Size of Hood Insert for custom wood - ModernAire/Prestige

new_morningJuly 19, 2013

Sorry if this is a repeat post, I can't seem to find the answer to this question anywhere.

After reading every thread on GW on hoods, I think we've settled on these criteria: 42" hood over 36" range, 1200cfm, 27" Depth (if possible). We have 8' ceilings, and the vent, if possible, will go straight out back (exterior wall). Thus, motor will be internal/ inside hood.

With a custom build, the size of the hood can easily be 42"x27". Now, which liner to purchase? Here's what I'm not clear on:

1. The ModernAire can be purchased at either 24" or 27" depth. Will the larger make a difference (in quality of removing fumes/smell) if it is raised inside a 42x27 custom hood? In other words, is the 27" more powerful, are the baffles actually any larger? Does anyone own this product - what do the baffles actually measure?

2. The comparable Prestige Power Pack UIB401200 (40" insert, 1200 cfm) specifications (on AJ Madison site) read that the depth is 15", and the
Cutout Width: 37 1/8"
Cutout Depth: 16 5/8". What does this mean? And can I assume that this product would be inferior to the ModernAire at a larger depth (or is the actual baffle size the same on both products)??


Thanks for anyone who owns these, or has info on these, and can chime in!

Also, one more side note: I was told that it does not make a difference whether you put in a liner around the insert, as long as the liner is raised 6" or so. Thoughts?

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Also just wanted to throw this out there: with the pricing of any of the above hood INSERTS mentioned, is a bill of 2K (or just under) just silly high? I'm only considering it because it has been reviewed by many as the best product. And I cook heavily w/ smells and fumes, and have an open floor plan, and low ceilings.

If there is a better bang for buck hood insert out there that would be of comparable quality, please let me know. Thanks in advance!

    Bookmark   July 19, 2013 at 10:24PM
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With that information, I'm confused too. My guess is that the two sets of information are using different terminology.

My guess from the wording is that the Prestige has a smaller aperture than the ModernAire, and that it is smaller than you want, but I can't be certain.

I also don't know how the words liner and insert are being used in your last paragraph; often these are used interchangeably to mean a hood without a fancy exterior that is to be covered by a cabinet.

Because I don't have either of these, I can only write generically. For clarity (and this may only apply to this message), let me call the size of the hood or insert aperture along the long dimension of a cooktop the length, the size transverse to this along the short dimension of a cooktop the width, and the vertical size between the aperture opening and the duct interface the height, just like one might describe a cardboard box sitting on the ground.

Choosing a length of 42 and width of 27 inches is good. Smaller will in many cooking instances lead to more leakage of effluent around the hood. Height is helpful, but of secondary importance to capture and containment except that short heights probably lead to increased pressure losses at the duct transition, thereby slightly reducing the actual cfm from a given fan.

Powerful is not the correct adjective for the question of 24 vs. 27 (or vs. 16). The larger the hood for the same fan/blower, the lower the velocity at the aperture, and hence one could use the term in a way that larger was less powerful. Larger would, however, be more effective. In any case, the rated cfm should increase with aperture area to have the same effectiveness in containing rising effluent at the higher velocities that some cooking can achieve.

One doesn't want to put a liner high in the wood cabinet that is forming the exterior of the hood. All wood exposed to grease should be protected by metal, both for cleaning and safety. I would want the aperture of the insert/liner to have a lip at the bottom that overlapped the wood. But if this wasn't included, I would want to have strips fabricated at a local sheet metal shop that I could apply to the wood edge.

The aperture of the insert (which should be the counterpart of the interior of a standard hood), must fit to the baffles in a way that precludes inducing effluent from "reflecting" out of the hood (plume spillage). The sides can taper, and the baffles can be installed over a range of tilt angles, all of which can make the baffle sizes vary from one hood to another.

So, in order of action in the capture and containment process, start with a large enough aperture then ensure sufficient actual cfm at full power. This second step has to account for all the issues you have seen discussed on reading every GW hood thread. (This by itself should merit some GW reward for patience.)


    Bookmark   July 20, 2013 at 10:18AM
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The least expensive insert with 1200 cfm for a 42" custom hood from a "good" brand is the Best CPDI362SB which at ajm is $1215. The top performing products are rarely "best bang for the buck" you usually pay a premium for the last bit of extra performance. It is roughly twice as loud as the Prestige and only the baffle filters are made of 304 SS the rest is made of cheaper 430 SS.

Trade-Wind PSL74212 is like a poor man's VAH with twin squirrel cage blowers but with baffle filters. Should be quiet but then you have to clean those squirrel cage blowers, it does not specify 304 SS but looks like thin 430 SS to me. Just a shade under $1300.

I think all the baffle filters are 12" squares but set at different angles. The MA insert is 12" high vs the Prestige at 14' which gives the area under the hood a different depth.

MA changed their units a few years ago with maximum performance in mind to handle what the Capital Culinarian was cooking. So my guess is that MA > Prestige.

    Bookmark   July 20, 2013 at 3:28PM
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Thanks - so it looks like if I want the premium, I go with the MA (with in no certain terms the Prestige being a solid second choice).

I still am confused as to the actual size of the hood inserts, and wish I could just hold them side by side. I wish I could make a decision just by looking at them. Anyone have pictures or own these and can help me compare!??

Kas - you're right, my last paragraph was unclear, sorry. By 'insert' I meant the actual appliance/box that housed the blower and baffles, and 'liner' would be the flat metal sheet (that would extend from the lip of the wooden hood to the insert on all 4 sides, likely at a sight upwards angle, if the insert is raised say 6" above the lip of the wooden hood, inside the hood). Maybe my terminology is off, but I hope that makes sense!

I've also gathered from this discussion, that perhaps this is not quite comparing apples to apples? If slight variations exist in each product (i.e. size of baffles, angle of baffles, depth, height), then there's no way outside of mathematical calculations to know exactly which product will best remove the effluent - and that means I have to just trust that when they say "1200 cfm" that it is actually operating at 1200, regardless of all those measurements which are in question.

Deeageaux - thanks for the other recs, just what I was looking for. I had looked for the Best, but didn't see it in 1200cfm, so I will look again. I think I could live with lower quality ss, and a little more noise. Question: is the height difference (12 v. 14") in the MA and Prestige relevant? Won't the location of the motor/hood insert be determined by where the contractor places it inside the hood (lower or higher), or am I totally reading this wrong?

Wow, $1250 is a stark difference from $1800-2000. Maybe this should be an obvious choice for me? :)

    Bookmark   July 21, 2013 at 2:30AM
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The height is the measurement of the units themselves.

Placing the Prestige higher or lower inside the wood hood itself does not change the insert itself at 14".

The Best is roughly twice the noise and the lower quality SS could lead to rust and will look different than your other SS appliances, which I take is all 304 SS? Maybe you are getting a lower priced microwave with a 430 SS door skin? The choice of SS is not a purely academic issue.

    Bookmark   July 21, 2013 at 3:34AM
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I'd go with the Modern Aire, the 27" depth is a huge advantage over the 16 5/8" depth on the Prestige, at whatever cost difference...

    Bookmark   July 21, 2013 at 9:51AM
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At best, the 1200 cfm is that of the entire package, without correction for any pressure losses from the ducting connecting it to outside, and without consideration of any pressure losses in supplying make up air.

After all, not even the most conscientious manufacturer can guess those two parameters.

At worst, it is the zero static pressure performance of the fans themselves, without consideration of the further pressure losses across the baffles and those at transitions such as the aperture and duct interface.


    Bookmark   July 21, 2013 at 10:55AM
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Thanks, Got it. Thanks for helping me try to compare/quantify some of these issues. So much to consider.

If anyone has used the MA, Prestige, or Best insert with liner in a custom hood, PLEASE let me know if you have any tips for me re: installation, or what exactly to tell the cab maker and installer. I'd hate to spend this much, and not have the desired, effective outcome.

Hope this thread can help others in the same situation. Thanks!

    Bookmark   July 21, 2013 at 12:51PM
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Hi new_morning,
Have you decided on a specific insert? I am wondering also, please, which specific Modern-aire insert you were considering that was 27" deep? Were you referring to the insert that is 22.5" deep being housed in a 27" custom hood?
The information in this thread is very helpful. I am on the same insert quest that you were on, except that I may have an 8" duct constraint. I'll be posting a question on that shortly, but am curious where you landed on your search.
Thanks, Ott2

    Bookmark   July 24, 2013 at 2:56PM
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