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not_sure

Gaggenau Wall Oven Locking

Not_Sure
9 years ago

It appears that the Gaggenau ovens have an "automatic door", which I understand to mean that there's no traditional handle, and instead you push a touch-screen button to open the oven. Is that right?

In this case, is there no way to physically open the door, without hitting such a button?

Long story short, I'm looking for an oven that can lock when in use for child safety. If it's possible to still manually open the door at all times, that kind of defeats this purpose.

As an aside, it's fairly shocking to me that few if any ovens actually have this feature, especially since they all lock when in self-clean. My parents GE oven 30 years ago had a simple lever you could move back and forth to lock at any time. Pretty absurd that ovens don't seem to have this these days.

Comments (20)

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    There is still a hidden handle on the side that can be used to open the door of the new Gaggs. The only ovens I'm aware of that will lock the doors outside of the clean cycle are Electrolux, however this can only be done when the child lock button is pressed while the oven is off. I am not aware of any ovens with a motorized latch that will lock while cooking. In fact, it is a bad practice to latch the door on older ovens unless you are self cleaning, because above a certain temperature, which could often be reached just by normal baking, those latches would lock shut for safety if engaged. By the time you turned the oven off and let it cool down enough to unlock, your food would be ruined.

  • Not_Sure
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Hm, ok, thanks.

    I did note that on page 30 of the BO 480 610 manual, there's a "Door Lock" feature that's described as follows:

    The door lock prevents unintentional open- ing of the appliance door. When "On" is set, you must touch the " symbol for several seconds before the door opens.

    Do you know what this feature is exactly, and will that achieve what I'm looking for?

  • plllog
    9 years ago

    I have the previous generation, but very similar, 280 series Gaggenau oven. There is, indeed, a child lock, but it's to prevent a child from turning the oven on, rather than opening an oven that's on, like the Elux that HVtech described. I tried to check the user manual for the new one but the website is having issues. It seems odd to me that it wouldn't have it, but it's not what you're asking for so doesn't matter either way.

    Having food inside and a locked door is a good way to start a fire. The point of the child lockout is to keep the children from playing with the oven while you're not in there cooking. They expect you to mind your ovens while they're in use, and to teach your kids to stay away from hot ovens.

    Edit:

    We crossposted. I'm pretty sure that that's the same as the child lockout function, but perhaps it also works while the oven is in use. It should say later on in the manual how to use it. In the old oven you have to turn the feature on in the set up routine, then there's a key that you touch.

    This post was edited by plllog on Sat, Sep 20, 14 at 18:43

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    Not_Sure, it sounds like that feature doesn't actually lock the door, it just changes the behavior of the "open" button on the touchscreen. Normally, just a light touch of the button would pop the door open, but enabling that option would require you to hold your finger for a few seconds before it pops open.

    I agree with everything plllog said about the issues with this feature if it were to exist. It would be more unsafe than safe. Keep in mind, too, that oven doors take 15-20 seconds to lock and unlock, so if you wanted immediate access you couldn't just hit a button then immediately open the door.

    Just to clarify, the Electrolux actually will lock the doors when the child lock is enabled, not just the control panel. That just keeps people from opening it while off, though.

    It looks like Maytag actually still has an oven with a manual door latch. This would be an old Magic Chef design that apparently Whirlpool was too lazy to update since ovens of that size and at that price point are really only sold for retrofit purposes. Of course, for the reason I said in my last post, latching it during baking would be a bad idea.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Maytag CWE4800ACE

  • Not_Sure
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Has anyone with a Gaggenau in their house tried to use this feature, or could test it for me to see what it actually does? Considering it's a $6K oven, I'd rather not act on a suspicion.

    The icon has a door with a lock, which kind of suggests that it actually, you know, locks the door.

    plllog, at least according to the 480 manual, it's definitely not the same as the "child lock" feature, sometimes called "panel lock" on other ovens. This is something else that is set within the factory settings.

  • weissman
    9 years ago

    Do you think your children couldn't slide that lever if they were so inclined? I agree with the others that it's dangerous to lock an over with food in it - you need to teach your children kitchen safety and monitor them when the kitchen is in use.

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    This is a new feature on the 400 series which just came out, and I highly doubt you will find anyone who owns one at this point. You should email Gaggenau and ask. However I'm almost 100% sure that they'll tell you it's just a software lock on the door button, and the hidden side handle can always be used to open the door unless you're self cleaning.

  • Not_Sure
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    weissman: Your post has nothing to do with the oven we're talking about (which doesn't have a lever), not to mention that it completely ignores the reality of children and child safety.

    Out of curiosity, do you also recommend that gun owners not lock up their guns, and simply rely on teaching their children about gun safety? Hopefully not ....

    And, incidentally, this whole concern about safety of locking an oven is bizarre to me. Under what exact circumstance does locking an oven exacerbate a fire risk? If I come up on my oven and there's already a fire, I'm probably getting the hell out and not trying to open the oven to extinguish it. If there's not already a fire and I come upon a hot, locked oven, I'll either turn the oven off at the controls, or flip the breaker off. Either way, no fire. hvtech's argument isn't a safety one but a food quality one -- if your oven mysteriously locks, you probably won't be able to open it in time to not ruin your dinner. Oh well.

    And, at some level, we have to think that if a true locking feature is implemented, that it will work as intended and not malfunction. If you're going to start opening the door (no pun intended) to all the various malfunctions that our appliances may have that result in fire risks, then prepare yourself to get rid of anything electrical in your house and return to the 18th century.

    In any case, I would very much appreciate it if someone could simply answer my question, rather than try to question my parenting practices. :-)

  • Not_Sure
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Thanks hvtech. I'll reach out to them, see what they say, and report back.

  • weissman
    9 years ago

    I was commenting on the picture of the oven with the lever that hvtech42 posted and your longing for the good old days when all ovens had the sliding lever.

    I hope you have a lock on the door where you keep your cleaning supplies - far more dangerous to children.

    And as far as guns go, I don't think anyone should keep guns in their house unless they're part of a well regulated militia. Period!

  • plllog
    9 years ago

    Do you also recommend that gun owners not lock up their guns, and simply rely on teaching their children about gun safety?

    Well, my folks did, and it worked. Hunting guns, though, not pistols. They were put away, and the ammo was high, but we could have gotten to them as easily as kids who know where the key to the gun safe is and how to use it, and how to climb on a chair. MUCH better to take them to the range, teach them gun safety and change a shotgun from what Elmer Fudd fires at Daffy's face, which leaves him still blinking and setting himself to rights, and all better in the next scene, to a scary, heavy monster that kicks back. Never load a weapon unless you intend to shoot it. Never raise the muzzle unless you're ready to shoot it. Never point the muzzle at anything you aren't going to shoot. Never take a shot that you can't make (i.e., hit your intended target). Never fire into the air or past the target (explanation of consequences). Always point the muzzle to the ground, but never at anyone's foot, including your own. There is no glamour to guns if they're not secret and forbidden. In reality, they're heavy, smelly, dirty, kick, pinch and are a lot of work to clean and oil. Much more fun firing nerf disks!

    Regarding the oven and finding out how the lock works, you might do better calling a showroom where they have the oven installed on the floor. If there isn't one near you, try a distributor like Purcell-Murray. They have nice people working the phones at BSH (Gaggenau parent), but they may not know the answer off hand.

    Re the fire safety, you're right about turning it off. If the breaker is well labelled that would be a good thing to do. The problem is whether you'll be able to open the oven after, and if your kitchen will burn down meantime. Not so long ago, lasagnas overflowed in my hostess's oven. It was her only oven, so she decided to leave it go and keep cooking. The spillage did, eventually, catch flames. It was easy to put out with baking soda, and the oven kept on working. The party (a big one) was saved. Baking soda will also help clean up the char. A lever lock wouldn't have been a problem. I assume it's operable using a knife for a lever or something if it gets too hot. I'd worry that an electronic lock wouldn't release in that kind of situation, forcing the trip to the breaker box while the dinner died and the oven was ruined...

  • plllog
    9 years ago

    Okay, the Gaggenau site is back up and I found what you were referring to. It's just on that one line, and not mentioned on any of the features sheets. To me, that means either it was planned and didn't actually make it in (though doubtful, as it would have been easy to delete it), or it was a last minute addition and they didn't have space to explain it fully.

    Given a couple of decades of reading Gaggenau manuals, my interpretation is that it's not exactly what you were asking for, but somewhat. That is, when it's set, you have to touch the door open icon for several seconds to make the autoopen work, but you can yank it open by pulling on the side at any time.

    While I was looking, I also found that they have an ingenious three day holiday system. The oven turns off automatically after 12 hours unless you counter that with a longterm timer. The Sabbath mode uses the timer to keep the oven from turning off. Then the three day mode lets you set a second timer that adjusts the temperature during the transition from Sabbath to holiday. A pain to learn to set, but a great selling feature!

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    You're right that turning off the breaker does not release the door on any oven. Ovens with a motorized latch will only unlock when the control board decides to do so. The control board can't do anything when there is no power to it. There are ways to manually get the door open if the control board or latch mechanism fails, though.

    If the oven has a manual lever like the one I posted the picture of, you can force the latch to the "open" position if you need to open the oven immediately, but doing so will damage the mechanism if the oven temperature is high enough to engage the latch lock.

    This post was edited by hvtech42 on Sun, Sep 21, 14 at 16:43

  • grubby_AZ Tucson Z9
    9 years ago

    those latches would lock shut for safety if engaged. By the time you turned the oven off and let it cool down enough to unlock, your food would be ruined.

    This is simply a wiring choice by the manufacturer since they want a passive safety device to prevent damage to tender humans during a clean cycle. This type of thermal lockout can easily be modified to work off of a momentary button or NO/NC switch mounted up high in a cabinet. You could arrange the spacing so that only a large person's reach/arm span would work. Except for hiding the wires well, and maybe modifying the solenoid, it's trivial.

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    ^Well of course you could modify the locking system of any these ovens to behave as you want as long as you know what you're doing. I was assuming the OP wanted to keep the oven as is from the factory as most people do.

  • plllog
    9 years ago

    ^^ And keep the warranty, more like!

  • Not_Sure
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    From Gaggenau:

    "The âÂÂDoor Lockâ feature is set up by following the instructions on the factory settings page. Once the lock is set it operates both while the oven is off or on. You can release the lock in both modes, by pressing the door lock symbol for several seconds the door will open. When you close the door it will relock. To remove this function you have to return to the factory settings and turn it off.

    Once the lock is turned on, the only way to open the door is by depressing the lock symbol for a few seconds. The feature is not related to the self clean function which locks the door and will not allow it to be opened until the function has cooled to a safe level."

    From Gaggenau again in response to a follow-up question on whether the locking mechanism is the same lock as what's used for self-clean:

    "I donâÂÂt know the physical mechanism other than being an electronic lock. The lock option is to achieve the purpose of keeping small hands,( children) from getting into trouble by opening the door in either the on or off mode."

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    LOL, that response from Gaggenau tells us a grand total of nothing. I concur with plllog's advice to find a showroom. The real question is whether you can use the hidden handle to manually open the door when the lock feature is enabled.

    I know how frustrating it is when you're trying to find the answer to a question and you get other responses like "that feature is unnecessary, the kids will be fine on their own!" And this is an appliance forum, not a parenting forum. For those reasons I've refrained so far from commenting on the utility of such a feature... but I have to say I agree with weissman. I would not leave a kid alone in a kitchen with a hot oven. I would definitely use the control lock feature to prevent the oven from being turned on when unattended, and try to teach some basic kitchen safety. On the other hand, I definitely think it is possible to be too protective, and in my opinion there are a lot of things that kids can and will teach themselves by exploration - the classic example of touching the hot stove.

  • Not_Sure
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    So, the 2nd paragraph from Gaggenau was in response to this question from me: "Is it possible to manually open the door while the "Door Lock" feature is enabled?" To which the rep said: "Once the lock is turned on, the only way to open the door is by depressing the lock symbol for a few seconds."

    I agree that it's not 100% clear given that he didn't seem to know how it actually locks. That said, based on the 2nd paragraph, I'm inclined to say that it's a genuine lock.

    This post was edited by Not_Sure on Tue, Sep 23, 14 at 18:36

  • hvtech42
    9 years ago

    The rep didn't mention the hidden handle at all - that, combined with the fact that he didn't know how it locked means I bet it would still open manually. I just can't imagine anyone would design an oven that could lock itself during cooking - I certainly wouldn't and I don't have the design expertise Gaggenau does.