Help with roof lines for addition

kangaroo3March 15, 2013

We are planning to add on to our 1400 sq ft single story ranch, but are having trouble figuring out how to tie into the existing roof in a cost effective yet attractive manner.

Currently, we have a T-shaped footprint, with dutch gable hip roof on three ends and a small jag in the middle where they connect. Below is the existing floor plan showing the roof direction.

The proposed floor plan will be about 2500 sq feet and will change the location of the garage door to a side entry. We are also considering extending the garage portion an extra 4 feet (not drawn yet, but would increase the garage depth).

Any help with the roof situation or feedback on the floor plan would appreciated.

Existing roof lines:

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kangaroo3

Proposed floor plan:
(Note, we are considering extending the depth of the garage by 4 feet)

This post was edited by kangaroo3 on Fri, Mar 15, 13 at 21:15

    Bookmark   March 15, 2013 at 9:05PM
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renovator8

You need to draw a proper roof plan not just some lines over the upper floor plan. This drawing is missing some important roof lines and I only see one Dutch gable hipped roof, not 3.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2013 at 10:44PM
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kangaroo3

Thanks for the reply.

I posted the sketch so it would show the general framing of the roof. There is a dutch gable hip on each of the 3 ends of the house. The lines show the peaks and valleys. Below is another view.

    Bookmark   March 17, 2013 at 12:59AM
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renovator8

I don't see a problem with what you have drawn.

    Bookmark   March 17, 2013 at 8:01AM
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kangaroo3

The first drawing is the footprint of the existing house, as is the 3D drawing showing the current roof.

The question I was asking is for design suggestions for the roof on the new floor plan (the second shown), so it ties into the existing roof. Our goal is to try to make it blend in (not look like a hodge-podge addition) and be conscious of cost.

In addition, an feedback or recommendations on the interior floor plan and flow would be greatly appreciated!

    Bookmark   March 18, 2013 at 11:52PM
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kirkhall

I can't get a handle on how the new layout is compared to the old to discuss the rooflines.

At this point, I'd suggest starting with a whole roof tear-off. It might actually be cheaper. But, something else might come to light, if you can superimpose the current roof layout on your proposed layout...

As for your floorplan--
I'd reverse your garage door to mudroom door swing so you don't have to walk around the door to get to the mudroom area. I assume you'll have some cubbies or coat hooks in the long narrow area between the doors and the powder room.

Does the music room need walls? I think it would feel more open/larger without the awkward partitioning there that causes a lot of turning to get into the hallway. Also, those corners won't be fun to move bedroom furniture into/out of.

Any reason not to have a couple more windows on the right side of the house--bedroom and music room?

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 12:52PM
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bevangel_i_h8_h0uzz

To help everyone get a handle on how the new layout compares to the old, here is an image that superimposed your old roof on top of your proposed new layout.

I'm not a roofing expert but I frankly don't see any way to tie new roof sections in to the old roof line. For one thing, there is no way you can keep that front facing dutch gable.

You need a new ridge line running across the width of the house, It will probably need to be positioned about where the ridge line of the right facing dutch gable is now but it will need to run clear over to the left side of the house. You can't keep the right-facing gable because the new roof on the right hand side needs to cover a wider span than the current right-facing gable due to the two new bedrooms on the right side making the house deeper. If you try to keep the current ridge and back half of the right side dutch gable, you have to decrease the slope of the front half significantly in order to make the roof stretch far enough to cover the new bedrooms.

Same thing is true on the left side except to an even greater degree.

And of course the center dutch gable gets swallowed up as you stretch the two side gables forward although you might be able to convert the dutch gable part of it into some sort of dormer.

Overall, I think you'd be better served - and will find it cheaper - to design a whole new roof to fit the new footprint.

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 3:13PM
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Naf_Naf

You did not draw the existing roof plan accurately.
There is one line that is missing, otherwise it can not work.
On the very first drawing, you need to draw a ridge line that start on the top corner, parallel to the ridge line of the right bump (the one with the dutch gable to the right)

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 3:55PM
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kangaroo3

Thank you for all the replies! Good point on switching the door, once we have a mudroom. I'll also have to think about removing the wall to the bonus/music room. My thought with the wall and large doors was to close off that room if it's too noisy and open it up to use with the kitchen/dining area.

After trying some other things, we are working on the design below (still being finalized). There will be engineered trusses on the addition, which will then be tied in to the existing roof. We will probably also change the existing dutch gable on the right side to a gable end, to be similar to the front and left side. (That change still needs to be fixed.)

Proposed roof plan:

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 4:28PM
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kangaroo3

3D view of proposed roof:

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 4:31PM
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bevangel_i_h8_h0uzz

Wow that's complex. I think I need to see it from several different angles just to totally understand how the parts fit together. Sometimes 2D drawings of 3D objects can fool the eye but I'm sure you've verified that it actually "works" in three dimensions. If not, it would be helpful if you would post several images taken from different directions.

I won't go into the aesthetics of the design except to say that I personally don't care for it.

If you like how it looks and it "works", then the only question is how much of the design will require new framing and how much of it will use original framing. Since the less complex a roof is, the cheaper it is to build, does it make sense economically to build part (50%? 60? 70%) of a very complex design so that you can use existing framing for the remaining portion? Or would it be less expensive to tear the whole thing off and build 100% of a less complex design.

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 5:33PM
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renovator8

The second 3D model bears little resemblance to the first one. What happened to the Dutch hipped gables?

I have no idea what you are asking.

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 7:28PM
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kangaroo3

Renovator8 - The two models don't look much alike, do they! :) In the second model, we've absorbed each of the Dutch hipped gables into the new roof. Regarding the purpose of the post, I wanted to know if anyone had a better roof plan suggestion.

bevangel - I appreciate your comment about the aesthetics. This is definitely not an architectural house, but just trying to do the best we can within our constraints. It won't look out of place, though, in the area.

With this design, the existing framing will remain on the current roof, and get tied in with the addition. We are going to re-shingle the entire roof anyway, as it needs it. As we continue this process of drafting the plans, we will need to consider your points about the cost of a complex added on roof versus a complete tear off.

Thanks for everyone's feedback!

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 10:24PM
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kangaroo3

2D view of garage side:

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 10:25PM
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kirkhall

What climate do you live in? You have some nasty valleys that will catch EVERYTHING--snow, ice, leaves, pine needles, rain, dirt. Unless you happen to be in a arid SW location, that roof is a liability, imo. And, if you are in the SW, that is a lot of roof area to have to insulate for energy efficiency.

Do seriously ask yourself and your contractor if you will be better off with a complete roof tear-off.

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 11:09PM
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GreenDesigns

You need to STOP, drop back, and reassess the entire building plan. The addition as pictured will be awkward to use and the traffic patterns don't work very well. It's not just the roof that is the problem. The root is the poor plan for the addition. There's not enough clearance for the functions as pictured. There may be a better solution that you haven't thought of that might not involve so many awkward compromises. Post the original plan and what your goals are for this space.

    Bookmark   March 20, 2013 at 8:01AM
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kangaroo3

Here is a quick shot of the existing floor plan. Our goals are to:
* Have four bedrooms and an office (or 5 bedrooms)
* Kids bathroom with separate door to tub/toilet
* Add walk-in closet to master
* Single story
* Not move the kitchen, but move the pantry closet in the mudroom to the kitchen area
* Expand mudroom, so we can have storage and a place to take off shoes, etc.
* We can only build out in the front, limited on the sides, and not in the back
* Two separate living areas (one for kids, one for adults)
* Master bedroom somewhat separate from kids bedrooms (master and office/5th bedroom together are good).
* Make wood stove central in the house
* We need to live in the house during the addition, so minimizing impact to house (not tear off entire roof)
* I'd like a front porch and like craftsman/ranch/casual style homes
* Cost is a large issue, so compromises are willing to be made to keep the budget down

Please let me know if it would be better to start a separate post. Thanks!

    Bookmark   March 20, 2013 at 12:03PM
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dadereni

I would have advised extending out from the sides but you said those are constrained. It might be cost-competitive to build UP. Have you considered that, are there limitations?

    Bookmark   March 20, 2013 at 3:56PM
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kangaroo3

We could build up, however we strongly prefer a single story home, unless there was a compelling reason for the second story (ie, a single story was unfeasible or the second story addition was significantly more cost effective).

We can go out 4 additional feet on the left and about 5 feet on the right.

    Bookmark   March 20, 2013 at 5:22PM
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