I used the same size kit for my bathroom. I used the kit with the offset drain, designed to accommodate plumbing from a previous bathtub. The foam pieces of the pan and curb are easy to cut-to-fit. The foam is easy to dent if you walk on it before the tile is laid. The 60" Long kit uses two pieces of curb that become joined as you set them in thinset.

The drain is pretty forgiving as far as placement is concerned. My experience with the Kerdi membrane itself was patience-testing. If the thinset was just too wet or just too dry, it wouldn't behave. On top of that, the membrane didn't like to conform to outside corners too well. I should have cut it at these points and then used Kerdi Band to seal it, but I didn't.

You'll find that, like any project, you'll learn a lot of things your first time through that you'll wish you had known about before hand. Do you have a friend that needs a Kerdi shower installed? ;-)

It's not difficult, but can be time consuming.

I've used the foam trays they've been fine. The tray is most appropriate when you can match the shower size and drain location to a tray's dimensions. Any fidgeting or fudging with the shower size and/or drain location, and for me it's easier to just use deck mud. Looks like it'll work fine in your application with the dimensions you listed.

The tray and curb installs fast and it's pretty easy to get it correct the first time you try.

Kerdi membrane itself is very straightforward and simple to use.

Most of the time the showers I've done are custom or one-off designs, so I'll do deck mud. Several years ago I did a bunch of apartment bathrooms in Kerdi. I designed the bathrooms for Kerdi with the foam trays and the installations went fast fast fast.

I have written a lot about how hard Kerdi is to install and how much easier it is in smaller pieces for some time now. Your question or observations are common and come up time and time again. Kerdi makes custom inside and outside corners but with 2-3 plys of Kerdi plus thinset these corners get tough for the first time installer or even an older pro like me.

If your building that steamer then Kerdi is the easiest and best way to install. If it's not a steamer then any of the liquid membranes approved for floors and walls is great. I'm working my way through a bucket of Hydro Ban right now and love it.

To give you an idea of the difference in skill set involved in these two installs my 8 year old daughter help me waterproof our last project. Together we waterproofed a tub enclosure in 35 minutes.

I have never had a liquid membrane fail - I can't say the same for my Kerdi installs. My only failure with Kerdi came from a careless error on my part where I didn't check the date code on my mortar and the mortar was too old and didn't work.

If you feel Kerdi is the best way to go then read Mongo's thread on it - it's the best online step by step bar none.

Here is a link that might be useful: Kerdi Shower Part Deux

Thanks for your replies. Interesting, I did a forum search on Kerdi, and nothing came up.

I guess I left my most important question out of my initial post. Is there any reason I should ask my contractor to use a Kerdi system instead of a more traditional approach (which I guess would be a shower pan)? If I am not DIYing, are both approaches equally acceptable? I think the contractor would prefer to use a system with which he is familiar.

One thing I want to add to this-- Something John touched on in his post-- something alot of pros are starting to do now is usd Laticrete's Hydroban in place of the Kerdi membrane, so you DON'T get that stacking up of membranes in the corners etc., and using it with Schluter's Kerdi drain. The Vice President of Laticrete is a close personal friend of mine, and he has assured me that Laticrete WILL WARRANTY this installation.

Yeah, once that word gets out I'm waiting for Schluter to charge $70 for the Kerdi drain when you buy it with a roll of Kerdi, or $150 when you just buy the drain as a stand-alone.

Hydroban is an excellent product, 'no fabric required' saves a bit of labor and mess.

No seams to deal with, either.

Help!

I was going to have my installer use Kerdi on my new shower, which he has never used, but very willing to try in my project.

Now I'm debating if I should have him use Hydroban with a Kerdi drain instead, as after reading comments here and corresponding with the Pros here sounds a bit more user friendly for the first-timer versus Kerdi.

Just want the shower to be as waterproof as possible and done properly, so there are no problems in the future.

Any comments would be appreciated.

Thanks you so much.

I just heard back from Laticrete and can confirm Bills post. Mr. Rothberg confirms they warranty all their product - I'm sure it's mentioned in their warranty that proper install techniques and approved building practices must be used.

Try the Hydroban it goes on like butter!

I love the pale green colour and that fine pencil lines show up so nicely when doing layout. I do however badly crave olives after a waterproofing session...

I'm testing the product under serve condition here in North Vancouver. With cold overnight lows and hot South facing sun the Hydroban testing over building paper is proving to me it's flexibility and it's ability to expand and contract and not fail. Of course Hydroban is not recommended over building paper and building paper is not a tile substrate - but the test shows me movement and expansion. I look for spider web cracks and failure at the edges and after 10 days I can see none. We have had driving rain, fog and sun these past 10 days here in North Vancouver.

Flexibility and expansion issues are important considerations and even more important when the framing or boarding prep is less than ideal.

On a side note I have just wrapped up a grouting job with their SpectraLock product and was blown away. The only one more thrilled than I with the end result is my client!

{{gwi:1440844}}

Laticrete #45 Raven SpectraLock PRO Grout shown alongside our custom made vanity and 1'x2' Jet Black slate.


Regards,

John Whipple
North Vancouver, B.C.

The thing I like about the whole Hydroban concept is that it's completely seamless, and that there's no buildup up of membrane in corners. Additionally, as easy as Kerdi is to use, who doesn't know how to use a paint roller! About the only thing to remember is that all seams and corners need to be reinforced with the 6" fabric that's available for it. past that, it's no harder than painting your walls.

Bill is the fabric needed? I thought it wasn't.

We tape'd the corners with stucco mesh / drywall mesh and speed set and these last two bathrooms have been boarded with Denshield. We board with construction adhesive and screws then tape our seems and fill the screw heads with a touch of speedset. The next day the installation is a tank and we Hydro Ban. The next day we give it a second coat and let it dry out for a few hours while we work on the cut list and any polishing or millwork needed for the install.

We have build many showers before this way and have had great success. Am I missing something?

I viewed the spec sheet at Laticrete and it doesn't mention the use of fabric - on the contrary it says it's not needed.

Here is a link that might be useful: Hydro Ban Spec Sheet

It's not NEEDED, but it is recommended for wall/ floor and wall/ wall junctions, basically the same as mesh tape. It's just to strengthen the corners. and seams between the sheets. Actually, what you've done is just as good. So long as the junctions of one sheet of wallboard to the next is reinforced, you should be good. I'd be wanting to use a nice wide mesh tape, though-- as in 3" minimum.

John,

Take a look through the whole sheet. The bullet list on page one says no fabric for cracks 1/8" or less, but it then refers you to the remainder of the spec sheet for complete instructions.

The complete details for shower substrates are mentioned under Step 5: Pre-treat Cracks and Joints.

I type too slowly!

Hi,
My Dad and I are remodeling a bathroom in his house...taking out a tub and putting in a curbless shower. I just found this thread. We were thinking of doing Kerdi...but now I am reading this about Hydroban. So if I understand, you use the Kerdi drain and then paint on Hydroban? Is Hydroban better than Redgard then? I have used Redgard in the past.

"Better" can be subjective, but I'll fess that I'd prefer to use Hydroban over RedGard for basic waterproofing.

And since you're going hybrid with the Kerdi drain, then I'd definitely chose Hydro over Red.

Thanks Mongoct...thinking that's the way to go

If you're going to go with the hybrid using the Kerdi drain, there's a very definite reason to go with Hydroban over the Red Gard. Laticrete will warranty the hybrid installation. Custom Building Products (the manufacturers of Red Gard) won't.

Thanks Bill. That is definately a good reason!