Good mid-range dishwashers?

pbx2_gwAugust 3, 2012

Can we get some mid-range recommendations to kick start our research on DW please?

Preferably MSRP The Miele's & high-end Bosche's were out of our budget range but they did have those horizontal utensil racks on top. Are they worth it?

Also - One which we are focused on because of brand reputation is the Bosch 500 Series - SHX55R55UC.

But otherwise, would appreciate to hear the recommendations & reasons.

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Same dilemma here, I've checked several websites (just to name a few-, whose ratings vary with inconsistent top raters. So far I am considering the Bosch SHE55R55UC and Samsung DMT800RHS.

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 1:45PM
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Whatever you get make sure it has a flow through water heater instead of an ring element heater. Flow through heaters heat every drop of the water. Ring heaters only heat the water that falls on them.

Basic rule of thumb is if you can see the heater it's not a flow through water heater.

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 2:51PM
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@ jakvis: hmmm - without checking them out in person yet, what can we see in the specs or marketing verbiage on-line that can show us this?

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 3:03PM
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I know the Meile, Bosch and Asko have flow through heaters throughout their lineup but I'm not sure about the others.
Bosch always gets the top ratings from CR and they have some great midpriced machines so I don't think you can go wrong with them. Of course I own a Bosch so I tend to lean that way for my customers when they ask the same questions you are. For $900 you can get a great Bosch since their pricing goes from around $500 to $2000 with the most expensive models having built in water softeners.

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 3:32PM
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Thank you jackvis! After I posted that question. I also googled & found that the Bosche are indeed Flow through heaters equipped.

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 4:05PM
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Whatever you get make sure it has a flow through water heater instead of an ring element heater. Flow through heaters heat every drop of the water. Ring heaters only heat the water that falls on them. That's not true. Any heat emitted inside the tub by an exposed element gets to the water and dishes. The individual water drops inside the tub aren't isolated from each other ... so any given drop that's heated by contacting an exposed element transfers that heat to the rest of the water.

The only real advantaged to a hidden water heating element is that it doesn't create direct heat to dishware loaded in the rack above, which can damage plastic and other such items.

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 4:57PM
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dadoes you are correct.
I guess a more correct statement would be that you want a flow through heater because is has faster and more efficent water heating due to direct contact of 100% water being pumped verses 10 to 20% of the water that happens to fall directly on the exposed heater and then transfers to heat the other 80 to 90% of the water. Typically flow through heaters heat the water at about 2 degrees per minute. ( some faster some a little slower) Ring heaters do ok in maintaining the temp of already hot water but are not very efficent in quickly heating the water due to the indirect contact of the water to the heater.

And as you state, the flow through heaters don't melt the plastic items you may place in the d/w.

    Bookmark   August 3, 2012 at 6:05PM
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I'm looking for a new DW. My head is turned by those with silverware tray at the top. Miele has this feature. In the $900-$1000 range I prefer the Kitchenaid because it seems to have more flexibility inside with fold down tines etc. Does Kitchenaid make a DW with a top tray or drawer for silverware (cutlery as the brits would say)? Getting tired of washing dishes by hand for 8 days now. I don't want to blow making the right choice. $700 to $1050 I guess is the max I will consider. SS steel inside/outside. quiet, reliable, efficient. Any help?

    Bookmark   October 7, 2012 at 3:31PM
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LG LDF8072ST is the only DW with full size cuterly rack in the sub $1050 market.Dishwashers are not the core competancy of LG and they have not been making them for very long. I would not buy one.

Bosch 800 Plus dishwashers can be found just above your target price with full size cuterly tray. If you look around Craigslist,Ebay,local clearance/sales you may find one in your price range. Made in Germany. Excellent dishwashers.

Asko also makes them with cutlery rack in the center of the three racks but way above your price point.

And you know about Miele.

    Bookmark   October 7, 2012 at 5:01PM
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The higher end of Bosch's entry-level Ascentia series (with the plastic base) are bargains and still quite affordable (look for one for 50db sound rating or lower - I think all the new ones are). Some of them have a deeper top rack that takes advantage of new thinner door design, with a dip only in the middle to clear the soap dispenser. I'm told the plastic base makes service easier than on their more expensive all-stainless-steel models.

Some Kenmores are rebranded Bosch machines - it's easy to tell them apart when the door is open.

Samsung would be nice if they were quieter. LG pretty good, still not as reliable or quiet as Bosch, but both Korean brands have larger racks than Bosch has, able to easily hold large plates on top and deeper front to back, and both also have the flow-through heater with no exposed heating element and (IIRC) no exterior vent.

    Bookmark   October 7, 2012 at 6:31PM
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mryp--KA does make at least 1 model with the silverware tray on the top. We saw it when we were looking for DWs--I think they're available in the KUDE60 line. There may be more models with it, but not sure.

Hope this helps!

    Bookmark   October 7, 2012 at 9:02PM
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deeageaux, the LG LDF7561ST also has the top (cutlery) rack, and can be had for $897 -- it seems the same as the 7551 except the price is $100 higher and it has the 3rd rack. The cutlery rack design lets you turn one half or the other 180 degrees to change the depth.
The other design thing I like is that the lower rack tines can be turned down in groups (every other row) to allow different thicknesses of plates/bowls.

I don't own one, just now shopping.

Here is a link that might be useful: adjustable cutlery rack.

    Bookmark   October 7, 2012 at 11:05PM
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One of my sisters has the KUDS30IXSS from Kitchen Aid. She got it five months ago and loves it, especially the Pro Scrub cycle and the One Hour cycle. Price is around $800, YMMV. No third upper cutlery rack.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 7:14AM
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I am also in the market for a dishwasher because we are remodeling out kitchen. We originally bought all Bosch appliances, then had to change out the fridge (because we needed a counterdepth and the Bosch was $7500!), and now I am getting cold feet about the dishwasher.

Thing is we had a Bosch dishwasher in our previous kitchen and there were some things that I just didn't like. This however was five years ago so maybe things have changed.

I didn't like the water sitting in the filter area (apparently it's for lubricating the rubber parts) - I always felt that that was a cause for machine stink.

I didn't like the way it had these two little flanges along the side which was supposed to integrate it with the flanking cabinets. That looked cheap to me.

I don't know if things have improved in the past five years but since we probably will go with the Bosch again I really hope they have.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 12:54PM
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If you had more than 1 inch of water at the bottom of the sump way under the filter the install of the drain hose was probably the issue. Also if you could see the cabinet attachment screws your trim pieces were probably not installed or installed correctly.

Also regarding the 1 inch of water. This is the water left after the final rinse so it should be clean. Again this depends if your install was correct.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 1:43PM
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jakvis: It's all a haze but I do believe we had a technician come out to redo the installation. Maybe the outflow tube was too low. The water in the sump was always about 1" or so.

As far as attaching to the side cabinets, I saw no screws but I did see these plastic (or rubber) flaps, that I thought were kinda cheesy for such an expensive machine. They were there to hide the side screws. I am going to go to the appliance store after work to look if the Bosch I am buying still has those dopey flaps! I was toying with the idea of installing removable scribe moldings if it really bothers me again but I'll just play it by ear.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 2:44PM
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The "flaps" are actually part of the noise reduction. They are supposed to seal against the cabinet edges to keep noise contained under the cabinet. Most people don't notice them.

On a side note regarding stinky dishwashers. We are seeing more of this in the field with all brands. It's mainly to do with the removal of phosphates from the detergents. This is allowing lime and calcium to build up at a faster rete than previously experinced. this hard water deposits ate porous and hold the odors. In some areas we are telling our customers to run citric acid cleaners about every 4 months due to their hard water.
Where a dishwasher has really build up a lot of deposits I've had to run up to 3 citric acid baths to clean out all the calcium.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 4:03PM
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I actually used to run the citric acid cleaners every once in awhile and they work! I am just second guessing myself with the Bosch. Maybe I have Miele envy. This is what happens when you order your appliances way before the cabinets are ready! I am getting Bosch induction cooktop, single oven and microwave and those I am definitely NOT changing.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 4:35PM
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Water left in the drain area is normal for just about all dishwasher brands. This keeps the rubber seals from drying out and leaking.

    Bookmark   October 8, 2012 at 7:16PM
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I vote for a Whirlpool with food disposer, the voyager platform that is uses has proven to be very reliable and cleans well. Parts are readily availabe, we are on our second one, first one made it ten years with one repair. Second one is on year 2 no problems. We just scrap off excess food and let the dishwasher do the rest. Never had a dirty dish come out even after they removed the phosphates. Hope this helps.

    Bookmark   October 10, 2012 at 7:29AM
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Forgot to add one thing, steer clear of Whirlpool refrigerators, have had two in a row that were lemons, neither made it to the 5 year mark.

    Bookmark   October 10, 2012 at 7:32AM
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