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lee676

Can a Drop-In tub be installed in an alcove?

lee676
11 years ago

I'm designing a bathroom with a 6' x 36" tub, which will double as a shower. It will be surrounded on three walls either by tile or a tub surround. Ideally a skirted alcove tub would be used here, but though 5' alcove tubs are common, the selection of 6' alcove tubs is relatively scant. Alcove tubs extend behind the tile some to ease the transition; drop-in tubs don't have this. There's no room to build a tile deck around the tub.

If installed carefully, can a drop-in tub be installed in an alcove, carefully caulking the three walls where they meet the (rectangular) tub, and tiling the front section where the apron would have been? This will be a straight soaking tub, no air or water jets. It looks alot like the one pictured here, although without the slight bevel on the edges where the three walls would meet.

thanks

Comments (28)

  • _sophiewheeler
    11 years ago

    If you are OK with the thin line of caulk being the only barrier between the eventual water behind your walls rotting things out and the continual water shed out onto the floor from the deck while being used as a shower, then go ahead.

    It would be better to turn the whole thing into a shower than to try to frankenstein a drop in into being something it's not.

  • lee676
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    Why would water shed outonto the floor any more than with alcove tub? Whether used with a curtain (most likely) or a door, I don't see how makes much difference, assuming the tiled wall serving as an apron is well constructed.

    As for the other three walls, I assume the lower few inches just above the tub rim would be backed with something more than drywall or such. I know there are some drop-in tubs out there that have manufacturer-supplied alcove installation kits, although the one I'm looking at doesn't.

  • lee676
    Original Author
    11 years ago

    OK, so let's say I go with a proper installation into a raised tile bed. Is there a minimum size the channel between the rim of the tub and the surrounding walls need to be? I usually see at least 6" or so, but could I probably make the tub fit the space I have if I had only 2" in front and in back of the tub. The long side of the tub could have a larger space between the tub flange and the wall. My main concern would seem to be cleanability of the 2" channel, but the tub is raised only about 1-1/2" above the surrounding tile surface so it would be easy enough to run a sponge through it.

    I'm being offered a free 72" x 36" tub from someone's remodel I'm trying to use, and I find its shape comfortable. I would probably have to forgo a shower if I went with this setup though, I'm assuming (except maybe a handheld spray, which would have to be used carefully).

  • rabidchild
    11 years ago

    Glad I found this, since I have exactly the same question! I'm faced with the potential quandary of installing a six-foot, non-jetted drop-in in an alcove, and have found precious little information on the subject.

    I know it's been a while since you posted this, but I was wondering what you did in the end. Did you install the drop-in, or did you go with an apron?

  • nycbluedevil
    11 years ago

    We installed the Kohler Greek tub into an alcove, using a tile beading kit to create the flange. A drop-in tub does not have the flange that directs the water back into the tub. But some tubs (including the Kohler Greek) can be installed either as a drop in or as an alcove if you add the flange.

    Our installation is over a year old and we have had no issues.

  • cathie2029
    11 years ago

    Did you try the kohler archer.. I'm going with the 5x32" but I think they make larger sizes too.. This style has a small lip (.375" about) and the edges slope towards the tub. I've seen this one houzz a bunch of times and this woman used it in her bathroom

    http://www.onestorybuilding.com/one-story-building/tag/bathroom

  • KevinMP
    11 years ago

    There are more alcove tubs than you think. Try Hydrosystems and MTI. Those tubs can be ordered with flanges on none, 1, 2, 3, or all 4 sides and with skirts on none, 1, 2, 3, or all 4 sides. They're expensive, however. You'd have more options if you were going with a standard length tub, but there's the Archer, too, as kali noted.

  • LE
    11 years ago

    just to clarify-- what is it that makes it an "alcove tub"? I was thinking it was the front finished side. I honestly had not thought of the tile flange issue. I was also hoping to do either a drop in or undermount that has a wall on 3 sides, but I really wanted the front to be tiled the same as the walls (it's not a large room). Are you saying it's not possible, not a good idea, or has to be done carefully?

    And what is the minimum "deck" width people find feasible?

  • sojay
    11 years ago

    I once did this. We dropped the tub into a plywood deck, then built up the deck with (I think wonder board) to match the height of the tub. Then used a liquid membrane waterproofing system to go from the middle if the tub edge and up the wall. Remark, the tub had a flat top and was suitable for both drop in and undermount. Then we added a concrete (but any stone would do of course) countertop over that. I loved the clean lines of an undermount tub, matching the undermount sink. I have since moved and hate that my current tub is drop in with the edge higher than the deck. So hard to clean, and it can't double as a shower.

  • _sophiewheeler
    11 years ago

    Drop in tubs are for tub only applications.

    You don't want any deck at all with a tub/shower. If you have a deck, then water won't drain back into the tub. That water has to go somewhere. That's why all of the tub/shower combos that you see that are designed from the beginning to actually work, do not have a deck at all. They have the integral tile flange that allows water that might hit the wall to drain back into the tub rather than go behind your walls or out onto the floor.

    And that is why 99% of the time, this is a disaster waiting to happen. If you want a tub/shower, then you HAVE to get a tub with a tile flange. Or budget for a tearout due to moisture problems at some point in the future.

  • KevinMP
    11 years ago

    It only really matters if you're using it as a shower. You could certainly put a drop in or an undermount tub in an alcove situation because water is not going to get everywhere or, for normal bathers, overflow during a bath. But when you shower, water goes everywhere. The built-in tile flanges will help dramatically because you can get the look of an undermount (not so much a drop in) and then tile up using the flange to built a small deck in the front (or also the sides and back) and then tile straight up the wall on the sides and back. Or you could do what I mentioned above and did myself, which is get an alcove tub with a skirt on one or more sides and flanges on the others where you'd want tile. The open sides would need a shower curtain or glass panels.

    Height does start to become a problem, too, when thinking about showering in deep tubs, so keep that in mind, too.

    Here's what I did, but I'm not using this as a shower. If I had wanted to spend another $1200 on a tub, I would have purchased the Hydrosystems Lacey with two finished sides so that I didn't need the knee wall with the cat on it at the one end (which would have made it not an "alcove" tub). But I didn't want to spend the money, and it would have forced me to install the pump for the airbath remotely in my linen closet--more expense there, too.

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  • LE
    11 years ago

    I missed that the original poster was doing a tub/shower combo. Our room will have a shower that you walk through with the tub on the far side next to the window. One remaining question: are there alcove tubs with the flange but without the "front"? I want to tile the front of the tub. Or would a drop-in or undermount work OK in this installation? (I'm looking at the Americh Madison at the moment.)

  • cathie2029
    11 years ago

    Lori.. there are plenty of tub with a flange and without an integral skirt. Just depends on how much you want to spend and what style you're looking for.
    here's a drop in..

  • cathie2029
    11 years ago

    And here's an under mount.. I've asked around on Houzz and the builders said that they used a water proofing membrane all the way down to the tub then affixed it to the tub so that water that gets behind the tile runs down the membrane and into the tub. I think you'd be able to do this, just get a pro.

  • cathie2029
    11 years ago

    Kevin MP can you post a pic or email me of how you treated the left side of your vanity against the paneling? It looks like it just blends in (from another post) but I can't tell in that pic.. Can you take a head on shot of the left side of you vanity and a close up? PS you're bathroom is awesome! My email; kali2024@gmail.com. Thanks.

  • KevinMP
    11 years ago

    My contractor installed the wainscoting first and then set the vanity in (with the exception of one piece of cove moulding by the left side backsplash return, which was installed at the end after the counter top had been installed). I ordered an extra high backsplash (5.5") in order to ensure that the backsplash went all the way to where the solid part of the wainscoting began.

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  • Lisa Lornie
    9 years ago

    I am using a drop in soaker in an alcove . It will look something like this.


  • _sophiewheeler
    9 years ago

    And it will have water problems if installed like that. The deck will allow water to spill onto the floor, and the interface of the deck and wall will have the caulk degrade and leak.

  • Andrew Mironov
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I am now very committed to installing a drop in tub in a three wall application. I too, like most others decided on this so I could tile the front. When I started thinking about the waterproofing in a little more detail it became apparent it was going to be a problem.

    Here is my though for waterproofing. the three closed sides.

    1. Use the manufacturers tiling-in bead

    2. Install cement board to top of tiling-in bead

    3. Waterproof cement board with Kerdi.

    4. Run Kerdi long to get 1/4" overlap onto tub and secure with Kerdi Fix while filling void between tiling-in bead and Kerdi with Kerdi Fix.

    5. Install tiles leaving 1/4" gap to tub and fill gap with 100% Silicone

    Tub at 3 walls



    My though for the open wall is this.

    1. Frame pony wall with 1/4" per foot slope at top to ensure excess water sheds to floor

    2. Install small back stop on inside of framing to ensure no water can get to the inside of the framing

    3. Place backer board and install Kerdi from Back Stop, over the horizontal piece and into the vertical.

    4. Fill small gap between tub and tile with color matched Silicone

    Tub at Pony Wall:



    And yes, none of my doodles are to scale.

    Does this seam like a reasonable waterproofing solution?

  • _sophiewheeler
    8 years ago

    What about the floor where the tub deck spills all of the water onto it? You gonna waterproof that to te tub and create a wet room? Just to avoid buying the correct product in the first place?

  • Andrew Mironov
    8 years ago
    You have to waterproof the floor condition as it a prime location for infiltration. Ditra on the floor with Kirdi bands in the corners.
    And it's not that I don't want to buy the correct product, it's just too late before I figured out that the manufacturers recommended installation really doesn't work.
  • monika2024
    8 years ago

    We used a kohler archer that has sloped edges towards the tub and has a small lip about .5 " tall. The tile is set over/infront f the lip. Had no issues so far and the only water that gets on the floor is when someone takes the curtain out of the tub and it drips fown the floor.


    I don't see how water is going to spill on the floor if u have a curtain or glass walls. Same as any other tub really.

  • Michael Wolff
    8 years ago

    So, what is the proper tub to use for an alcove with shower? I am looking for one without an apron (so I can tile) and with jets/whirpool. Cant seem to find this combo.

  • stark52
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    This thread has continued for a long time and the person first seeking advice is probably done with their remodel. With that said we just stripped out a bathroom to completly remodel. It was a 1985 bathroom, untouched except paint and some new fixtures. The tub was a drop in Jacuzzi set into an alcove with custom tile all around including a built in shelf and a shower head - hence a tub/shower combo with a drop in. When we ripped everything out there was no water damage at all to the area except from the leaking faucet valve. A drop in can certainly work as a shower/tub if installed correctly. Here is a picture taken right before demolition. Very dated and hideous but in great shape. PS this set up used an extra long shower curtain.

  • Carri Oosterbaan
    7 years ago

    Excuse my ignorance, but if we put a drop in tub in an alcove, what creates the vertical "wall" from the one open end of the tub to the floor (where the skirt would be in an alcove tub). i like the look of tiling the front, but without a deck, how do you do it? Thank you

  • S Hill
    7 years ago

    Wow Stark52!!! That is one heck of an 80's bathroom!!! I'd love to see an after pic.

    Has anyone found a good solution to this? I'm looking to do the same... I want a 60x42 shower tub combo with air/jets and roomy rectangular shape ( the alcov models are all oval)

  • Dawn Willis Casey
    6 years ago
    Kohler makes an alcove drop in tub with tile flanges.