Am I missing something in these quotes?

theraptscallionJanuary 20, 2011

Hi all, recently made the decision to replace my HVAC system. Old unit was a 23 year old interior furnace coupled with a 17 year old exterior weathermaker heat pump unit. Defrost was no longer functioning, so I felt no need to throw good money after bad after getting a $300 repair quote. Called around, had several pros come out and quote me a new system. I'm strongly leaning towards the carrier quote, but I'm nervous because it seems so low.

3.5 ton Amana: ASZ140361B unit coupled with AEPF42016C handler for $3900

3.5 ton Carrier: 25HCC542A unit with FV4CNB006 handler for $4480

3.5 ton Trane: XL15I unit with XV90 air handler/furnace. He didn't give more specific numbers. All for $6200.

One of the three did a manual load calc, and said that I could go down to a 3 ton, but with the way I program my thermostat, it may be better to stay with a larger system (very large swings between sleepy time and awake time). No quotes include rebates, since I only qualify for $300. All include a completely new charge line and refrigerant. Two include moving the hot water heater to make servicing and filter replacement much easier (currently, handler is obstructed by the HW heater, so I have to bend filters to fit them in). The Trane and Carrier installers seemed to know their business better than the Amana dealer, who mentioned an ASZ16 system for 4900, but I like the reputation of the trane and carrier. To me, it seems like a no brainer to save over $1000 for an equivalent system.

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the Carrier is a nice system with a very good price.

see below performance/eff numbers. excellent numbers.

3676245 Active Systems COMFORT 15 PURON SINGLE STAGE HP CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING 25HCC542A**30 FV4CNB006 42000 13.00 16.00 42000 9.00 26200

what is your location? you are replacing a 3 1/2 ton system?

air handler is var speed.

I would recommend a new refrigerant lineset and matching Carrier Thermidistat. what size heat strip was quoted?

The one negative is time/temp defrost which I do not like.

You have access to nat gas? the trane quote is actually dual fuel-HP with gas furnace?


    Bookmark   January 20, 2011 at 8:09AM
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these are some good quotes. Go with the trane or carrier. If you already have natural gas at the house then the dual-fuel option is the way to go.

Either way with the heatpump option make sure it has demand defrost.

    Bookmark   January 20, 2011 at 9:06AM
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I live in SW Virginia, right above the NC border and the prior system was 3.5 ton.

While I don't currently have gas, the local gas utility (and I do mean local, it only services our municipality yet is not publicly owned) will connect my house at no charge. I'm nervous about getting gas, however, because our local utility rates are fully 70% higher than that for the rest of the region thanks to our tiny utility. They also offer no rebates for appliance upgrades on account of their tiny size and I've heard that the rates tend to fluctuate more rapidly than most.

A new lineset is included in all three quotes, as well as a honeywell 8000 series for the carrier and amana, not sure of the thermostat on the Trane. None of the quotes specified heatstrip, at least that I know how to read on the quote.

Is there any workaround regarding demand defrost? I assume from your comments that the 25HCC does not have that as an option.

    Bookmark   January 20, 2011 at 3:22PM
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you would have to upgrade the model of the outdoor unit to get demand defrost.

If you currently don't have natural gas, and don't want the service fee's associated with gas just stick with the straight heat pump solution. Sounds like your gas supplier isn't cheap either.

How much is your total cost for electricity for KW?

You want to verify with the installer the the airhandler has heat strips.

How does your existing heatpump do? Do you know how old and efficient? What type of electric bills do you get?

    Bookmark   January 21, 2011 at 7:58AM
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post your current electric rate. do you get any electric incentive for HP heating?

post what the nat gas rate would be if you elected to have service brought to your house.

I would take a hard look at the no charge cost to bring nat gas service to your home. it gives you a great deal of flexibility plus I would think it could make your home more attractive if and when its sold.

if you could post the complete mdl numbers of the Trane quote when you are able to get the info. while the Trane quote is more dollars, I like the idea of dual fuel system if the nat gas rate is reasonable.

I am not aware Carrier offers demand defrost feature on their HP product line. Both Trane and sister company AmStd do.

post back.


    Bookmark   January 21, 2011 at 8:21AM
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Electric rate is .09075 per KWH
Gas is currently 1.3412 per Ccf

While the new gas line would be run free of charge, I would have to purchase the meter and they would tear up the yard something fierce to install.

Only incentive, since everything is administered in a small locality, is a $300 rebate for air-source heat pumps.

Existing heat pump is an 8 SEER that is 17 years old. The existing electric furnace is 23 years old.

My electric bills in summer are sub $60, but in winter get upwards of 150. The home is 2000sq ft and I wear sweaters.

    Bookmark   January 21, 2011 at 11:58AM
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thanks for the info. I wouldn't get gas then.

Your doing fine with electric. Thats a pretty nice electric-rate. Mine is between .11 and .12. Your like 20% less. $150 electric bills in the winter is pretty reasonable - and you had an old 8 seer unit!!! This new equipment is going to use like 1/2 the energy!! You will be able to turn the t-stat up and save money.

Make sure your new heatpump has on-demand defrost. This is very important. This will sve you money on energy and prevent excess wear and tear on the heatpump. It will also be more comfy for because nobody likes it when the heatpump goes into defrost (noisy, cooler air).

Ask the installer who gave you the carrier quote that you like the price to upgrade the condensor to the highest efficiency single stage unit. This will definitely have demand defrost.

    Bookmark   January 21, 2011 at 12:31PM
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