What is the Point - Saving for Retirement?

cathie54June 24, 2006

Unless you are a multi-millionaire?

We hear about it all the time on the news. We are urged to save - save - save for "retirement".

I don't get it.

By the time one is old enough to retire, MANY have health conditions that wipe them out! Physically and financially!

They are not "Spring Chickens" anymore, so many can't even enjoy travel - or even simple pleasures in life.

The fact is that once the medical and drugs have exhusted your retirement funds (and they will), one cannot get any help until they've wiped out your entire liquid assets.

So far...they cannot take your home. One is still allowed to have one car, and I'm not sure today, but used to be $2000 or less "cash" per person or $3000 max/couple? (I think it went up to about $4000.00/couple max - not sure.)

Doesn't matter. I have been asked MY assets when I was younger and my son got leukemia. I was asked if I had any kinds of INSURANCE policies. (I'm sure they would have commanded me to cash those out, IF I had any.)

I just don't get it.

Exactly HOW much should one "SAVE" for retirement?

And WHY?

So you can pay a little longer out of your pocket?

Stretch the pain of exhausting all your hard earnings/savings out - thus prolonging the inevitable stress?

Add in inflation. Add in the rising cost of insurance and decreased coverage. Add in the cost of medical- whether it be simple office visits, or meds, or paying for that fancy new machine.

As someone said in so many words - they are banking on the baby-boomers to become ILL, for THEIR future livelihood.

Now, someone please set me straight on this big issue of "saving for retirement" please :)

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Maybe you'd be interested in reading the discussion at a thread entitled something like, "Should my husband retire at 55" that's been around here for a time.

I made a contribution there that might interest you.

Yes - some get sick previous to retirement, or shortly after. Or die.

But - more people are living longer, these days (in your country and mine, and in most of Europe) than ever before.

And many of them are running around in RVs, seeing and doing a lot of things that they've wanted to do for years.

Having a ball - that costs a substantial amount of money.

Ask them if they'd rather be sitting at home, eating turnips due to nil bank account, and they'll look at you ... and laugh.

I'm 77. Enjoying good health - haven't taken a pill in 30 years, I think.

And I live in Canada, where many (but a diminishing number) of medical and hospital services, are available without a direct fee.

While I live frugally, I'm pleased that I have the assets necessary to do what I choose: thankful not to need to count every penny.

And our country has many more services available than yours.

Choose your route - spend now ... or have the freedom to spend later, rather than being strapped.

Good wishes for many happy, healthy, wise and prosperous years.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   June 24, 2006 at 3:16PM
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stepped up basis: Okay, let's say your mom bought Microsoft for $5 a share back in 1981 and now it is worth $500 a share. It she sold her stock, she would have to pay taxes on the $495.00 gain. If instead, you inherit the stock when it is $500 a share, and sell it a month later for $510 a share, you would only owe taxes on the $10 because when you inherited, you got the stepped up basis - the value when you inherited. It works the same for houses and other assets as well.

    Bookmark   June 25, 2006 at 5:54PM
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well, that was a non-sequiter. I meant to be answering a different posting

    Bookmark   June 25, 2006 at 11:15PM
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Not everyone who is retired is in poor health. My mother is 82 and just started having poor health. Until now she was able to enjoy a lot of things and never worried about money because she had savings.

We might need to get someone to live with her and since she has savings she can afford it and not worry about going to a nursing home.

Having savings can make for a much more comfortable and happy retirement.

    Bookmark   July 3, 2006 at 11:46PM
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I've said for years that it makes sense for several older people to live together.

Much less costly than entering a retirement home, if they have only minimal need.

Helps keep one from being bored, letting one's brain go to seed, etc.: along the line of "use it ... or lose it".

Much lesss costly: housing and household costs are shared among several.

Less work: chores are shared.

Safer: if someone has a spell and needs help, others will know of it much more quickly, in many cases.

If one becomes partially dependent, other seniors in the home can help keep that person independent for longer, usually.

Many say that it won't work - that they'll fight. Over moving a chesterfield (O.K. - "sofa") 6", sort of thing.

Sure are some worthwhile advantages, though.

I spoke of the value of finding some folks in our community who might be helped by such and encouraging them to do it, in church last Sunday.

One issue: they'd all need to move into a different home. If they move into one person's home, s/he'll consider that s/he's the boss.

Have a great week, everyone. Enjoy your holiday today (July 4).

ole joyful

    Bookmark   July 4, 2006 at 3:19PM
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Chemocurl zn5b/6a Indiana

Well, I saved in my younger years, and was able to retire at age 48.

While I cannot afford to take lavish vacations often (which is just not my style anyway), I have enough to do and buy about everything I want/need.

I was fortunate to work 30 years for a big company, and retired with health and prescription benefits.

I've been enjoying the life of Riley for 7 years now. I feel secure in knowing I am secure.


    Bookmark   July 8, 2006 at 8:02AM
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Mainly you need a home free and clear and your debts paid off. To me that is as important as money in the bank. I did not want to change our life style. We saved a lot and it has paid off for us. My husband was able to afford his hobby and I can afford to travel. It has been better for me than my husband but that's the luck of the draw. He is 79 and just went into in a care home with alzheimer's. He has a private room and the division of assets has been done and I will be ok financially due to our savings and income.

    Bookmark   August 5, 2006 at 11:37PM
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well the truth is that it really depends on how you want to live...We never went without or set aside something we wanted to do but we worked hard at seeing that we had savings for when we retired...We bought and sold and invested with the idea of making money on each deal and now we are retired...our home is paid for...yes our financial planner said invest that money and do the mortgage thing...nope we like that it's paid for and we don't have to worry...We are not rich but we can just about do whatever we want to now and yet we still live rather modestly...It's nice to know though that we don't have to pinch any pennies...I go to the market and I buy whatever strikes my fancy and I figure I'll spend it instead of leaving it for my kids...if there is any left...they can have it but I didn't save my dollars for them...saving is really just to set yourself up for the future and the lifestyle you want...and the issue with health is as someone else said...the luck of the draw...My health care provider pays for my gym membership and we have over 100 senior citizens that are there every day exercising and participating in classes...People live longer and healthier these days...so unless you expect to have a whopping SS check or retirement fund...saving is the way to go...

    Bookmark   August 15, 2006 at 12:29PM
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Possibly you have no interest in leaving any of your assets to your offspring (and family solidarity plus the great possibility that our kids and grandkids may find life much less prosperous in future leads me to feel that I would prefer not to do that).

Possibly also you are not interested in supporting charitable enterprises - but it seems to me that in a society where the citizens value their freedom, there is a need for us to be responsible citizens, also, concerned for one aother. Plus thankful that we've enjoyed the good health that enabled us to enjoy prosperity, while others have been less fortunate and merit our assistance.

If so, your project is to arrange to have the date of your personal expiration on the date that your bank accounts have exactly the amounts left in them sufficient to pay your debts, including taxes, plus your funeral costs.

For most of us, that is a difficult situation to arrange, but there is one situation in which it can be taken care of ...

... if you choose to commit suicide.

Careful, though - if anyone asists you ...

... and get caught ...

... they'll go to jail.

Also, in some jurisdictions, if you try it, unsuccessfully ...

... you'll go to jail.

Hope you're enjoying your life, as it is today.

Plus, making some provisions for the future.

It's nice to have more than enough near the end of life, rather than being broke. And not physically, mentally or emotionally able to go to work to keep body and soul together comfortably.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   August 17, 2006 at 7:57PM
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Mind if I rant a little?

I'm in employee benefits and pensions. It wasn't long ago that you could work for a company for 10 years and retire with company paid medical coverage. Then the govt (USA) came up with regulations where you have to report the cost of retiree health plans on the company's income statement. Bye-bye company paid health care. Sure there's still some around, but not like it used to be.

Next came the pension plan (defined benefit) terminations. Every day I run cost projects for corporates who want to terminate their pension plans. It's just getting too expensive for them to keep them. Investments haven't been doing so well and govt regulations require companies to contribute more and more money to make up for poor investments. They just want it to stop. Bye-bye pension plans.

That leaves us with 401(k) plans (and 403(b), 457 plans depending where you work). These plans leave us at the mercy of the stock market and our own ability to choose investments wisely. Most people will not be netting the kind of benefits that the old defined benefit pension plans produced.

Also, some "people" in our govt want to change Social Security into a plan just like our 401(k) plans. [sigh]

What ever happened to our Three Legged Stool for retirement - Social Security, Company Pension, Personal Savings. Me thinks it's getting wobbly.

BTW, some people think a pension plan is their 401(k) plan. It is, but there is still an animal called the defined benefit pension plan. Unions will always have them.

I don't come to this forum very often. I have my own retirement to worry about. OYYY!

Thanks for letting me rant.

    Bookmark   August 22, 2006 at 4:34PM
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I'd rather die with a few bucks left in my pocket than without.

Have you talked to folks living on welfare?

That ain't no picnic.

That's for sure!

ole joyful

    Bookmark   August 30, 2006 at 6:10PM
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My Aunt saved every dime and lived like she never had a dime.She has a nice house and a load of money and no kids.Her husband died several years ago.Now she is in the early stages of Alzimers and is in a nursing home.The nursing home gets over $5000.00 per month.Yet there are many residents there that did not save and are on State Aid.They have the same quality of living offered to them that my Aunt does.Also many of them im sure paid until there money and property ran out.Many of them traveled and did every thing they wanted and could afford in life and did not pinch penneys.My Aunt saved and did without and her hobby was counting her money.So she can give it to a nursing home.That claims there just getting by.Maybe they are but my Aunt is paying for her self and the ones that have nothing also.Why?She might as well spent every dime and enjoyed life just like the ones on State Aid.Because there both living the same exact life style now.I never did see a U-Haul being pulled behind a hearse.I say live for today.Because when you get to that nursing home you will not know if your a paying customer anyway.

    Bookmark   September 14, 2006 at 12:38AM
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johndeere, you are "right on"! I look at some of these people like your Aunt and they are all alone because they have chosen to isolate themselves from anything "fun" or family and so they have amassed all this money for what??? I agree, my dh will retire at the age of 59 1/2 and I wouldn't dream of asking him to work any longer! He has worked SO HARD for the same company and it will be 33 years when he retires. We will be ok money wise but we are going to have FUN and even if we have to get jobs we will not do "without"!

    Bookmark   September 14, 2006 at 3:41PM
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Semms to me that there's a happy medium somewhere in between, that we aren't required to just follow one of these two paths or the other.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   September 26, 2006 at 6:31PM
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Chemocurl zn5b/6a Indiana

I saved and invested for my future. Some might say or think that I saved every dime. Well, I am in a home I had built 17 short years ago. It is paid for as well as the surrounding 40 acres. I go when and where I want and spend whatever I want.

Do I want or need an expensive new car? Probably not...I'd be upset if I ever had to haul one of my dogs in it. That plus the fact that they soon just turn into old 'used' cars anyway.
Do I want or need expensive high tech electronics, jewels, expensive clothes, shoes, and purses? No...didn't need any of that stuff b4 either.

I'd hate to think that I would ever have to try and survive on social security...cause survive it would be...maybe. It should wouldn't be 'living'.

Have you talked to folks living on welfare?

That ain't no picnic.

That's for sure!

I sure don't want to find out either.

There is a difference sometimes between a paying and a non paying nursing home resident, at least here in Indiana. If you are a paying resident, then you can have a private room. I hope I never have to do time in a home, but if I do, I at least want a private room with a window
to call my own.


    Bookmark   September 29, 2006 at 12:48AM
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Good post Sue

    Bookmark   September 29, 2006 at 4:00AM
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I can see your point also Sue.But for $5000.00 per month.If I had that kind of money.I would still have it all turned over to the kids before going into a home.So the nursing home did not get it.So there would go the private room and window.There just a room anyway.Basically a bed and a TV.I would be down at the activity room playing Bingo anyway.The room mate would be someone to talk to maybe?

The way I see it.I like driving new cars and I like the latest electronics.If im in a nursing home.More then likley I will not have my full mind.Money will be the least of my thoughts.I will more then likley forget what it is anyway?Life in a Nursing home would not be something I would want to spend money on.I feel I paid taxes all my life.Its the least my state can do for me.Might be a bad attitude and sounds like I feel someone owes me something.But that the way I feel about it.Sort of the way I feel about being a homeowner.Paying high property tax.Why?I often feel I should sell the place and just rent.Point being sometime your better off not having anything.

    Bookmark   September 30, 2006 at 11:56PM
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Is it good idea to spend up retirement money to try to assure that it does not get paid to a nursing home? I'm not so sure that nursing homes will continue to be paid for by our governments if one is indigent. Many people think that USA social security payments will be seriously cut for the late range of babyboomers. Why would we expect that nursing homes , which are much more expensive, would continue to be paid for that generation?

I think it is best to simply try to take care of and pay for oneself, not counting on anyone else, including government. On the othe rhand, I also think it is best to extend oneself to help take care of one another to the extent that we are able. I think I might accept dying in poverty and unable to afford medical or nursing care if at least I feel the love of people around me....That is what will most matter...though I am saving for my old age. In the mean time, I will live a little below my means. Who is going to buy me a new roof if a storm blows blows up when I'm 87 and healthy, but spent up all my money living entirely for the present?

    Bookmark   October 1, 2006 at 3:47PM
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Who you ask?The insurance company.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2006 at 10:18PM
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Chemocurl zn5b/6a Indiana

I can see your point also Sue.But for $5000.00 per month.If I had that kind of money.I would still have it all turned over to the kids before going into a home.So the nursing home did not get it.So there would go the private room and window.There just a room anyway.Basically a bed and a TV.

So you would want to give all the money to the kids and live off of others hard earned tax dollars, to 'protect' what you had worked for? Am I understanding that right?

Chances are the kids would buy cars and electronics, and they would have little or no value b4 you were even gone.

It is my understanding that when one is in a nursing home, and the government is picking up the tab, that the nursing home gets the social security check, and hands the resident $30 back for spending money for that month.....or something similar to that.

I don't know about you, but $7.50 a week wouldn't keep me in chocolate, triscuits (rosemary and olive oil) and adult Pampers if they were needed. I'm told the government doesn't pick up the cost of Depends, but that is another story. It certainly wouldn't pay for having a phone, or buying birthday cards and postage, or a gift....just wouldn't find that a very fun way to exist.

I'll gladly pay my way for as long as I can. Then if anything is left over after I'm gone, someone can be happy to get it.


    Bookmark   October 28, 2006 at 12:10AM
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Why save? Well, so you can enjoy some options. You could retire early, travel while your health is still good, get involved in things that interest you rather than things some manager expects you to know. You save so that after retirement you can still shop at Trader Joe's instead of the Canned Foods Warehouse and dog food burgers. You save so that you can buy that latest book from your favorite author, rather than waiting for the cash-strapped public library to offer it. You save so that when the roofer tells you it's going to cost $10,000 to put a new roof on, you gulp but can write the check instead of charging it or worse, leaving it undone and having your largest financial asset start to fall into disrepair.

You save so that if you need to take a cab to the doctor's office, you can do it because you're not disabled enough to qualify under the strict rules for free Paratransit services in your city. You save so that you can afford a dentist when you have a toothache, instead of waiting for it to turn into a full-blown root canal, or worse.

How much do you need to save? It depends on many things, including where you want to live. If you live in a low-cost labor area, you can maybe get away with the usual 80%-of-what-you-now-make rule. But if you live in a high-labor cost area, it isn't unusual to find your cost of living does not go down at all in retirement. In general, you do not want to take more than 5-7% maximum from your retirement savings annually. With good investment results -- although most people are absolutely pathetic investors, buying high and selling low instead of the other way around -- your principal will be preserved and you will be able to increase your withdrawals to counter inflation. So if you want to supplement your Social Security payment with another $2,000 monthly, you need about $400K saved up. I'd consider that as a minimum, and really, the way healthcare costs are increasing, you'd want to double that amount, particularly if you lack a company pension and any retirement medical benefits.

People are living longer. When a couple retires in reasonably good health (not perfect, just average health), do you know what the age of the SECOND spouse is, on average, when s/he dies?

Currently the second spouse dies at age 92!

So when you think about retirement savings, you should realize the money may need to last a much longer time than previous generations thought. And with the steady improvements in mortality being made, it is not unreasonable to expect that figure to rise over the next couple of decades. The fastest growing segment of population in the US is people over age 80.

As one gets older, it gets more difficult to do things. You are less flexible, tire a little more easily, don't "bounce back" from bad stuff as quickly as before. When you drive, you don't react quite as quickly, you don't hear as well, your peripheral vision may be failing. But you're NOT incapacitated. You can manage pretty well for yourself, you just need a little help to stay on your own. Now, where does that 'little help' come from? It used to come from the family. But you've moved far away from your family, or you don't have any children. And one can only impose on the neighbors so much before becoming a nuisance.

Most people want to stay as long as possible in their own homes. This does not always happen due to a number of circumstances:
- Many homes are simply not accessible if one has any disabilities at all. I broke my leg in a fall at age 52 and was shocked at how difficult it was to get in and out of my house -- and we have only 5 steps in and out, much easier than most homes in the SF Bay Area!
- Property taxes and utility costs have risen to the point where retirees sometimes find they are paying more each month for these two costs than when they were paying on their original mortgages.

Most people equate old age = nursing home. Actually, the segment of healthcare forecasted to have the highest future demand is home care services. Remember that there are strict definitions for being disabled and receiving care. If you do not qualify under those rules, any care you need to receive will NOT be paid for by the government, period. The US government is in a deficit position, long term, and simply will not be able to afford to be generous to you when you are old. Government deficits will have to be made up by a combination of increasing the costs to the users and restricting services even further.

Neither Medicare nor Medicaid, both of which are in far worse financial shape than Social Security, will pay for long term home health services. That cost is covered by only 2 sources -- an insurance company or your own pocketbook. If you want home services to enable you to stay at home, you will need to pay for that yourself, even if you need those services tomorrow. The government does not now, nor do they intend to, nor will they be able to (unless by some miracle politicians get smarter/braver/more fiscally responsible) get into the business of paying towards your ability to remain comfortably in your own home as long as possible.

So saving will give you more options, that's all. And life, usually, is a lot better when you have more alternatives, rather than fewer.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2006 at 12:37AM
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As a famous female singer (sorry, I forget which one - was it Ella Fitzgerald?) once said,

"I've been rich.

"I've been poor.

"Rich is better".

I don't claim to be rich, but I have some assets above my current needs, and enough to meet my future needs, I hope.

I like that better than wondering whether I'll have enough to get by on, now or in a year or two.

Or five.

Or ten.

In ten years I'll be 87, if I make it that far.

When my Dad was 85, he drove almost 2,000 miles in 3 days, driving alone, to spend a few weeks visiting family and old friends, from 40 years and more previously.

Who knows - maybe I'll make another 20 years? I guess that God does - and S/He's not telling!

It'll be nice to not only be not broke, but even badly bent, should I make it that far.

Which is over 30 years past the usual age of retirement.

Further - government pernsions used to have five or more paying in for every one drawing.

With the boomers currently beginning to retire, and fewer people coming into the work force, they say that soon it'll be two paying and one drawing.

Can anyone see shrinkage of benefits in the cards, before long?

Seems to me a reasonable assumption.

Hope you have - or will have - enough to get by one - now, and for the rest of your life. Comfortably - and without tearing your hair out.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   November 17, 2006 at 3:47PM
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Chemocurl zn5b/6a Indiana

Where has cathie54 (the OP) gone anyway.

Caaaaaaaaathie....Where are you?

Any comments on any of the above?

By the time one is old enough to retire, MANY have health conditions that wipe them out! Physically and financially!
Are you pretty sure that you will be one of those MANY? Are you a pessimist?

    Bookmark   November 22, 2006 at 7:44AM
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Optimists live longer.

ole joyful

P.S. Or maybe, despite that, to pessimists ... it might just seem longer?

o j

    Bookmark   November 30, 2006 at 1:06PM
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Depends are paid for if you are on Medicaid, private pay does not. My husband is in a care home. It is private pay until I spend down to X amount of dollars, then he goes on Medicaid. Everything for him will be paid for by medicaid even his supplemental insurance. I was told when I did a division of assets that I would not be liable for any of his bills unless I die first, then they will tie up my estate to recoup their money. I will have a decent income when he goes on medicare and will set aside X amount of dollars for emergencies. I will spend the rest. If I should end up in a care home, my home will keep me in a private room until it is spent. My husband is in dementia ward, if I am diagnossed with Alzeimer's like him I will opt for suicide. There is no way I will go through what my husband and the people in his ward go through. His life is a living hell and he is in one of the best alzheimer's units in Kansas.

    Bookmark   December 1, 2006 at 9:15PM
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I am sorry that you have this heartache to deal with.

Like they say - it's "the long good-bye".

The face is familiar - but it's like a mask - there's nothing familiar behind it.

(((((jonesy - and family)))))

ole joyful

    Bookmark   December 3, 2006 at 2:35PM
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"chemocurl" looking for me?
I'm here now. Sorry, but I have limited access many times to computer. (I don't own a computer - have to use someone elses.)..just now read all the posts on this thread.

I don't know...it's very interesting to read different opinions/thoughts.

I think basically there is a line drawn - people who have 'good paying jobs' vs people who 'don't' for one reason or another.

I had this big thing written out, but I deleted it! LOL!!! (I'm just too tired right now to make any sense!)

Someone mentioned about $5000.00/month. DANG! For WAY LESS than that, I'll bet you could hire some teenagers to come in and take care of you! (AND, they'd probably do a darned good job!)

Anyway, I'll come back to reply on some other comments as I soon as I can again...

    Bookmark   December 4, 2006 at 10:52AM
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Don't forget the availability of internet-connected computers in (most) local libraries.

My computer is so old that its virus-protectors are outdated and I think I got a virus, as I can't go online from home any more, and when I try it messes up my phone line.

At least, on dial-up, they can't invade your 'puter and use it to allow a lot of folks to make overseas phone calls, sticking the computer owner with, sometimes, thousands of dollars worth of long distance charges.

That's enough to curl your hair.

Have a happy week, everyone.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   December 5, 2006 at 7:13PM
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Don't forget the availability of internet-connected computers in (most) local libraries.

My computer is so old that its virus-protectors are outdated and I think I got a virus, as I can't go online from home any more, and when I try it messes up my phone line.

At least, on dial-up, they can't invade your 'puter and use it to allow a lot of folks to make overseas phone calls, sticking the computer owner with, sometimes, thousands of dollars worth of long distance charges.

That's enough to curl your hair.

Have a happy week, everyone.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   December 5, 2006 at 7:14PM
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Don't forget the availability of internet-connected computers in (most) local libraries.

My computer is so old that its virus-protectors are outdated and I think I got a virus, as I can't go online from home any more, and when I try it messes up my phone line.

At least, on dial-up, they can't invade your 'puter and use it to allow a lot of folks to make overseas phone calls, sticking the computer owner with, sometimes, thousands of dollars worth of long distance charges.

That's enough to curl your hair.

Have a happy week, everyone.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   December 5, 2006 at 7:15PM
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Sorry about this triplication, or whatever, folks.

Tried to post the message - "Rejected - you've commented here before".

So, as I have previously, tried to add something to the title, in this case a second "?".

Rejected - or so the system reported to me.

So, figuring that the title was probably using all of the available spaces, and hadn't permitted my second "?", I changed the hyphen in the middle of the statemetn to a colon, deleted a couple of spaces, then added some more "???".


So did the others, as well, it appears.

It's a poor day that one doesn't learn something.

ole joyful

P.S. Again - "Rejected" - till I did what I'd done before (and will this duplicate messages, again)???

"Rejected" again - so deleted the "RE" in the title. Lord only knows what'll happen this time - but we'll soon find out.

o j

    Bookmark   December 5, 2006 at 7:25PM
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A good example - for what it's worth.

I hear Social Security will increase 3 per cent for 2007. Based on "cost of living"?
If I understand this correctly, this will amount to an increase of approx $22.00 per month for most. AVERAGE.

In the mean time, Medicare has increased it's monthly fee at least $5.00/month. That leaves maybe $17.00.

I happen to be in an HMO. Monthly rate increase for me this coming year: $47.00.
That leaves -$30.00/month

If I opt in for Medicare Part D - another $20.00/month (if I read it correctly)
That leaves -$50.00/month

Dental annual insurance thru my HMO: $135.00/year (MUST be paid in full by Dec 15th 2006. ($11.25 per month)
LEAVES: -$61.25 per month.

Not to mention increases in co-pymts, Office visits, RX's, etc.

AND, not to mention the rising cost of ALL the utilities, gasoline, property insurance, FOOD!... (Geez - housemate paid $1.79 for a 31 - ounce can of PORK N BEANS last night, and $2.00 for a pkg of 8 crappy hotdog bun ("fluffs" - lol!) - and that was at the 'low price leader' store!) (I know, we nead a better diet...)

OK, I don't know who does the math. I don't know much about economics, etc.

But I'm not STUPID enough to believe that I'm not going deeper in the hole! I taken the numbers and double checked. I added forwards, backwards. I've even mixed them up. No matter what I do, it ends up in the red.

$735.00 in the hole for the year - $600.00 over and above this past year - (that's without adding then deducting back out the $22.00/month increase) - before I even see a Doc or buy my first RX!

"They" just won't let one get ahead.

SO, what's the point saving?

p.s. - I've never eaten a turnip. I want to try it tho. Any recipes to share? haha...

    Bookmark   December 6, 2006 at 8:32AM
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Both of my grandparents stayed at home until they were in their late 80's and then Mama had no choice but to put them into a nursing home. My GF lived about 3 years after and my GM is still living. She turned 100 in Sept. She has very good care and is the favorite in the home. She has a double room and has been lucky for the most part about room-mates but she has had a couple that were a chore to deal with. When they retired they had a substantial amount of savings and their home with a few acres of land. We hired one of the home health aides to come spend the night with them for a few months but were paying out about $300 a week and all she was doing was sleeping there. Anyway now my GM has been in the home for about 13 years and all of her money is gone. She gets $30 a month and goes to the beauty shop in the home once a week and the family pays for her TV and phone and any other things she needs. Her money was building up in her account and they told my sister that we needed to spend some of it because she wasn't allowed to have but a certain amount and she was over the limit. Family members moved into their home for a few years and then when it was vacated we sold it and the money went to the home. We had no problem with that. They've taken good care of her and know they will continue to. The main point is that people save their money for their old age and then when they get their and need it for health care the other family members often think it should be theirs. Yes, we've paid taxes most of our lives but nobody can live on the amount of taxes you pay in for a month.

Probably the best solution would be to go back to many years ago where extended families just built onto the family home and the kids stayed after marriage and were there to help
care for the elderly family members (great-grandparents) and the grandparents are there to baby sit for the grandchildren. Thus cutting out a lot of expenses. Of course we've gone away from this custom for too many years for most to want to do it. G'nite John-Boy! lol


    Bookmark   January 17, 2007 at 6:28PM
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My DH and i turned all our land over to our DD,s abt 8 yrs ago. My youngest lives next to me and as she takes care of me will get the house and has money in her name. DH has died and i have a lifetime use of the land. If one does that, at least in ARK,3 yrs after legally doing this no one can touch it as mine. I get a fair SS check and 2 small retirement checks. I've always been a frugle(not stingy) person. I do very well.
And still have left a legacy for my girls and no they can't fight over it as it's already settled.

    Bookmark   January 21, 2007 at 7:52AM
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Vickie! You are so lucky. I'm proud of you for your diligence. I just found a really simple book that explains just how easy it is to get to retirement without being in a huge financial mess. It's straight forward, plain english, and a good read, to boot! "SAVING FOR RETIREMENT WITHOUT LIVING LIKE A PAUPER OR WINNING THE LOTTERY" by Gail MarksJarvis. If you're like me, and you want a little advice on how to retire, I would really recommend this book.

    Bookmark   April 4, 2007 at 9:42PM
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I am retired now. Im living in Panama City Central America with my wife. We decided to come here because of all the advantages that we encounter here. Our money is more effective due we are not dealing with high taxes anymore. I really advice you to think about retire in the country of Panama as your better choice.

    Bookmark   April 30, 2007 at 2:09PM
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What kind of medical care is available in Panama wen you need it, Panama retired?

Residential home/nursing home?

Or will you return to the States (if possible)?

Will medical/nursing home care be available to a recent returnee (I assume) citizen ?

ole joyful

    Bookmark   May 1, 2007 at 4:53PM
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My DH and I are both 38 and saving for retirement. We are enjoying life now with our 3 children (9,7 and 6), but putting away as much $$ possible. My DH hopes to retire at 55. Our dream is to wake up together, have coffee, go to the gym and take afternoon naps. Maybe 2 or 3 times a year travel to somewhere new. Rotate visiting the kids every month (if they'll have us). We are not extravagant people, but our simple dream will cost $$. I would much rather save now than have my DH work into old age. I hope we both live long and are healthy enough to enjoy retirement together.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2007 at 10:32PM
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Well, folks... how're things going with all of you?

Are you all still healthy and happy ... and prosperous?

I'm well past 80, and our provincial section of our national radio had a phone-in, which they have weekdays at noon, and the topic that day was, 'Are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?'.

I don't recall how much attention was paid to the idea that four years ago, late '08 and early '09, were not good times in the stock market.

I said that I was ... but because I'd disobeyed the advice that the financial planners give, to be heavily into equities when young, when one can replace losses in investments which may occur, and light in bonds, e.g. at age 20, having 80 - 85% in equities, and 20 - 25% in bonds, changing to about 50% - 50% (55% - 55%) at age 50, and 20% - 25% equities and 80% - 85% bonds at age 80.

But that, at something over 80, I was about 80% in equities and about 20% in the kind of investments where the number of dollars can't shrink ... in which case, they can't grow, either.

That the only income that they produce is produced now, and (here) taxed at top rate. Plus ... one must consider that the number of dollars has shrunk, as they'll purchase less than when they were invested, due to inflation.

Dividends on my Canadian equities is taxed at a lower rate ... and the increase in value (most years) isn't taxed ... until I sell them - or die - and then taxed at half the usual rate.

I like them apples better.

I was in good health when writing earlier, and since am taking diuretics for varicose veins ... and Warfarin to thin blood due to some blood clots ... and glocosamine sulphate to build ligaments due to osteoarthritis (and they're increasing my discomfort-free movement).

But I'm in good enough health that I was able to have 3/4 of a mile of rows in a veggie garden, last year, and expect to do so again in this coming summer.

ole joyful

    Bookmark   March 28, 2013 at 5:04PM
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Well. If you have the means to save for retirement now. Then why not? If you don't have the means to save for that now then there is no point even considering saving for your retirement.

    Bookmark   March 29, 2013 at 10:01AM
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Very funny, if you are a multi millionaire, you don't need to save for your retirement.

    Bookmark   March 29, 2013 at 6:23PM
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My wooden kitchen chair has a nice, comfy cushion ... left over from uncle/aunt's days there, eight and ten years ago, prior to their deaths and the sale of the farm ... with the new owner renting the house to me.

I find that more enticing than slapping my rump down on to a wooden chair, when I choose to sit.

Now upwards of 20 years retired - I like something of a financial cushion, also.

ole joyfuelled

    Bookmark   April 10, 2013 at 7:34PM
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