urgently need advice: rheem rapm-jez or trane xr15

Pete22August 27, 2012

Need your advice on the final decision. Thanks!!

- The current unit is 27-yr-old A/C (5 ton York and gas furnace) and duct system.

- 2300 sq ft one-story house (built in 1985) with 20 windows (double-pane).

- Currently have 14 air supply, 1 return on hallway ceiling, and 2 small returns on the wall. We will seal the returns on the wall.

- Location: Dallas. The average winter temperature is high 59 and low 39. The average summer temperature: high 95 and low 76. Average days in a year over 100 degree are 18. We usually have very dry hot summers.

We need to choose over 3 options from two contractors. Both contractors are locally reputable companies (none of them does Manual J calculation):

(1) Trane Contractor

Option 1 (total $12000):

*Equipments: ($8320)

Trane 4 tons XR15 split system A/C w/R410a, Model 4TTR5049E1000A, AHRI Ref# 4180345

Trane XV80 100000BTU variable speed upflow/horizontal furnace,

Model TUD2C100A9V5VB

Trane H/E aluminum horizontal flat coil Model 4TXFH063CZ3HHA

Trane programmable 3 heat/2 cool touch screen thermostat Model TCONT802AS32DA

Labor Cost

* Install New R8 Duct system: will add one 16" return at the entry hallway, one 12" return in master bedroom, and one supply at the entry.

* Warranty is 10-yr manufacturer warranty. 1 year labor warranty. (We can pay extra $800 for extended 9-year labor warranty.)

(2) Rheem Contractor:

This contractor thinks we should use 5 tons for this house. We asked him to provide a quote for 4 tons scenario.

Option 2 (total: $11680-)

*Equipments: ($9180.-)

5 ton 14.5 SEER Rheem RAPM-060JEZ, AHRI# 3554679, Gas furnace is 80% AFUE

HW Focuspro 6000 thermostat

* Install New R8 Duct system ($2500): add 16x25 return box and grill and 2 additional drops

* Warranty: All parts are covered for 10 years from the factory. The heat exchanger has a 20 year warranty. Labor is 2 years. No cost on labor, Freon or other parts for 10 years if the coil leaks.

Option 3 (total: $10850.-):

*Equipments: ($8350.-)

4 ton 14.5 SEER Rheem RAPM-048JEZ, AHRI# 3549842, Gas furnace is 80% AFUE

Which one will be the best deal??

Sorry for lengthy posting. Thank you very much for your help.

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First off if you are unable to find a dealer to perform a load calc, then do it yourself. Cost is minimal. Will take a couple of hours to gather the information. I can provide a link if you are interested, it will make you a better informed homeowner as well.

The AHRI number provided on thecTrane quote is not correct. It shows a 3 ton condenser. Please verify.

And the AHRI numbers on the Rheems do not identify the furnace mdl number. Need that info to give you an informed opinion.

Just on the Trane info alone, I would say that furnace may be oversized.

Any info on new linesets and new air filter cabinet?

On the Trane system, you want a true two stage thermostat. You were not quoted true two stage stat like HW VP IAQ.

Post back with complete and verified info.


    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 12:09AM
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Thank you a lot for the quick response. Please see the reply below:

1. Trane contractor told me this morning that he can do it but need to schedule it. My AC is not working since 9:30am. It will be 95 degree later and we only have fan... We may need to make a decision this afternoon in order that either of the contractors can install the new system tomorrow. Please provide the link. I will try to do it this afternoon. If I cannot, should we go for 5 tons because we may build a small sun room (100 sq ft) on part of patio outside of my breakfast nook (sliding door to patio) 2-3 years later? Rheem contractor thinks installing 5 tons will not hurt the life of the machine because his thermostat will control the on and off, if we concern on oversize issue. Is it true?
2. My bad....The correct AHRI number is 4180435.
3. Rheem furnace model number. This contractor forgot to include the model number in his email. We are waiting for his call back to get this number. The information he provided in the email is: "The furnace is a 80%. The SEER only requires a specific furnace when a variable speed blower is involved. Before you ask, variable speed is worth up to one SEER and is not a very good payoff (more than 10 years)."
4. Trane dealer's reply to oversized furnace is "The XV80 100,000 btu furnace is a 2 stage heat unit that operates at approximately 79,000 btu and 52,000 btu dependant on demand from thermostat."
5. Trane dealer's reply to thermostat is ""Trane" thermostats are manufactured by Honeywell. The TCONT802 is an excellent thermostat and will do everything that you need and at less cost than the HW IAQ."
6. Both dealers are using my existing copper lineset but their quotes include flush of the existing lineset.
7. Yes, we will have new air filter cabinets from both dealers.

I will post the furnace model number within a couple of hours.

Appreciate your reply.

    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 1:18PM
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1.You need a load calculation for both heating and cooling

2.the Trane dealer is advising you incorrectly about the thermostat. On a two stage furnace, you want the thermostat to control staging based on demand not the timer on control board that always goes to high stage whether your home requires it or not.

3.lineset whether new or existing must be the correctvsize to manufacturer specs. Close does not count.

4. Why have an oversized furnace whether 2 stage or sgl stage. It will only cost you more to operate. Dumb, dumb, dumb. Size to the load calc.

Sorry to sound so adamant but this is important purchase that should be sized correctly with best equipment including thermostat to take full advantage of equipment's capabilities.

Link for software attached.

Good Luck

Here is a link that might be useful: HVAC Calc Software

    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 1:36PM
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You are better off spending a few nights in a hotel then be rushed into a decision that you will later regret. You want a properly sized unit installed correctly by a reliable contractor. You need a written quote with all the correct model numbers and details of what work will be done.

    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 2:01PM
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Rheem furnace model is RGPN, 80% AFUE Single-Stage PSC Motor.


    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 2:08PM
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Not as good as the Trane as long as Trane is equipped with the correct true two stage thermostat, not the 802 or 803.


    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 2:24PM
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Rheem model number is RGPM1debrjr. Thank you, everyone, for the inputs.

    Bookmark   August 28, 2012 at 2:32PM
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