Discussion on type of paint to use and primer?

desertstephNovember 18, 2010

have we had one recently? in the last yr at least?

i know many of you have painted... I KNOW that. and now I wanna KNOW more about it! what type? brand? good and bad of it? primer?

i need to buy some soon. real soon, and haven't a clue. I used to buy Sears paint in Autumn wheat I think it was...

I want Navajo White mostly this time around. it's by Behr but I think I can get it made up in another brand if Behr isn't good. recently read about it coming off the walls. will ask my sister about that as they used Behr...

want other opinions too tho.

I'd like to wash down and get the closets / pantry done this coming week so I have a place to put things that is clean and I won't have to keep moving the 'stuff' around to paint wherever 'stuff' is temporarily housed.

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Steph, I've used Behr for everything on the last five houses I've painted, and no problems.

If there is a bad surface that needs a special primer, they have a KILZ primer that is supposed to cover up stuff. It comes either as an alkyd base or a water base paint. I used the alkyd base in the bathrooms at the advice of our contractor. It was new surface, not knotty wood, and not mildew and such. After you prime with that, you are still free to use a latex or alkyd top coat.

I know Behr says their new fancy PLUS paint does not require a primer, but I use a primer anyway. To me, I can SEE the thinness of the paint coat, and I like it to look like it has some SUBSTANCE to it.

DH used the Navaho White by Behr in a couple of his rooms, and it was a nice off white. However, he did EVERYTHING that paint, and I wanted to accent the wood trim and the fancy molding. It took more time to do that, but even he admits it looks quite nice.

My favorite woodwork white is Behr ULTRAPURE WHITE latex and it can be either satin or semigloss. Semigloss is much more washable. They make a LATEX ENAMEL in their paints too, and I never never buy anything that is simple FLAT LATEX now, it is LATEX ENAMEL and could be flat with a bit more washability, but eggshell is the next step up.

I've even put semigloss white on the ceiling, and the sheen of it makes the room look bigger somehow. I NEVER buy what they call "ceiling paint." Now if you want it to have a bit of color to it, put a few drops of your wall color into the white and mix very well. You'd be quite surprised at how even a hint of color comes through.

And if you get the sample jars, they are 8 ounces, and always flat paint. If you are looking for soft colors, they always look darker than the sample.

About using a roller or a brush. I use a brush for the woodwork and to cut in at the edges etc. But I love those tiny diameter rollers with a 30-36" handle. Or longer if you like. I never get a fat roller. They make a mess.

    Bookmark   November 18, 2010 at 5:01PM
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thx moccasin! I couldn't imagine my sister not saying something to me if it was flaking off (unless she hasn't noticed it...) in the 2 yrs they've been in that house. maybe 3 by now.

I'm gonna do my bdrm/bath in other colors...and maybe a wall in the laundry and craft/storage room - just for fun. otherwise, i really like the NW and figure it'll look good with everything and add to the light.

I'm sure I'll get a looong handle for my roller. I think the thick rollers are for textured walls - which I have. slightly anyway. I'll have to think about what level of 'fluff' I should use - lol! maybe they'll know at the store.

I agree on putting the primer on also - I haven't read good reviews on the 'paint 'n primer' in one. I don't have anything really bad on the walls to cover up. It should all come off with a good washing. I'll probably still think they are dirty!

there'll be some patching of course. well, lots of it I think.

that'll be painting each room 2x but most rooms have so many doorways and windows it shouldn't be too bad. I don't think there's a lot of trim work. what is there looks like it just needs replaced anyway.

I hadn't thought about what to paint the ceilings. geeze, so many decisions! lol! maybe I'll give them a good dusting and not prime 'em. I'll need someone taller than i am to paint those!

I think I should go with semi-gloss in the laundry, pantry, closets and the shelves. what do you think? I doubt I'll be washing down the closets but IF I would want to, I could easily then. The pantry might need some washing down now and again.

i never use flat paint - don't like it. Maybe I'll use eggshell in the other rooms.

    Bookmark   November 18, 2010 at 7:21PM
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Hi Steph, I've used Behr paint a lot in the past too, and have never had an issue with it. I agree that primer is very important if there's a problem with the wall. IMO the best primer for those problem areas (rust, knots, stains etc) is a Zinsser primer called Bullseye.

If paint is coming off the walls - I'd guess that maybe dust etc wasn't cleaned off properly prior to painting. Drywall dust is so invasive and can cause major paint issues.

I like flat paint for ceilings - I've painted many popcorn type ceilings in the past - it's not difficult if you have a good roller - just messy! Ceiling paint is good, especially for popcorn ceilings that have never been painted before.

I like an eggshell or semi gloss for walls. I do not like flat for walls. The reason builders use it is it hides any imperfections in the wall finish but is shows fingerprints and scuff marks terribly!

Good for you for investing in a long handled roller. I use an 'extendo' handle on my rollers. It's great for all the rolling I do. It makes walls wayyyyyy easier to paint. The handle twists and then extends, and then locks in place.

My extendo handle

Here is a link that might be useful: Bullseye primer

    Bookmark   November 18, 2010 at 8:48PM
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ML I have a question about your reply.

"and I never never buy anything that is simple FLAT LATEX now, it is LATEX ENAMEL and could be flat with a bit more washability, but eggshell is the next step up."

Do you mean you do use the enamel and it comes in different textures of semigloss and egg shell, super shiny?


    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 12:30AM
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Ok, hmmm, well, LATEX ENAMEL is a water based enamel. It has more durability than plain LATEX. While LATEX and LATEX ENAMEL both come in a flat finish, the LATEX ENAMEL flat version is a bit more washable. It is not my choice at all. I do not buy anything FLAT these days.

The LATEX ENAMEL might not be as durable as the ALKYD ENAMEL (dilute with mineral spirits and not water), but it is a whole lot easier to apply, and dries much faster, just like the plain old LATEX. So I get the LATEX ENAMEL. I like a brighter shine on my woodwork, so I get the LATEX ENAMEL SEMIGLOSS for the woodwork. Then for the walls I get the eggshell or satin, which is softer but not flat.
If you know you plan to put several coats of paint on a surface, you can also make the first TOP COAT (after priming which is always important) a higher gloss paint, which is the most durable paint. Then your final top coat can be the eggshell or satin to bring down the shine.

And like PrairieGirl says, the Zinnser Bullseye is a great paint. I never remember from one time to the next what paint I use for a primer! But Kilz and Zinnser are the two I see most on store shelves. And I have an Extendo handle also. It fits the little diameter rollers as well as the big boys.

And Steph, when I painted my mother's house several years ago, I had so much nicotine on the walls that I had a hell of a time covering it. She smoked 3 packs a day. It took two coats of primer, and then 3 top coats to get it looking white again. I was totally exhausted when I finished. I do not think you'll have that much trouble. It was this experience with so many coats of paint that showed me there is an obvious difference in the DEPTH the paint gives to a wall.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 12:43PM
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moccasin - wow - 5 coats to cover you mother's walls! ugh.
I did scan the walls/ceiling for signs of nicotine. didn't see any - just some pretty dirty walls. having raised 4 kids I have never seen walls as dirty as some in this place. especially the hallway!

    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 1:33PM
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So my painting knowledge has multiplied by about a factor of 100 over the last month or so as I'm doing most of the painting for our renovation. I've painted almost every surface you can imagine, and fortunately the professional painter we hired for the ceilings has been so nice about giving me tips and suggestions.

On the subject of brand of paint: Everyone seems to have their favorite and if you have one, then stick with it. I prefer Benjamin Moore or Sherwin Williams. I used to use Behr but once I used BM I never looked back. I sometimes use SW because they have coupons in the paper.

My go-to paint is Benjamin Moore Aura. I like matte for walls and satin for woodwork/trim but that's totally a personal preference thing. Make sure you read the directions for the paint you're buying. For instance, with Aura, when you cut in, you want to cut in, let it dry completely, then roll in. This is different from most paints which want you to keep a wet edge on the cutting in.

On priming: I don't care what a paint claims. I prime. I'd rather spend a few extra buck and a little extra time to ensure that it will be a good job that lasts than have to redo it in two years.

On cleaning: Buy a product called Dirtex at the hardware store to clean whatever you need to. It's perfect for cleaning before painting.

And my last tip: by really good brushes. I've got a set of Omega brushes now that cost about $28/each. I take good care of them and they are amazing. Worth every penny. And certainly a money saver as I would have purchased many lesser brushes by now.

Oh, and on the paint matching. I got a BM color mixed in SW paint a couple weeks ago. For some reason I thought all these companies had each other's formulas in their computers, but that was not the case. They ended up scanning the color chip and matching it from that and it took three tries with it. That was a little worrisome for me. If you REALLY love a Behr color and you want it to be exactly that color, I'd probably use Behr paint.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 3:43PM
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Quick note on primers. First of all, all the pro painters on the paint forum hate Kilz and say they won't touch it with a 10-foot pole.

For most applications there is a primer that is best suited to your situation. I have four different kinds of primer in my house right now and I use them all regularly.

It sort of depends on what you're painting. If it's something that has been painted with oil-based paint, you want to use an oil-based primer (I like BM's Fresh Start in both the oil and water-based formulas). After that you can paint with either oil or water based paint.

If you KNOW it's water-based paint that you're painting over, then you can use a water-based primer.

If you have to seal knots you want to use Zinnser BIN. It's a shellac primer. It's stinky, difficult to work with and a b*%$@ to clean up, but it works. I spot prime knots with it using a throw-away foam brush, then prime over with whatever else I'm priming with.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 3:54PM
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Thanks for the break down ML. I do appreciate it. I am not really ready to dive into painting right away. Will not be long though.

Your walls always look so nice. Very happy you shared your secrets.I am still considering Lorettas two tone paint and need to make up my mind before I have to do another room over.


    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 4:11PM
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thx for the good tips wi-sailorgirl!

i'm starting with the closets and pantry so if Behr seems to be a problem paint, I can switch before doing the walls. I'll be doing the closets in semi-gloss anyway I think. I haven't painted in about 27 yrs - that I can remember.

does Behr have a major paint smell? that might do me in...

    Bookmark   November 19, 2010 at 4:46PM
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