Wiring a stove

scotts_2009September 29, 2009

I am trying to figure out the correct way to wire a stove and need some help determining which wire I can use.

I had both a double oven and a stove top on separate circuits. I replacing them with a single stove and I am not sure which set of wires I can use.

I am located in the U.S. so please make responses for U.S. codes and regulations.

Background info:

Double oven was directly connected with three wires a red, black and white. The breaker is 45 amps (double breaker?? it is two breakers put together) The wires are really thick so I am sure this is a 240 line.

The stovetop was directly connected with only two wires one black and the other white. The breaker is 40 amps (This is also a double breaker) I am not sure if this line is a 120 or 240.

The oven I have says the electrical supply it takes is 120/240 VAC, 120/208 VAC. I do not know what this means in terms of which line I can use.

I am installing junction boxes to extend the wires that I need (stove is in a new area of the kitchen) and I want to make sure I use the correct wire.

My questions are:

Can I use either of these lines for the stove?

If not which one should I use?

What is the correct size wire to use to extend the existing wiring?

What should I do with the extra connection that will be left from the wires I do not use?

I want to install a plug for the stove what is the correct size outlet to use a 30amp or 50amp?

How high off the floor should I put the outlet? I want to make sure the stove will slide back against the wall.

Also should I use a surface mounted outlet or put it in the wall. which is better?

Thanks for the help.

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randy427

What does the stove instructions say the amperage requirements are? My guess would be that you'd want a 60 amp breaker and a 50 amp range receptacle.
Current code calls for a 4-wire cable; black, red, white and ground (bare or green).
The size of the conductors depends on the length of the cable run. #8 for up to about 50 ft, #6 for up to 100 ft.
I would remove as much of the unused cable as I had access to.
Place the receptacle at a height where it is most convenient.

    Bookmark   September 30, 2009 at 7:15AM
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joed

You can't use either of those cables. You need a four wire(red, black, white, ground) feed for the stove.
Usually #8 on a 40 amp circuit is enough. Occasionally if you have a larger stove #6 on a 50 amp circuit is required.

    Bookmark   September 30, 2009 at 7:58AM
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brickeyee

"Current code calls for a 4-wire cable; black, red, white and ground (bare or green). "

Older 3 wire installations are grandfathered.

Stoves and dryers usually come with instructions for either 3-wire or 4-wire installation.

    Bookmark   September 30, 2009 at 12:57PM
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normel

You could use the old oven wiring with a 3-wire installation, but only if it is used as is.... no relocation or extending. Any change you make has to be brought up to current code, which would be 4 wires as others have pointed out. Depending on the manufacturers requirements, you would need either 8/3w/g and a 40A breaker or 6/3w/g and a 50A breaker. In either case a 50A receptacle would be required.

    Bookmark   September 30, 2009 at 3:17PM
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scotts_2009

Thanks for the responses. I have a few follow up questions.

Please let me know if what I am proposing to do is correct.

I will be adding to (extending) the current three wire connection that was used for the double oven. I am planning on running the current wiring into a junction box and add the new 8/3/w/g wire (4 wires) to it using wire nuts/caps. (or do I have to run new wire from the breaker?)

If it is ok to attach the new wire to the old wire in a junction box, is it ok to ground the green wire to the junction box (with a screw)? (what is the proper way to ground the green wire?)

I am also planning on using the 50A receptacle and place it 3 inches from floor... there seems to be a nice big open area there on the back of the stove.

Is it ok to use the same 45 amp breaker or should I replace it with 40 or 50 amp breaker?

Thanks!

    Bookmark   October 1, 2009 at 12:41AM
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samneric

I will be adding to (extending) the current three wire connection that was used for the double oven.

You cannot extend this circuit. Read normels's post above.

    Bookmark   October 1, 2009 at 6:37AM
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brickeyee

The grandfathering goes away as soon as you modify the branch circuit and a new 4-wire circuit must be run.

    Bookmark   October 1, 2009 at 9:37AM
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scotts_2009

Thanks for the information.. I know understand what needs to be done.

I am going to have to run a new 4-wire circuit from the main electrical breaker box. I am not sure the exact distance so I will use 6/3w/g wire with a 50A double breaker.

Since this electrical box is from before the time when a Green ground wire was required what is the correct way to wire it inside of the electrical box?

Just to make sure I am doing it correctly (let me know if this is incorrect)... I am going to match the wires colors and replace then inside the box. Black to black, red to red, white to white...

Where do I attach the green ground wire to?

Thanks, you guys are a great help.

    Bookmark   October 1, 2009 at 12:01PM
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Ron Natalie

Which box are you talking about. The green/bare wire gets connected to the corresponding green/bare from the stove. If the box is metal, you also connect it to the box (via a tapped screw or other listed device) and then at the main panel it gets connected to where all the other grounds are. There's a strong possibility that the grounded (neutral / white) conductors and the grounding (bare/green) conductors all connect to the same bus there. That's fine if that's the main house disconnect.

    Bookmark   October 1, 2009 at 3:21PM
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scotts_2009

I am referring to the main electrical panel where the breakers are.

Do I need to connect the green wire to both the metal junction box and run it back to the bus in the electrical box? I understand that I need to take the green wire from the stove back to the bus in the electrical panel box... but since I have a metal junction box (and metal studs) do I have to connect the green wire to the junction box as well?

In your reply it seems like i need to both the junction box AND the main panel.. I just want to double check to make sure this is the correct way to do it.

Thanks.

    Bookmark   October 4, 2009 at 9:55PM
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Ron Natalie

Everthing metal that has electrical wires in it needs to be connected to the ground system somehow (the ground wire for the circuit that passes through it is the common way).

    Bookmark   October 5, 2009 at 7:07AM
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scotts_2009

Thanks.

I got cable it is 6/3/w/g ... it is has four wires a black, red, white and green. I noticed that each wire is made up of a group of wires that are bundled together. So for the black wire it is actually a bunch of smaller wires (they look like copper wires) on the inside and on the outside it is black.

Is it ok that each of the wires (red, black, white, green) are made up of smaller wires? or should each one of the 6/3 be a single thick solid wire? (for my 12/2 cable, each wire is a single wire not a group of smaller wires together to form each wire.)

    Bookmark   October 6, 2009 at 5:19PM
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bus_driver

The conductors are called stranded. Solid conductors larger than #10 cabled together do not handle well during installation.

    Bookmark   October 6, 2009 at 6:57PM
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scotts_2009

Thanks eveyone for the all the help I have the wiring moved and ready for the stove.

Is it ok to use a 45 amp breaker in place of a 50 amp breaker? The range/stove says to use a 50 amp breaker but I cannot find one for the electrical panel (the electical panel was installed in 1980).

    Bookmark   October 27, 2009 at 9:43AM
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dave777_2009

Yes & No.

The 45amp would be tripping a lot... Hard on the breaker, and hard on cooking.

The 50 is probably available (for your box). Need to go to electrical supply house. Like GreyBar Electric.

Or Petey posted a link for someone else recently. You might try here...

Here is a link that might be useful: Breakers

    Bookmark   October 27, 2009 at 12:40PM
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