Experts--Help with Kitchen layout

pkovoJuly 31, 2013

Hello. I am looking for help with my kitchen layout. I currently have a small kitchen with a small adjacent dining room. I am going to remove the non-load bearing wall between the two, and make a larger eat in kitchen instead.

I have a rough idea of the layout in my head, but having no experience/knowledge of kitchen layout other than common sense, I really could use the input of some experts.

My idea was to basically mirror the row of cabinets with fridge and oven onto the left-most kitchen wall (directly across, then have either a peninsula or an island roughly in the center of the room. This would mean closing off the window on that wall, but it literally faces a garage 7' away, so it's pointless from a view perspective. Will also move the closet door to open to the hallway.

Existing measurements are:

Kitchen 9'1" x 15' 3"
Dining Rm 9'5" x 11' 5"
Wall Thickness 5"

Although i woudl lik to open the wall between the lvng room and kitchen, it's load bearing and I've decided to leave it case anyone was thinking of suggesting that :-)

some additional info---I am currently having a 2nd story addition added to my house. We were planning the kitchen remodel as a "second phase" project to be done a few yrs later, but now we are leaning towards doing it all at once.


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closer pic of kitchen/dining space only

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 11:54AM
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I would not rule out taking that wall down. There are ways of working with loading bearing walls. Personally I think you could have so much of a better layout if you even partially take down that wall.

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 12:02PM
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Can you give us dimensions?

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 12:03PM
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You mention "eat-in" and an island. Will the island suffice as the eat-in space or do you need a normal table too?

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 1:50PM
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I will need a normal table too. I thought I would keep the table in front of the sliders. I have a golf course behind my lot and a great view out the sliders

Definitely not married to the island idea, or the peninsula idea either. I was looking at basically from a counter-space perspective. My thinking is either would give more working counterspace to work with, but maybe that's not imperative.

It's funny, the bulk of the layout of my addition came from me. roof pitch, room layout etc, general dimensions everything. But with the kitchen, it's so hard for me to visualize. I just can't see a clear vision of what makes sense and what doesn't

Worth noting, my wife cooks...a lot. Everything from scratch. i cook almost never, so it is very much a one cook kitchen

This post was edited by pkovo on Wed, Jul 31, 13 at 15:09

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 2:38PM
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debrak2008, I know you are right. I think about that every time I think about the kitchen. When I sit in the living room and look at that wall, I know exactly where the lally columns in the basement fall, so I can see how much I can open and still utilize them to carry a point load. It's not 100% ruled out, but it makes it quite a bit more involved, and more expensive.

I have three kids in this house now, hence the 2nd story addition. But when we had 2, and considered stopping, my plan if/when we needed another bedroom was to convert the dining room back to a bedroom, and remove the wall between the existing kitchen and living room and make it open space and move the table to the end of the current living room area

With the addition of kid 3, we soon realized we needed more square footage so it was move or add on. I was leaning towards moving, my wife towards adding...guess who won :-)

One of my friends is a carpenter and he persuaded me as well.

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 2:53PM
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Did you consider swapping the cooking and eating areas? Then you could open the living room up a bit more to the dining space, so it has a view of the back yard and maybe have easier traffic flow?

And will you still have the full bath downstairs? Is the whole family moving upstairs?

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 5:39PM
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Full bath is definitely staying. I have 3 daughters that will all be teenagers togher for a spell. 2nd full bath going in upstairs, but I will need every bit of both of those bathrooms.

I have definitely thought about opening it up. Less for view and more for flow and versatility but would prefer to do the kitchen without dealing with moving structure, and keep it just between the existing kitchen and dining rooms if possible.

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 10:46PM
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Does the door opening into the kitchen lead to garage?

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 11:26PM
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Does the door opening into the kitchen lead to garage?

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 11:30PM
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Where does the door on the left side of the kitchen go to? Do you need any mud room type functionality or maybe a small powder room?

What type of appliances are you looking at? Cooktop/ovens or range, fridge size, etc.

    Bookmark   July 31, 2013 at 11:34PM
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Door to the left goes to mud room/laundry which connects to the garage out the other side, and has both a door to the front and rear of house. Can't touch it. It's not to code, but grandfathered in. Used to be an open breezeway. it's very functional anyway, so i wouldn't want to change it.

Standard sized typical appliances. Fridge, single oven/cooktop, dishwasher, microwave. Nothing over the top in terms of appliances.

Really needing help with actual layout, assuming those two rooms were one. Counter/appliance/cabinet placement.

    Bookmark   August 2, 2013 at 12:11AM
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Here's a very crude graphic of the general layout I was thinking. Take the cabinet selections with a grain of salt, I didn't really know how to use the program, but the appliance layout, and general layout of the island is what I was thinking.

Nothing is really exactly true to scale in this pic. Also, I added some extra junk on the wall overlapping the table, and couldn't figure out how to remove it, so ignore :-)

    Bookmark   August 2, 2013 at 12:33AM
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I'm not sure of the dimensions, but you might want to use a movable work table, rather than an island. Maybe with a butcher block top?

Also, if you can add another window on the sink wall (to replace the one you're losing by the range) you could move the sink over a bit and have a little more prep space, between the sink and range.

From Farmhouse plans

    Bookmark   August 2, 2013 at 6:55AM
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This may not be your style, but perhapsyoull find the pictures useful....

Could you turn your kitchen into a U and off the pennisula have dining seating?

Something like these:


Do the L and run a long skinny table down the kitchen dining area? like this:

In either solution I think you could place additional storage in the form of buffet/china hutch or even a bench seat placed between two shallow tall pantry cabinets...

    Bookmark   August 2, 2013 at 12:14PM
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Okay, this is very old fashioned, but I just don't like breaking and crowding that space up with island or peninsula plus table. It's a nice size if left open, but it's not that big. I'd try to keep it open.

You have room for a good, functional L wrapping between the mudroom door and the sliders. So a nice functional L there--with either one or both sides 30" deep for additional work space. And a big pull-out cutting board in just the right place while I'm at it.

Then built-in hutch/additional storage across the other short end of the kitchen. It would have a deeper middle hutch section flanked by shallower storage sections because the slider comes close to the corner there and it needs to leave clearance for draperies/whatever, now or as future option. The sides would include some book shelves to hold cookbooks and whatever. Over-fancy, and the table's doing the wrong way, but in general

Traditional Dining Room by Other Metro General Contractors RDM General Contractors

That leaves about 16' in the middle for table, chairs, traffic through, and children chasing each other around the table, which is oval to smooth traffic and minimize injuries. That's not more than enough, but it's a good space. Two of the chairs would be comfortable enough to lounge in while chatting with the cook.

This is one of my favorite kitchens on line, so I thought I'd just throw it in. L-counter, table in middle, a hutch, books...

Traditional Kitchen by Norwich Architects & Designers Smith & Vansant Architects PC

While I was at it, I'd probably widen the living room door--toward the stair side, or wherever living room furniture placement made good sense--but only about 4 feet, 5 feet max. (I'm not big on HAVING to have all the kitchen banging and riot in my nice, reasonably civilized living room all the time.)

This width would also keep open the option of a pretty set of French doors so the spaces could be closed off if desired later on in the family's life. Even the suggestion that they could can be effective. The power of suggestion is...powerful.

Of course, MsPkovo, who "cooks...a lot," may her own ideas, but I'm sure she'll get to have her say too. :)

This post was edited by rosie on Fri, Aug 2, 13 at 13:37

    Bookmark   August 2, 2013 at 1:12PM
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Thank You to all for the ideas.

Special thanks To Rosie. You definitely got me and Mrs. Pkovo thinking about it no island no peninsula. It makes sense. Clean and open. When needed, I can extend the table and have a nice sized room for entertaining. Mrs Pkovo gave that idea a thumbs up.

Perhaps add a movable work table as lav.. mentioned if we need extra work space, but then be able to yank it out of there when we don't need it, or need more space to extend the table.

I can visualize this, and I like it. Thank You

    Bookmark   August 4, 2013 at 8:27PM
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