Wow, I'd forgotten about this thread and a LOT has changed for my ratings in the last four years. Vaporvac - sorry it took a while to get back to you about your question. Disneyland lasted about 3 years for me grafted from J&P then died, so I replaced it own root about 2 years ago. It didn't come back last winter but that's one that i still pine after and will probably replace whenever I can. There's something about the solid "pow" of color that makes my heart sing, and to top it off my son wrote the name tag for that rose when he was about 9 so it has a sentimental value that way too. Moses, glad this is helpful, but to be really helpful I need to update the listing above quite a bit. For starters, very few Harkness roses are hardy for me in zone 5, with the exception of Samaritan and Volunteer in a normal zone 5 spot and Savoy Hotel and Well Being which are grafted and in my zone 6 pocket. A few of the climbers by Harkness are also hardy - Perpetually Yours and The Prince's Trust are several years old and Ginger Syllabub has survived my zone 4 pocket - but they almost never bloom. Olive is a better bloomer (a few blooms a year) but it's no more than 4' tall after about 4 years. I still do have some Harkness survivors in my yard that surprised me when I did a search - Apricot Abundance and Honor Elizabeth, International Herald Tribune are just barely hanging in there and Easy Does It and Livin' Easy have lasted sporadically but usually die off after a year or two. Armada, Bridge of Sighs, Carris, and Pride of England have only lasted one winter and that's not enough to consider them hardy yet. I've started to nix roses bred by Harkness on principle as marginally hardy in the way that Viragharavian roses simply aren't bred for my climate. It sounds like I have a lot of Harkness roses but given how many he bred and how many roses I have, it's not that many (compare that to 50+ thriving roses each for Kordes, Lim and Austin and you get the picture). OK, so here's my updated list from above with notes on whether I'd still rate them in the same group or not. Floribunda Roses hardier than expected in zone 5 (those w/ an asterisk are in a zone 4 pocket) 1 - cane hardy (w/hybridizer) Black Cherry - Zary (probably a 2 - not cane hardy but reliable after winters) Black Ice - Gandy (probably a 2 - not cane hardy but reliable after winters) *Bolero - Meilland (probably a 2 - not cane hardy but reliable after winters) Bonica - Meilland Brothers Grimm Fairy Tale - Kordes (50/50 if it has surviving cane or not) Champagne Moment - Kordes Cherry Parfait - Meilland (50/50 if it has surviving cane or not) Cinco de Mayo - Carruth (probably a 2 - not cane hardy but reliable after winters) Easy Does It - Harkness (put this one a 3 for me - needs my zone 6 pocket) *Eutin - Kordes *First Edition - Delbard (probably a 2 since it died in that cold spot) *Floral Fairy Tale - Kordes Grand Duc Henri - Lens (was cane hardy but the graft died out and I can't replace it) Gruss an Aachen - Geduldig *Hannah Gordon - Kordes *Heaven on Earth - Kordes Heimatmelodie - Tantau (I'd bump this one down to a 4 - only lasted a year or two) *Hot Cocoa - Carruth *LavaGlut - Kordes Pink Emely/Bad Worishofen - Kordes Pink Gruss an Aachen - Kluis (50/50 if it has surviving cane or not) Pinocchio - Kordes (was cane hardy but the graft died out and I can't replace it) Pomponella Fairy Tale - Kordes (probably a 2 - not cane hardy but reliable after winters) Pretty Lady - Scrivens Puerto Rico - Delbard (I'd bump this one down to a 4 - only lasted a year or two) Rainforest - Moore (I'd bump this one down to a 3 - I've replaced in my zone 6) Sunsprite/Friesia - Kordes (probably a 2 - not cane hardy but reliable after winters) World's Fair - Kordes (was cane hardy but the graft died out and I can't replace it) Flori2 - root hardy (w/hybridizer) Amberlight - Le Grice Anne Harkness - Harkness (not hardy more than 1 year even in my zone 6 pocket) Bahia - Lammerts (probably a 3 - lasted several years & I'm replacing into zone 6) Bengal Tiger - Kealovetz (totally wimpy rose never more than 1-2' and finally died) Blueberry Hill - Carruth (probably a 3 - lasted several years & I'm replacing in zone 6) Burgundy Iceberg - Swane (not hardy more than 1 year even in my zone 6 pocket) Chic - Boerner (was hardy but the graft died out and I can't replace it) Chihuly - Carruth Chrysler Imperial - Lammerts Colorific - Carruth Confetti - Christensen Disneyland - Zary (probably a 3 - lasted several years & I'm replacing in zone 6) Elina/Peaudouce - Dickson (was hardy but the graft died out and I'm replacing it) Escapade - Harkness (not hardy more than 1 year even in my zone 6 pocket) Everest Double Fragrance - Beales George Burns - Carruth Guinevere/Louisa Stone - Harkness (probably a 3 - lasted several years, don't want to replace it as it wasn't very exciting) Hettie - Barden (probably a 3 - lasted several years, I'm waiting to see if RV has it) International Herald Tribune - Harkness (had to replace once, probably a 3) Julia Child - Carruth Lilac Dawn - Swim & Weeks (was hardy but the graft died out and I'm replacing it) Marieken - RVS Mardi Gras - Zary Melvin - Jerabek Moondance - Zary October Moon - Barden (has survived several years in zone 6 spot) Olympiad - McGredy Oranges 'n' Lemons - McGredy Pillow Talk - Weeks (wimpy 2a rose, but it was in a poor spot and died over time) Playboy - Cocker (not hardy more than a year or two even in my zone 6 pocket) Singin in the Rain - McGredy (not hardy more than a year or two even in my zone 6 pocket) South Africa - Kordes (not hardy for me - I simply can't overwinter this Kordes) Tempi Moderni - Barni (not hardy more than a year or two even in my zone 6 pocket) Trumpeter - McGredy Wishing/Georgie Girl - Dickson (was hardy but the graft died out and I can't replace) Flori2a - root hardy but wimps (w/hybridizer) Ebb Tide - Carruth (bump this down to a 4 for me - has died in my zone 6 pocket) Hiroshima's Children - Harkness (not hardy more than 1 year) Irish Hope - Harkness (lasted a couple of years in zone 6 pocket but wimpy) JC Thornton - BEES (bump this up to regular 2, in zone 6 pocket) Kiss of Fire - Gaujard (not hardy more than a year or two ) Our Lady of Guadalupe - (own root OLOG is doing better than grafted one) Valentine - Swim (same as above - I'm replacing mine this year in zone 6 pocket) Flori3 - root hardy in protected site - zone 6 pockets (w/hybridizer) Drop Dead Red - Carruth (iffy for me, probably a 4 - both times grafted) Flash - Barni Grimaldi - Delbard Hot Chocolate - Simpson (not hardy more than a year or two) Innocencia Vigorosa - Kordes (probably better, but wimpy rose) Isabella Rosselini - Poulsen (iffy for me, probably a 4 - both times grafted) Lili Marlene - Kordes Minuette - Lammerts (iffy for me, probably a 4 own root) Sammy - Athy (iffy for me, probably a 4 - grafted) Summer Dream - Warriner Tickles - Dykstra Tiki - McGredy Wavria - Lens (iffy for me, probably a 4 - grafted) Flori4 - hardy only with protection (w/hybridizer) Atlantic City - Jolly (lasted a few years then faded) Daily Sketch - McGredy (might be better) Erfordia - Matthews (This one bumps up to a 2 - a rock star all summer bloomer) Guy de Maupassant - Meilland (bump up to a 3, has lasted in zone 6 pocket) Gypsy Carnival - Suzuki (dead) Little Darling - Duehrsen (dead) Mauve Melodee - Raffel (lasted several years before fading, might be a 3) Mellow Yellow - Carruth (might be better) Outrageous - Zary (might be better) Pride of England - Harkness (on its second try) Purple Heart - Carruth (dead) Spice of Life - Dickson (dead) Tenacious - McGredy (This one bumps up to a 2) Tuscan Sun - Zary (This one bumps up to a 2) Zambra - Meilland (lasted a few years then faded) That leaves the following as the floribundas that are the hardiest for me for the most years in zone 5, down to zone 4 if * (I haven't checked the ones planted since 2013): Bonica - Meilland Champagne Moment - Kordes *Eutin - Kordes *Floral Fairy Tale - Kordes Gruss an Aachen - Geduldig *Hannah Gordon - Kordes *Heaven on Earth - Kordes *Hot Cocoa - Carruth *LavaGlut - Kordes Pink Emely/Bad Worishofen - Kordes Pinocchio - Kordes (was cane hardy but the graft died out and I can't replace it) Pretty Lady - Scrivens Anyone surprised to see Kordes leading the pack? I didn't think so... Cynthia

Dear Fishy, Thank you for the lovely box of goodies that arrived yesterday! I love the Calla Lilies! I have been wanting some for quite a while now and love the mixed mixed colors that you sent! I don't have any of these in my gardens and will be looking forward to all of these new blooms. I just received my order from Novosel the other day so it is perfect timing with all of the peat pots and trays and mini greenhouses that I now have! Here is the list of all that I received: Calla Lilies Mixed Colors Large bag of mixed Gladiolus Morning Glory Crimson Rambler Godetia Sweeties (I have never seen these before, they are so pretty!) Bachelor Buttons Cyanus Double Mixed Colors English Daisies Mixed Colors (perennials) Watermelon Sugar Baby Fishy I think the little Clay Pea Pod that you made is very cute. It is perfect, my nickname for my oldest was sweetpea when he was a baby, I got a big smile when I picked that out of your box! The boys have confiscated the coconut monkey that you sent! They love it and have decided to keep it for themselves! LOL! It is now on display in their bedroom on the dresser. Thank you very much for everything that you sent!

Here is the list containing 462 names. When you see names of hostas on the same line but separated by a front slash ( / ), this means that these are look-alike: List of Distinct Hostas It is said that out the 3800 to 4000 now registered and NR hosta varieties, between 450 and 500 are DISTINCT ONES. HERE IS "A LIST" (not "THE" LIST) of 462 names: * Aarkward * Abba Dabba Do * Abiqua Drinking Gourd / Love Pat / Golden Teacup * Abiqua Hallucination Abiqua Moonbeam / Mayan Moon Academy Flora Alex Summers Allegan Fog Alligator Shoes Alvatine Taylor / Tokudama Flavo-circinalis American Sweethearts Antioch / Moerheim Apple Court Aristocrat Aspen Gold August Beauty August Moon Austin Dickinson Baby Bunting Banana Boat Banana Muffins Band Of Gold Barbara Ann Behemoth Betty Hammond Big Daddy Big Daddy Streak Big Mama Bill Brincka Bill Meyer Birchwood Parky's Gold Bizarre Black Banner Black Hills Blizzard Blue Angel Blue Arrow Blue Betty Lou Blue Blazes Blue Cadet (small)/Hadspen Blue (medium) Blue Cups / I'm So Blue Blue Dimples Blue Hawaii Blue Jay Blue Mammoth Blue Moon Blue Mouse Ear Blue Shadows Blue Umbrellas Blue Velvet Blue Vision Blue Wedgwood / Blue Dimples Bob Olson Bold Ruffles Border Bandit Bottom Line Break Dance Brenda's Beauty Bressingham Blue Bridegroom Bright Lights / Blue Shadows / Tokudama Aureonebulosa Brim Cup Bud is Wiser Camelot / Curlew Canadian Blue Canadian Shield Candy Hearts Candydish Captain Kirk Carnival Caroline Blue Cat's Eyes Center of Attention Chartreuse Wedge Chartreuse Wiggles Cherry Berry Chinese Sunrise Choo Choo Train Christmas Tree / Grand Master Cinnamon Sticks Citation City Lights Collector's Banner Color Glory /Super Nova / Borwick Beauty Color Parade Colossal /Big John /Big Foot Cool Hand Luke Cracker Crumbs Crepe Soul Crepe Suzette Curls Cutting Edge Dark Star Darwin's Standard Daybreak (true 'gold' color) Deep Blue Sea Delta Dawn Devon Green / Peridot Diana Remembered Dick Ward / Midwest Magic Doctor Hale Don Quixote Donahue's Piecrust Dorothy Benedict Dorset Blue Double Dutch Dragon Wings Dream Weaver / Thunderbolt Dust Devil Eagles Nest Early Sunrise Ebb Tide El Capitan El Nino Elata Elatior Elegans Elizabeth Campbell Elphin Fire Elvis Lives Elvis on Stage Embroidery Emerald Coast Emerald Eyes Emerald Necklace Enchantment Eola Sapphire Eventide Fair Maiden Fan Dance Fantabulus Fascination Fascinator Fatal Attraction Filagree Fire and Ice/Loyalist/ Paul Revere First Impressions Flame Stitch Flower Power Formal Attire fortunei Aureomarginata / Ellerbrook Fragrant Blue Fragrant Bouquet Francee /Albo Marginata Frances Williams /Aurora Borealis/Olive Bailey Langdon/Samurai Fried Bananas Fried Green Tomatoes Fringe Benefit Frosted Jade Frosted Mini Muffins Fujiboton, Galaxy Galaxy Light Geisha Gilt bby Association Ginko Craig / Bunchoko Ginsu Knife Glory Gold Drop / Gold Edger Gold Regal Gold Standard Gold Teacup Golden Canopy Golden Cascades Golden Crown Golden Friendship Golden Gate Golden Maple Golden Scepter Golden Spades Golden Sunburst Golden Waffles GoldenTiara/Amber Tiara/Heavenly Tiara Golder Scepter Grand Prize Grand Slam Grand Tiara Gray Cole Great American Expectations Great Expectations Grecian Vase Green Acres / Mikado / King Michael Green Eyes Grey Ghost Ground Sulphur Guacamole Guardian Angel / Angel Eyes Gunsmoke Gypsy Rose Hacksaw Hadspen Blue / Blue Cadet Hadspen Samphire Halycon Heart and Soul Heartsong Helios Hi Ho Silver High Style Hirao Magesty Hirao Splendor Holly's Velvet Piecrust Honeybells Hoosier Harmony Hope Hot Lips Hubba Hubba Hyacinthina Ice Cream Invincible Iron Gate Delight Island Charm Jack of Diamonds Jade Cascade / Green Fountain Jade Scepter Janet Jewel of The Nile Jimmy Crack Corn Joshua's Banner Joyce Trott June Just So King Tut Kiwi Blue Sunrise Kiwi Full Monty Knockout / Snowcap Komodo Dragon Korean Snow Krossa Cream Edge Krossa Regal Lacey Belle Lady Isobel Barnett Lakeside Babyface Lakeside Beach Captain Lakeside Black Satin Lakeside Blue Jeans Lakeside Cha Cha Lakeside Coal Miner Lakeside Dividing Line Lakeside Dixie Lakeside Dragonfly Lakeside Kaleidoscope Lakeside Knick Knack Lakeside Lollipop Lakeside Looking Glass Lakeside Masterpiece Lakeside Meter Maid Lakeside Mom Lakeside Party Dress Lakeside Pincushion Lakeside Prissy Miss Lakeside Roy El Lakeside San Kao Lakeside Shore Master Lakeside Surfrider Lancifolia Laura and Darrell Leather Sheen Lemon Lime Liberty Little Ceasar Little Doll Little Sunspot Love Pat /Abiqua Drinking Gourd / Lovelight Loyalist / Fire and Ice / Paul Revere Lucy Vitols Luner Orbit Mack The Knife Marion Bachman Masquerade Maui Buttercups Medal of Honor Midas Touch Mildred Seaver Millennium Ming Jade Miss Missy Mississippi Delta Mistress Mable Montana Aureomarginata Montana Macrophylla Moon Wave Moonlight Sonata Mount Tom Mountain Snow Mr. Big My Brother Ronald Neat and Tidy Niagara Falls / Green Piecrust Nifty Fifty Night Before Christmas Northern Halo / Northern Exposure Northern Lights Obsession Olive Branch On Stage On the Edge One Man's Treasure Ophir Orange Marmalade Pacific Blue Edger Paintbrush Pandora's Box Paradigm Paradise Joyce Parthelion Patriot / Minuteman / Francee Paul's Glory Peace Pearl Lake Peedee Laughing River Peepshow Permanent Wave Peter's Passion Piedmont Gold / Richland Gold Pineapple Poll Pineapple Upsidedown Cake Pizzazz Plantageniea Plantageniea Aphrodite Plum Bob Polar Moon Popo Potomac Pride Prairie Magic Praying Hands Princess Anastasia Principal's List Queen Josephine Queen Of Islip Quilting Bee Radio Waves Rainforest Sunrise Rapsberry Sorbet Reasonance / Ground Master Red Dragon Red Neck Heaven Red October Regal Rumor Regal Splendor / Border Patrol Remember Me Reptillian Revolution Rick Rack Riptide Risky Business Robert's Rapier Rosedale Spoons Roseville Tractor Seat Rossing's Pride Royal Accolade Royal Flush Royal Standard Royalty Rupifragia Rusty Bee Ryan's Big One Sagae Saint Elmo's Fire Salute Satisfaction / Tyler's Treasure Savannah Supreme Sea Biscuit Sea Blue Monster Sea Dream Sea Frolic Sea Gulf Stream Sea Lotus Sea Monster Sea Thunder Sea Wiggles September Sun / Inniswood Seventh Heaven Shade Fanfare Shady Lady Sharmon Sheila Macqueen Sheila West Shogun Showboat Silver Bowl Silver Kabitan Silver Streak Sitting Pretty Snow Flakes Snowcap So Sweet Soaring Flame Sparky Spilt Milk Spinach Patch Spring Fling Spritzer Squash Casserole Stained Glass Stepping Out Stetson Stiletto Stirfry Stolen Kiss Striptease Sugar and Cream Sugar Daddy Sum and Substance Sum It Up / Lady Isobel Barnett Sum Of All Sum Total Summer Breeze Summer Joy Summer Music Sun Power Super Nova / Color Glory / Borwick Beauty Surprise By Joy Sweet Home Chicago Swoosh T Rex Tardiflora Tattoo T-Dawg Tea and Crumpets Thumberlina Tiffany's Godzilla Tijuana Brass Tiny Tears Titanic Tokudama Aureonebulosa Tony Avent Topaz Torchlight Tortifrons True Blue Turtle Dove Twilight Twist of Lime Twisted Sister Unchained Melody Undulata Univitatta Unforgettable Valentine Lace Ventricosa (a species that won't be appreciated till it gets to maturity) Victory Vim and Vigor Warwick Comet Warwick Delight Wheaton Blue Whirling Dervish Whirlwind Whirrling Dervish White Christmas White Triumphator White Wall Tire Wide Brim Wiggle Worms Wild Bill Windfield Blue Winter Lightning Wolverine Xanadu Snow Yellow Emperor Yellow River Yingeri Zounds Note: This list is not meant to be perfect. Oher names could possibly be added. compiled by PAPOU Last revision: March 24, 2004

OHHhhhh, this is sounding better all the time....but yes, Chris, you'd better fill us in on this character!! Count me in for the dark chocolate...(altho' when it get up to about 70-75% cocoa, it's a little bitter for me...) I tasted some lovely ports this past week that would be heavenly with dark chocolate... (an aside -- we tease DS about being a foundling, because he's the only one in the family who really just doesn't like chocolate...) this is a far better celebration that what I'll get at home! take care litlbit