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Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-posted)

Posted by purpleplume (My Page) on
Sun, Aug 5, 12 at 22:09

Our new Miele Futura Diamond DW was installed on Friday. I was not happy with the installer, who was held out to be Miele trained, but not employed by Miele. He spoke only broken English, so communication was challenging. And the few questions I asked--from reading GW forum threads--he dismissed as not applicable to my situation. (For instance, he said I didn't need to test or adjust the water hardness setting because I don't have well water. And when I asked for the DW to be connected to the cold water line for proper China/Crystal performance, he insisted on connecting it to the hot water line.)

When the installer left, the dishwasher was running (with water only, presumably to test for leaks) and he just left without a word of explanation. When the cycle stopped, I opened the DW and discovered he'd left some soft foam packing material on one of the racks!

I settled in for an evening of reading the 82 page Miele manual. This morning, I returned to the kitchen to try to get my new baby up and running. My DH has been very patient but is visibly amused that I just spent three grand on a dishwasher that--48 hours later--has yet to wash its first dish. ;) After removing the red-bar plastic protector from the control panel so I could read the display, I began anew, with the manual open to the 9 page section entitled: Before using for the first time.

Since the control panel display said to add rinse aid, I did that. Then I programmed in our water hardness setting at 15 gpg, as determined by a SofChek water hardness strip test that I picked up at the shop where I purchased Miele DW supplies yesterday. Sure enough, the factory default setting for water hardness was 1 gpg, much different than our actual "non-well water" hardness.

Next, I proceeded to the directions for adding salt, and this is where I am currently stuck. Page 16 of the manual says to add 2 quarts of water before adding salt for the first time so the salt can dissolve properly. After unscrewing the lid of the salt container, I proceeded to add 8 cups of water with my measuring cup. When I started pouring in the 5th cup, the water overflowed. Since I find it unlikely that the German engineers would misstate the quantity of water required, I now had to question whether my installer may have added some water to the salt reservoir.

DH suggested that I remove all the water and start anew. So, turkey bulb baster in hand, I removed the water. I took out the same amount of water I had poured in--just over half of what Miele instructed. Despite DH's suggestion that there could be a lower portion of the water reservoir that my baster could not access, I am thinking that my installer did not, in fact, even unscrew the lid of the water reservoir.

The Miele manual state that the salt container should be "filled" with salt, but does not say how much salt it should take. Since it took only half the water amount specified in the manual, how much water and how much salt should I put in? The manual does say that the salt container holds approximately 4.4 lbs. (2 kg) of salt. An entire box of Miele salt contains 3.3 lbs. (1.5 kg) of salt.

If I put in half the amount of water per the Miele manual (4 cups) would you think I should put in half the amount of salt (2.2 lbs) the manual states it takes to "fill" the salt container? I can't imagine that 2.2 lbs of salt would dissolve into the amount of available volume (approx. 1/4 cup) left after I add half the prescribed amount of water to the salt reservoir.

This must seem very amusing to those of you who happily operate your Miele DWs without a second thought, but we have never used a water softening system of any kind in our house, so the whole concept of salt for softening is new to us. Many thanks for any advice!


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

No advice, just sad!

I had my handiman install my Miele Optima about 6 years ago. Before we installed it , I had a "Whole House water softener" installed, on the hot side only, by "Raine Soft Water", (A Competitor to "The Culligan Man").

So I went thru none of the trials You have, and in fact, I've never even read the manual (I know, Shame Shame)butttt---We had a Kitchenaid before and I ran that for almost 10 years without reading the manual and it always worked great until the lime from our Extremely Hard Water in S Calif, totaled it (Hence the water softner now).

Well, after about 6 years, we are quite happy with the way the Miele does the dishes but to be honest, that's probably about once/month,, as there are only 2 of us, we just find it's easier and faster to just hand wash them. Also neither of us wishes to acquire a Doctorate In Miele DW Operation--so we ain't gonna spend the time reading the manual trying to acquire one!

If I can's add soap, push a button or two and get clean dishes, then, at least for us, It ain't worth the trouble!

Good luck with yours!!!

Gary


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

There may be residual water in the tank. Miele dishwashers are thoroughly tested prior to shipping.
I would add all the salt....and the water is just a one-time process...in the future, you will only add the salt and NO WATER...
Be sure there are no salt crystals on the threads of the reservoir before screwing the cap back on...also, Miele recommends running a rinse cycle after the addition of salt...hope this helps!


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

Just my guess.

Vat they vant is orders to be followed!!
Fill salt tank full of 2L vater!! Vater comes out. Ja!
Fill salt tank full of vater, full of salt!!
Displaced water comes out! Ja!
Set fuse for ...! Nein! Nein!
Screw cap back in place!

Best to wait for helpful owner who knows? Ja!


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

My Miele Diamante Plus that I got two years ago had some water in the salt container. I first filled it all the way up with water, then added the full box Miele Salt with the funnel. The manual says that the excess water will come out of the opening while adding the salt. Then screw in closed and run a rinse cycle. After that, I set it to 5-7 grains hardness. The box lasts me about 7 months. When adding the 2nd box, all I has to do was empty it into the container as it was full of water.


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

@dodge59 I know, I never had to read a manual before either. Your lime experience makes me wonder if hard water is responsible for the early demise of our KitchenAid DW. It was a top-of-the-line model from their Architect Series six years ago when we installed it. Would you mind sharing with me the symptoms your DW manifested as it failed? I purchased two expensive LG front-loading steam laundry appliances a few years ago, too, and your post is making me wonder if they are at risk for a short life as well due to our hard water.

@ottlane - Got it, thanks. I did wipe the threads down and run the rinse cycle this morning, after speaking with Miele tech support.

@laat2 - Brilliant! I so needed the laugh you provided with your German engineer humor. I think your translation should be included in the Miele manual as a sidebar.

@fauguy - Your post gave me the confidence I needed to proceed with the salt routine, thanks. Apparently, Miele dropped the reference to excess water from the current version of their manual. Had that info been in the manual, I wouldn't have had to post on GW for help. BTW, feel free to PM through GW. It appears we are neighbors here in SoFL.


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

The "hard water symptoms" were easy to see. It looked like snow inside the dishwasher, it got on the stainless inside, would get on the soap and jet dry dispensers and muck them up.
I would run lime away or clr thru it occasionally to try to "Clean it Up" but even after several washes using either of these 2 cleaners it still looked a mess inside. Soooo, I poured a ton of CLR into the thing, removed the impeller,racks, and anything else I could get loose. I took a stiff brush and scrubbed away, kept adding more clr as I went.
Actually got rid of most the "Snow" on the racks, the stainless interior, and the dispensers. I didn't look as new, but a lot better.

It ran a few times after this and then the pump went "Kaput" figured it probably ate some really big chucks of our hard water (Lime). We were about to remodel our kitchen at that time, so decided not to fix the old KA, and also not to subject any new dishwasher to such a "Harsh Environment". All around our misc faucets in the house, sinks , tubs, shower, you can see the lime buildup on the cold side only, Hot side is clean as a whistle! I have tried, (without success), to get the wife to only use hot water, but alas!!! Sooooo, I am going to have Raine connect both the hot and cold sides to the softener. I will have to run a pipe of "Non Softened water" from the front yard to the back, and that is in fact why I did not install the softener on the cold side in the first place. However, looking at faucets on the cold side and the couters below them, and the water spouts on the tubs, I think it will be worth it. We have to have the worst water (as far as hardness goes), of any US City!

Good Luck with your new dishwasher!

Gary


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

purpleplume,
What area are you in? I'm a bit surprised that you have 15 grains with city water. I'm in northern Broward, and first called my local city water and was told 5. Then a couple months later I had a Miele tech out because of a small issue, and had him check the hard water. He had a kit that you had to fill with a special liquid agent and the water, and it would turn color. He said it was 7 grains. But with my Diamante Plus, you can eneter in an exact number. It has a group setting of 0-4, 5-7, 8-10, etc. So I have it set to 5-7, but from the factory the default was 0-4.
The company that did our install is called New York Minute and are trained by Miele. I had them connect it to the hot water, since we don't use any China or Crystal expect at Christmas. I called Miele about it, and they did recommend a hot hook up, unless 25% or more of the washes would be using the China Crystal mode.


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

@fauguy - I live in NE Fort Lauderdale, zip code 33308. After testing the water from my kitchen tap with a Sofchek water hardness test strip I picked up at the shop where I purchased my Miele DW supplies (a vacuum shop at Commercial & 18th Ave.), I set my DW settings to 15 gpg. If I end up having a Miele tech out here at any point, I will ask them to recheck the water hardness. Our DW allows me to set the water hardness at the precise setting, as opposed to setting based on ranges. Unfortunately, I don't have much confidence in information obtained from my local water utility department; that's why I tested the water hardness myself.

BTW, I spent time on the phone today with one of the founders of NY Minute, the company I booked based on your excellent recommendation. In my case, the installers left much to be desired. The lead installer spoke only broken English and communicating with him was a challenge. I put down layers of beach towels on the floor surrounding my dishwasher and the kitchen sink, yet the lead installer repeatedly ignored my requests to set his wrench, drill, etc. on the towels, and I repeatedly heard him dropping his tools onto the floor. As a result, I found multiple areas of damage (divets) in the marble flooring when they finished.

Additionally, I just discovered that it appears I am missing two pieces of my dishwasher installation. Earlier today when I phoned Miele tech support to ask about how to tell when a cycle was complete, I learned that in addition to the audible setting (which had been disabled when our DW was installed) there should be a "prism" mounted to the underside of the granite counter, just above the Miele control panel on the DW, that serves to reflect the red indicator light that illuminates and flashes when a cycle has completed. According to the Miele tech, this prism is shipped in the box with the DW and comes with a corresponding stainless steel frame. Both pieces are to be attached by the installer. NY Minute's install team did not install, discuss, or leave me any such parts. Although my keyword search of the PDF manual does not indicate any matches for "prism," I discussed this with NYM today and also have a call in to the Miele Territory Manager who handles Miele issues for the dealer from whom we purchased our DW (FL Builder Appliances).


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

Wow! I also purchased mine from FL Builders Appliance in Pompano. The install guys were good, but wouldn't say great, but did speak English OK. They did the install fine, but did not test the water hardness. The only part they forgot to install was the 4 tiny push caps that go on the sides that cover the four side mounting screws. Mine did come with a top metal piece, but the install manual says its only used for top-mount installs, but mine isside mounted. When my unit is done, there is progress meter on the front, and has a yellow LED light at at "End".

Please keep us updated when you hear back.

I'd say they (NY Min or Miele) needs to seed one of their top people and check the install and fix those issues. You can always threaten to return it.

When I was looking 2 years ago, I also went to House of Appliances is Boynton Beach, and they wanted like $275 for installation, but they have their own in-house install team, not sourced to another company. But I went with FL Builder App because there was a tax-free thing at that time, and they were able to process it, where House of Appliances didn't seem willing.


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RE: Before using Miele dishwasher for the first time (cross-poste

Our water hardness is 17 grains per gallon. I add salt to my 6-year-old Miele constantly. A lot of water always pours out when the salt is going in. It seems the salt reservoir is usually completely full of water and salt and when I add salt it is replacing water. I don't think it's a malfunction because it has done this from the beginning and the softener works great. My manual and the current manuals do state that water runs out when you pour in salt. I can't speak to your other concerns, but I don't think you have to worry about this...


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