Leaks - Pipe cannot pull out of the joint and can be pulled out

coodyApril 24, 2011

A pipe is leaking in two pipe joints. One is on the right elbow joint and I am able to pull the pipe out of the joint. The other is on the left T joint and I am unable to pull the pipe out of the T joint. Click on the . I do not want to cut the pipe. Can you tell me how to repair the leak in two situations, 1) the pipe cannot be separated from the joint and 2) the pipe can be pulled out of the joint? Can you also tell the material I need it for those two repair situations? Thank you.

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bus_driver

Call a licensed plumber!

    Bookmark   April 24, 2011 at 9:09PM
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bus_driver

Look here.

Here is a link that might be useful: 31, or more, posts

    Bookmark   April 24, 2011 at 9:12PM
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coody

Hi! I post the question here because I wonder whether the pipe has to be pulled out of the joint or just glue the pipe and joint from the outside of the pipe. How does a plumber usually handle it? If the pipe and joint can be glued from the outside of the pipe without pulling out of the pipe out of the joint, it is, of course, the easiest way to repair the leak; otherwise, I have to try pull the pipe out of the joint and then put it into the joint again with the glue. Can any plumber provide your opinions?

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 12:44AM
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alphonse

"Can any plumber provide your opinions?"

I am all for DIY, but given your comprehension through both these threads, suggest you call a plumber and be done with it.

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 6:53AM
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maryland_irisman

Coody,

I'm impressed by the patience the folks trying to help you have shown!!! Some of them are plumbers.

Here's what a plumber will do...
...Pull the pipe out of the joint
...Primer the pipe that was pulled out.
...Primer the inside of the fitting
...After the primer dries (about 15 seconds unless you over-do it)
...Apply glue all around the the end of the pipe and at least 2-1/2 inches back. Make sure you completely coat all the way around since you will not be able to give the pipe a turn.
...Immediately push the pipe into the fitting as far as it will go. HOLD IT THERE for about 15-20 seconds. If you don't hold it, hydraulic action could cause the pipe to pull back out a bit.
...Don't disturb the pipe for about 2 hours. In other words, wait a while if you still plan to fool with the back of the drywall. You can still use your washer right away, it won't pose a problem but don't disturb the connection by bumping into it, etc.

The entire process would take a plumber about 1 minute to complete at a cost no less than around $75-$125 depending on where you live. You can do it for around 5-10 bucks for the primer and glue. It's almost the simplest plumbing job that can be made. If you can't do this (which I think you can) you need to call a plumber or at least get someone who is a bit handy to do it for you.

To the guys here who have been trying to help...yes, there are some trade details I didn't mention. I think in this case and the purpose the joint is used for, too much detail would cause too many non-pertinent questions?

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 7:34AM
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coody

Thanks for the instructions. One problem is I am unable to pull out of the pipe out of the T joint on the left side but I saw the water stain under the joint. I do not want to cut the pipe. I saw sealant in a store, which indicates it can seal the pipe leak. I do not know whether the sealant can effectively seal the pipe and joint or I have to pull the pipe out of the joint and then put it into the joint again to glue it. Do you think the sealant will work? Thanks for the help.

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 10:56AM
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coody

I cannot pull the pipe out of the joint because it was ever glued. Should I just use the sealant to seal the pipe and joint or the pipe must be pulled out and re-glue it?

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 1:43PM
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weedmeister

Have you tried giving the pipe a twist?

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 2:15PM
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brickeyee

"Do you think the sealant will work?"

No.

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 2:42PM
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kudzu9

In looking at your original photo, it appears from the slightly different colors of the pipe and the joints, and the possible mis-match between the pipe's outside diameter and the joint's inside diameter, that whoever did this may have used two types of plastic -- ABS and PVC. This is a combination that requires either a special type of solvent glue or Fernco fittings, and even then may not be to code. I know you want to do as little as possible, but you are unlikely to have a fix that won't leak again soon if you don't have it done right. No insult, but I think this is beyond your plumbing skills. You really do need to have a professional look at this.

    Bookmark   April 25, 2011 at 9:03PM
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bus_driver

I have no further advice to offer to coody. But in order that readers not be misled by some of the responses, none of the pictured pipes is ABS. ABS for DWV is black.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 8:14AM
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brickeyee

"ABS and PVC. This is a combination that requires either a special type of solvent glue or Fernco fittings..."

There is NO cement approved for joining ABS and PVC.

Either threaded joints or a Fernco must be used.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 10:30AM
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kudzu9

Thanks guys...I had a senior moment: I meant PVC and CPVC...not ABS.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 1:52PM
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bus_driver

PVC and CPVC have different outside diameters for a given nominal size and trying to directly cement one to the other is an exercise in futility.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 3:55PM
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coody

By search, I have realized the leak is due to the condensation. This is because of most of the time the pipe is dry. The relatively modest amount of water/leak proves the joint must have been lousy. That should be due to the poor workmanship during initial pipe installation. Since I am unable to pull out the pipe out of the joint on the left side and the pipe is still glued, I saw an idea to use the epoxy putty or pipe sealant first. If it does not work, then I may have to call the plumber to cut and replace the joint. The right side of the pipe can be pulled out of the elbow. So it should be easy to prime and glue the joint. Do your experts have any inputs on my plan?

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 5:59PM
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coody

By the way, do you have any good idea to easily cut and remove the left T-joint only without damage of the pipe?

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 6:07PM
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brickeyee

Just use the correct pipe cement and primer for the joint you can get apart and see if it fixes the problem.

There is no reason to use anything like epoxy putty when the correct cement is easily available.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 7:11PM
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kudzu9

coody-
Several different people have given you input, but you seem focused on just gluing this back together with something and thinking it will be good. As brickeyee says "use the correct pipe cement and primer"...and part of determining what's correct is confirming what you have. Take a look at the pipes and tell us if they are stamped as PVC (or possibly CPVC).

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 7:38PM
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coody

Hi! The pipe is stamped PVC. I have taken apart the elbow joint. See the . That was the most leaks ever. You can see the black mold on the ceiling board due to wet in an attic. When I pulled the pipe out of the elbow, there was no glue at all. It must be due the poor workmanship during the initial pipe installation. The pipe was just put into the elbow without glue. Because there is insulation material covering the ceiling board, I had not noticed the wet in the attic for several years until recently I saw yellow water stain on the ceiling in a laundry room on the first floor. Then I found the problem is due the pipe joint leak from the inside pipe condensation. However, it should be easy to repair the leak by putting the pipe into the elbow again with the pipe primer and glue.

The difficulty is on the . There is a little leak under the T-Joint. Since the T-Joint was ever glued, I am unable to pull the pipe out of the T-Joint. So, I think I may try the marine epoxy putty or pipe sealant to seal the leak. If it does not work, I may have to call the plumber to cut and replace the T-Joint.

I can also try to cut the T-Joint with a plumb saw. But, I do not know how to remove the glued T-Joint without damage of the pipe. If I can remove the T-Joint, it should be easy to find the same T-Joint from the HD and then prime and glue it. So, I ask your experts if you have good ideas to remove the T-Joint without damage of the pipe.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2011 at 10:18PM
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alphonse

Are you sure the leak at the tee is from INSIDE the pipe and not outside, running down from the roof?
From your picture, the branch of the tee doesn't look glued. May require some tapping to get apart.

If the leak is from a poorly made joint (glued but still leaks), the best thing to do is cut out the tee and replace with a new tee and couplers if there is insufficient pipe or slack in the arrangement to accommodate the shortened pipe. You may be able to use Fernco couplers.

If you don't mind hack solutions, get some purple PVC primer and continually wet the leaking juncture. There can be no water in the joint. Then daub on PVC glue. Let dry. Do it again, and again if necessary, creating a fillet.
I'll name that procedure Manhattan 42 after the "inspector" who recommended it. For little flow/no pressure, it will likely work.
Get the idea of using epoxy out of your head.

    Bookmark   April 27, 2011 at 8:36AM
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coody

Thanks for your advice. I have checked outside of the pipe and pulled the pipe out of the right elbow. I am pretty sure the water came from inside of the pipe due to the condensation. The pipe in the most of time is dry. I can prime and glue the right elbow but admit I have no confidence to replace the left T-joint because it is still glued. If I have to cut it, the pipe may be damaged. That is why I want to try sealing it first to see whether it will work. If not, I will probably have to call a plumber.

I checked the pipe sealant from the HD today. The store salesperson recommends the Goop Plumbing Sealant. Do you know this ? Is it good to seal the PVC pipe leaking joints?

    Bookmark   April 27, 2011 at 3:01PM
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weedmeister

This is what you need.

Here is a link that might be useful: primer and cement

    Bookmark   April 27, 2011 at 6:50PM
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homebound

Since you don't want to cut the pipe (which is easy with a hacksaw), then go to your local hardware store and buy epoxy for plastic. Use that on the joint you don't want to replace.

Reglue the other joint with pvc primer & cement (after you push it together, hold it together while it bonds (read the directions, but like a minute or two).

Here is a link that might be useful: Here's one product

    Bookmark   April 27, 2011 at 9:02PM
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alphonse

Being a somewhat public forum, anyone can join, advise, opinionate or just plain B.S. here.

In the real world of real estate with plumbing and codes regulating the practice thereof, where the unknowing are hopefully protected from the unscrupulous by the specification of products and procedures, there isn't much laissez faire as to unorthodox methods.

So while it's well meaning to recommend epoxy on plumbing, is it something you'll point out to a prospective home buyer? or something you hope the buyer's inspector misses?

    Bookmark   April 28, 2011 at 9:14AM
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rjh2o

It's a vent pipe. The "Schedule 40 PVC" was not primed when initially installed. That's why it did not hold and leaks. Take apart what you can, clean it thoroughly, prime all the the joints (purple PVC primer) and re-glue with PVC CEMENT. Clean around the tee as best you can. Primer the connection and run PVC Cement around connection, wipe with cloth and let it be.
RJ

    Bookmark   April 28, 2011 at 9:53AM
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coody

H1 all! I have bought all the from the HD. The Goop Plumbing Sealant to seal the left that it is still glued. The HD salesperson said the Goop Plumbing Sealant is more highly recommended than the epoxy by the plumber.

The purple primer has contained the pipe cleaner. So I do not have to buy the pipe cleaner additionally. The green PVC cement is the strongest glue. The Wallboard Joint Compound can patch the black mold ceiling board (after it dries) due to the wet.

I wonder whether the pipe needs something additionally such as pipe rubber, sealing strip etc before the pipe is put into the right elbow joint or the primer and PVC cement are sufficient. In addition, is the wallboard joint compound the best material to patch the ceiling board (from the other side)? Thank you for your help.

    Bookmark   April 28, 2011 at 3:56PM
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weedmeister

the Primer and Cement are all you need. The Primer also acts as a cleaner as you rub it around the outside of the pipe. It is thin and will run and stain anything it touches. Clean both the pipe and the inside of the Elbow joint. Put the Cement on both the pipe AND the inside of the elbow joint .

    Bookmark   April 28, 2011 at 4:51PM
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coody

Hi! I eventually pulled out the pipe from both of the elbow and T joints. So it should be easy to prime and glue the pipe and joints right now. I noticed, however, both of the T and elbow joints actually were not primed and glued before. I also noticed rjh2o replied "It's a vent pipe. The "Schedule 40 PVC" was not primed when initially installed. That's why it did not hold and leaks." If it is the case, I wonder why the PVC pipe and joint should not be primed and glued when they were initially installed. Can you explain it or it was just poor workmanship during the initial pipe installation?

    Bookmark   May 9, 2011 at 10:22PM
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weedmeister

poor workmanship. Makes me wonder how the rest of the house is put together.

    Bookmark   May 13, 2011 at 9:34AM
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zoneiii

I realize that this is an old thread but I want to respond for anyone with a similar problem in the future. I am amazed that someone would tell you to hire a licensed plumber for such an incredibly easy job. Come on, folks! Have we become so helpless? When I read the question, I assumed it was about copper or galvanized pipe which would be very easy to fix too but then I saw it's PVC pipe. Nothing could be easier to fix and I have no idea why the person asking the question thinks he cannot remove the elbow. Of course you can remove it! You can simply cut it out with a hacksaw and put in a new elbow. You can extend the pipe that is cut off easily with just a union and a piece of PVC. Working with PVC is so incredibly easy that I am baffled about why the question was even asked. A proper repair would take about ten minutes and cost a couple dollars. I never cease to be amazed by how helpless people are becoming. This is pretty sad.

    Bookmark   February 3, 2012 at 9:16AM
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brickeyee

"You can extend the pipe that is cut off easily with just a union and a piece of PVC."

Why would you even use a union?

Get a coupler without a stop.

    Bookmark   February 3, 2012 at 9:28AM
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bus_driver

The fact that the question was asked indicates that the person was not prepared by experience nor knowledge to tackle that job.
Does that work for you, zoneiii?

    Bookmark   February 3, 2012 at 7:11PM
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lazypup

Actually he had already made up his mind to try pasting some type of goop, epoxy, bubble gum or whatever on the pipe and no amount of good advice was going to sway his notions,,,he was simply soliciting someone to agree with his jury rig B.S.

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 8:27AM
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mgs-001

I also have a leak at the joint. It is where the lower 3" ABS DWV pipe joins the ABS tee. The joint developed a small leak a couple of years which, based on research and Hardware store recommendation, I fixed with epoxy putty. It just started to leak again.
How would cutting the pipe at the tee make this an easy 10 min fix? The solvent cemented pipe remnant would still be stuck in the tee. How would I get that out without damaging the tee? If I'd have to replace the tee joint, I would also have to replace each the two elbow joints and parts of the other two pipes as well as the third pipe and and install three pipe couplings, two elbows and a tee. It just doesn't make any sense to me that a sealant applies at the joint wouldn't be able to fix it. I am wondering if epoxy glue instead of epoxy putty would be more permanent although the hardware store guy told me the latter should work. He did sell me a tube of Goop plumber.

    Bookmark   July 8, 2012 at 4:13PM
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