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cnvh_gw

Security deposit not returned-- LONG

cnvh
18 years ago

DH and I purchased our first home last December; previously, we had shared a 1 BR apartment. The apartment itself was about 10 years old by the time we moved out; we had been there for just under 5 years. The apartment was attached to a townhome, where our landlord lived. Landlord was/is also a real estate agent, and we used his services to purchase our new home, which happens to be right next door to our apartment/his townhome-- so we are still neighbors.

For the entire time we lived in the apartment, we had a wonderful relationship with our landlord-- he would often come by our apartment to chat, and over time we came to consider him a friend as well. He and his family were invited over (and came) for dinner numerous times, even for Christmas Eve with our family on two occasions. We went out of our way to do a little "extra" here and there, too, just to be nice and neighborly (we would occasionally shovel out his parking space when it snowed, as he parked right next to us; I'd bring him cookies if I'd happen to be baking, etc). We even invited him and his partner to our wedding, and they accepted our invitation.

The whole time we lived there, though, we never got a return invite for dinner or anything like that. The only invite we ever got was to his daughter's 16th birthday party, which we did attend and gave a card with a check as a gift. Basically, he never really reciprocated our generosity other than with his company, but honestly, we didn't mind or even notice at the time. Throughout the process of helping us buy our home, he frequently commented how he was losing his best tenants; we really and truly got along very well.

So, fast-forward to us buying the house. We closed on the house on December 10th and were officially moved out of the apartment by December 17th, and of course our rent was paid in full for the entire month of December. The apartment was re-rented at the beginning of January. We hadn't broken any leases by moving out-- in actuality, I had never even signed a lease in the first place. I had asked him about it when I moved in, he said he'd get around to printing one up but never did. I had, however, paid a security deposit up front, equal to one month's rent.

We left the apartment very clean when we moved out. There were two very small sections of damaged wall which we had repaired ourselves prior to moving; both were not in prominent locations and the repairs were indistinguishable from the rest of the walls. We also accidentally broke an exterior light fixture when moving out, which would have cost no more than $30 to replace. The carpet was also fraying where it met up with the kitchen linoleum, but it was easily fixable-- and besides, the carpet was 10 years old and beginning to show wear anyway.

We continued to be "chummy" with our landlord after we moved, but we didn't hear anything more about the security deposit. I fully expected him to keep some of it, at least for the damaged light fixture, but I also expected that we would at least get a chunk of it returned... and as first-time homeowners, every penny counts, you know?

A couple of months went by, still no word about the deposit, and it began to grate on my nerves-- because as well as we got along with our former landlord, we also knew he was a real "cheapskate," too. One day I finally decided that it was stupid to be stewing over it; maybe he just forgot, maybe it was an innocent mistake. So I called him, and very pleasantly asked "if there was anything left" of the security deposit.

To which he answered, no-- it had gone towards repainting and replacing the carpet.

I told him that I would need to receive some sort of invoice detailing where the charges had gone to; he said he would get this to me. This conversation took place over 6 months after we had moved out-- and to this date, over a YEAR after moving out, we haven't gotten a thing in writing from him.

So, my question is this-- isn't repainting considered standard practice before re-renting an apartment? We didn't smoke inside EVER, hadn't painted it ourselves in some weird color, thus neccessitating a repaint other than for routine purposes... As for the carpet, it was 10 years old and by that time, was about due for replacing anyway. What on earth does one pay rent for, if not to offset the routine wear and tear of an apartment?!

The law in our state is that a landlord must return the security deposit in its entirety, OR a portion of it, accompanied by a written breakdown of what the deposit was used for, within 30 days of moving out. If not, the landlord is not allowed to retain ANY of the deposit and must return ALL of it to the tenant. The tenant is legally allowed to go to court to receive double the security deposit if they so wish. For the tenant to pursue this, they must have provided the landlord with written documentation of their forwarding address, which we did not do, but for goodness sake, HE was our real estate agent, and we moved RIGHT NEXT DOOR.

I know that, in the interests of being a good neighbor, I should probably just let this drop, but every time I see him, I'm so irritated that I can barely be civil. I feel like we were taken advantage of, and he saw us as another way to save an extra couple bucks. On some strange level, we do miss his company and I wish we could just settle this and go back to being friendly neighbors, but at this point I don't know if that's possible.

Sorry this was so long... but what would you? Help me out with something I haven't already thought of...

Comments (14)

  • nfllifer
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    As a landlord I feel bad for you. This type of guy gives us a bad name. To top it off he was paid a commission on your purchase. I also am a Realtor and as a bonus any tenant that purchases a home from me gets their last months rent for free. Even tenants that leave $30 worth of damage I rarely charge them in hopes of maintaing a good relationship and possible referals. I would call the landlord one more time and request the damaage deposit be returned in full minus the expense for the light fixture. Explain to him he has violated the law by not providing receipts or money. Also let him know how much he is costing himself in your future home purchases, and all the referals you would be giving him. The XXXX of dollars would be a cheap investment. Finish the call by saying if I dont recieve the $$ by next Friday I will be forced to take this matter to small claims court as I feel this is not fair and it upsets me. It is nothing personal just something I feel is unfair. Then follow up and sue him.

    Small claims is very inexpensive and you will win regaurdless in most states due to the timeline of him not getting anything to you. In MN landlords are forced to double the deposit amount if its not returned in 21 days. Check into that also.

    Good luck!

  • cnvh
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I would rather not take it to the point of sueing him, for two reasons-- first, since we never actually had a written lease, we probably don't TECHNICALLY have a leg to stand on. Second, we still have to live right next to each other regardless of what happens, and I don't want to start an all-out war. I can forsee that causing more harm than good in the long run... call me paranoid, but I don't want an enemy living next door. We have a dog, and I have horrible visions of something toxic being "accidentally" tossed over into our yard that she could get into... that sort of thing, you know what I mean.

    It's just the audacity of it that kills me, because as you said, he even got a commission out of us since he helped us buy our house. We paid rent faithfully and on time, every month for almost 5 years, and did everything we could to be good tenants and neighbors. I don't feel like we are asking for a "favor" in getting our deposit back, but to keep it and make up dumb excuses about it going for paint and carpet, which, in my opinion, is what we paid rent for for all those years!

    I think I will call him up and ask him out for coffee after the holidays are over and see if we can work it out civilly. If we can't, then at the very least he will know exactly what I think of him, that he is a greedy, self-serving and very sad human being. If he can live with himself and how he treats others, it will come back to him in the long run. Personally, I'd rather have the good karma instead.

  • deniseandspike
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I would write him a letter and send it certified to show him you are serious about the matter. You can be friendly in the letter, but it also serves as notice for your small claims suit which you are certainly entitled to. Hopefully once he sees that you are treating this issue as a business decision, he won't take it personally and will either furnish you proof of repairs or refund the money. Either way, you'll have your documentation for court.

    De

  • TypoQueen
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    certified letter followed by small claims court .
    From your post it sounds like he's stealing.

  • redcurls
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    The longer you sit on your rights, the more you are giving those rights up.....

    There is a legal term for this, but I will give you this one instead: "You snooze, you lose."

  • janengland
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Why on EARTH would you ask him out for coffee to discuss this matter?? Wake up. All those unreciprocated dinners and visits were his way of telling you it's strictly business. You are his tenant, he is your landlord. From here on out, YOU make it strictly business too. Start with a certified letter per poster above. Document everything- move in/move out dates, receipts, expenses, any responses from him.
    I understand your concern with starting a 'war', especially where pets/ children are involved. But this guy has, in effect, stolen your money by painting and carpeting that was long overdue. Your days of being friendly neighbors are probably over- the bigger issue is, why would you want to be, after the way he has treated you?? Actions speak louder than words. Good luck. The longer you drag your feet, the stickier the whole mess will be. Sorry I come across as a hard case- but if you lay down and act like a rug, rest assured you WILL be walked upon.

  • cnvh
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Why on earth would I take him out for coffee to discuss it? Because our society has gotten entirely too "sue-happy" and it sickens me when everyone seems to think that thier first course of action needs to be taking legal action. I understand, you are not advising me to contact a lawyer, but by the tone of your response, you seem to imply that I should want to squash him like a bug. (Okay, while I might fantasize about that, it's certainly not a very grown-up response!)

    I should mention that since we moved out, aside from the security deposit thing, he's made efforts at continuing to be friendly with us-- always waves, always says hello, etc. Over the summer, he even tried to give us an electric hedge trimmer that I'm sure he got free somewhere (our properties are separated by a hedgerow-- and yes, my husband is meticulous in maintaining it, by hand). So it's not like he's going out of his way to avoid us.

    I would like to maintain that degree of civility if at all possible. Confronting him directly and in person, as far as I can see, is the most straightforward, honest, non-cowardly way to go about it. And since I want to do it on neutral ground (neither his house nor ours) and in a public place (lessen any potential for a scene), the local diner for coffee seems to make sense.

    I have documentation on our state landlord-tenant laws that I intend to bring with me. If he can look at that and still refuse to return the money, then small-claims court would be a possibility.

  • ebrigham
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    How much was the deposit again?

  • cnvh
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    $360. (Tiny apartment!)

  • deniseandspike
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I'd be nice to you too if you gave me $360. What a great Christmas present!

    De

  • cnvh
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Yeah, right!! :)

  • ebrigham
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Ah, I thought it would be more (My only frame of reference is NYC). Do you think there was any damage not due to normal wear and tear? If so, could it have amounted to $360?

  • over_n_under
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    When you get around to sending a certified letter, add the following - " At the advice of legal counsel, .... " or " At the advice of my lawyer, ..... " It can sometimes help get the ball rolling, even though you have no intention whatsoever of suing the individual.

    I applaud you for your willingness to work it out and not contribute to clogging up the court system. But you are owed the money. Painting and normal wear and tear on carpeting are part of the usual operating expenses. (Notice I said 'normal wear and tear'.) Let him know that you are willing to take him to court if he refuses to return the deposit.

  • cnvh
    Original Author
    18 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I specifically asked him what it went for, and he said "paint and carpet." Oddly enough, he didn't even mention the light fixture we broke, even though we told him about that when we turned in the keys.

    ebrigham, I can only imagine what a month's rent must be in NYC... Central PA is A LOT more reasonable; that's why we love living here.

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