Help Choosing Kintetico System

burner74November 12, 2010

I would appreciate help with a couple quotes I received from two different kinetico salesmen. Live in a 3800sf 4 bath home with 3 people. On city water with 1-1.5 ppm Cl, 17-20 grain hardness, 400-450 ppm TDS.

One rep gave me a quote of 4200 including tax for a Kinetico Decholorinator 1060, 1030 softner, sediment housing, & K5 RO system.

The other rep gave me a quote of 5200 + tax for Kinetico 4060s & K5 RO system.

My questions are which one would work better for me. There seems to be a large price difference. Thanks for your help

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asolo

Your situation similar to one of mine except your hardness is about 2.5x so you'll be using a different number wheel. You want the 4060s.

K5 comes with air-tank reservoir or WoW reservoir. Designation K5A or K5W. You want the K5W, believe me. It is more expensive....and worth it.

Can you say which one being quoted?

    Bookmark   November 12, 2010 at 1:22PM
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burner74

Thanks for the reply, I am looking at both quotes and neither specifies K5A or W (one says K5C). Both told me that there is a tank, but did not tell me the difference. So what is the difference?

I have concerns with the 4 tank design (4060) vs the separate units (dechlorinator + 1030), do I have to worry about problems when it is time to change the carbon?

Once again, thanks for your help.

    Bookmark   November 12, 2010 at 1:29PM
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asolo

Copied/pasted from my June 28th post here. Also recommend using the search function. There are quite a few previous posts about Kinetico. Perhaps what I've copied here will answer your questions about the tank.

You will have to replace the carbon in the 4060s lower tanks eventually. How soon will depend on your chlorine level. The reps you are talking to can tell you how soon. Mine opined 4-5 years with a cost around $250.-300 as I recall. Some people say the charcoal modules are silly because the softener resin takes maybe 10 years before the chlorine messes it up to the point replacement is needed. That is, in fact, about how long it took at both of my locations. The 4060s at one location installed in June is my first experience with the charcoal modules so what I'm telling you about replacement is hearsay. Will have to talk again in 4-5 years. Seemed like a good idea so I did it. Excellent performance so far. As far as drinking water is concerned, your K5 has it's own charcoal filtration so chlorine wouldn't be a problem there in any event.

Don't know how "de-chlorinator" might work. I thought de-chlorinators were charcoal stacks....pretty much like the 4060s. Perhaps my lack of specific expertise is showing.

I've had two K5W's installed at two different locations replacing older Kinetico units that gave perfect service for 18 years.

"K5W RO system is a complete redesign compared with my old unit. The water-on-water tank is a significant improvement over air-bladder tanks. Holds 2.7 gallons and re-fills with no back-pressure in under an hour. The spigot provided is also a vast improvement that uses a 1/4-turn ball-valve instead of the el-cheapo lever-valve most of them use. Flows 1.2 gallons per minute using household line-pressure which I estimate is about 3x what the old air-bladder tank put out even when full....and without any fall-off in flow-rate from full to empty. Really worthwhile improvement. Much more convenient and useful. Highly recommended.

The filters are self-contained 1/2-turn screw-on design as opposed to the older housing/cartridge design. They are the same price as the old ones. There is also provision for adding three other filters of various kinds for those (not me) who desire customized filtration or added minerals for taste. Everything is better designed and simpler to service. Has an indicator to show when you're getting close to filter-change time so you can be ready with new filters before it shuts itself off. (Auto shut-off after 500 gal.)"

    Bookmark   November 12, 2010 at 3:24PM
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asolo

I'm interested in this. I am unaware of a "K5C" designation.

Their K5A (traditional air-bladder tank) is their cheaper unit. The K5W (WoW=water on water tank) is their top-of-the-line. That WoW reservoir is proprietary. Nobody else has it. If you've got a few extra bucks, it will change your life. I've given my opinion to my own dealer (with appropriate courtesies) that if I was in his business, I would no longer offer air-bladder tanks. This is a device you will use all day every day for more than a decade. The performance increase -- by which I mean practical convenience in-use -- is VERY worthwhile. No comparison to air-bladder tanks. I recommend it without hesitation. Then, again, I don't have money issues. Not trying to put anybody down. Just saying it is a demonstrably superior system. So much so, there really isn't any room for discussion.

    Bookmark   November 12, 2010 at 6:31PM
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justalurker

The WoW feature in the Kinetico RO is really a WOW advancement in convenience of use for SURE but it has no effect on the treatment of the water or the quality of the water product and comes with an eye-popping price tag for some (many?).

There are a few of us out here piddling along with ROs using air/bladder delivery and are quite pleased and with the thousand or so we saved by not buying the Kinetico RO we bought water softeners and quite a lot of salt or KCl.

Geez Asolo... "there really isn't any room for discussion?" Maybe for you and if you're buying one for me thanks (I'll think of you every time I draw a glass of RO water), but if not while I do covet the WoW feature I won't be buying at it's price.

I am not criticizing you in any way for choosing to buy one. Everyone has the right to decide how to spend their own money... don't you agree?

    Bookmark   November 12, 2010 at 10:46PM
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asolo

justalurker....we've been here before....I thought I covered the money issue. Thought I separated money issue from performance statement. Obviously, I need to do better.

My last two sentences were these: "Just saying it is a demonstrably superior system. So much so, there really isn't any room for discussion."

Basically saying the Kinetico WoW reservoir/delivery-system is superior to anything else. Happy to stand by that. No money in that statement at all....only performance. You know me pretty well by now. Yet you feel you need to ask about whether or not I "...agree that everyone has the right to decide how to spend their own money"?

Jeez. Feeling like I need to go to sensitivity training to avoid stepping on your toes.

    Bookmark   November 12, 2010 at 11:16PM
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justalurker

I don't know you at all...

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 12:47AM
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asolo

We've both appeared on quite a few threads. You've helped me out several times, for which I've complimented you. From those cyber-associations I was alluding to your likely recall of the way I write. Obviously, I was mistaken in assuming such familiarity. You don't recall.

Otherwise, just trying to keep it light. Have a nice day.

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 7:57AM
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justalurker

Cheap shots don't keep it light...

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 10:54AM
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asolo

Don't understand any of this. Intended no offense at any time. I apologize if I have offended...and now disengage. Believe OP has what he needs.

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 11:00AM
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andy_c

burner74,

I would go with the first choice with the separate carbon filter instead of the 4060.

asolo, the 4060 is a downflow model with carbon on the top, making it easier to rebed.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 11:02AM
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asolo

Thanks for correction.

Does sound like both units are carbon-beds, however. Suspect, therefore, both would become exhausted and need replenishment with time. Except for ball-park from installer, don't know time or precise cost. Nor do I know actual procedure. Are they similar?

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 11:35AM
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burner74

Thanks for all of the feedback. I have been busy reading through every posting on kinetico products. From a price point, I am leaning on doing the separate carbon filter with the 2030 as Andy suggested. The only things that have me concerned is what asolo brought up is 1.) making sure I get the WOW version, 2.)will the 2030 be a sufficient size for my house, or should I go with a larger size.

For replenishing the units the 2nd rep told me it would be $250 after 7-10 years. The 1st rep told me that the advantage with having a separate carbon filter is the potential for damaging the 4 tank system when you need to replenish the carbon after 8 years.

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 12:25PM
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asolo

You're doing your homework...which hardly anyone ever does! Good on ya.

At this point I'm over my head so it's time to bow out. FWIW, andy c and justalurker are both experienced and expert and have been posting here for years. I've learned to trust their advice. They've certainly set me straight on a number of issues. I would have every confidence in what they may tell you.

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 12:37PM
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burner74

Asolo, thanks for your help!

    Bookmark   November 13, 2010 at 1:04PM
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