Comparing R22 vs 410-a

gwflOctober 19, 2007

One difference between the Trane XL19i and the 16i is the refrigerant. Should this be a consideration is choosing a compressor? In terms of effeciency and future availablity.

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garyg

The biggest difference is that the 16i has one dual stage compressor and the 19i has two separate compressors.

R22 will be around for a long time so I wouldn't make that a major consideration in your choice.

When you speak about efficiency, you need to know thw EER (Energy Efficiency Ratio) of the matched system. EER, and not SEER, determines true operating costs. Post the model numbers of the condenser and air handler for the 16i and 19i.

Best to you.

    Bookmark   October 19, 2007 at 7:24PM
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baldloonie

The 19i runs at about a 50/100% split between the stages using 2 compressors. The 16i runs about 80/100% split using 1 compressor that has 2 capacities. I've noticed that the dehumidification out of the 16i on low isn't too great so if in a humid climate, might be an issue. While I'm not a fan of the old Mexican made compressors they use on the 19i, I do like the idea of lower low output capacity. You can get this out of the Bryant/Carrier 16 as well.

    Bookmark   October 20, 2007 at 11:43AM
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bonanza_stu

R-22 will be around for some time but, at what cost. In less than 2-years there will be no R-22 equipment made and R-22 production will be cut by 50%. If you need service in less than 10 years you may find R-22 in excess of $100.00/ lb. You might have to make a choice between replacing a condenser that has a compressor still under warranty because it's not cost effective to buy the necessary R-22 due to price.

Good luck,

Stu

    Bookmark   October 23, 2007 at 11:34PM
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saltcedar

Or just use a drop-in replacement like R417A (ISCEON® 59)

Regards

    Bookmark   October 24, 2007 at 12:34AM
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don21

The production may be cut by 50% (don't know if that is factual or not) but even if it is, since all new systems will be 410 the 50% cut still leaves a huge surplus since lots more gas is used installing new systems than repairing old ones - With a 50% cut, there should be a bigger surplus of 22 than there is today

Don

    Bookmark   October 24, 2007 at 12:35PM
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bonanza_stu

The production may be cut by 50% (don't know if that is factual or not) but even if it is, since all new systems will be 410 the 50% cut still leaves a huge surplus since lots more gas is used installing new systems than repairing old ones - With a 50% cut, there should be a bigger surplus of 22 than there is today
############################################################

Before you post something, spend some time looking at the Montreal Protical, Clean Air Act etc. R-22 refrigerant production was cut by 30% in 2003, a 50% reduction will take place in 2010 and a 90% reduction will take place in 2013. That will leave R-22 production levels at 3% of what it was prior to 2003. Final production will cease in 2022. Industry projections indicate the demand will outstrip available supplies by 2014. The demand is not just for residential systems but for commercial and industrial users. Have you priced R-12 lately? A 30lb cylinder costs about $1600.00, production ceased in 1993.

Suggesting someone should not purchase R-410a equipment is not responsible on your part. research your opinions.

    Bookmark   October 24, 2007 at 10:27PM
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garyg

R22 was not a factor in the purchase of my new heat pump in June '07. I chose R22 because of the lower operating pressures. The evap coil was the same for either R22 or 410A, so I chose the R22 for lower pressures.

This is another topic debated to death on www.HVAC-Talk.com.

    Bookmark   October 25, 2007 at 11:49AM
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bonanza_stu

Lower operating pressures??? What sense does that make?

    Bookmark   October 27, 2007 at 5:25PM
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brickeyee

And small cans of R-12 are down to around $8.
If you have the correct license you can purchase them.
A 'universal' card does not allow the purchase of the small containers.
You need a mobile card.

There will also be recycling of R-22 after the price rise.
R-12 hit almost $20 per can (~14 oz) until recycling brought the price back down.

    Bookmark   October 27, 2007 at 6:59PM
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garyg

"Lower operating pressures??? What sense does that make?"

- Lower operating pressues = less stress and strain on the coils and system.

    Bookmark   October 27, 2007 at 8:35PM
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aldematt57

If you currently own a R-22 type system, don't worry about any problems associated with availability of the refigerant.
If you are considering buying a new system, consider a more ozone friendly alternative.

Here is a link that might be useful: Tradewinds Heating & Cooling

    Bookmark   October 28, 2007 at 1:39PM
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bonanza_stu

If you currently own a R-22 type system, don't worry about any problems associated with availability of the refigerant.
If you are considering buying a new system, consider a more ozone friendly alternative.

################################################################################

Good advise, why fight the inevitable? R-410a is here, why do people defend an old system that is being phased out of existence and argue about the cutoff dates, pressures and minutia. People read these posts and rather than get good info they are exposed to personal pissing contests. It makes no sense.

    Bookmark   November 2, 2007 at 4:26PM
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