Fleck 2510 clock unit

obrionusaOctober 17, 2011

My current softner is going out so I stopped out to talk to a water softner dealer and he is suggesting a 2510 fleck 48k clock unit. My hardness is 22 gpm with 3 ppm iron. He said I ahould be recycling every 3 days and Its just me living here. Is there anything else I should adding to this system? He wants $849 if I install and $899 if he installs. I found the same unit online for 519 with free shipping. Please comment on this.

Thanks!

Bart

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justalurker

Timer based softeners are very old technology and waste water and salt. Contemporary on demand technology is far superior while environmentally and economically responsible.

If only one person is the max occupancy that house will ever see then a 1.5 cu ft softener is to large and that is a bad choice along with the bad choice of a timer based control valve.

If there's a possibility that occupancy will increase look into a .75 cu ft or 1 cu ft (each tank) twin softener. A twin will accommodate extra people with no changes and with 3ppm iron it will regenerate the resin with softened water instead of raw, hard, water with iron which will increase the resin life.

You also want to institute a regular application of Iron Out or a similar product.

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 1:09PM
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obrionusa

Justalurker, Its just me living in a 3 bedroom home. I dont want to under-estimate the house in case I get married, etc. So what unit would you reccomend? I heard real good things about the fleck and you seem very knowledgable.

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 3:35PM
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justalurker

Deja vu...

"If there's a possibility that occupancy will increase look into a .75 cu ft or 1 cu ft (each tank) twin softener. A twin will accommodate extra people with no changes and with 3ppm iron it will regenerate the resin with softened water instead of raw, hard, water with iron which will increase the resin life.

You also want to institute a regular application of Iron Out or a similar product."

That would be a Fleck 9100SXT either .75 cu ft/resin tank or 1 cu ft/ resin tank with Noryl bypass, top basket, and gravel under bed.

You'd want to set it up for efficiency and not the wasteful way softener sellers would set it up.

It would look like this...

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 3:57PM
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justalurker

On further consideration... minimum size would be 1 cu ft each resin tank or commonly called a 2 cu ft twin and set the calendar override for 4 days.

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 5:23PM
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obrionusa

Then that would be a fleck 9100sxt 32,000 or 40,000 unit. Is it worth the extra money to get the twins? Generally Im at the girlfriends house, my lake house or here. So Im not here much. But things could change and I find another woman with 2 kids too. But at that time a water softner would be the least of my worries.

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 6:02PM
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justalurker

Well, repeating myself again, some more...

Fleck 9100SXT 2 cu ft (1 cu ft/resin tank) with Noryl bypass, top basket, and gravel under bed.

You'd want to set it up for efficiency and not the wasteful way softener sellers would set it up.

A twin will accommodate extra people with no changes and with 3ppm iron it will regenerate the resin with softened water instead of raw, hard, water with iron which will increase the resin life.

You also want to institute a regular application of Iron Out or a similar product.

A Fleck 9100SXT is a twin resin tank softener.

Or, just wait until your living arrangement stabilizes and address the softener question then.

Let us know what you decide and how it works out for you.

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 6:19PM
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obrionusa

I really appriciate you being patient with me. You have helped me out a lot!

    Bookmark   October 17, 2011 at 8:06PM
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justalurker

Your smartest move might just be to wait until your living arrangement stabilizes and address the softener question then.

By waiting, you can make a decision that will serve the living arrangement for the long run.

With 22gpg and 3ppm iron you probably don't want to live at all with that water so think about renting a softener till you're ready to make a final decision.

Culligan rents regenerating softeners and tank exchange softeners... worth checking into.

    Bookmark   October 18, 2011 at 12:19AM
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obrionusa

justalurker, Could you reccomend an online dealer to purchase a fleck from? The places I checked are all within 5 percent of each other. I live in Indianapolis Indiana and would rather purchase somewhat close to me.

    Bookmark   October 18, 2011 at 8:46AM
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justalurker

From a logistical standpoint it doesn't matter which online dealer you order from. None of them stock anything. They all have components and parts drop shipped from regional wholesale distributors.

There's a big drop-shipping wholesaler in Ohio and that's probably where your components will come from regardless of where you order. So, look for an online seller in Ohio.

Instead of the absolute cheapest source you should be shopping for the seller who you have the most confidence in.

Based on your posts you'll be talking to them repeatedly after the sale because the way the softener comes programmed is not the way you want to run it if you want the most efficient (lowest cost) operation. You will need them to facilitate warranty parts replacement if the need arises.

A dollar's worth for a dollar is the best deal out there. People who want to pay 75 cents and get a dollar's worth usually end up paying 75 cents and getting 50 cents worth... especially when buying long distance.

You seem to have made a decision so let us know how it works out.

    Bookmark   October 18, 2011 at 10:16AM
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obrionusa

Well I emailed OPWC, returned emails, then called and talked to CK. He was very friendly and knowledgable. Anyhow I think Im going to order the 2510 meter on demand 40,000 unit with the "SST60" Resin. He said I can set it to recharge at around 700 gallons at 9# salt and still have plenty of room to increase if extra people to rent or live here. If justalurker ever gets to Indiana I would like to buy him a mouse burger at our local pub called "The Mouse" in Yorktown. I'm going to sleep on it before I order it because as always I want to resourch everything first.

    Bookmark   October 18, 2011 at 4:45PM
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justalurker

CK is a great old guy and knows what he knows from back when he learned it.

CK does not size softeners correctly nor does he set them up for efficient operation. He's also in love with SST-60 when there is no real need for it... but he makes more profit when he sells it. There is nothing that SST-60 can do for you that can't be achieved with standard hi capacity resin.

CK's recommendation is as wrong as it can be for your circumstances and is the worst choice if the occupancy of your house increases... especially with the metered 2510 instead of the 2510SXT. Setting that softener at 700 gallons using about 60gpd for one person will mean over 10 days between regeneration which is WAY too long with 3ppm of iron... even for SST-60.

I have no dog in this hunt and am not trying to sell you anything so I'll just sit back and see how this works out for you. Please keep us informed and especially down the road... so others can learn.

    Bookmark   October 18, 2011 at 5:15PM
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obrionusa

I know you dont have a dog in the hunt and appriciate your advice. Lol, I already invited you to a mouse burger if your in the area, Maybe they will have the wet t shirt contest the day your down to intice you. I dont have the room for a twin unit. I have about a 30"x30" space. I may be able to move some stuff around and get 36"x30", But thats it. What would you put in here?

    Bookmark   October 18, 2011 at 5:37PM
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Waterpro

Twin is unessesary. Its purpose is for uninteruppted soft water like at a 24hour business. The time clock may be your better choice due to high iron. meters can get fouled. It is alo very important to consider the type of iron. RED (oxidised) iron can be filtered out with a 5 micron dirt and sediment filter while CLEAR iron (dissolved) needs ion exchange(softener). Regardless a quality prefilter is nessesary in your situation a big blue type 4.5" 10" or 4.5 x 20" is best. Fllter changes will depend on amount of red iron and water use. When your family grows you will need more frequent filter changes. Just let it go initially until pressure drops then you will have an idea of filter life. Be prepared a filter filled with iron is NASTY wear gloves.

    Bookmark   October 19, 2011 at 10:34AM
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obrionusa

I understand that the clock units are not very efficient, but with that amount of iron I should be recycling every 3-4 days mininum to flush the iron out. I heard that from justalurker and my local softner dealer. With a 1 cubic foot softner @ 6 pounds that would give me 588 gallons of soft water. I would use about 15 bags of salt per year. Annual cost for salt $60.00-$80.00. With that figure there will be enough water for two people at 70 gallons a day.

    Bookmark   October 19, 2011 at 2:17PM
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justalurker

"Twin is unnecessary. Its purpose is for uninterrupted soft water like at a 24hour business"

There are more advantages to a twin than providing soft water 24/7... although that is a pretty appealing feature.

A twin regenerates the resin with SOFT water which extends resin life ESPECIALLY if there's iron... like the OP has

A correctly sized twin will work in a circumstance where occupancy is low and then more people move in down the road, exactly the OP's situation, without being too large at the beginning and too small at the end and not having to do anything as the occupancy fluctuates.

"The time clock may be your better choice due to high iron

Completely bass ackwards...

On demand electronic control valves almost always have a calendar day override setting while a mechanical valves like the Fleck 5600 Econominder and 2510 mechanical don't. Electronic control valves provide FAR greater flexibility in setup and have proved VERY reliable.

3ppm iron is manageable without a pre-filter, which introduces it's own problems, if the softener is correctly sized, correctly set up, and the right routine maintenance is done.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 10:27AM
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obrionusa

I'm still considering the twin now that I seen one in person. I can set the salt storage tank in front of the unit to make it fit. My next question to justalurker is:
If I go with a twin will I still have to set a 4 day calendar overide with the amount of iron I have? Or can I let it regen once the tank has exhauseted? I like the fact it regens with soft water. I work out of town a lot and sometimes gone all week and only here on the weekends. Im trying to avoid the 4 day overide if possible. Justalurker I cant thank you enough for your input. If your a gardener and would like some harneck garlic I will mail you some for all the information you have given me.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 12:36PM
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landperson

Sidebar: Can you explain the "calendar day override" and how/whether it applies to my current Culligan Gold Series (with Aqua Sensor)? When Culligan was here a few days ago to look at the possibility of adding a new system to a rental, the owner/service/sales guy checked my current system and adjusted the clock (I think it was just off by a couple of hours), but this conversation leads me to want to know more about my own set-up.

Thanks (and apologies to the OP if this takes us sideways for a minute or two)

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 12:51PM
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justalurker

to obrionusa...

You can locate the brine tank feet away if you have to. You just need to be able to run the brine tank safety overflow gravity line to a drain.

With just you in the home setting the calendar override is the way to go. With more people the water usage will trigger the regeneration before you hit the calendar override.

You could reset the calendar override to ZERO (0) when you go out of town and return the setting to FOUR (4) when you get back or just leave it alone and you'll use an extra few bags of salt a year.

You have a unique set of circumstances and they are vague and fluctuate so there is no pat answer... just the best compromise.

to landperson...

The Aqua sensor may not have a calendar day override as it regens when the sensor says to.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 1:08PM
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obrionusa

I was hoping you would say the 9100sxt wouldnt need a 4 day overide since it regens on salt water, but doesnt seem the case. Anyway I can get around the 4 day over-ride?

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 1:39PM
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justalurker

obrionusa,

I don't know any other way to say it other than the three or four times I've said it ALREADY... with 3ppm iron you need to regen every 3 or 4 days or you will foul the resin regardless of the softener. That is the way it is if you want to use the softener to treat everything, which is the simplest and most cost effective solution IF you have clear water iron.

The alternative is to treat the iron with separate hardware BEFORE the softener and then the softener can be set up to regenerate at longer intervals, BUT that is a more complicated installation, with more hardware, more maintenance, will take up more floorspace, and will cost MORE MONEY.

You keep adding more variables to the circumstances and that is getting annoying and my fingers are beginning to hurt from typing. Now, it's "I'm not there all week".

You seem to have skipped over the most valuable statement made in this thread... "You have a unique set of circumstances and they are vague and fluctuate so there is no pat answer... just the best compromise"

I've given you all the information you need to make an informed decision or not.

Let us know what you decide and how it works out.

Good luck.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 2:04PM
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landperson

Thanks, and now I'm gonna duck.

:-))))

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 2:24PM
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obrionusa

One more please. Since the twins 9100 sxt doesnt have a "built in reserve" will it use the same amount of salt as the 2510 sxt? on each regen?

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 3:10PM
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justalurker

Let us know what you decide.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 7:13PM
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obrionusa

I know you cant imagaine this, But I drive my girlfriend nuts too! Thanks for your help.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 7:20PM
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justalurker

Careful, she might just get out and walk... then you'll only need a softener for ONE.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2011 at 8:01PM
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obrionusa

Update: While waiting for the bacteria test to come back from my well I was making my mind up on the digital model. I didnt want to do anything without first making sure the well was safe to drink. I went to the girlfriends house over the weekend and was web searching craigslist. I seen an ad for the head off the same model softener I was replacing. Hmm, all I need is a clock/timer and I can get mine back working again. I called the older gentleman and assured me the unit worked great. The tank was leaking on it and he wanted it gone. I bought the whole head with new seals for $15. I went home done a 1/2 cup iron out treatment down the brine tank and regenerated the unit. Made sure the cycle was complete and regenerated again to make sure it was flushed out good. Tomorrow Im going to put the craigslist timer on my unit and take a water sample in to see how my 21 year old unit is doing. Oh, I found an excellent place to get water tested. A local pool/spa company.

    Bookmark   October 25, 2011 at 6:53AM
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