Help!! Bosch or Asko?

fpmomFebruary 6, 2013

I have used front loaders (both Bosch and Asko at different times) for the last 15 years in Australia and never a problem with mold in the gasket or anywhere for that matter... moved to Boston and was convinced by the salesperson that the Electrolux front loader and dryer was the way to go for various reasons (I love european machines so I feel crazy that I made this decision) and purchased these 8 mths ago... now have awful mold problems in the gasket and the appliance place has said they will replace with the machines of my choosing - I want to replace with european made 24 inch (it has never been an issue for me to use 24 inch machines since I like to do small loads anyway and I don't care about how long it takes since I think they wash better) and so my choice is Bosch Axxis or Asko (I would buy a Miele in a heartbeat but this place does not sell them)... The Bosch and Asko I used in the past were much older models i.e. 10 years back so I am not familiar with what's on the market now - any recommendations? Priorities for me is that it is european made (so Asko or Bosch brand) no history of mold issues, washes well but very gentle on clothes, good with cold water, gentle low heat drying (I hate the dryers that over heat and shrink clothing)

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janiceme

Please read my Asko experience at the recent post about Asko v. Miele. I had the 24'' Bosch from 2004 to 2009(in another state) and was pleased with them. I had to leave them behind,unfortunately.

I have a full size LG FL set in one of my residences and have never had the mold problem. I'm not thrilled with my current Asko set purchased new about 14 months ago. There are some things I like about it -- but I wouldn't purchase it again. The dealer who sold it to me originally has changed his mind about Asko -- after selling that brand for more than 20 years -- and now only sells Bosch unless a customer specifically request Asko.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 2:40PM
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fpmom

Thanks ukigumo - how did you find the Bosch dryer? I only had the asko dryer in the past but not the Bosch dryer... was it gentle on clothes and did it ball things up much?

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 3:08PM
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eleena

Hasn't Bosch Axxis been discontinued?

I know AJM still sells it and I wanted to buy one too but my local dealer said it had been discontinued. If true, I'd be worried about the service.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 3:16PM
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fpmom

Eleena really? Isn't the Axxis the only Bosch washer dryer left (the one still made in Germany?) If it's being discontinued does that mean Bosch is exiting the W/D market - that sounds strange? The dealer was telling me that one of the reasons he recommends is that Bosch has great service and quick (in Boston)

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 3:32PM
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eleena

Here is what I have found:

"Now, they [Miele) are the second European company, after Bosch, to stop selling front load laundry manufactured for this market."

http://blog.yaleappliance.com/bid/83143/Miele-Exits-Front-Load-Laundry-and-the-Best-of-What-s-Left

He is talking about full-capacity Miele washers, not compact ones.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 3:55PM
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eleena

AJM has 24" Bosch Axxis and it is possible that my local salesperson was talking about full-capacity washers.

But there are several negative reviews about the service. IDK whether believe them or not.

BTW, could you elaborate about washing small loads?

I do them too but I also have a king size bed and need to be able to wash at least the sheets.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 4:06PM
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fpmom

Eleena I am guessing that what the salesperson is referring to in that quote is about the Bosch 27 inch since that was manufactured for the US market i.e. a bigger washer since americans tend to like the bigger sizes - the bosch axxis (I think that might be the one I had 10 yrs ago too) is the 'european' 24 inch size manufactured in Germany and I haven't heard that they are being phased out (I think the Bosch 27 inch got phased out end 2011?)
I wash small loads for a few reasons and always have (even though I now have twin toddlers and are a family of 4) - partly psychologically because I don't like masses of washing piling up and then feel like I have a heap of work ahead of me so I do a load or 2 each day and keep on top of it! The bigger reason is that I think smaller loads are gentler on clothing (and the fibres) and don't cause as much wrinkling if you are going to line dry and hang clothing i.e. shirts/tops on hangers to dry and I hang all my toddlers clothing as I don't want any shrinkage from a dryer while they are growing so quickly... I was always able to fit decent amount of sheets and towels in to the Bosch from memory i.e. QS sheets or duvet
When I had the Bosch in Australia I never needed it serviced - ran really well and washed things amazingly clean... I've heard here from a couple of different retailers that in this area (maybe different where you live) the Bosch service people are easy to deal with and fairly quick unlike the Electrolux ordeal which took forever
While I loved the Bosch back in the day I wasn't sure if anything had changed re quality which is why I was asking for people to respond who owned one recently and I am considering the Asko because I read that they are more 'mold resistant' with the way the gasket is

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 6:48PM
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lcubed

both bosch and miele have left the US 27" FL market. they both still sell the 24" compact FL.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 6:54PM
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janiceme

@fpmom

I don't remember having any complaints about the Bosch dryer. I did separate Q size sheets and dry them one at a time -- this reduced wrinkling. I would start with the bottom sheet and put it on the bed right from the dryer.

Not just based on my experience, but I would avoid Asko. It is nice to not have to wipe the door seal for mold, but then again, that same seal is prone to leaks --not just according to me, but also the tech mentioned it as a common Asko problem.

The store where I purchased the Asko no longer carries them on display. They had for more than 20 years -- I am in the upper Midwest with a large Scandinavian population that likes Swedish things. The store will order Asko if a customer wishes -- the salesman said Asko is the prettiest of all the machines and some people choose them for open installations. But now he is most positive about Bosch.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 6:45AM
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fpmom

Thanks Ukigumo - I used to separate sheets like that as well and often put them straight on the bed so won't be a hassle for me to dry one sheet at a time... I find it strange living here that 'bigger is best' i.e. biggest machines so you can shove as much in to one load - it's not good for the clothing, it cleans less effectively, it makes them more creased, and you then have a lot of folding once the load is done (which is actually the part I hate the most and why I line dry a lot of things on hangers so they go away quick and easily) and I don't believe it's good for the machines from what I understand... it really puzzles me

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 10:11AM
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relic

"but then again, that same seal is prone to leaks"
News to me and I have had my Askos since 1994.

    Bookmark   February 8, 2013 at 8:13PM
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beaniebakes

I've had the Asko 6424 for two years and love it. Why? Everything about it: efficiency in water usage, ability to select water temperature, high spin results in almost dry clothing, not one iota of movement during spin cycle due to shock absorber system (I have stacked washer/dryer), almost no moisture on door at end of cycle, narrow gasket that is never wet. Not crazy about dryer but it does its job. Sheets get balled up and wrinkled so I dry one at a time with a few small items mixed in. Sometimes the moisture sensor doesn't seem to work when only one or two items are in the dryer. But I consider this a minor annoyance and would definitely buy Asko again.

    Bookmark   February 9, 2013 at 5:32PM
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eleena

Thank you, fpmom!

I do my laundry the same way you do and air dry almost everything and I so *hate* those piles of clothes!

Sold!

I am ordering a compact washer.

    Bookmark   February 9, 2013 at 6:59PM
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eleena

Here is a good review (I think):

http://blog.yaleappliance.com/bid/86271/Bosch-vs-Asko-Compact-Laundry-Reviews-Ratings?_hsenc=ANqtz-_FjpgtDvMPfGIQ2S9IOt3mLUgzzoQaAAgqaWR6EjD6Krg97LyL6Z-9ovWobnweRMI3295VtCEDJKAUDmiDgRQhw4mOIg&_hsmi=3793516&utm_campaign=compact-laundry-ln&utm_source=hubspot_automated_email&utm_medium=email&utm_content=3793516

    Bookmark   February 9, 2013 at 9:33PM
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cj47_gw

Wow, I find this interesting. I've had my Electrolux washer and dryer (70 model) for almost a year now and no hint of mold, no off smells, ever. I do not wipe out the gasket after use,just leave the door open afterwards. I do run the 'clean washer' cycle with bleach every once in awhile, usually a few weeks after the "clean washer" note is displayed. :-) I'm not a fussy person and I do not pamper my appliances. I wonder why this washer developed mold while your other washers did not. That's puzzling. I doubt that it's because it's not a European washer, though--otherwise, you'd hear about it more with this brand. I'm not saying you shouldn't get your Euro washer, because you know you like those--I'm just saying that Electrolux washers are not known to go moldy more than others, and I'd worry that anything new will have the same problem. .

Hope you find the right washer for you,
Cj

    Bookmark   February 10, 2013 at 3:56PM
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fpmom

cj47 I agree it's bizarre and I think unexpected after such a short time to have this mold problem - I've read that doing a lot of cold washes can do this so moving forward I will be doing a hot wash once a month (though I never did this in the past and haven't changed how I wash clothing)... I also read that there is a class action suit going on now against electrolux for mold problems so perhaps just a recent problem with the model I have?

    Bookmark   February 11, 2013 at 2:07PM
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fpmom

beanibakes thanks for your thoughts on Asko - I must say that I am torn re which one to replace the Electrolux... I'm sure both will do the job well - the Asko is appealing since I have not read anything re Asko's being associated with mold.... if I remember correctly from when I moved in with my husband and gave up my Bosch to use his Asko I thought the Asko was not as gentle on the clothing as the Bosch but this must have been splitting hairs - how do you find it re getting things clean and being gentle on clothing? (I was the kids clothes as well as most of mine on gentle setting and my husband's on normal)

    Bookmark   February 11, 2013 at 2:13PM
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dks35

We got Bosch in July 2012 - Axxis WAS20160 washer and matching air-dryer (not the condensation dryer!). Works great, laundry comes out "stupid clean". Six months is a short period though but FWIW - we like it. When doing research on washing machines we needed to take into account the washer having an internal water heater. Our house water heater is tankless and the water temp rise is slower than if you get it from the tank. So a 240V washing machine that has internal heater was a must. Miele, AFAIR, is 120V for US market, will heat the water but might take longer. The ASKO models have the 240V heater and will also allow you to select cycle temperature and have much hotter cycles up to 200F (according to the dealer we talked and also to testimonies of GW members). Bosch has highest temp at 165F I believe (sanitary cycle). Regardless of your incoming water temp both Bosch and ASKO will heat the water to the appropriate temp during the cycle. However, ASKO capacity is significantly smaller than Bosch Axxis which I believe is the largest of 24" washers. Good luck with making your decision!

    Bookmark   February 16, 2013 at 5:46PM
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dks35

To OP: I am convinced that the mold problem that people have with washers is a result of using too much liquid detergent. Using less detergent should help your mold problem if not eliminate it completely. The front loaders are using very little water (4 gallons?) and a quater to 1/2 cup of detergent should be sufficient. Touch the drum of the washing machine after the cycle is done - do you feel the slimy film on your fingers? If yes - too much detergent was used.
There are long discussions on this forum addressing this particular issue.

    Bookmark   February 16, 2013 at 5:58PM
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fpmom

Thanks dks35
I've never had a mold issue before (with my previous Bosch and Asko) so I find it bizarre... I also use very little soap - about 1 Tb of 'Charlie's soap' liquid and I don't use fabric softener but add vinegar to the rinse cycle to help soften (I would have thought this would have helped the situation?)... I will begin using hot washes at least once a month since I am a cold water user mainly and I have had feedback saying that this could be an issue for mold (though, again never had this problem in the past and always used cold water)
PS Specifically how do you find the bosch dryer? I haven't used one before and prefer one that can cater to low gentle heat - does it ball things up much and do things come out very wrinkled?

    Bookmark   February 24, 2013 at 1:07PM
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moon1234

This thread is old, but I thought I would follow-up with you. We bought a Bosch AXXIS WAS24460UC 24" front loader a while back. My wife uses it almost solely for washing diapers. We have a Miele for our regular laundry.

The Bosch AXXIS sold to the US market has a motor that has brushes. This means they will wear out. We burned through a set of brushes in about 18 months. We do two to three loads of diapers a day in this washer (Three kids in diapers). Bosh sold to the UK and Germany has a brushless motor (and a much longer warranty).

We started getting an F43 fault code and then the drum would not spin. F43 means bad control board or bad motor. I could reset the control board and it would run until the drum is supposed to spin and then it just gets an F43 fault code again. This tells me I have a bad motor, worn brushes or a loose cable from the control board to the motor.

I have a replacement motor on order from Bosch as the commutator (the part on the motor that the brushes physically touch) is no longer smooth. A small grove has been worn in the commutator over time where the brushes touch. This means that if I just replace the brushes they will wear much faster than normal. I have done this dance in the past and replacement brushes never last me more than 6 months without taking the motor to a machine shop to have the commutator resurfaced. This costs almost the same as buying a new motor. This I why service guys always suggest replacing the motor even when it just needs brushes.

Our Miele has a brushless motor and does MORE laundry than the Bosch. The Miele has over 6000 hours on it (according to the diagnostic menu) and the Bosch had a fraction of that. The Euro manufacturers, other than Miele, are skimping on parts, but still charging full Euro prices. The only manufacturer building washers to last is Mile.

Even our Mile has had several service calls. We bought a W4840 large capacity model. When it finally dies we will be purchasing the Miele Little Giant Professional Line. It seems that all consumer models have been skimped on to the point of not lasting more than 5-10 years. At least the Miele Pro line still has that tank like build quality with 220V electrical service and boil wash options. They are pricy though.

Don't get me wrong, the Bosch WAS24460UC cleans really well. It is a nice little washer when it is working. I just don't like changing motors or brushes every few years due to our laundry load. If you are a "normal" household with "normal" laundry levels then I bet you get 4-6 years out of it before it will be motor/brush replacement time.

For a dryer we purchased a Siemens Ultrastack. I don't think they are sold in the US anymore. Bosch and Siemens are the same company and their models usually have the same parts inside. I liked the Siemens as it had an LED display that showed time remaining for drying. It was usually pretty accurate and I liked knowing how long was left. It's Bosch twin lacked the LCD display, but 95% of the internal parts were identical. The external styling is almost identical as well.

    Bookmark   November 27, 2013 at 4:36PM
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Andrew47

i'm jumping on this thread to since it has a number of Euro style devotees. My wife had a bad FLexperience due to mold years ago (2 houses) but we're looking again and she likes the idea of the greater cleaning performance vs TL. We have two young girls so we're unsure if the Miele 24" would have enough capacity and can't find any details about the typical wash durations.

Our interest is the highest with the new Asko Pro series 2.8 ft2 washing machine but we can't find a soul or review who has any experience with it. It has it's own heater, uses a very discrete rubber gasket, and provide precise control like the Miele. Any knowledge on this site would be appreciated.

We also read a positve gardenweb review on the SQ FL semi-commerical but just like the Asko, you're North of North of $2k and it's main claim is durability and less about clearning performance.

    Bookmark   October 5, 2014 at 9:38PM
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hvtech42

What do you consider to be "enough" capacity? That mostly depends on the size of the bulky items you'll be washing. Other than that, you'll just need to adjust the frequency you do laundry. European front loaders lend themselves to frequent, quick, sessions rather than weekly laundry marathons. You'll probably need to do more loads than whatever you had before, but the overall cleaning results will be better and you'll use less water and energy. I have found that European front loaders respond better to a completely full drum than American sized ones, so the difference in usable capacity may not be as much as you think.

If you got mold before, though, you need to look into your laundry habits if you get a front loader again so as to avoid ruining another machine, since it is generally caused by user error. Hot washes, bleach, leaving the door open when not in use, GOOD. Too much detergent, too little detergent, overuse of fabric softener, BAD.

    Bookmark   October 5, 2014 at 10:58PM
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lee676

I have the same Bosch as moon1234 and thusfar it's working great. Bosch recently revamped their 24"w washer line, not sure if they've gone brushless or not. I also have an older 240v Miele at another apartment which is outstanding, save for the smallish door opening. But new Miele washers sold in the US have been dumbed down and run on 120v power (except on their very expensive high-end model) so they take longer to heat the water and can't get as hot; they're still very well made though. Bosch and Asko continue to use 240v for most (all?) of their US market washers. I've found the capacity on both to be more than adequate - about the same as a 1980s/90s full size top load washer. There's a thread here about the new Asko 2.8cu.ft. washer which looks great on paper, but I've never seen one. I like Asko's door design that resembles commercial front-load washers with a thin metal door opening and no big rubber bellows.

    Bookmark   October 6, 2014 at 1:27AM
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Andrew47

I just checked the Pro Series user manual and confirmed it runs off 240v. It appears you actaully plug the washer into the Asko dryer.

For reference, their 'color' program runs 1:49, uses 3 rinse cycles, and up to 24 lbs of clothes.

I'm interested but I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the 67% premium they're charing for the Pro WD over the standard 2.2 ft2 WD. I'd over to talk to somebody from Asko to help understand what is so special with the Pro besides the 0.6ft2 volume increase.

How long does the typical Miele color cycle run?

    Bookmark   October 6, 2014 at 2:12AM
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