Remember the Bishop children's gravestone?

alisandeFebruary 21, 2013

This picture should refresh your memories:

We had quite a time deciphering the names, particularly the mother's name (Hattie). That was back in the fall. Well, I just received an email from Henry and Hattie's great-great-granddaughter. She thinks the stone on the left, which looks to me like HELEEN or possibly HELEN, should in fact be WILLIAM. The dates she gave me don't jibe with information gathered by Dbfirewife, so I'm not making any changes right away. I had planned to revisit that cemetery in the spring, and take closer photos of those stones, and I'll stick with that plan.

It was interesting to hear from one of the parents' descendants!

PS: The picture is showing up a little small on my screen, thanks to the new KT format. You can view a slightly larger version of it here.

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Cassandra

It sure looks like an H and not a W to me! On top of that I'd be suspicious about the dates. . .

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 6:37AM
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rob333

I tried to just close my eyes and clear my mind... and on the bigger picture, I can see an outline of an M at end. What if they've all thought it was William and really, it's a less common name like Helliam, something like that. People correcting it to what they thought it should be? Edited to add: and why would it start so far to the left and not go all the way the same distance to the right? It's longer than Helen.

This post was edited by rob333 on Fri, Feb 22, 13 at 10:34

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 10:32AM
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ghoghunter

Where did these children die? Can you try to find a death record?
Joann

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 11:31AM
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alisande

Good idea, but PA didn't start recording deaths statewide until 1906, apparently, and our Historical Society goes back only as far as 1893.

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 2:18PM
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LuAnn_in_PA

Just like the MILES stone says son below the name...

Whatever is below the HELEN/WILLIAM name will let you know the sex at least.

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 3:06PM
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alisande

Good point, LuAnn! To me it looks more likely to be "daughter," but I'll find out for sure (I hope) when I take another look in person. Thanks!

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 3:12PM
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maire_cate

I can't see a William either, Heleen looks more like it.

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 4:48PM
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Dash2

Today, Heleen would be spelled Helene. The stones show that Henry and Marie Bishop lost their 3 infant children. None appear to have made it to 6 months of age.

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 8:25PM
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dbfirewife

I do remember this well.... There may be a William but this is definately not his stone... Gosh.. now I'm going to have to go back into Ancestry and see what else I can find.....Will be back....

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 8:38PM
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dbfirewife

Bingo!... Here they are in the 1880 Census. They live in Lackawaxen, Pike, PA. There is a "William" in the house, he is 13 so he would of been born abt 1867 give or take a year....

Henry Bishop 52

Harriet Bishop 46

Eva Bishop 21 ( At age 41 she is listed as single and living with her parents on the 1900 census for Hawley, Wayne, PA)

Liddie Bishop 19 (Cannot find her after 1880, perhaps Liddie is short for Lydia) will look for her more later...

Mary Bishop 17 (Can't find her right now after 1880)

William Bishop 13 (Can't find him after 1880 either, perhaps he went by Bill or a nick name after this census)

Hattie Bishop 10 (Can't find her right now on any census after this year)

Asher A. M. Bishop 6 ( In 1915 Asher is living with his wife and Leana and two children. This is the last census I can find him on. His wife is listed in several N.Y. phone directories after his year, listed as being widowed)

Will report back with more if I find it...

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 9:16PM
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alisande

Wow--that's exciting, Deb, thanks! Ancestry must be so much fun. Unless there were two Williams, the descendant who contacted me must be mistaken.

By the way, she said "May" (stone on the right) is Mahala. Unusual name.

I'd love to get over to Lackawaxen this spring or summer. I know there's a wonderful old cemetery there. Lackawaxen is on the Delaware River. Zane Grey wrote his books from his house on the river. I think he also had a dental practice there.

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 9:27PM
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dbfirewife

Here they are in 1870
Lackawaxen NY.

Henry Bishop 46
Harriet Bishop 37
Anna Bishop 17
Effie Bishop 11
Lydia Bishop 9
Mary Bishop 6
William Bishop 3
Henry Bishop 6/12 (I thinkk this means 6 months old)
Hattie Bishop 6/12

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 9:35PM
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alisande

So it looks like little Henry and Hattie were twins? And apparently Henry didn't survive to 1880. Sad.

I hope Anna and Effie got married and moved out before the 1880 census. By the way, Anna and Effie were the names of twin little girls who lived in my house before we bought it.

You know how a word sometimes starts to appear strange when you've been looking at it for a long time? I'm starting to read Bishop as Bis-hop. :-)

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 9:44PM
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dbfirewife

Man... this poor mother must have buried a lot of children... some of them I just can't find anymore and look at the ones that are missing from 1870-1880

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 9:46PM
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dbfirewife

It was very common for what we would now call a young girl 13-15 to be out of the house working as servants back then so let's hope, that is where some went or married...

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 10:18PM
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dbfirewife

Susan... I just had another thought.. I think you should link all three of these memorials to their parents and by the way... When I did a search on, maybe it was Miles?... on Ancestry, the link to his memorial on FindAGrave showed up....

    Bookmark   February 22, 2013 at 10:23PM
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ghoghunter

Just a thought about the two possible William's. If an earlier William died the parents may have named another child William. It was a fairly common practice back then.
Joann

    Bookmark   February 23, 2013 at 12:30PM
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ghoghunter

I found them in the 1900 census. Henry was 72 years old and Harriet was 67. Their daughter Eva B was 41 and worked as a weaver in a silk mill. They lived in Hawley Wayne co Pa. Harriet said she bore 11 children and 7 were still living. They were married 50 years.

In the 1850 census there is just the two of them...Henry is 22 and Harriet is 17.

In 1860 they had just two children listed Anna who was 7 and Eva who was 2.

Joann

    Bookmark   February 24, 2013 at 7:48AM
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alisande

I love this stuff! Every time one of you Ancestry members comes up with exciting facts from the past, I'm tempted to spring for a membership myself. But it's not as though I have genealogy skills, and it's not as though I'm on top of my other projects.

Anyway..... Dbfirewife, I took your good suggestion and linked the three children to their parents this morning. I don't know why I didn't do it when I first put them on FindAGrave; I always link. I've noticed that some memorial managers ignore infants completely, and sometimes other children as well. It's as if the little ones don't count because they didn't produce children of their own. But I feel strongly that the babies deserve mention, and their loving parents who erected the stone would certainly want that for them.

Joann, so Eva worked in the Hawley silk mill. I know it well. In fact, I have a connection. The enormous silk mill, which now houses a community college and some boutiques, had on the property a separate building that held about $250,000 worth of cocoons (a princely sum in those days). About 5 years ago the owners of Hawley's best restaurant converted it into an upscale coffee house, and during the planning phase hired my daughter-in-law to manage it. She was the perfect choice......not only does she have a degree in business management, but she and my son have always roasted and ground their coffee beans. :-)

    Bookmark   February 24, 2013 at 9:49AM
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