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Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Posted by 4mamma (My Page) on
Mon, Mar 5, 12 at 14:44

Hello,

I'm new to this forum and to the whole technology of posting messages, etc.

I've been reading the discussion on the various ranges (ie. French vs pro-style American). Originally, I was going to purchase the 48" Wolf DF range. My very first kitchen had a 36" Wolf all gas range which had its share of problems (e.g. ignition, uneven baking, etc.) One of the reasons I was considering another Wolf was b/c of the great customer service and the responsiveness to fixing my unit.

But, I have fallen in love with La Cornue - it is truly jewellery for the kitchen. After reviewing messages on this site, I was lured to find out more about a Molteni and I am seriously thinking about this range. From what I have read it sounds like its the best and comes with the good looks of the La Cornue.

I am a mother with 4 young children (aged 7, 5, 4 and 2), a hungry husband and mother-in-law who love home-cooked meals. I enjoy cooking and the luxury of creating meals (when I have time). I host my family gatherings on all of the holidays which includes cooking for 16 people.

My family has recently moved into an older home and I am re-doing the kitchen in the very near future. (still working on the kitchen design and layout). I live in Ontario Canada and do not have the opportunity to visit the Molteni showroom in the US.

I would love to hear from anyone who has a Molteni, experience with a Molteni or has been thinking about buying one.

Any other comments and feedback is also appreciated.

Thanking you in advance for your thoughts.


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Celco distributes Molteni ranges in Canada. Maybe they can show you a range or direct you to a place to see it.
Never cooked on a Moteni range but have heard great things about them. If you post your journey to buying a Molteni range I will read with great interest.

Celco Inc
585 Secretariat Court
Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
L5S 2A5
www.celco.ca

Email: info@celco.ca
Phone: (905) 364-5200
Toll Free: 1-866-77-CELCO (23526)
Fax: (905) 364-5205


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for the information deeageaux.

I visited Celco and was able to see their commercial ranges and the various options Electrolux offers.

Apparently, the Molteni range is a color version of the commercial range! So, if you goto the Celco website (http://www.celco.ca/) and look at their product list you can pick the component of your stove.

I must admit that I was very impressed. Everything about the stove is heavy duty. I especially liked the cast iron pan supports.

Here's the options that I'm looking to incorporate...
- hinged electric hot cupboard
- gas or electric powered smooth griddle
- gas or electric pasta cooker (depends on price)
- convection electric oven (the models appear to be static ovens in either gas or electric)
- cast iron solid top plate with at least 3 central rings
- 2 open burners under enamelled cast iron griddle (not sure what kW I should be asking for... min 9.3 kW or higher? We operate in BTUs so I'm not sure of the conversion)
- brass handrail and fittings
- backsplash
- matching hood
- red or orange enamelled finish

I've also inquired about these components in a range top.

Any thoughts?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

1 kw/hr = 3412 btu
9.3 kw/hr = 31,731.6 btu or roughly 32k btu

You don't need to worry about those open burners simmering tiny amounts of delicate food since you will have the solid tops.

Do you have specifications on the gas/electric elements for the griddle,pasta cooker and ovens? Are you getting a single oven?

IMO red is more traditional while orange is more "taste specific." That is realtor speak for ugly/ hard to sell. LOL


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

..... so I have a question.... I notice the ranges have a central stack or chimney that goes up from the cooktop. Does the range always stay on, like an Aga??


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for the conversions. These are very powerful burners... the simple dishes I cook may be burnt to a crisp! I figured the burners would be powerful so the solid tops are making even more sense.

I know you are right about the color... my preference is red but my cabinets are either going to be cherry wood or a painted white maple... but, I'm leaning towards the cherry... so I wanted a contrasting color? Perhaps yellow, blue or green instead of the orange? My family thinks the orange is ugly as well.

I haven't rec'd the price points on what all of these options will cost so I'm getting a little nervous. I'll probably have to drop the pasta cooker. I'm hoping for a 36" oven with at least a 12" vertical. The ovens are 9 or 7 kw... haven't received specs on the warming cupboard... I believe its 1.5 kw. I'll keep you posted.

I was told that the central stack or chimney is the exhaust for the stove.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I think at the point that you're putting in a Molteni, you can have whatever color you want. If you're finding it hard to sell the house, get an old Wolf on Craig's List and take the Molteni to your new home. :)

If you're going to do it, however, get each little thing your heart desires, including the pasta cooker if you really love it. This is your one chance, after all. A range like that is a kitchen in itself. Don't short change yourself. You can always fix up the cabinets later. ;)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

At that price point, what's another couple of thousand if it's something you will use? If you're not a pasta 2x a week person, then I might rethink it.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Re Chimney

Whereas most range ovens exhaust right into your legs and/or the stovetop the Molteni exhaust through that chimney and hopefully into a range hood.It is not "always on" like the Aga cooker that vents through the "smoke stack" out the back wall or the ceiling to the exterior.

Re Color

I would not pass on the orange for resale value purposes but for fear I would have such intense buyers remorse a year or two down the road I would punch myself in the face like Edward Norton in the movie Fight Club. :)

I used the phrase "taste specific" as humorous alternative to "Orange? Really lady? WTF are you thinking!" LOL

I tried googling "orange" and different French range brand names that look similar to Molteni for a picture of an orange range installed in an actual kitchen; could not find one.

If we eliminate red and orange then royal blue is a really nice traditional color.

Re Pasta Cooker

When purchasing a Molteni range any pretense of this being a rational purchase should be left at the kitchen door. This is pure indulgent luxury. If you can't "afford" the pasta cooker then you cant "afford" a Molteni.

This is a bit like buying a Bugatti Veyron but skipping the Hermes special edition because the marginal cost is too high. Get the Hermes edition. I would still not get the exterior in "Hermes" orange though. LOL


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I don't think a 50K orange range is the wisest resale choice. Plus, with your choices, you may be all the way up to 60-70K. I'd personally rather have a BlueStar plus furniture quality solid walnut custom cabinets for the money you will spend. Plus, there's going to be a BIG learning curve as they do not cook like standard American style ranges.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

BTW, the blue or green would be stunning! But, you'd want to contact Christopher Peacock or Mick DeGuililo for your cabinet needs to be able to stand up to the level you just ramped your kitchen up to.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Red goes just fine with cherry though if you really have your heart set on red.

But the black will go with everything and is a classic color with the brass.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

You'll are hilarious... yes, my Molteni purchase is going to be pure indulgence... and, I must admit a bit of revenge (my husband will be putting in a tennis and basketball court). So... my kitchen and Molteni stove are 4 me!

When I create in the kitchen I want to create delicious dishes on something beautiful, something that works well and was fun to purchase. Life's too short not to enjoy a few indulgences. I don't wear diamonds or high fashion clothes... my jewellery is my kitchen and my kids! (That was my monologue).

I really like the color blue. I think it will contrast well with the cherry wood. The Molteni standard colors are red, blue, green, ivory, and white. Ivory with brass fittings would also look stunning.

Christopher Peacock & Mick DeGuililo cabinets are gorgeous.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Ivory/White with brass fittings would imply brass hardware throughout the entire kitchen.

That would be the Brian Mulroney/Ronald Reagan choice; meaning conservative and 1980's :)

Just kidding! That would be beautiful. Brass with any non high-end French range would be a risky choice.Is brass making a comeback? But paired with the Molteni it would be gorgeous in any decade.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Hello,

Are you sitting...

Well... I rec'd my first set of quotes back for my wish list. I say wish list b/c Hollysprings was close with the price range. My quote came back with a stove measuring 78" wide and costing close to $90K US (before taxes...).

The burners are powerful at 18.6kW, solid top at 14kW, warming cupboard 1.4kW, oven at 7kW and the griddle at 4.8kW.

My favourite color will cost about $10k and my pasta cooker is more than a couple thousand... its about 25. I can't imagine the weight of this baby. The price includes the cost of shipping which is determined by weight.

Needless to say, a 78" stove is not what I'm looking for. So, I re-sent my request for a 48" (max 55") stove (no pasta cooker), in a standard color. I'm also considering just the range top. I would love to get a combi oven at some point (after I recover from the $$$ needed for this stove).

Wow... I'm still in shock. I hope the Cdn $$$ takes a leap!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Well,I did say it was the Bugatti of ranges not the De La Chapelle of ranges.

My guesttimate was $75K.

The burners are 18.6Kw each?

On their website it says they have 5.8kw or 9.3kw burners.

So two of the more powerful burners put together make 18.6kw?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I LOVE the restaurant kitchen in the animated movie "Ratatouille". I think the multiple ranges in that kitchen are very-Molteni-look alikes. If I am not mistaken, they were copper. Are copper ones available?

My vote is the blue one since i am very partial to French blues. But then, I have a Viking in Cobalt Blue.

One of my partners put in a Morice range from France a few years ago. They felt that it was at a price point that was more accetable for them than the other French ranges. You may want to check out the brand for the price sake.

http://www.appliancist.com/ranges/morice-cookers-grand-veneur.html


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Molteni will make anything that is possible including copper but I think that would be one of the "big buck" options.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I haven't seen copper listed on the tech sheets that I've rec'd, but then again, I didn't request it. I agree that anything you request is probably possible for a price.

The Morice range looks nice in the article, but I can't find the web site. Any idea?

I am getting nervous about the Molteni. Its taking so long to get my specs back, let alone any information about even buying one. I wonder what the time delay would be for technical questions and servicing if I purchase one.

Plus, it doesn't seem as though a real person owns one/has used one/purchased one... I don't want to be a lone ranger... I was told that there's 1 unit being installed in Ottawa that cost $100K. With the prices that I've been quoted, I expect better service.

I have also looked at Lacanche. I have read lots and lots of positive feedback about them. I also rec'd a quote for my original request which was much more realistic.

Wolf is having a great sale on their ranges... but, I really don't want to go back there. It just doesn't compare to the french ranges.

Any thoughts?

Your feedback and assistance is always welcomed.

Making the move to a Molteni is more difficult than I thought it would be...


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Morice is like the De La Chapelle of ranges. It is like importing a French kit car made to look like a Bugatti.

For me, after Molteni next in line would be La Cornue Chateau 120.

About 48" 22k btu power burner and those wonderful vaulted ovens. About $37K.

Then again you could get a 48" Capital Culinarian with every option for about $11k. 3 reds or 2 blues available. Self-clean.One oven fits commercial baking sheets other oven is 12" for everyday small jobs. Motorized rotisserie. 23k btu open burners and a very effective wok grate that protects your hands from heat and helps keep heat enclosed under wok.Grill and griddle too.

And you can join my clan here on GW,the CC clan:)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Advertisement on Dallas Craigslist

Molteni Professional 145 Evo Stove New in Crate!!! - $13000

I don't know what logistics,customs,and tax implications are but here is the link. In royal blue.

Here is a link that might be useful: LINK


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Wow! A posting on Craigslist for a Molteni! This sounds too good to be true... I'll respond to the ad and let you know.

I looked at La Cornue Chateau 120... pretty nice. I'm investigating the CC.

Any thoughts on Lacanche... I was looking at the Citeaux.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I am actually the person with the listing and it is legit. :-) some things are as good as they seem. With the economy the way it is, my plan to build a house and use this stove are not coming to fruition. I believe my partner paid around $28k for it new. I know it is worth $15-20 and I have had it stored in a climate controlled facility since new. It has never been uncrated! Molteni sends a stack of brochures with DVD if anyone is really interested. You will never see another Molteni at this price and the blue and chrome is beautiful in person. Truly a work of art these stove are and are a centerpiece and conversation price to be sure. I know the Hotel Dubai uses them and Bill Gates has One in a home he owns! Email me and I would be happy to talk over pc or phone. -Wise


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Hi Wise,

I am beaming from ear to ear!!!! My husband thinks this is (i am) crazy and wonders why I am making such a big deal over a stove!

Thanks for posting a message.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Looks like my thoughts on Citeaux are no longer needed.

Remember when you get your range it is always nice to post pictures on GW as a thank you to the members who helped you pick your appliances/kitchen.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

deeageaux your thoughts on Citeaux, Lacanche, Corune, Molteni, colour, conversions, etc. are always needed and appreciated. Not only for me but I'm sure for a lot of others on GW.

I am working hard and fast to finalize the logistics of shipping this 400kg beauty to Canada. First, I thought my husband and I could take a roadtrip to pick it up... not, Texas is 24+ hours away... I don't think we would make it. I'm really not sure how or what to do. I have contacted my rep (who is currently in the States) for some advice and perspectives. I am hoping/wishing/praying Molteni will assist in shipping.

Any thoughts?

There's a discussion on the kitchen forum as well titled Brand new molteni.

And, I will happily post pictures on GW once I get the (a) range. I hope my experience will be of interest/benefit/use to others. I just have to ask my nephews and niece how to post a picture :0)

I should have more developments to post tomorrow. Good night!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Since the range is already crated I don't see why you just can't hire a shipping company to pick it up in Oklahoma and drop off in Ontario. It might spend some time in customs and maybe a tarrif applied?

Why don't you give these guys a call and ask for help?

F1 Freight Systems Inc.
7385 East Danbro Crescent
Mississauga, ON L5N 6P8

Phone : 1-877-557-6555
Fax : 1-800-974-7764
Email : dispatch@f1freightsystems.com


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Good morning,

Not sure what I would do without you and GW!

I have contacted the freight company. They are preparing a hefty price quote to do the job. Apparently, I also need a customs broker before the unit can enter Canada.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Perhaps you've already done all the due diligence in terms of contacting the owner of the range, finding out why it's for sale in the crate instead of installed etc.

And if it's the range you truly want, then go for it.

But I see a infrequently imported bargain with metric connections and installation instructions in a language most plumbers don't speak. So unless there's a tremendous amount of tech and customer support from someone, or you're a French speaker and have no issues dealing with them, I'm wondering why you don't go with Lancanche or La Cornue which have substantial user bases, can customize a ranges for you and provide support.

You could take a flyer on this and it could be fabulous. But I personally don't see it.

Even the top KDs in the country, who routinely install La Cornue, are given classes in how to use the ranges. The chefs are flown in by the manufacturer.

Is there a single Molteni owner or anyone who has used one who can discuss how it works? Can you deal with oven settings in Celsius and recipes in Fahrenheit?

Everything looks good before. It's the 400 pound after that you'd be living with. If your location was Quebec it might seem more logical to me.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Metric vs Standard/Imperial

The range was designed to be installed in the US. Oklahoma specifically. Not many French speaking plumbers with metric tools in OK. I am sure Canadian plumbers can install. She is not importing directly from France.

This is a range not rocket science. Burner goes from low to super freaking hot. Solid top is hot at dead center and super low simmer on the edge. Again not rocket science.Any pro cooking class that uses solid tops would do.

Whirlpool has a larger customer base.This is the Bugatti of ranges. Bugatti has a smaller customer base than MB or GM. There are some drawbacks but the benefits are plenty.

La Canche has standard sealed burners and while La Cornue has better burners IMO,still sealed. Molteni simply has better performance.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

deeageaux I'm not disputing that it's a superb range. And if it's what the OP wants and she's willing to take a flyer on it, I think it's great.

I'm also not making assumptions because I lived in France and know better.

From the sound of it, the OP is looking for a luxury range which, presumably should make cooking easier for her, not more difficult.

I'm just pointing that out and that's the purpose of this forum. I've been around here for a while and, you can condescend all you like but, unless you're the owner of the range or you have seen the order you're making assumptions, not stating first hand facts or even citing your own experience installing Molteni ranges.

And how cool is that you because no matter what happens to her you remain some genius in your own mind with absolutely no responsibility in the situation.

Assume the range is fully converted and all the fittings are Ok. And the floor and walls and ventilation can handle the heat it throws when it's "super freaking hot." And she can stand it front of it and deal with that.

How much support does she actually have from other users and from the company? It's something that needs to be considered carefully unless she's an expert. Which she may be. But she didn't say so.

I'm all for fabulous stoves and particularly when someone has the access to ask Joe Bastianich or Gordon Ramsay to send one of his chefs over to give her pointers the next time someone's in town.

Otherwise it's like buying a Bugatti and then finding out there's nobody around who knows how to either drive or service it.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Chill out rococogurl, deeageaux is just trying to be helpfull. The OP appears to be doing a major remodel, so I am sure provision for venting, non flammable surfaces, etc. will be taken into consideration. She was contacted by the person selling the range and is aware of the reason for sale. I imagane if the oven knob was metric she could get an American replacment, and other than maybe an adaptor for where the gas line comes in (one probbly came with the range) what else would you need? Oh yes, one more thing. If I had a Bugatti I sure wouldn't let any one else drive it, except maybe deeageaux, because he seems like a pretty good guy to me.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

The OP started this thread with purchasing a Molteni in mind not at my suggestion. She has already spoken to the Canadian Molteni distributor. I am sure she has a competent GC and a husband who is not an idiot.Nothing can be known for certain but why would anyone import a Molteni direct from France when there is a US distributor? The OP knows I have not inspected the range myself.

There are people who own both Bugattis and Moltenis in the both the US and Canada. Therefore it is only logical to conclude there are people who can service them both.

Driving a Bugatti or cooking on a Molteni is not rocket science. Just because it is far more expensive does not make it beyond the realm of mere mortals.

Bottom line is my advice comes with a moneyback guarantee. It is free and anyone can take it or leave it. But I guess I am not the genius you are rococogurl because I have not lived in France.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Oh dear... this is a lively discussion indeed!

I did have some of the same concerns that rococogurl mentioned in terms of technical and everyday support in Canada. It seems to take a very long time to get answers about the stoves (e.g. pricing and technical information) from Molteni b/c most of the info is coming from either France or Italy.

I was going to switch to Lacanche b/c I didn't want to be 1 of 2 Molteni owners here in Ontario (not sure about the rest of Canada). But... then came this bargain! It is such a great price and I do like getting a good deal. Plus, it makes a juicy story to tell and re-tell doesn't it.

My Cdn. Molteni rep has promised +++ support for the unit as long as they can verify the original purchase. I have met their chef who will work with me to learn how to use the range. Although it is a Molteni, the component parts are just like many commercial ranges... just better ;0)

I am not a professional cook... I consider myself to be an average person who prefers well made things and enjoys the challenge of preparing a tasty recipe. With four kids (aged 7, 6, 4 and 2), a hungry husband and mother-in-law with dementia, I have very little time to wait for my water to boil and to turn muffins halfway thru cooking or wondering if my burners will ignite. I want my appliances to work when I need them to work.

I'm figuring it shouldn't be too hard to use... it is just a stove. Just like a car is just a car. I'm having a harder time figuring out the internet lingo... I had to google the meaning of "OP".

I will ensure the contractor and his team are aware of the requirements for the stove. My kitchen guy is really good. I fully trust my contractor and I'm sure he'll ensure the weight, fire and ventilation req'ts are met. Cdn has pretty strict req'ts and inspections when building/remodelling homes. I've watched Mike Holmes and I know that things can happen so I'll stay on top of them.

I really appreciate all of this discussion, feedback, help and support. I'm having fun making the move towards a Molteni and I hope y'll (that's American isn't it) are too.

Kind regards... and, I'll keep you posted.

Cheers!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4mamma, if you see this, go to kitchens, that is where I posted the pics of the range.
I saw it today and it very beautiful.
Wasn't able to take full head on pictures because it is well crated and they don't want to take the crate apart.
Did the best I could for you!
OH, and BTW, the range vent-a-hood that I bought, I am very pleased with, in the box.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4mamma, sounds like you've got all your ingredients in the house with the rep and the chef -- which is all I was trying to get at above. Yes, it's just a stove, of course, but it isn't your Mom's stove either. But you're covered properly on accessibility, which you should be with the purchase.

Sometimes with a reno you get lucky and things you want/need just come along at just the right time. Can't make that happen when it won't -- so you go girl!

I did see the pic over on kitchens and it's an amazing color. Will look forward to pics of the bright blue piano when she gets installed and to hearing a full report on how it functions. There aren't many Molteni users here so you'll be needed in the future I'm sure.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I think you are getting the best of both worlds.

A range appliance geeks love for performance and interior designers love for looks.

And you are getting a Bugatti type range for Mercedes type money.

Too bad it was not in Orange,you could have bought it for Ford type money:)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for the pictures susied3. The range is beautiful and I would have loved to have it. I say would have b/c someone else came in and bought the stove when my back was turned.

I indicated that I was on the scene first... but the other person made the deal with the mom while I had an arrangement with the son. In the end, it was the mom's stove... and, mother always knows best.

So... back to the drawing board :===== (that's me crying).

Unless... the other person doesn't wire their money ;0) Now, that's not very nice of me is it.....


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4mamma,

I feel your pain.

If the other deal for the Molteni doesn't fall apart what are the top two options you are considering?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

:====

wahhh

I'd keep calling them to check to see if the other person followed through. That's a lot of moolah, and things happen, that buyer could change his mind. The owner might not contact you right away. I'd keep the pressure on until you hear that they have received the money and the deal is officially done.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

You were looking at the brand before the bargain came along so if it still works for you at full price, and you're not soured by missing out, then it seems it's a question of which really good range. In your original post, you indicated you had fallen in love with La Cornue. Lacanche owners adore their ranges though some will argue that's another animal.

Bonnet and Delaubrac are other possibilities you might explore. Bonnet is currently considered to be the top but that's always a matter of who's considering.

Additionally, there is a company in my area here in the U.S. that specializes in French ranges and might be of help.

Here is a link that might be useful: Estate Kitchens


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

The deal is done... I checked and the $$$ was wired into the mom's account 8am Monday morning.

The other stove I was seriously considering was the Lacanche. I went to see a live unit yesterday at someone's house. It was beautiful. The owner's spoke with such passion about their stove that it re-ignited my passion for the Molteni. I was mourning the lose and thought I'd leave it and move on... but, then 2 things happened.

The first... the Lacanche owner's passion for their unit. Both the wife and husband thoroughly enjoyed cooking on their unit. They had such pride in their ability to prepare meals for a large number of quests with no problems. Prior to getting the stove, the wife didn't spend much time cooking, but after their purchase she enjoys cooking. She said that you can't have a Lacanche and not want to cook on it. Plus, their kitchen (their whole house) was SO beautifully designed. It made my mouth drop in awe. It was designed by Julie here's the link to some of her work http://www.depoitiers.com/

Anyhow, they LOVED their stove and LOVED using their stove. I could see it in their eyes. I could also see they were having fun together just talking about it. A stove, car, house, cookware, etc. are things that make our lives easier (or should make our lives easier)... but, its all just "stuff". I could probably go without most of it... it is just pure indulgence. But, I feel why not indulge in a few things... (after I've paid my taxes, helped my neighbour, given donations, kissed my children and saved for their future, etc) ;0)

The second... I'm seriously considering going to visit the Molteni showroom next week. My sales rep suggested that I come to take a look at their line-up of products to help me make my decision.... get this, at their expense. Now that's customer service!

I'm a little nervous about going. My husband said they'll have their smoothest sales rep helping me to make decisions and before you know it, I'll be like Madame Blueberry with several baskets of "stuff" being shipped to Canada. I think he's more nervous than I am!

I've learned so much from reading GW. You all know much more about appliances than I do... so, here's my big question...

Would someone from this forum like to come along? deeageaux and susied3 you both have been so helpful. I'm not a creepy person (at least I don't think so), just a bit indecisive (just a bit). I don't like to feel pressured or get hustled. I want to make a good decision. That's one of the reasons that I came to this forum.

So, would anyone like to help me move on with my Molteni...

BTW - The Electrolux head office is approx 20min from downtown Charlotte. The address is:
Electrolux
10200 David Taylor drive
Charlotte NC
28262

Please let me know ASAP if you are available Tuesday or Wednesday next week. Thanks!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4mamma - You're killing me, that's where the showroom is?! I traveled there and worked on that road for years and had no idea. I'll add that to my list of excuses for why I have to get to the CLT office again one of these days. Good luck!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

If I lived anywhere near there I would go but I live in Los Angeles.

Sorry


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I could send Mr. Beekeeper, he will be in Greenville that week. He will make sure you leave the showroom without spending any money. He's good at that.

:)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

deeageaux - Sorry to hear that you aren't close by... I would have enjoyed the day so much more if you were coming.

beekeeperswife - Your husband sounds exactly like my husband... I'm emotional and he's practical!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I had a similar experience in pursuit of a used La Cornue range that was sold out from under me. My suggestion from my experience is to ask the seller for the buyer's contact information. Given your willingness to pay for a new Molteni, there is a good chance that the Molteni that got away is worth more to you than the new buyer. You could offer the buyer a few thousand (whatever you're comfortable with) more than what they paid for it.
My other suggestion would be to monitor Ebay for this range. The person that bought the La Cornue I wanted later tried to flip it on Ebay.

Good luck. It's a beautiful range.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for the suggestion wolfgang80. It is worth a try.

My husband had a similar experience with our pool table. He sold it on kijiji for a nominal fee. Someone then brought it to our attention that it was being re- sold for a much higher price! And, get this... the person was using our same pictures to advertise!

BTW - Did you end up getting the La Cornue?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Okay... my BF is eager and willing to go shopping. My mom wanted to go but she couldn't find her travel documents. It probably works out for the best since my mom has Bugatti type taste. I might have left with that $90K stove ;D

Anyhow, I'll take lots of pictures (if I'm allowed) and send them so that we can make our final decision. Notice how I said "we"!

Thanks again for your encouragement and I'll keep you posted. I should be able to send another message on Thursday or Friday next week.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Sounds like I would get along with your mom.

My mom was not a fashionista but a Maxxinista.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

deeageaux - I know you would get along with my mom and sisters. You share a similar sense of humour.

My sister sent me this link for a stove... I believe she's joking ;0D


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

What Link ?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I'm back! What a trip! I had an amazing time! I got to spend the morning drooling over appliances and the afternoon relaxing. As I mentioned, I have 4 young children and a mother-in-law who can be quite obstinate so I rarely get a second to think. So, I relished in the peace and quiet of a day all to myself. It would have been perfect if my BF enjoyed kitchen appliances as much as I do (his eyes would glaze over any time I talked about the stove! He said he just kept thinking "... I wonder what Sears has to offer!") It would have been nice to share my experience with this forum. Next time...

Electrolux really has some nice looking units to display. I was having trouble finding in-store Electrolux products to view but viewed various items from their line-up.

Some of the items that caught my eye (besides the Molteni... I'll get to that in a moment) was the trash compactor (appears to be a good idea), their combi oven and combi microwave, and the ICON all fridge/all freezer. I haven't researched these units for feedback... but, they sure look impressive.

Now to the reason for my visit... the Molteni!

I'm really not sure what to say... it made me speechless! It is like no other stove that I've ever seen. Its solid as a rock... people have described it as a tank. Everything on it is solid cast iron or steel. I could shift my Wolf back and forth, but this unit wasn't going anywhere. Even the oven door takes a firm grip to open.

I viewed 4 units - 2 ranges and 2 podiums. Both ranges were custom built units that were already bought and paid for in full and were waiting for installation in customer homes. The first was a matte black unit with 4 burners and 2 double cast iron top plates with 3 rings each. I can't imagine what this unit cost.

The next unit was a smaller (approx 60") in a brilliant orange colour. I had to laugh b/c the orange didn't look as nice in person as I had envisioned it would.(I kept hearing... I told you so). This unit had only 2 burners and 1 solid top plate wth 2 rings and a single oven which was surprisingly small. I believe it measured 21" x 12" x 19". I need to verify this b/c that sounds very small...

To me, the ranges carried a more vintage/classic old time car look whereas, the podium had a more modern sleek look like the bugatti.

What I liked about the podium is that it had all the essentials a kitchen would need (refrigeration, cooking, cooling, storage) incorporated into 1 unit. One of the units even had a wok built into it! The podiums were very large and require ++ space to be able to walk around the entire unit... which I don't have. Plus, I'm more of a traditional gal.

So, I revised my wish list to include the following:
- warming drawer/cabinet (before I said cupboard)
- char grill
- oven to fit (18" pans) may have to choose btwn gas or electric, not avail in convection; they indicated there's no need for it with their ovens; if I really want speed then I should look into a combi oven
- cast iron solid top plate with 3 rings
- brass handrails and fittings
- backsplash
- 2 open burners under enamelled cast iron griddle (not sure if enamelled is easier to clean than not enamelled)
- brass stand (this may be ++ $$)
- royal blue or ivory enamelled finish (my cabinets are cherry wood with a chocolate glaze) - I was originally leaning towards the royal blue, but I think ivory will look better with the cherry wood
- 55" - 60"

Any thoughts?

Some people asked what I thought about the Lacanche that I saw the other day b/c I didn't say much about it. I know that I can get all of the features that I'm looking for in the Lacanche. But, I LOVED the look, quality and the power of the Molteni. I really liked the Lacanche. I figured that I should go for what I LOVE... although I would still be happy (and my husband happier) with what I really like. Really, I would be happy with either range. They are both beautiful pieces of art. I won't know the real difference btwn them until I start cooking.

My only fear with the Molteni is that the stove seems to carry a lot of prestige with it. I'm just a regular person... I'm not a chef, or a millionaire. I don't live in a mansion or have a super huge kitchen. I consider myself quite ordinary... this may sound silly, but, people may wonder why an ordinary person like me has a Molteni. I don't want to appear "out of my league". But... who cares... its my stove right!?!

Anyhow, I forgot the link to the comical stoves that my sister sent to me. Here it is... http://www.appliancist.com/ranges/boretti-stoves-economy-line-gas-ranges.html Opps!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

My only fear with the Molteni is that the stove seems to carry a lot of prestige with it.

It is only prestigious among a handful of hardcore appliance geeks and Chef's in 2/3 star Michelin restaurants. If you had those people in your circle of friends you would be asking them for advice not GWers.

No one will really know what the Molteni is or what it is capable of unless you tell them. My every day wristwatch for the last 10 years is a Panerai that is just as expensive as a Rolex President. But only three people have noticed it in that time.Two hardcore watch collectors and the girlfriend of a hardcore watch collector. If I wore a Rolex President as my daily watch I would worry about going into certain neighborhoods,I would get looks of "You are such a A-hole" from time to time etc. Most rich people think Sub-Zero Wolf is the highest of the high-end when it comes to appliances if they think about it at all.

Most professional chefs can't afford a Molteni. Celebrity chef's have the range they are endorsing or got for free. So when the Foodie/Kitchen magazines come to take pictures Wolf/Viking/etc is in the shot with said celebrity chef.

The megawealthy have interior/kitchen desingers pick their appliances. Usually a Wolf Range. Gaggenau cooktops/ovens if going for Euro-modern look or La Cornue if going for French country/Old World European. Some interior/kitchen designers recommend appliance brands based on the discount they get and markup they can charge their clients. That is not Molteni. Most megawealthy don't care because they don't cook just reheat or have personal chefs do the cooking.

Molteni home ranges main market is upper-middle class willing to sacrifice vacations/luxury cars and lower-upper class foodies that are TKO. Molteni is not out of your league.

Repeat to self

I am good enough

I am smart enough

And doggone it people like ME!

They really really like ME!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4mamma - Yes it's prestigious. Not to a select few who are in the know, but to all. I can't imagine anyone walking into a kitchen with a Molteni and not immediately begin to ask questions about it. If they don't ask you how much it cost, rest assured most will be googling as soon as they get home.

What's the Molteni for, if not to be a work of art on display? Deeageaux has pointed out why professional/celebrity chefs don't have one, but the other half of the equation is that they don't need one. You've gone out of your way to describe yourself as your average mom cooking for her family. I highly doubt that the function of the Molteni will make you a better cook in any way. At best, you'll become a better cook because you love being around it and cooking on it all the time. At worst, you'll be afraid to dirty it up and you'll end up getting take-out five nights a week!

I say go for it if it's a luxury you can really afford and if you think it'll make you happy. Yes it's going to raise some eyebrows - especially if you're really just as average as you present yourself to be - and I suspect some people will be talking about it behind your back. Especially if you serve them anything less than spectactular meals from it! But to think that the only people who will notice it are those in the know, well that's just not going to happen. That would be like driving a flourescent Lambo down the road and expect it to blend in with all the Nissan Altimas.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

People do buy Wolf ranges because they like the red knobs. Looks and prestige can drive a purchase like this. If you want to treat yourself, and that's your treat, to me it's no different than earrings or a fur coat.

But it is something you'd be using every day. So my practical gene wants to know if there was a working model of the range that you were able to "test drive" to see if you like the way it functioned?

I am old-school on this and come to the purchase of any range from a cooking perspective because for me a range and a user need to be matched up well. There's nothing worse than a stove you hate for some reason, one that won't do what you want it to do (I'll add ugly to that, too). F.ex. I've used our DDs stoves at their houses and they like them but those would drive me nuts. I don't want something that gets so hot I can't stand and make pancakes for the kids on the griddle comfortably because the ovens are on and standing there is roasting my feet.

So you've seen Molteni. You've seen Lacanche. Which one would you feel most comfortable using? Do you have any curiosity about exploring other similar brands like Bonnet and Delaubrac? I'd certainly want a base for comparison but your process and decision stream may not take that turn.

IOW why this range? If the answer is I'm the Mom that's why, it's a perfectly good answer. But I'm seeing lists of features rather than a list of "features I like, which should I choose".


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Just skimmed over a BusinessWeek article from this January. Sorry deeageaux, but it seems like you've got their market entirely wrong.

While restaurants make up most of Molteni's customers, demand is increasing from private buyers, says Alberto Zanata, head of Electrolux's professional products division. These customers, about 20 a year, tend to be the super rich, designers who favor the stoves' standout aesthetics, or chefs who want one for their own homes. "People are looking for more appliances close to the ones used by the famous chefs," Zanata says. Molteni's biggest markets are France, China, and the U.S. (Its wares are especially popular in Las Vegas.) "Asia in general and China in particular" is growing fastest for Molteni, Zanata says, spurred by the region's embrace of luxury and by "culinary trends becoming global."

Here is a link that might be useful: article


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

These customers, about 20 a year, tend to be the super rich

They don't give actual numbers in the linked article, not net wealth nor yearly incomes.

It seems more marketing propaganda than anything else.

These ranges are aspirational.

Manufacturers of super luxury products are going to say their customers are super rich,super educated, and super fashionable.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

You know, $13K was not really expensive for what you would have been getting.

I have just priced BS cooktop + Gag Oven + induction cooktop + cabinet for the cooktop area. It is not much less, plus Molteni had a vent insert AND the looks.

I agree that $20K is too much b/c it is over-priced (if you ask me) as you'd be paying for the brand name.

I live in a subdivision with a lot of $1M+ houses (while the rest are a LOT less) and know personally some of the owners. Their imagination does not go beyond an All-Viking kitchen. They wouldn't have known Molteni from Bosch, I don't think. LOL. So, what's the point?

If a stove can make you happy, who cares what people would think? We have two friends who bought a Mercedes in their 60's b/c they had always wanted one. If I had spare cash, I would go on a trip around the world, instead.

If someone gave me a Ferrari, I would drive it, but other than that, a car is just a tin on wheels to get me from point A to point B and only has to be safe as well as reasonably comfortable and nice looking.

To each their own, so do whatever makes YOU happy as you cannot please everybody no matter how hard you try. :-)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Well rococogurl... I took your advice and went to see a working model of the Molteni. Apparently, Le Select Bistro has a stainless steel double island suite that is about 8 years old. It has a salamander, 2 open burners, and a large plancha on one side; a huge french top and oven on the other.

The unit was very impressive. Every burner, oven and element was turned on. The burners and oven lit by using an ignition button. You need to turn the gas on and then press the button to ignite the burners. It reminded me of lighting a barbecue (without the bang!).

The chef had nothing but good things to say about the unit. I asked about servicing and repairs... the chef said that the unit did have minimal repairs but they were minor concerns. I asked if he owns one... he said that he couldn't afford it, but would if he could and he would get the combi oven. He said that in his experience the unit was very good. However, one of the cooks did say that it takes a long time for parts to come in.

I found the top of the stove (the metal surface excluding the knobs) and the hardware around the oven to be very hot to the touch. I know the unit had been running all morning (we went for a late lunch) but I immediately thought of my kids getting scorched. I would have thought the chimney would have dissipated some of that heat. My former stove got warm to the touch... but, its not as powerful as the Molteni. Does anyone else have this concern with their stove?

On another note... foodonastump... you mentioned that I have gone out of my way to describe myself... I do this b/c I think it gives a better context of who I am. Articles about Molteni users paint a picture that I feel does not describe me. Plus, aren't you curious about who I am? I am new to this technology of forums on-line... I am use-to seeing or hearing someone to get a feel for them... I do wonder who everyone is. I would love to be able to have this discussion in person... or over the phone. But, distance, time, convenience often doesn't allow that to happen. Hence, I type... Isn't technology GREAT!

I do mourn the loss of the $13K deal... but, I must move on. I did receive drawings for the Molteni that I describe above... When I figure out how to send them... I'll be happy to share.

I am still grappling with whether to add the warming cupboard or not. A warming drawer won't work with the unit... and a cupboard will add another 20". The drawing I rec'd measures 4'11" wide which is quite large. If I take another 20", I'll have to give up some crucial cabinet space. Any thoughts?

I do have a very small hesitation... I keep thinking the markets going to crash and I'd be better off saving my $$$. But, then I think "I'll be nourishing my family and friends with it!" and "I DO deserve it". So, yes... I have decided to do what makes me happy. That's why I'm moving ahead with my Molteni!

I looked at Bonnet. It appears comparable to Molteni in terms of it sturdiness but for some reason it looks more commercial than Molteni does. Plus, I don't think they are in Canada. I only found US based info. I like the look of Delaubrac but I haven't been able to find their direct link. I will have to contact Estate Kitchens to inquire... I do like to make an effort just in case I miss something... or get an amazing price!

Anyhow, I love this discussion!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Great that you're researching. It will only be helpful to you in gaining all the knowledge that lets you "know" you're going with the right range.

One of our friends has an 84" Lacanche Sully built into a niche. It's the focal point of her kitchen and I think it's fabulous. Might as well get all the parts you think you might want.

Here's a link to another very large Lacanche , Sully I think. You could calculate the length from the pieces. The island is 18-feet long in this kitchen so that's another way to judge.

Additionally, a woman in Ct. had a gigantic, gorgeous Bonnet in a kitchen done by Victoria Hagan. It was in Town & Country. It was somewhat similar to this bigboy (also Hagan) which may be a Molteni but pic is annoyingly small.

I've linked the Delaubrac site below. It has English translation.

One of my issues with these ranges is the heat they throw. Our DD had a 48" Wolf d.f. in one of the houses and I found it very hot using back burners or the griddle with the ovens going. It appeared to vent in the bottom front. Expect that's not as powerful as Molteni. While that bothered me it might not bother someone else. She has little ones but it wasn't an issue (though the freezer drawers were). Everyone has different tolerance on something like this -- perhaps others will chime in. In England, Agas are on all the time and aren't a problem. Very individual -- why the go-sees are so valuable IMO.

Here is a link that might be useful: Delaubrac


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

When I lived in England, we visited a home where I saw my first AGA in person. But I had to ask the hostess why, when she had such a beautiful range, was there a cheapo electric coil range on the opposite wall. She replied that the AGA was too hot to run in the summer, so she needed the other one for the few months (or would that be weeks?) of English summer.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Re Warming cupboard

I think we need to see a layout to give real good advice.

Without it we can't see how crucial the cabinet space is to the functionality and aesthetics of the kitchen.

The Bonnet is also comparable in terms of performance but I think it has an even smaller footprint in N. America.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Hello,

This is a test...

I'm trying and trying to send some files so that you can view the stove and the kitchen.

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen Plan


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

The test worked, can see the plans....is the dishwasher next to the range and is served by a small prep sink? It looks like there is no dishwasher in the main sink area...am I seeing this correctly?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Please see attached link. I have attached the layout of the main floor with comments. I will send the picture of the Molteni (without warming cupboard) next.

I'm not sure where to put the dishwasher b/c of limited space. Ideally, I would like it beside the main sink but there's not enough space in that loc'n. The island might be another alternative... but then I'd have to spin to put the dishes in the dishwasher. I think my floor plan needs a lot of work. Perhaps, I'll post it in kitchens for discussion.

Some have suggested that I'm trying to squish my kitchen into the original kitchen space and that I should use the kitchen, kitchenette and family room for my entire kitchen. Others have suggested swapping the kitchen and the family room loc'ns. Not sure about the last suggestion b/c then I'll need to walk through the family room when serving food in the dining room.

Here is a link that might be useful: Floor Plan with comments


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RE: Making the move to a Molteni Range

Rococogurl - I love your friends kitchen! It looks fabulous... if only I had that kind of space. But, I really like the idea of the alcove... perhaps I could make an alcove as well and then I won't have to lose the view. Hhhhmmm...

The whole kitchen would have to be re-worked. But the alcove would give the stove a more prominent space.

Thoughts?

Here is a link that might be useful: Molteni (without warming cupboard)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Rework. Range would be the focal point and need a major hood. And should go into a kitchen that's gorgeous with a great design.

When I see that floor plan like that my first thought is one large window. But depends on your taste/needs. I also like a major sink, refrigeration, extras.

There's a "think big" aspect to this when you make this sort of commitment. The space is there -- depends on whether/how you want to use it and what your family needs. A friend of mine set up one part of the kitchen for her DH to come in and make his coffee, a sandwich, use the micro etc. out of her way.

Have you seen kitchens that combine kitchen and family rooms? Is there a good big pantry for storage? Butler's pantry (if you have a lot of china). Mudroom storage area for kids & their stuff? Drinks & snacks fridge for kids to use? Breakfast area? Wine storage?

Your plans were drawn up by someone selling cabinets to people who buy pro ranges. You're kicking it up a few notches. They'll jam cabinets in because that's their job. Just like you rethought the range, you may (or may not) want to rethink the kitchen to balance what you need want now, how to build it what you'll need in a few years as the family grows, etc. It should function and efficiently for you and be a joy to be in there as well. Our friend has 4 kids, they entertain constantly and her kitchen is extensive kitchen that works well for them.

You get it, just need to think about the kitchen and how it would be used everyday now.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4Mamma,
I happened to be in a NJ store today that had a huge french range on the floor.(Can't recall if it was a Molteni or a Morice - I was too busy admiring it)
It had an oven that was two sided, a french top, griddle and a host of other features. I would describe it more as an independent cooking island then a range. It was probably 7 feet by 4 feet. It was in a shiny black. I think the trim was brass - but I am not sure. It has knobs like the old fashioned faucets.I didn't count the number of ovens so I am not sure if it has has more then 2. A gorgeous piece. The person I deal with in the store said they had never sold a single one - and had put this one on sale for $50,000 but it hadn't sold. I think he said MSRP was $90,000. If you are interested let me now and I'll put you in touch.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I agree with rococogurl,that layout needs to be re-imagined not simply adjusted.

The Molteni needs to be showcased not hidden behind the island.

That room calls for that big window rococogurl suggest not just for the view(unless that window is looking out at something ugly?) but the natural light.

A lot of people want a "social" kitchen where people can talk face to face when cooking. But most of your time is spent prepping not cooking in front of the stove.

I am not the layout guru some are in the kitchen forum but I know bad layout when I see it.

I would start a thread with the title " Molteni Mamma desperately wants your layout advice." There will be very good people that will really want to help.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Completely agree about the layout. Not showcasing the range properly is about the least of the problem.

I totally sympathize though. I haven't been able to figure out an ideal layout for my own kitchen for years now. I've gotten input from friends, relatives, cabinet sellers and a paid KD, and also looked in identical houses in the neighborhood. It's all less than good without significant rework of the available space.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for all of your advice. I know my layout needs more work to not only showcase the range but to have a social kitchen. My last kitchen had that social feel and I think that's why I was able to finalize things much quicker. This one is lacking...

Foodonastump - IMO - I would rather wait until I was able to do the significant rework (or at least close to it) rather than settle for something you don't want. If your ideal is not attainable than get as close to it as you can.

With that said... I will start a thread on the kitchen forum for some layout advice. I hope it doesn't take years to figure out my ideal kitchen... but, I'll wait.

And while I'm waiting... I'll check out the stove deal that avidchef mentioned. But, this time I'm not going to discuss it ;0D


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RE: Making the move to a Molteni Range

So... I checked out the deal and it is a GREAT deal! But, I'm going to pass on this one. Here's what my dear sister had to say about the whole thing...

"You want a Molteni!
I'll have to hear about the Molteni you didn't get for the rest of my life - especially after I buy one!
Get the Molteni and stop being distracted.
You've chosen your fiance now stop looking at all the other guys!" :0D Isn't she cute!

Anyhow, I also came across a listing for a La Corune range with matching hood on ebay that might interest someone.

Here is a link that might be useful: La Corune with matching hood


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Did you decide to keep the old layout ?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for asking. Yes, I'm still here... I just got busy with life!

While life was happening... I did a few things.

First, I went to an interior designer for some advice. She wanted $5k to share her advice so I said "no thanks, please keep your advice"... but, I was really thinking "taking your advice and ....". Then, I went to a kitchen designer instead.

I don't recall who gave me this wonderful advice (at no charge) but it was well worth it. His advice was wonderful. I believe that he fixed my kitchen and made it look pretty. I've attached it for your feedback. FYI - The pantry wall will just have cabinetry no high speed appliances.

The second thing I've been doing was finalizing my Molteni order. Still! Yes... it has taken that long. I must admit the length of time it has taken to finalize my order did dampen my spirits and then "life" really does put things into perspective.

Anyhow, I put in my revised scaled down custom order and waited... and waited.... and waited. My Molteni rep thought the price would come back around $35K. A good few weeks of waiting and my custom order was quoted at $68K which included 2 burners, flat top, 2 additional burners, oven and warming cupboard. Despite what the magazines say, I am not a millionaire nor filthy rich and don't want to spend that kind of $$$ on a stove.

So, I was going to go with a standard unit which fall within my price range. However, a standard unit is just that a powerful standard unit - 2 burners, flat top, 2 additional burners (extra cost) and an oven. But this came back at $45K. At this point, I feel as though I'm paying for the name... my wish list has disappeared... my unit is shrinking... and I can't even afford the hood. I keep thinking $45K on a stove! and... I still don't have a hood (which will cost about $10K).

Anyhow... I'm moving away from my Molteni. What I'll get remains a mystery...

I've been contemplating an AGA. It has everything that I'm looking for - multiple ovens including roasting, baking, warming and simmering, 4 burners (if I get the companion), a boiling and simmering plate. All for a great price. I can even afford the hood! Any thoughts?

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen Plan - Range still a mystery????


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Are you looking at classic Aga cookers with radiant ovens or the Aga ranges?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I'm looking at the classic 4 oven cooker with radiant ovens with the companion. I saw the Aga range but I don't know much about it. They also have another Aga called the Total Control which allows you to turn it on and off... but it takes 45min to pre-heat.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

So you know about rotating dishes between ovens and servicing every 9 months?

When Aga says their cookers are not simply appliances but a lifestyle they are not kidding.

You have read about the cookers eccentricities? About how it was designed by a blind Sweedish physicist so that he and his blind wife could cook without adjusting knobs and waiting for ovens to preheat?

If you really really want the exotic looks of the Aga Cooker without the Molteni price tag,have read the threads here on GW,gone to a demontration,and have done your due dilegence then go for it.

I would not get the companion. There are some $1200 ranges that have better stovetop performance. A single sealed 12k btu burner as your "wok performance" burner for boiling water for pasta and searing steak? Really? I know that some Aga owners will insist they can get by but why after spending $25K on a setup?

I would get a Bluestar Companion instead. Two 22k btu open burners and a powerful broiler in the oven as well. You can get a side opening door for a more exotic look too. And they will match any color you send them. About the same price as the AGA fully optioned. If you get the standard oven door about $1k cheaper.

Or you can get an induction unit to pair with cooker. Wolf is coming out with a 15" unit with a 3kw hob next month. Very powerful.

If it was my money I would rather get a fully optioned 60" Capital Culinarian with powerful 23k btu burners, thermogriddle, hybrid charbroiler, motorized rotisserie in a 36" self clean oven,and 24" secondary oven in RED.

Then take the $10k you saved over the AGA setup plus what you were going to spend on the AGA hood and spend it on a custom show stopping range hood.Hire a stonemason to make custom stone hood,a coppersmith for a custom copper unit,or any other kind of hood you like. And you will still have some money left over for a warming drawer(s) if you so desire :)


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

IMHO, the most credible advice you're ever going to get about any appliance is going to come from those consumers who have actually owned and/or used the product over a considerable amount of time and who are willing to share truthfully about its pros and cons based on that direct experience. Unfortunately, because Molteni is a range that occupies such a rarified, high-end niche category, you are unlikely to run across many who have had such experience.

Aga, is also a high-end, niche product (though clearly not in the same league as Molteni) where finding a broad customer base to query will be hard. There are a few owners of Aga cookers who used to be active here, but I haven't seen them of late. While I don't know if it's still in existence, there used to be a pretty active forum of Aga cooker owners over on Yahoo. Their group name is/was AgaLovers.

Unfortunately, I can't speak with authority on Aga cookers --even though I initiated a pretty lengthy thread here, some years back, on the Aga family of cooking products. :-) I can, however, speak with substantial authority on the Aga 6-4 -- having been the owner of one now for 3+ years. The 6-4, is a dual fuel, 6 burner/4 oven cast iron range that turns off and on with ease. Similar to the Companion, but much bigger and with more options, it was Aga's first serious attempt at a pro-style range and it mimics the traditional Cookers in appearance. Should you have any interest in knowing more about the pros and cons of the Aga 6-4, please feel free to email me.

And, by all means, whatever you end up with, good luck in your search!

Here is a link that might be useful: About Aga Cookers and Ranges


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

What about Lacanche? While I can't speak from experience, there are Lacanche lovers on the forum. We are headed to Seattle to look at them this week (making the move from a Bluestar 60" at $14K to a Sully 2200 at $25K). The ranges can be configured in many way...chargrill, French simmer plate, griddle, 5, 11, 15 and 18K BTU burners with multiple ovens and warming cupboards. I hope we love them as much in person as online.

Another option for you to explore.

M


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Thanks for the advice. Nothing beats actual experience and that's one of the many reasons that I love this forum.

deeageaux - I will do my due diligence and read the threads on Aga cookers. I know you've mentioned Capital before... and I'm sure the performance is spectacular... and the accessory package is generous... but... its just not that pretty! I value your opinion and I would love to chat with you directly... you've given me so much good advice... if Capital would just design a better looking line of equipment I would buy it in a blink of an eye. :0)

marthavila - The duel fuel 6-4 is newer to the Cdn. market so the reps can't speak to it well. I will email you directly to have a chat after I've done my reading.

MichelleDT - Your trip to Seattle sounds like so much fun! If I was closer I would come along just for the fun of it. I like the Lacanche... but, I liked the Molteni more. Lacanche was my next choice. Right now I'm disappointed with the Molteni and I don't want to feel as though I settled for my 2nd choice.

I know that's so purely emotional one could gage... my DH rolls his eyes... I know its just a stove. But these things are so expensive I want to love its performance as well as its look.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

But what is your definition of performance? I can't imagine being torn between an Aga cooker and a Molteni range. To me that's kind of like being torn between a horse and a motorcycle. They're both pretty.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

What is my def'n of performance? Hmmm, first and foremost, I want my stove to be reliable. My Wolf had lots of problems igniting. Sometimes it would light with a bang, sometimes it wouldn't light at all and other times it would work just fine. So, first and foremost, I want the stove to work.

Next, I want the versatility that power offers. I want to be able to boil water for my tea, soup or pasta in minutes... not 10s of minutes. I would like to be able to sautee, and then simmer without the flame going out. I want to be able to broil, roast, and bake in the oven(s).

I'm not interested in the latest technology... that's why I'm not gravitating towards induction... although I hear its wonderful. And, that combi-ovens are the latest. But, I don't think I'm there yet.

I prefer traditional cooking with the luxury of advanced technology.

You are right foodonastump. The Molteni and Aga are both beautiful. The Aga doesn't compare to the power of the Molteni. I've been reading the Aga threads and I am very surprised to learn that the whole Aga cooker is powered on only 15K BTU's... that's equivalent to 1 Molteni burner! But I feel that I'll be getting so many more features with the Aga (ie. the various ovens, the simmering and warming plate).

I had to laugh with your comparison of the Aga to a horse! But let's be fair... at least a thoroughbred pedigree horse ;0D


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Any range can have problems.Wolf in general is very good in terms of reliability but it seems you got a lemon. But you have heard of the recommended service every nine months for AGA cookers? And the 10 year service plan?

"I want to be able to boil water for my tea, soup or pasta in minutes... not 10s of minutes. "

Then you will need something more than AGA.


"I would like to be able to sautee"

Unless you want to pre-heat cast iron pans for 10+ minutes a true sautee is not going to happen either.


"Aga cooker is powered on only 15K BTU's... that's equivalent to 1 Molteni burner!"

That is less than half of Molteni's power burner.


"But let's be fair... at least a thoroughbred pedigree horse "

More like a Clydesdale. Or you are going from Bugatti to horse and buggy


"its(Culinarian) just not that pretty"

The endorphin rush of buying something so Very Pretty last a few years.

The utility of Performance and Function last forever.

Remember one of the justifications of spending so much money on a range?

It will "help nourish my family?"

Pretty does not help nourish a family it just feeds Ego.

If you are willing to deal with servicing an AGA cooker and dealing with the eccentricities like rotating dishes among the ovens then they do an excellent job as ovens.

But there is no way around the subpar cooktop/stovetop performance. It really should be paired with something other than an AGA companion. A Bluestar companion, a 24" Bluestar rangetop, or something else.


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Ok! Points well taken and noted.

There's an Aga cooking demonstration tomorrow (Wednesday) June 13th at the Grange, 150 King St. E. in Toronto ON M5A 1J3 from 5-6 pm. Anyone interested?

Please RSVP directly with Daniel at (416) 943-4726. ‎


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Oh for goodness sakes, 4M! These ridiculous Aga-bashing comments by folk who are trying to talk you into buying a cooking appliance of their personal preference are largely without merit and should not be "well-taken"! LOL!

If you don't know it by now, you should at least know that Agas are those darn British cooking contraptions that some on this forum love to hate -- whether they've ever owned one, or even had substantial cooking experience on one or not. Nevertheless, for nearly a century now, Aga has been turning out the traditional Aga Cooker for a very solid and serious fan base. And, whatever bricks and bats have been thrown at the Aga Cooker, -- none have ever made a serious dent where the claim was that the machine is of "subpar" performance! Has it gotten a bad rap for being "always on"? Yes. A fuel hog? Yes. Requires a slight learning curve in getting to know how to operate the thing? Yes. Pricey? Yes. But subpar in performance? No! A terrible service history? No! A horse? No! At least not unless you are talking about being a work horse. Then, yes! :-)

Again, I neither own an Aga Cooker nor a Companion nor do I work for Aga, an Aga distributor, vendor, or servicer. At the end of the day, I do not really care what cooking appliance you buy for yourself and your family. In short, I've got no skin in this game. However, as an owner of the Aga 6-4, I do admit to trying to combat some of the more ridiculous, meritless claims that are often made about Aga products on this forum from time to time. That said, let me at least offer these few counter points for your consideration:

Every owner of an Aga Cooker I've ever heard from (on this forum and elsewhere) has marveled at their cooking results with that machine. If you enjoy cooking with cast iron pots and pans, imagine how much you might like the results of cooking where the entire cooking unit is made of cast iron. (Trust me, as the owner of a cast-iron Aga 6-4, I love it!) Since you are going to an Aga cooking demonstration tomorrow, you might want to raise all your concerns about "subpar" performance at that time. As for the Aga Companion, I'm also unaware of any performance-related complaints about that machine. If you feel that a 15K BTU burner just can't get the job done for you and you must have a 30K+ BTU Molteni "power burner" to truly meet your needs in a residential cooking appliance, then, by all means, go back to the Molteni! (Meanwhile, I wonder what all the cooks of the world, from time immemorial, have done to feed their families when using cooking devices of 15K BTUs or less? Or, shudder the thought of struggling to prepare meals on a --dare I say it-- sealed burner? Oh the horror of pre-Bluestar/Capital appliance manufacturing!) LOL!

The traditional Aga Cooker has got to be one of the most bell-and-whistle free "modern" cooking machines money can buy. With so few doo dads, it just doesn't have a reputation of constantly needing service. So, never before having heard that it's necessary to service an Aga Cooker every 9 months , I actually called Aga customer service directly to see if I could substantiate that claim before posting these comments. In a nutshell, here's what Aga customer said:

The recommended frequency of basic maintenance on a vented, gas fired, 4-oven Aga Cooker is one year. [Aga also recommends replacement of Cooker thermocouples every 3 years.] However, an annual maintenance call is only a recommendation. It is most certainly not a requirement. Because the Aga Cooker is "always on," you might want to think of this machine as you think of your home heating system. Many homeowners conduct an annual check of their heating units which includes cleaning, replacing of filters, etc. While such a routine is not necessary, with an "always on" system, it certainly doesn't hurt to engage in periodic maintenance. BTW, other Aga cooking products, such as the Companion, 6-4, Legacy, Aga Pro, for example, make no such recommendation of an annual and basic system maintenance call.


As for the "looks vs performance" argument. . . huh? I do not get what what the problem is with your considering looks as one of many factors to consider when making a major appliance purchase. If looks are your only consideration, then I can perhaps see a concern about your judgment. But I would think that most consumers who are trying to make such a major decision will take a variety of factors into account, including price, performance, size/dimensions/weight, service history, serviceability, and, yes. . . looks. FWIW, I'm not ashamed to say that the appearance of my range was a very important factor in my choosing an Aga 6-4 in order to replace my beloved antique stove when I did my own kitchen remodel.

I repeat: If you have any serious intention in considering the Aga Cooker and Companion -- or any appliance for that matter -- then please find a credible, experienced source to query. I suggest to you that such an informed source has yet to appear on this thread -- including moi. :-) But, then, I'm not trying to talk you out of, or into, any other product purchase either! Whatever you choose, just make sure your choice is truly well-informed and well-reasoned. And, again, good luck!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

WELL. Speaking for myself, my comment was not an attempt to bash Aga cookers in any way. It was to point out that - at least from what I understand - they require a considerably different approach to cooking. To me this isn't along the lines of a Bluestar vs Culinarian discussion, or even a gas verus induction discussion. I've linked the Aga Cookers page. The very first thing it says: "It's a way of life." As such I feel it's something that requires passion and commitment that's a lot deeper than simply being a second choice because you've decided a Molteni is too expensive.

4mamma - I look forward to hearing about the demo. Hopefully it's not in a very large room, so you can start to get a feel for how hot your smallish kitchen will be, year round. That may not be a problem up north by you, but I couldn't have it running more than about four months out of the year where I live.

Here is a link that might be useful: Aga cookers


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

4mamma, just came over to check out some info on some appliances. I see you are still searching.

Is the Molteni rep you are talking to the same one you got advice from on the craigslist range? If so, you sure are stronger than me!! I would still be painfully bitter at him for doing what he did to you! It still burns my blood when thinking of it!

Good luck, hope you find that perfect one!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Hi!

Your message made me smile susied3. I did feel great remorse over loosing the craigslist deal. In hindsight it was such a GREAT price.

After that deal went belly up I was turned off of the purchase... then, my rep was replaced with the president of the company who re-ignited my flame by flying me out to Charlotte. After that trip I forgot about craigslist and was ready to purchase. In my discussions, we thought the price for a reasonable unit would come back around $35K and I was ready to purchase. But, then life happened on my end... and several weeks (almost 1 month) pasted on their end. The price came back and it was higher than our discussions and we couldn't seem to get it down! They needed to figure freight, the value of the Cdn $, etc. into the equation.

Anyhow, at this point I still love the Molteni. Nothing compares to its powerful burners, its solid build and unique design. The team I was working with was great... I never felt pressured to make the purchase and they were always willing to work with me. Their typical client probably doesn't have to fuss over $10K but that's a big deal for me.

I still think that everything happens for a reason... do I mourn the loss of that Molteni... heck yes! But, if I hadn't lost that deal I wouldn't have had a GREAT time in Charlotte with my BF and I wouldn't have re-considered my range options which allowed me to re-think my kitchen layout. All of which is going to end up saving me $$$ (my husband is already happier) and I think I will be happier with the end product.

With that said, I am going to start a new post related to the AGA!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Have you considered the Diva de Provence ranges? I know nothing about them but someone posted a link here recently and I looked at the website. They look gorgeous. Obviously very high end. I noticed they are distributed out of Toronto so perhaps might be good if you are in Canada. Good luck!

Tina


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

Hi Tina,

Thanks for the suggestion. I was surprised to see Diva de Provence distributed out of T.O. as well. I searched and searched and searched for them.

Apparently they are no longer available due to some tech. type issues.

I liked the look of them as well. But, it can't be pretty and not function properly. That's like having beauty without the brains!


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

This may be an another thread, but -

follow-up? please?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I know this is a long shot, since I'm asking a poster from back in March, do you have any idea what that vent hood is? I like the style and I want to find something like this in a smaller size. I'm considering a 36inch Capital range, so maybe a 36 or a 42.

Also... $ 50,000 for a range? Whoa. I can buy 10 Capitals for that. Really hope the hood isn't in the same ridiculous price range? Or if it is, any cheaper alternatives?


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RE: Making the move towards a Molteni Range

I'm not sure what you mean traci_allen? Please clarify what vent hood?


 o Post a Follow-Up

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