?'s about friends of the opposite sex

doodlebooMay 15, 2009

Ok, so 'm just looking for some honest opinions here. I know this isn't step family related at all but I trust your judgement so here it goes.....

J has made a friend with a woman who owns a local shop. They were both raised Jewish and are now converted christians so they have alot in common culturally. They are close in age and this woman seems to be a nice, christian lady.

Heres the rub. He has been stopping in at her thrift shop two to three times a week. He mowed her grass for her a couple days ago even. Now don not get me wrong, I don't think J is interestd in this woman sexually. She is nice but not good looking in the least. It's not a jealousy thing. The thing is she is going through a divorce.

I have told J he is playing with fire being a handy man to a woman in the middle of a divorce. Even the most christian, good hearted person can get wrapped up in the emotions and get "clingy". I have told him I don't like him putting himself in this position.

He just got angry at me and told me I was being ridiculous. He accused me of not trusting him. When I tried to explain that it isn't really a trust issue so much as I just don't feel it's appropriate he just made some ridiculous comment that he is just going to stop talking to anyone but me and save himself the trouble.

I am just uneasy with my husband being another womans emotional outlet/handy man. I don't care how ugly she is. I don't care how religious she is, I don't care if it is or is not sexual. I just feel like her divorce details/finanancial woes are not his concern and he is setting himself up for an embarrassing situation. Not to mention how pissed I'd be considering I warned him.

Am I wrong here. How would you ladies feel if your man started hanging out with another woman all the sudden. Say you KNEW he had no feelings for her but you questioned her motives. Would you feel this way too or am I really being stupid? Wouldn't it stand to reason that if it really is nothing then it shouldn't be a problem for him to cut the visits down?

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It would make me uncomfortable. Especially in her vunerable state of going through a divorce.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 2:50PM
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"Especially in her vunerable state of going through a divorce."

I think this is what is making me so uncomfortanle Mom2. I feel like she is needing a mans companionship and I don't feel like sharing. Even if it is innocent on J's side I think she is emotionally latching onto him and I don't like it at all. She is on a rebound and we all know how those go. I also strongly believe in emotional cheating.

The way I'm looking at it is J has his friggin plate FULL right now. Hello? Court, Crazy BM, JOB HUNTING!!!! He has business AT HOME he needs to be focusing on. He doesn't have time to "hang out" with anyone, especially not a female (very recent) divorcee.

Of course when I expressed concern I was being a petty girl:(

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 2:59PM
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I think I would just leave it at, as you said, he'd got his plate full, and has to worry about his own family.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 3:04PM
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Thank you very much KKNY. That's kindof how I feel about the entire situation but it's been turned into the "You don't trust me" debate. BALK!

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 3:10PM
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I wouldn't like it and who would? Unless of course both of you become friends with this woman as well. Like she comes to your house hang out wiht both of you, but if it is just him then it is inappropriate. taking in consideration that he also spent time chatting wiht women on facebook, i would suggest it is something he likes to do like having female friends/emotional outlet outside of his family. He has 3 children and a wife. he needs friends (we all do) why not men? Why women?

now completely different topic i am not sure why would you emphasize "even the most christian person", "nice christian lady" like what if she wouldn't be Christian would you be more suspicious or just being Christian makes her that nice. As about having a lot of cultural similarities, well it is not good enough reason in his case.

My X left his common law wife of 10 years for a woman (his current wife) he was friends with and had emotional affair. His long term GF/common law wife said: "they were just friends, I never expected that to happen". Well they were friends until emotional affair grew into something else over the years.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 3:39PM
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This goes back to my problem with my DH and the Ex-Girlfriend he was having phone calls with. NO you do not want your husband having friendships with other women. My case she was an ex girlfriend who is single and was calling regularly and talking to Hubby. He maintains that after they broke up they were just friends and I had nothing to worry about. He also didn't let me know when she called. The whole thing was never sexual after they broke up but he was leaning on her emotionally and that is what this sounds like too. Search EMOTIONAL AFFAIR and see what you find. It can be a deal breaker in your marriage.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 3:53PM
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When my DH makes a "girl" friend, usually through work or one of his guy friend's girlfriends, he tells me about her, then either brings her home/invites her out/schedules something so that the two of us can meet. Usually she and I become good friends. Same with me and "boy" friends. We share our friends.

He should not be mowing her lawn, or fixing her plumbing. Not unless she is a very good friend of the family. And not if his home chores are being neglected. You need to get out Doodle. Get out, go to the mall, go out to eat with some girlfriends, do something that makes you feel like you again. Go get your hair done. Something.

I don't want to spend my spare time talking to other men. If I'm talking to a man, other than my husband, it's my dad. I want to share my life with my husband. And he feels the same. The question is what isn't being fulfilled in J's life that he's seeking this outside recognition of his manliness?

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 3:53PM
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Finedreams- The reason why I emphasized it so was it was one of the excuses he kept using to prove his point of how ridiculous I am.

He said "You are being absurd. She is not interested in me...she's in love with Jesus" HAHAHAHA. That sounds like a line out of a COhen Brothers film.

At that point in the converstion I was so mad and frustrated that I replied "Hitler was a christian too. At least he TOLD everybody he was and in his brain he was doing GODS WORK!" I'm not buying the being a christian makes her exempt from human error. I'm not that naive.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:00PM
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"what isn't being fulfilled in J's life that he's seeking this outside recognition of his manliness?"

Well that's just it! It totally denies that it has anything to do with any kindof sexxu attraction to her. I do believe him because ,not to sound mean, the woman is very VERY homely.

I'm having trouble making him see why I feel the way I feel because he is adament that she is just a real nice CHRISTIAN lady going through a real ruff path and he just wants more CHRISTIAN friends and blah blah blah. He even thinks helping her is what GOD wants him to do. He felt the URGE to cut her grass like it was Gods work. How the hell do you argue with that?

I'm not saying God wouldn't want us to help out our fellow man but I doubt he would want it at the expense of a marriage having problems! It's not causing serious problems but it is deffinatly irking me...even more so now that he as fluffed it off and called me petty. He can be so damned sarcastic sometimes and it drives me nuts! I think that is what has really set me off. It's the way he treated me like a baby over it.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:09PM
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Dang..sounds like my husband! when i say i dont like it..its oh you dont trust me! blaaaaaaaah!
Some men are just suckers!
You know, your J doens't have to go 3 times in one week. I know he's probalby worried about her and feels he can help her cause he went through it...BUT i think he can cool it off a bit cause if her recent ex hubby accuses him of having an affair, it wont look pretty!
How about you keeping him busy so he dosn thave too much time to do things for her. ????
For now, let it go, cool off but then plan things and get J booked up!
My hubby did something similar last year and his 'friend' was sleeping over alot...i told him after a few months (everyweekend!) i had enough and i want privacy on my weekends for my marriage and a third wheel wans't helping!

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:09PM
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EEEEWWWW. He had her sleeping over with you guys?! Yuck! I don't blame you one little bit for nixing that. I would flog J if invited her to stay with us. He mentioned she may be getting kicked out of her apartment. I hope he wasn't getting any ideas........


    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:12PM
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I might be tempted to ask him if it's okay for you to hang out with a guy from work that's going through a divorce... maybe stop by a couple of evenings a week to fix him dinner, poor guy doesn't have a wife to do it for him...etc.

See how he likes THAT.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:27PM
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Precisely IMA

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:29PM
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He see's this woman at her BUSINESS. He has never gone to her home. The grass he cut was her store front. The first time he met this woman we were together. We stopped into her store to browse and they hit it off because of their Jewish roots.

He is wanting us to go to this womans church now. OH! And she happened to move into our old apartment building when her and her husband seperated so when he was moving he always chattered with her at the apartments. She is just popping up to much for comfort. J looks at is as some kindof sign. I look at it as just plain freaking annoying.

She saiidshe'd pay him to move some furniture at her store tomorrow and as much as we need the money I'd really rather him not. He told me I'm going to be the one to tell her he can't help her when she calls tomorrow just to be condensending.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 4:50PM
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"the woman is very VERY homely."

looks mean nothing. I wouldn't put too much weight on that. when I first saw my SO's Xwife I thought "poor woman, what years did to her!" But then I looked at her pics at young age including casual pics and pics where you suppose to be all made up, like wedding etc, she is a VERY ugly woman. I don't say it just to to be mean, she is a very unattractive woman, she looks like a man, a big man. Yet he married her, was in love and lived wiht her for 27 more years. More so X left him for TOM (TOM is very old and ugly himself but still he found her attractive). So the fact that she is unattractive means nothing. Love is blind.

Not to say your DH is attracted to this woman, he is not, but it doesn't mean that looks prevent guys from falling for women. I know plenty of nice looking men who have scary looking wives or girlfriends.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 5:24PM
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"She is just popping up to much for comfort. J looks at is as some kindof sign."

Yeah - I'd see a sign too. She's popping up where he'll be. (Remember doing that in 7th grade?)

I'd also be uncomfortable and annoyed, and phrasing your concern as a "Of course I trust you -- It's her I'm unsure about. She's just in a messed up place right now where it would be easy for her to mistake kindness and Christian goodness for something more."

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 5:41PM
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If she loses her apt. and moves near you I would be worried!

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 5:57PM
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"He felt the URGE to cut her grass like it was Gods work. How the hell do you argue with that? "

Ok, seriously, that had me rolling! I about died laughing!

As far as the original topic...NO, I would not like it, I would feel the same way you do. And my dumb@$$ DH would probably have the same "don't you trust me" answer, as well.


I don't blame you for being irritated. I think with J your strongest point is going to be that he already has plenty of obligations at home--you, the girls, Layla, looking for a job, etc. His FAMILY needs to come first.

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 6:08PM
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I would not be alright with my dh suddenly making friends with a woman. Acquaintances is fine. Say hi to her when you have a real purpose to go into her store. Say hi if you run into her in public.

But when he has a newborn at home and two girls who are going through he** over their mother right now he has no business making new friends and going and doing things for them. His place is with his family.

Is he working yet?

If not this could be dangerous. He could be feeling low about himself for not working and this woman is finding things for him to do and making him feel important. They have a common bond (religion) and are becoming friends. This could end up being the beginning of an emotional affair that could end in him and her doing things they can not take back and will affect your lives forever.

His talking to woman on the computer and then this gives me warning bells. Be careful!

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 6:12PM
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I would tell him that the next time he wants to stop by her shop or anything that you would like to tag along, that way you can gauge for yourself....if thing feel really uncomfortable, than I think you might have something to worry about, but if all goes well, and the woman is friendly and relaxed towards you and you dont feel uncomfortable than I don't think you have anything to worry about.......IF he was interested in this lady he is in no way going to want you to go hang out with them...........
and the person who said looks don't matter was exactly right!! I have seen some of my DH's X's and it was pretty bad....the way he explained it to me (and please no one get offended was that "sometimes...a hole is a hole" KWIM?

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 8:57PM
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Fill up his time!!! book things and just tell him next time with her..or how about this!! ?? WHy dont you help a few times as a team. Lets see if this homely woman will liek that???? I wonder if she's get uncomfortable with you around...lol....
yah men have this idea' i'll fix it! i'm a man!..i'm here to save the day!!!'
oh brother!

yes i had mine sleep on weekends..after 4 months i ripped a hole into him! i know how he felt , i felt sorry for her too..she got evicted. and didnt' want to always sleep at her sister house etc.e.tc..but every damn weekend over at my house. Like her...i do..but way too close! and then all the sudden my husband started to sit onthe couch withher.....and they would have talks as well....then the sexual jokes would come up....which did not blow over well with me..
oh yah, heres the kicker. I got pist...so i invited my old bo over....lol..i mimmicked exactly what he'ld do with his female friend. My friend and i also spoke and he said she wants him....so he helped me out...within one week she was out! eheheheheheh........yah......yup...i can tell you stories with this girl. Calling every fridya...saturday pm showing up, falling asleep onthe couch...lol...i have to laugh...
Keep on eye on J. He's in a stressful situation and yes he needs to prove his manly hood. ...

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 9:00PM
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I would NOT be happy. And of course you are made out to be the bad guy when you tell him your concerns. I see that as a manipulative move, for him to throw it back at you with the'don't you trust me?' question. It focuses attention on you and you end up defending yourself, but the issue is not with you, it's with him and that is where the focus should stay. I would tell him it's not trust that's the issue, it's priorities. You trust him but you need him to be there for you and the baby/girls, and it hurts when he spends precious time with somebody else. If it was a bloke and he was helping him fix up an old car and he'd spend 3 nights a week overthere you'd also be hurt that he gave that priority. And then it wouldn't be a trust-issue but you'd still be equally upset. Maybe put it to him like that
and see if that gets him thinking.
(Having said that of course we all know that IT IS more annoying for him to have a female friend who's trying to suck him in 'emotinally', grrrrr...)I'm just trying to give you a good argument Doodle, so that when you put it to J he will not be able to play the 'trust'card.

And I hate to say it but I also think "The question is what isn't being fulfilled in J's life that he's seeking elsewhere". It might be as simple as this being a replacement for a job. He's now contributing something outside the home, something like that.

And I actually don't get the "they have so much in common because of their religion". I'm a Dutchie that lives in Australia, and I don't hook up with other Dutch people when I come across them, just because we have so much in common. Our roots have nothing to do with our personalities! Anyway, maybe it is time to give him a bit of his own medicine and see how he likes it. Leave him home with the kids and go see that 'colleague' who really needs somebody to talk to :-)

    Bookmark   May 15, 2009 at 10:21PM
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Sweeby said exactly what I was thinking. It's not that you don't trust J, it's that you don't trust the other woman. She could well interpret J's kindnesses in a totally wrong way, and be very hurt when she realises he's not interested. Or worse, mortified if she makes some sort of move or remark that indicates to J that she thinks he's interested in her when he's not. That would be more unkind than to let her find someone else to be the handyman.

    Bookmark   May 17, 2009 at 7:11AM
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I'm about the least jealous person I know, I have no problems -none- with opposite sex friends, even including exes in the right circumstances, and I still think this would bother me. Like you said it's not about not trusting him, and she may not even have bad intentions, but she is in a vulnerable needy spot and if she starts to rely on him too much for emotional or practical support it is just too easy for feelings to develop and he could wind up in over his head in a situation he doesn't know how to handle. I think you are right he is playing with fire.

    Bookmark   May 17, 2009 at 11:29AM
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I'm a very trusting person too. Maybe I'm mixing up people, but I thought OP works full time and there are 3 small kids in the household and OP's spouse is not working. OP's husband needs to get his priorities in order. His kids need him to get a job. If he has time to do yard work, he should take out an add or crgislist and do it for $$ while he is looking for employment.

Looking for work in this economy isnt easy, imo. You get a lot of rejection. But I know OP is reassuring her DH that he is loved and will find things -- but right now, he needs to keep at it.

    Bookmark   May 17, 2009 at 11:36AM
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Honestly I know TOO many men who ended up involved wiht females who were JUST friends for a long time or just colleagues etc. It is very common, more common than people think. Real life examples are just too many. This woman needs J to fill the void and he needs her to fill the void, and needing each other is a bad combination. Plus it is more fun to hang out at her store than being around 3 litle chidlren and nagging wife.

YES KKNY OP works, two children are in school and a baby is watched by her mom, her DH doesn't work (or does very little). This alone is bad enough.

A friend of mine was on unemplyment for 6 months, ti expired, she works now as a cashier at Walgreens (she is an engineer), and someone else i know is currently wahsed windows. there are jobs

    Bookmark   May 17, 2009 at 1:25PM
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I agree it is more fun for DH to hang out with this woman than look for job, clean up and fix dinner at home, do odd jobs for $$.

If doodle and dh are active in church, perhaps doodle can talk to minister and ask him to remind dh that he has family responsiblies.

    Bookmark   May 17, 2009 at 1:36PM
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I hate it when married men do this kind of thing & we women (I'm as inclined to do it as anyone else is) blame the woman.

She's very fragile right now & she may be convinced *by the guy's behavior* that this guy just can't stay away from her, that instead of being "rejected", she's worthy of being pursued.

& men will do this kind of thing over & over & over, ignore their wives' wishes & requests, flatter the already-vulnerable woman, & when it all blows up in their faces, they act surprised & swear they had nothing to do with it, it was just crazy women getting all emotional & reading things into their perfectly innocent behavior...

Hubs is the responsible party here, but I don't know of any words or actions that will overpower the tremendous ego-rush that he's getting from being "fought over" by 2 women.

& it seems like men's likelihood of getting involved in this kind of thing is in inverse proportion to their success & self-image of the moment;

Hubs needs a job.
He has a family that includes a newborn.
He likely needs to take some expensive legal actions.
...& he may have a wife who's smarter than he is...

talk about stress!

You might try getting close to her yourself, maybe even getting her to help out with your family-going *with you* to run errands with the children, etc.

*Do Not* have her do anything without you.

Be where she is.

Have the kids with you.

& keep a sincerely friendly smile on your face & let her know you're on her side.

    Bookmark   May 17, 2009 at 2:44PM
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I am so GLAD that you ladies all feel the way I do. I was starting to think maybe I WAS just being insecure and jealous but it seems to be the general opinion that no one would dig this situation.

That being said heres the follow up. I went home that evening after we had our little row over the phone about this woman. I was bracing myself for a cold shoulder or comfrontation because I had been STRONG in some of the words I chose. LOL. Anyway, when I walk thru the door the house was nice and clean. Laundry was being done and dinner was already on the table. The girls had already bathed and a glass of tea was waiting for me at the coffee table by the couch where I always nurse Layla.

The conversation never came up. It was like it never happened. He was suppose to help her move furniture around her shop for some $ the next day but when she called he didn't even answer the phone. She called four times and left a message. He didn't even return her call. So I'm wondering what the hell clicked in that three hours between our conversation and me getting home. When I checked our shared cell phone I noticed he had called his dad after we hung up.

He had called his dad to b*tch about me and his dad must have agreed with me!!! HAHAHAHA. His dad must of said something to him that clicked. The conversation still hasn't come up but 50 bucks says he won't go to the shop anymore.

I do honestly believe he was only being friendly for someone he thought was a nice person having a hard time. He's like that. He is even MORE like that now because of his new found devotion to trying to be a better Christian. He has turned to faith because his situation with work has him feeling beat down. He is looking for guidance and some hope. He prays alot and reads a bible where as he never did before. He gets us all out the door to church every Sunday and bugs me to pray and read my bible as well.

It wasn't him I didn't trust...it was her. If the situation had been a little different I wouldn't of had the issue I had with it. Of course he didn't want to validate my concerns which only pissed me off more. Apparently hearing it from Dad was enough to make him rethink the situation a little bit. I wish I knew exactly what was said.

As far as the work issue, he has passed out tons of appliations and resumes this past three months and has gone to Workforce I KNOW at least a dozen times. Nowhere is hiring. It's just plain scary. He is feeling very much so like a loser right now and has expressed this to me many times. His self esteem is extremely low. DO I think this is why he was helping this woman so much? No. I think he feels if he strives to be more godly than he will be more open to gods hand stearing him in the direction he wants him to go.

He was wanting to help out another Christian and in the process wasn't thinking of all the factors involved. He isn't a bad guy looking to get laid. Just a good guy who doesn't realize that some women can not just be friends with a man or sometimes the risk just isn't worth it.

It was the same thing with the computer. He honeslty felt that he was just friends with all these old aquintances. He didn't see it any different than talking to the old guy friends from High School. It just never accured to him how messy things like that can get. It can go from friendly and innocent to complicated in the matter of one typed sentence.

He has a bad case of the male ding bat syndrome. A woman could straight up standing in front of him batting her eyelashes and wearing I ighn that read "I WANT YOU SLEEP WITH YOU" while wearing nothing but a ball cap and he would just "She was nice don't you think?" He is just that oblivious. He can't see underlying intentions untill they have smacked him dead in the face. In the case it would be he wouldn't see it untill a friendship had turned into something else. By then it's too late. If you love your family you don't leave yourself open for these things to even have a CHANCE of happening. You avoid the situation all together which seems to be what he has decided to do....THANK GOD!

    Bookmark   May 18, 2009 at 11:28AM
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His dad!

Of course!

Man-to-man stuff is the best!

(They actually hear each other; that testosterone-induced deafness so often seems to strike only when the speaker is female...)

I don't think anyone thought he was a bad guy looking to get laid;
it's just that the situation is so flattering, having a woman who is *not* part of his ("his" meaning guys in general) day-to-day reality relying on him.

sending good thoughts for the perfect job.

    Bookmark   May 18, 2009 at 2:15PM
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great news! thanks to dad LOL i bet you he called to complain but dad said: what are you thinking? and the fact that woman called 4 times says it all, she was onto somehting. I am glad J got rid of her, hope it si for good.

    Bookmark   May 18, 2009 at 3:29PM
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"i bet you he called to complain but dad said: what are you thinking?"

That is precisely what happened. HAHAHAHAHAHAA. Thank God for dad:)

    Bookmark   May 18, 2009 at 4:19PM
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Yay Dad!
Just goes to prove that while they might be slow learners, they can be taught! ;-)

    Bookmark   May 18, 2009 at 6:49PM
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Great news !

    Bookmark   May 18, 2009 at 6:54PM
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Well here is to hoping it turned out all good like you say.

There is such a thing as getting emotionally involved with someone, and not having it be sexual.

Men, will take sh*t like that to the grave though, before they ever admit to anything. But you know. A woman knows.

You trust your gut.

There is no such thing as a woman friend that the wife isn't also friends with. No such thing.

Big ole red flags to me when he is getting all defensive about the situation too. Guilt points a finger at someone else. It was you who didn't trust him, as he accused. There is no need to be defensive if you are not guilty, not to the extreme like he did.
When I think about my dh talking to other woman at work or wherever, and I say something offhand to him about it, he is normally nonchalant and teasing about his response, like its cute that I am jealous or whatever. Not launching into the defensive like I just accused him of sleeping with someone else.

So I would keep this info tucked into the back of your mind at least. Men are kinda funny about things like that, and looks don't matter when they are getting some little need met, even if it is something as minimal as feeling needed for handyman work. They are getting something out of it, otherwise they just wouldn't go and do those things like mowing lawns twice a week or whatever....I mean come on. lol They do it because there is a payback of some sort. Be it minimal or not. It is something.
I wouldn't be hearing no excuse like "I had an URGE...." he has an urge all right, but wasn't for mowing the lawn...well....okay nevermind won't even go there lol.

Seriously though, your gut was telling you something was up...listen to it....instincts about this are seldom wrong. You can try and tell yourself it isn't jealousy or she is ugly, whatever...but it doesn't change the fact that you had a gut instinct that the situation was sketchy. From what you told us, it does sound a bit like something was going on, and like I said, it doesn't always have to be sexual. Emotional affairs happen too. They can be just as devastating.

    Bookmark   May 20, 2009 at 3:53PM
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Oprah just had a segment on having an emotional affair... and what it means for a marriage. It's a pretty good read.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2009 at 10:53AM
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Yep, thats what I'm saying, and most people who do it, do not consider it an affair or anything close to it because they are "not having sex". But there is a reason why they get so defensive of the relationship that they are emotionally involved in. They want to preserve it, and deep down they know they are wrong. Because they can feel that form of infidelity too.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2009 at 11:01AM
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With 3 small kids and no job, this guy should be out looking for work or taking temp work. He doesnt have time for any type of affair, emotional or otherwise.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2009 at 11:34AM
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