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Range - Electric box location

Posted by Samantha111 (My Page) on
Sat, Dec 10, 11 at 21:22

I just happened to notice something while looking up how to raise the height of my new range. The instructions note that when the unit has a warming drawer, the electrical box should not be located in a certain location. Looking inside the warming drawer, that seems to be where the heating elements are running.

The electric box on mine is loose and fits into that open area on the back of the range. My contractor said it was easier that way when moving the range rather than having the outlet installed on the wall.

You can see here, the box sticking out a bit from that well at the base. I think that well is supposed to be for the cord to stack.

Here is the instruction diagram. It sounds to me that the electric box shouldn't be in that hollow (too close to the warming drawer element) and that it is also pretty much falling at the location it shouldn't be if were installed on the back wall instead.

I hope I'm explaining this clear enough. Does anyone know anything about this?


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Range - Electric box location

Eeek! Your electric box should be in an enclosed junction box in your wall! (I assume it's a plug-in model). A properly installed wire should never come out of a wall like that; even if your stove was hard-wired it would exit from a junction box with a proper opening/cover. It is especially important for your range, as you're talking higher power surging through those wires.

Some ranges do have a very specific location for the electrical outlet which should be MOUNTED IN THE WALL! I'm a little scared of your "contractor" making these calls about a potential fire-hazard. Electricity is not something to leave to amateurs (as long as you want your insurance to pay up in case of a fire at least).


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RE: Range - Electric box location

Hm. The wire always came out of the wall like that for a direct wire to the range. He converted it into a plug but just didn't attach the box to the wall. Left it loose on the floor tucked into that hollow where the cord stacks. The original setup was done by a hack handyman many years ago, yes, but I'd had an electrician come through the place to inspect everything at that time. I can't imagine he didn't check the range hookup. He'd found problems.

What would a box have accomplished with the direct hookup? The wire simply would have passed through it same as it was running through the wall itself or across the foor up to the connection on the range. What would the box have done other than look neat and professional?

This guy just converted it to a plug of some sort (which I didn't see). He is not an electrician. He's a construction contractor who does do simple things like hook up outlets, switches or fixtures just as a handyman or DIY would. He does that type of thing on his regular job working for a company but does not do wiring.

I just happened to notice the location should be specific which would appear to be because of the whereabouts of the heating element.

I wish workmen would read and follow directions.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

That box is a surface mount box, ment for places like a laundry room. It would be wired using conduit. Your range should have a box in the wall. Building wire is not to be left exposed. I can't believe your electrical inspector missed this eiither.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

I'm confused on the hard wire aspect. This was a 1970's build and the original range was hardwired with this (house inspection was many many years ago). It could never have all been in the wall or the range could not have been hooked up or pulled out. My understanding is this hard wire situation is normal for old installations.

When purchasing, the question came up for a 3-wire or 4-wire situation and whether I needed a cord. It is a grandfathered situation the way I understand it.

I think my contractor was probably lazy not putting the new box on the wall. Now I'm concerned because by leaving it loose it is probably sitting in a spot where the manufacturer says not to because of the warming drawer.

Are you familiar with the old hard wire ranges?


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RE: Range - Electric box location

Historically, when a wall mounted box wasn't used, the cable for the range would come out of the floor or wall base into a (usually phenolic) receptacle housing suitable for the current that the range would require. However, this receptacle housing was supposed to be attached to the structure of the house (wall or floor, not that it always was). The range would have a cord with a plug that was appropriate for the receptacle.

One would have to go back a lot farther than 1970 to find a period when a hard-wired range didn't require a box attached to the house structure to terminate the house wiring cable and allow the (more flexible) range wiring to connect to it.

Beyond the code violations related to unmounted boxes, a mistake that can be made is to use a lower temperature rated connector pair to connect to higher temperature rated range wiring cable. The installation instructions must be closely followed unless one is prepared to meet the underlying requirement by a different approved method.

kas


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RE: Range - Electric box location

" a mistake that can be made is to use a lower temperature rated connector pair to connect to higher temperature rated range wiring cable"

Are you saying the box & plug they used might not have been the correct one even though it is made for a range (guessing they must have gotten that part right when they selected it. It takes a large sized plug).


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RE: Range - Electric box location

Here's a better picture of the box. It's located at the halfway point of the range. About 15-1/2" center tucked into the cord storage area.

Any electricians around? Is this urgent or just not so good an idea due to the warming drawer generating heat? I have not used the drawer yet.

(Yes I will be calling one.)


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RE: Range - Electric box location

The drawing and its measurements don't make sense to me but looking at the measurements on the right side of the diagram, it looks like 15 1/2" in might be spot on for where not to have the thing located on the wall. Worse is that it's right smack up underneath directly next to the back of the drawer area.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

The junction box should be secured to something. It doesn't much matter if it is flush mounted in the wall or mounted on the surface but it should be mounted. I'm concerned about all that electrical tape I see there. It lends me to believe that something really ugly is happening with the cabling. Most cabbing should not be flopping around on the floor like that either. It should enter directly in the box.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

"Eeek! Your electric box should be in an enclosed junction box in your wall! (I assume it's a plug-in model). A properly installed wire should never come out of a wall like that; even if your stove was hard-wired it would exit from a junction box with a proper opening/cover."

A surface mount box is acceptable, but it must be mounted.
The extra wire is a problem.
While it was needed for a direct wire stove to allow moving it out, it is no longer needed for a plugged in stove and should be cut short.

"That box is a surface mount box, ment for places like a laundry room. It would be wired using conduit. Your range should have a box in the wall. Building wire is not to be left exposed."

There is nothing in the NEC that says the box pictured is not acceptable for this location in a house or that it requires conduit.

"It's located at the halfway point of the range."

If that is on the restricted zone in the installation drawing it needs to be mounted correctly.


"I'm concerned about all that electrical tape I see there. It lends me to believe that something really ugly is happening with the cabling. Most cabbing should not be flopping around on the floor like that either. It should enter directly in the box."

The tape is a problem.
It is probably concealing damage to the jacket of the cable, form installation or previous use.
The cable should be cut back and routed directly in to the receptacle enclosure.
A large junction box with a receptacle might be easier to wire.
If you can recess it into the wall or baseboard, all the better.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

Thanks. Obviously, I will have an electrician install it correctly. I just like to know what's going on and how urgent it might be.

I am very interested now about the tape. I can't imagine they damaged the wire underneath and left it that way rather than cut it off. I do know that when they replace switches and outlets, they wrap them with tape. They said it's safer that way. I think they said it keeps any wires from touching or touching metal or something. Maybe from coming loose, I don't know. That's what they do in commercial construction. Sounded like a good idea to me. I was glad to have new receptacles that were safely taped.

There was a small knick in the gray covering which I was concerned a mouse had nibbled on the wire. It did not go terribly deep but just through that gray layer. The wires were intact. Maybe that's the spot but it was only a 1/4" knick not inches like that.

It will be interesting to see why there's tape. I'll try to remember to post back on it.

Thanks.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

My interpretation of the instruction is that the box goes on the left side. The arrow is pointing to the black area on the right as a restricted area for stoves with a warming drawer.

From the looks of that box and the cord plug, you should mount the box horizontally near the baseboard/floor. You have 7" of width and height.


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RE: Range - Electric box location

Thanks. I think the black areas are for the box and the white area in the center is restricted. It looks like the white restricted area is 3 1/2" wide and is 9 1/2" over from the left side, 17" from the right. I was having trouble adding it all up this morning, lol.

I think they should be required to insulate the area if it's a hazard. So many people do not read directions! Men are notorious for it for some reason although I'm sure an experienced electrician would be aware of the warming drawer situation these days. Why take that risk with life and property damage. This hookup shouldn't have required an electrician. Homeowners probably do this all the time but I did hire a contractor to take care of it. Honestly, though, I know of a gas range that was installed by the store where the wrapping wasn't completely removed and the oven caught on fire wrecking the house with smoke damage. I don't believe the guys they send out from the store are electricians either.

Good thing this counter was going to be sitting high and I was looking things up in the documentation! I would have never known until I smelled plastic melting or the house burned down.


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