Trane HVAC system pricing help(Texas)

dan711September 11, 2012

I know many of you experts get tired of the same ol' questions. I would appreciate, however some help.

My house is 38 yrs old with the original GE AC and air handler still functioning. Obviously, its time for a new system. I have researched it to death.

I live outside of Dallas, TX....2800ft3 one story/slab built in 1974. Radiant barrier, 20" insulation, new windows and duct work sealed three years ago. All electric--no gas

Here's the quote:

Trane XL16i 5 ton 2-speed R410a heat pump

Trane Hyperion 5 ton variable speed air handler

Trane 20kw auxiliary heat kit

Honeywell programmable thermostat

(handful of new grille covers, new plywood base in hallway for air handler, 10 year parts and labor, install and haul off)

$11,265

Thanks

dan

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tigerdunes

Dan

Being all electric, any other heat source other than HP?

Size of system being replaced? Size of existing heat strip?

I would want a price on the two stage 5 ton XR15 heat pump?

Describe your typical winter climate.

Post back.

IMO

    Bookmark   September 11, 2012 at 3:04PM
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harlemhvacguy

Dan,

Do you plan on living in this house a long time?

Which hyperion A/H did they quote... which t-stat?

XL16i units are a little pricey. You may be able to lower the price some with the new XR16 heat pumps. The 5 ton XR15 5-ton heat pump is single stage. The 5 -ton XR15 straight air unit is 2 stage but not the heat pump unless something has changed I don't know about. (But that is possible).

When you answer the questions we have asked we should be able to help you more.

    Bookmark   September 11, 2012 at 4:00PM
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dan711

The existing system is a 7 seer 4 ton GE almost 40 years old. The summer months are primary concerns here in Texas. Mild winters (40-60 degrees)with the occasional freeze but not too much to worry about during the winter months.

Since I first posted, I have gotten a second quote.

xr15 single stage 5 ton
Hyperion TAM7 air handler
Trane 802 thermostat
(all of the other minor items plus 10 year labor warranty from dealer)

$8100

first quote:

Trane XL16i 5 ton 2-speed R410a heat pump
Trane Hyperion 5 ton variable speed air handler TAM7
Trane 20kw auxiliary heat kit
Honeywell programmable thermostat (no model # listed)
(handful of new grille covers, new plywood base in hallway for air handler, 10 year parts and labor from dealer, install and haul off)

$11265

    Bookmark   September 11, 2012 at 6:33PM
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tigerdunes

I like the XR 15 version best. You do want the two stage version.

And definitely if going from a 4 ton to a 5 ton system, ductwork system needs a thorough evaluation as size, adequate return(s), etc. Not to be disregarded and overlooked. Yes, a big deal.

I think a 20 KW heat strip is ridiculous. Ask for Trane's two stage 10/15 KW heat strip.

I would insist on Trane's 803 thermostat or identical HW mdl #8321.

How are you filtering return air? I would want a good 4-5" pleated filter media cabinet.

IMO

    Bookmark   September 11, 2012 at 7:16PM
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david_cary

So you were 4 tons and made improvements and now you are switching to 5 tons? That needs some explanation. Presumably some trees have grown up too.

So does the house stay cool on a really hot day? Does the unit ever shutoff in the afternoon on a hot day?

It is likely that a modern 4 ton unit will provide more cooling than a 40 year old 4 ton unit. If you switch to 5 tons, you may get short cycling and higher humidity - is that something you want to risk?

    Bookmark   September 11, 2012 at 8:13PM
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dan711

Thanks to harlem, tiger and Dc

I did not mention that there is a 4" filter system included in both estimates.

The 2nd guy proposing the xr15 did a more thorough investigation of return vents, duct work and in-room duct vent grills. Claimed the original 4 ton might not have been big enough for the home so that's why he suggests 5 ton. The house gets cool in summer time but i have to crank down the thermo and the system runs for a while.

talked to neighbor down the street (retired ac tech) and he claimed that there really isn't a need for a heat pump in our area.

    Bookmark   September 11, 2012 at 8:41PM
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david_cary

Really isn't a need for heat pump?

Well sure - you can heat with electric strips at roughly 3-4 times the cost of a heat pump. If you are doing a/c, the upcharge is so little that there really isn't a climate in the US where a heat pump isn't helpful.

Obviously if your heating costs are $50 a year with electric strips, you will take a long time to pay for a heat pump but it would still be worth it (probably 15 years).

The strange thing to me is that you are quoted 20 kw of electric strips which costs a minimum of $2 an hour to run. So if your heat runs 50 hours a year, your payback might be 7 years. If you were in a truly hot climate, why would you need 20 kw of electric strips?

I just looked and saw your were near Dallas. Don't listen to that retired tech - that is unbelievably bad advice. I have a vacation rental in a climate with 2300 HDD which is about what Dallas is. I have heat pumps in that and I don't even rent it in the winter. I still probably paid $150 last year to heat it. Electric resistance would have been $450. Even needing 2 heat pumps is a 3 year payback.

    Bookmark   September 12, 2012 at 6:01AM
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tigerdunes

Your neighbor is probably jealous he does not ave a HP and has to rely on heat strips.

And I would insist on a load calc especially with recent improvements.you can do it yourself at a minimal cost. I can provide a link if you like.

As said, the 20 KW heat strip size seems to be over the top.

IMO

    Bookmark   September 12, 2012 at 7:09AM
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harlemhvacguy

You don't list what heat strip the xr15 quote has?

Your neighbor has dementia or something because Dallas is perfect for a heat pump.

I like the xr15 quote better myself due to the price being more in line and it is a fine system on top of that.

    Bookmark   September 12, 2012 at 9:24AM
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dan711

Well my neighbor (nice guy) is 74 and been out of the AC business for a few years.

With the xr15 quote--I spoke with the salesman and he said additional $900 for the heat pump--but said the xr15 alone will still work extremely well and will be a great improvement over my current unit that is 38 years old.

Leaning towards 2nd quote for the xr15/hyperion air handler/trane 802 or 803 t-stat for a total of $8100 w/o HP or $9000 w/HP

Not only is there a nice price difference but it seems that the gains of going with the xL16i would be minimal

    Bookmark   September 12, 2012 at 11:36AM
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weedmeister

Can we safely assume you're using an electric furnace to heat the house now? If so, you would be, well, nuts to not install a HP in Dallas. You'd probably make back that $900 in 3-4 years or less.

I'm not that thrilled about the Trane Xn16 HP. I think a single stage HP with a variable speed blower would fit you nicely.

    Bookmark   September 12, 2012 at 4:32PM
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