Another stab at layout...and beginnings of BS consideration

steph2000August 5, 2012

As I go round and round, contemplating the various dilemmas of this small house while likely over-exposing myself to so many great ideas, another option has come up I wqanted to run past people.

It all started when I started looking at what would happen to the kitchen if dealing with the washer/dryer that is on the other side of the wall requires a bumpout to make it fit. (Right now it juts a foot out into the hallway, impacting the little walkway/hall that leads to the bathroom.) It motivated me to get out the tape measure and layout program and come up with this:

Which, you know, got me thinking that the mini-nook created by the bump out would allow me to go topless on the range wall and to go with some color on that wall because it would be recessed a bit. As I played with it, it also seemed to help out the dilemma of how to deal with backsplash on that wall given the backsplash window that is on the exterior wall.

We might be able to find a smaller W/D and according to my partner, this might become a non-issue. It does seem that having uppers on the interior wall does make it kind of tricky to deal with the window BS in a way that harmonizes and makes sense - while just eliminating the uppers on that other wall somehow doesn't create that complication? It's just something different, wtih a little bit of it brought over the sink? Is my thinking right on that?

It also gets rid of the dreaded upper corner cabinet and allow for full symmetry on the exterior wall at least on the uppers (which I love).

We aren't talking about a great deal of lost storage, but obviously, in a small kitchen everything counts and I have to be really smart about the rest of the layout to justify such an indulgence as a topless wall in this tiny house. lol But, just for kicks, what do you think?

From the front door/sitting room area:

There are still some heavy dilemmas about the layout. Especially involving the lowers on the exterior wall. My love of the symmetry on the uppers is creating some dilemmas on the lowers as I try desperately to center the darn sink. In the last rendition I went down to an 18" DW, which I can live with. I also have gone to a tall, skinny fridge to get a pullout pantry on the side of it. But, I've either lost the garbage or the appliance storage in the corner, depending on which way the bullet is bitten. Not really very viable... The area left of the sink is so, so tight.

Any and all suggestions, impressions, gut reactions welcome.

Here's one tile that I think would be great on a floor to ceiling application, as I do believe eye candy is the accepted currency around here?

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I like it better with the bumpout, because it creates definition around the range.

    Bookmark   August 5, 2012 at 6:17PM
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I liked the bump out too.

    Bookmark   August 5, 2012 at 6:27PM
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Thanks for chiming in, palimpset. The nook does seem to add some definition - though my partner doesn't like it.

I'm not sure if you remember my prior layouts, but do you like this better than with uppers framing the interior wall?

I also thought of another question for everyone. My home is a 1952 ranch. Does this tile work with that in mind? Are there other directions folks who attend to design from a historical perspective recommend I consider? I'm not really doing a period house, but I don't want to leave purists shuddering and I am way out of my knowledge base on these kinds of aspects of design.

    Bookmark   August 5, 2012 at 6:41PM
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I love the look of the bumpout and the tile to the ceiling. If you don't need the bumpout, you could consider a counter-to-ceiling cabinet to create the same definition (and give you a bunch of extra storage). I used one to help with my symmetry and give me a place to stop my tile (sorry I don't have a picture without a bunch of goofy reflections):

Have you considered putting a trash pullout under the sink? There was a fairly recent thread that I'll link below.

And I LOVE the tile.

Here is a link that might be useful: Trash pullout under sink thread

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 8:13AM
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I think I would forego the glass doors over the sink, 1) to maximize storage, and 2) to keep all the emphasis on that long horizontal window.

What are those details on each side of the sink? If they are some kind of millwork detail, that actually seems inconsistent with 1952 ranch.

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 8:47AM
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Good morning!

Thanks numbersjunkie, for taking the time to give feedback. The bump out is kinda interesting...who would have thought?

mpagmom - Sounds like you think I might be on a good track here? I love your counter to ceiling cabinet. My only concern is that our peninsula is likely going to end up some odd depth and I'm not sure how to do it to the counter so it fills up that space completely and looks good from both sides? Hm... I wonder if I could do a floor to ceiling? I just doesn't seem it would have the same effect as the wall bumpout, somehow... I might have to at least play around with that.

And, about the garbage under the sink... I've been pondering it. But I do a ton of prep work at my sink - not to mention rinsing out recyclables. The thought of having to pull away from the only sink so someone can use the garbage isn't thrilling me. I haven't had space for garbage in my current sink. If you had asked me the ONE thing I would love in a new kitchen, I would have said 'room for garbage'. Oh, the irony!

Have I missed your unveiling? It sure looks like that is a lived in kitchen! It's looking great!

Palimpsest - The details on each side of the sink are just 3 inch fillers from the virtual design program I am using. I have 2 on each side to reserve space for pullouts on each side of the sink - but don't intend to do fancy moulding on them in real life. Would it be inconsistent with this house to have those half-legs on each side of the sink? Better to keep it to just flat panels?

I hear what you are saying about the glass doors over the sink. I'm drawn to them because they echo the white french doors that lead into the den from the room with the front door. I'm having a hard time letting them go - how strong is this recommendation? Lol

The ultimate problem here in the end is the darn layout on the lowers. I can easily fit in what I need IF I forego symmetry on the back wall. Otherwise, I a) can't have drawers on each side of the stove like I want or b) have to give up a garbage slideout or a corner cabinet for the appliances.

I really like the idea of garbage on one side of the sink and DW on the other. But, I can't find the room unless I put a blind corner into the stove area, which ruins the symmetry on THAT wall while eliminating the option of drawers. Bleh.

This kitchen really did not feel small until I went to redesign it...

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 12:00PM
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I really like your lemonade-from-lemon bump-out wall too. In fact it's all looking really wonderful. LOVE the bands of windows and cabinets.

I really think you shouldn't be so concerned about centering the sink. It would be nice perfectly in the center, mainly because you want it there, but the important thing is that everything ELSE be properly placed. That entire wall, featuring the line of glass and the niche above the sink, is THE feature. Not the sink. Design the rest well, and nobody'll even notice its position. Probably literally in the majority of cases. I'd help this along by choosing an unobtrusive undermount sink in an unobtrusive material and an unobtrusive faucet that would be mounted wherever up and down the sink I decided to place it.

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 12:14PM
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I think you could go off center with the sink since you have such a large band of window there, and you could keep the uppers symmetrical. Visually I think it would look fine. Functionally just don't go too close to the range. But I think you have some inches to play with.

It's a fairly strong recommendation to use solid doors. I think the horizontal solid vs. void makes a stronger statement. Only if the entire back of the sink area was glass to the ceiling and the doors were glass, would it be a stronger statement even. Right now I think it detracts a bit from your transparent backsplash to have those upper glass cabinets.

I think slabs on the pullouts would be better. Unless your ranch has traditional details elsewhere I wouldn't go with legs and such.

That said, the phony colonial ranch was big in the mid century. I did a small ranch that had an entire wall of glass on one side of the LR and 6/6 lite windows on the other, with "colonial" millwork (and some in the development had "colonial" fireplaces. Some original inconsistencies but it still all looked okay because the inconsistencies were consistent throughout the houses, making an overall statement, not just isolated to one room or element.

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 12:41PM
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Thanks, Rosie! Now my partner is groaning at the suggestion that we might want to make a bump out even if it isn't needed. I'm trouble.

I hear you - and Palimpsest - about not worrying about centering the sink, but it really is the kind of thing that bugs me. If the DW and sink both fit under the raised area, that would work for me. But, it's the right side (I said earlier) that is so tight because of the dreaded corner cabinet.

I did figure out a way to have a garbage pullout if I am willing for it to not be beside the sink but on the other side of the DW instead. Intersted to hear what people think of that.

Here's a pic, of that plus solid uppers:

Basically, that exterior wall goes 15" pantry, 24" fridge, 9" cookie sheet thingy, 15" garbage pullout, 18" DW, 6" pullout, 30" sink, 6" pullout, 39" blind corner cabinet. This allows me to put drawers on each side of the stove for utensils, gadgets, and spices.

As you can see, I also experimented with putting a floor to ceiling cabinet there in lieu of a bumpout, but the beam pretty much kills that. Too bad, I could really use a general purpose area/linen closet.

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 3:38PM
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I was thinking the counter-to-ceiling cabinet would have it's back to the wall and the door(s) facing the dining room.

I would have a tough time giving up those glass cabinets over the sink, too, but palimpsest is probably right.

I haven't "unveiled." I was waiting for my dining room furniture to be moved from our old house (which finally happened - yea!) and now I'm waiting for the backordered shades to come in. Should be soon.

I think you're on to something here.

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 4:37PM
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Comparing the two I think it looks nice with the glass uppers and without, but I still think it is a bit cleaner without.

Does the beam go over the edge of the doorway, or is it along side?

    Bookmark   August 6, 2012 at 5:12PM
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Good morning, again.

mpagmom - I know you were thinking ceiling to counter, but I was on floor to ceiling. I worked up some drafts with your idea - I just worry about how accessible that cabinet would be given it is over a peninsula and I'd have to lean in to use it. It does provide some definition, but it's not symmetrical.

What do you think?

Yes, I have the glass cabinets over the sink in this one. Mostly because of the version of the layout I used. But also because I am still partial to the glass.

Palimpsest, I think I have one of those phony colonial ranches you speak so highly of. I have glass-paned white french doors leading into the den and fireplace mantles on each side of the fireplace that are white pained wood with colonial touches that my partner built a decade ago and is still very attached to. So, I figure I can either work with what I have but keep it clean and simple - or tear out the mantles, replace the french doors and go modern. The first option is not going to go over well, and was what I liked last decade. I really could see the house "working" either way.

The dreaded beam is not in yet, but I assume it will go right where the wall currently exists, which is right on the edge of the doorway. The plan doesn't show the doorway how it really is, because it insists on including framing. It is actually just a cut out to the ceiling walkway, no framing, no drywall around it. Our thinking is that the beam will have to be exposed but the posts it sits on will be in the walls. Does that help?

    Bookmark   August 7, 2012 at 12:54PM
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One of the things that you could do with the bumpout is have it line up with the beam (if the beam doesn't intersect the doorway) to tie the beam and the bumpout together and give some sense of "structure".

Colonial revival details have been so popular that they have really been adapted to all periods of housing in this country, and it often makes a pleasant mix of styles--if their has been a system to the way they were applied.

    Bookmark   August 7, 2012 at 3:00PM
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Palimpsest - I'm not sure what you mean regarding the beam. I'm not very good with spatial things. Can you elaborate or point me to a pic?

It's funny how my taste is evolving over time. I could live with a modern/MCM interpretation of my home and really have fun with it now. Not when I bought, though. I'm just not sure which way we'll go but given the windows and doors are still without trim, if I got a wild hair and decided to spend the extra to switch it up, I probably could. Though the windows along the front have the paned look, too, now that I think about it. And, they are new and the outside of the house is much improved by them.

    Bookmark   August 8, 2012 at 11:10AM
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