shoot him an email to tell him what you told the masons (straight, random, mortar style etc).
When you see something you don't like call the GC and have a 3 way meeting with him, the masons and you. Then its up to him to tell the masons to tear it down and start over.
If the architect hasn't been hired to take the job through construction (and this has been the feeling that I've gotten from you in previous posts) then he has no responsibility here. Even if there isn't a detail on the butting of the stone to the ceiling, this isn't the first stone and ceiling abutment that the GC and masons have done.... I'm not seeing why the architect who hasn't been supervising the project should be concerned with straight stone laying?

You aren't alone and things happen. In an otherwise spectacular stonework job on our house, there was a section about 5' x 3' where the ledgestone wasn't level and tilted up. Unfortunately it was front and center over the outdoor fireplace. There were no questions asked when told to tear it out and redo that section. Many other people could have lived with it or perhaps never have even noticed. But that wasn't me and I was the one that had to be happy.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

The architect was hired to see the project to completion. His involvement should not be with straight stone laying, but to explain how the stone should meet the soffit or crown.

I'm not going up be the one to tell the masons to fix this. My builder will handle it.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Sorry Threeapples!

I thought you'd said in the past when asking about trim, stairs etc that your architect wasn't involved. My mistake.

Please let us know how it turns out.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

Gbsim, you're right. I did say that. He has not been involved in any details. That is not what we anticipated or intended, however, and the reason we are sort of lost and frustrated.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

What did your Builder say?


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

We are waiting to hear back from him about it.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

so did you keep the wall....?


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

everything is fine now, it was bowed out to accommodate for the water table, which you can't see in this particular photo, but it's great now. we haven't had them add stone to the top yet, but will do that as soon as we have some better weather.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

I'm confused as it appeared to bow out on the left side (at the brick) in the original photo and flare out at the bottom on the right (at the garage door)--did the builder fix it or does it still look uneven? Can you post a new photo?


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

It's perfect, no flaring out at all. I don't have an updated photo, but will try to remember to take one soon.


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RE: Would this uneven wall bother you?

So glad it worked out, good luck with the rest!


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