Kitchen Family Room Floor Plan

jebroughFebruary 6, 2013

I have a houseplan that I am going to build in about 2 months. I am trying to figure out furniture placement, appliances, cabinets, etc. for the kitchen family room. We added 4 ft. to the back of the house which extends the kitchen out that much. My wife wants a banquette, a small powder room, and a sink in the laundry room. I am having a hard time trying to move things around in order to make it all fit. We may have to lose the powder room. Any suggestions?

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pps7

What is the function of that family room? The way it is drawn you can put a pair of chairs but that is about it.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 5:33PM
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jebrough

Thanks! The Kitchen/FR will be approx. 22' x 22' after the addition of the 4' on the back of the home.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 5:38PM
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jebrough

Thanks virgilcarter. I forgot to add that we are relocating the garage doors to the left side of the house. This is a stock plan, so I am not sure why the driveway was by those doors in the first place?? My main problem is trying to fit everything into the kitchen/area since we will probably be spending most of our time there. Right now I have a few weeks to make changes to this plan.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 5:54PM
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athensmomof3

You need 4' behind the island if you plan to eat at the island to allow people to walk behind someone sitting at the island and the typical club chair is 3' deep so I am not sure that will even fit.

If you do a flush hearth, you may be able to fit two small club chairs facing the kitchen on either side of the hearth and an ottoman in between and still have room for stools - preferably backless.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 7:13PM
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GreenDesigns

This plan cannot work if you plan to have that be a usable family room. It need way more than a 4' bumpout. More like an 10' bumpout. And the kitchen is darn awkward for it's size. No real prep space at all, and I can't see where you'd even eat in this home. Perhaps the "family room" could be a small dining area, but only if you lose the fireplace. As it is, you have a pantry blocking the possibility of more light in the kitchen, and frankly, I think it's oriented the wrong direction.

Why do you have a family room and a great room? One is too large, and one is too small, and they serve the same purpose? And no dining room, or breakfast room. Just birds or a wire seating crowded onto the island.

I'm sorry, but this plan would be very unpleasant to actually live in as is.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 7:23PM
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mydreamhome

When you say you're adding 4' to the back of the house, do you mean width or depth? If I'm reading the plans properly, the distance from the edge of the island to the fireplace is 10'2". Extending that room out the back of the house 4' (depth) does not help. The room needs to have greater width--14'2" is better, but still not ideal. It almost seems like that space is really going to be a very wide hall or more of a keeping room (which usually aren't located in the middle of the house just beyond the foyer.) Likewise, the laundry area would benefit from being wider as well if you want to fit all those options in. Adding the 4' to the back of the house doesn't even give you enough space for a powder room in that space.

Probably not what you want to hear when you're planning to break ground in 2 months, but better to delay the build than move ahead and end up with rooms that just don't work and will inevitably make it nearly impossible to sell if you want to try again.

Just my $0.02.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 8:45PM
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kirkhall

I'm with the above. The FR in this plan functions more like a sitting nook, not a true family room that you'd be able to put a sofa in.

    Bookmark   February 6, 2013 at 11:21PM
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jebrough

Well, this is the plan that I have to build so for you architects out there, here is something that I am going to try to do and would like your advice. I cannot add any more square footage to this home. I was trying to keep it under 3000 sq. ft., but it is now 3500 sq. ft. That is as large as I can go.
The pantry takes up a lot of wall space with the door being where it is. I am hoping to relocate the pantry to the mudroom area, move the door from the garage into the kitchen down, and put the laundry room where the pantry used to be. The former laundry room can be the mudroom where it flows right into the laundry room. I am still not sure if there is enough room for the pantry, so I wonder if there is a way to encroach into the Great Room, and somehow make it all look right. The architect probably won't want to make these changes, so I will have to try to do it with the builder. As far as the reason for moving the house out 4', we had to make a hallway upstairs to get to the attic/playroom which was only accessible through a closet. Therefore, we had to add that downstairs also.
With the relocation of the pantry, that will free that wall up for counter/cabinets. I would like to take the sink off of the island and put it on the middle of the wall where the refrigerator is now, and put cabinets on either side. Then relocate the refigerater to the opposite wall, across from the island, where it says "Base Upper Cabinets".

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 11:17AM
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kirkhall

Will you please post your whole plan? And, also a sketch of what you described above?

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 11:54AM
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live_wire_oak

All I did here was shorten the too long living room and then widen both it and the "family room". Now the proportions of the living room make sense, and there is an eating area for the family to gather.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 12:18PM
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auroraborelis

live_wire_oak - that is a great way to make this plan usable!

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 1:26PM
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kirkhall

That is a great revision LWO, but for the OP, I am thinking it has more modifications (esp to roof) than what the builder can do without engineering... Unless I am mis-reading what it looks like you revised.

IMO, though, it would be money well spent to have that revision properly drawn out/engineered rather than trying to use what you have.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 1:49PM
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jebrough

Here we go. I am attempting to scan and upload the 1st and 2nd floors. I do not have the software to do this, so I am cutting and pasting. Be kind. Thanks LWO for the redraw. Looks good, but wife wants to keep the fireplace in the kitchen. Here are the originals and my mods. Looking forward to your suggestions.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 3:30PM
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jebrough

Not sure why that is so small. I will try it again.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 3:33PM
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jebrough

First Floor

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 3:39PM
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lavender_lass

I like the fireplace, but I love kitchens with fireplaces :)

If you want to keep the island with seating, then a couple of comfy chairs (and maybe an ottoman) by the fire will work beautifully! If you need a kitchen table, then you might have to rethink the island and make it more of an eat-in kitchen and move the sink to the back wall...with a window. The fridge could move down to the other wall, against the living room.

If you plan to have the dining table in the great room, then I like the island and the cozy seating area would be a great place to sit and talk to someone, while they're working in the kitchen...or to read a book on a cold, winter day!

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 3:41PM
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jebrough

2nd Floor

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 3:45PM
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jebrough

1st Floor with added 4' on rear Revised by Me

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 4:13PM
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jebrough

2nd Floor Revisions - Home was extended 4' in the rear to allow for an upstairs hallway so attic could be used as a playroom. Not sure how to put a door down there? We will see. (the door was in the bedroom closet)

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 4:28PM
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kirkhall

Trying to add the space upstairs by just adding 4' out the back is not working at all on your first floor. You have really awkward, long rooms that don't function well.

How married are you to this plan? I know you purchased it already, but you might be better off to "eat" this cost and find something better. It definitely needs more work than something the builder can adjust on the spot.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 5:27PM
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jebrough

Thanks kirkhall. Very married! The only rooms that change are the kitchen/family and the Master. However, we do have an architect who will revise it according to our requests for a $$$$ price. It is worth it to have him do it. Just trying to keep the sf low.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 5:49PM
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jebrough

Actually, the other rooms that change are the upstairs rooms, but not by very much. Bedroom 2 actually needed to be a bit larger.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 6:07PM
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mydreamhome

Since you're already pushing the envelope square footage wise, have you thought about just adding 4' to the width of the garage? It would get the garage off the main house a bit and allow for a staircase to the attic playroom. That should be much more cost effective than adding 4' to 2 levels out the back + the rooms will be more proportionate.
But it still doesn't solve the family room really being more in line with a small keeping room size.

I can't make out the dimensions on the great room--I think it's either 23', 25' or 28' long. What if you shortened it by a few feet and added the saved square footage into the family room? Or what if you pulled the great room back in some and made it the small family room/keeping room and added that save square footage into the current family room adjacent to the kitchen? (Note: I haven't figured up the sq. footage on that option.)

I get the idea of a fireplace in the kitchen area & I like it, however, keep in mind that deleting that fireplace will save ~$3,000-5,000+ (depending on style and finish). Especially since you're already pushing the envelope with square footage, it may be money well saved. Just a thought.

Hope this helps!

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 6:23PM
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jebrough

Thanks for your suggestions mydreamhome. The Great Room is 25'x 17'6". I was thinking of shortening it as well, but only about 5'. We can't pull it in very much, as it will not look good the way the exterior is designed. Also, we will have a dining room table in there.
The upstairs playroom is for the kids to use upstairs so they don't have to come down the stairs and through the kitchen in order to go to their playroom. They could use the door in Bedroom 2, however, our girls would not like the boys going through their room to get to the playroom. lol

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 7:46PM
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kirkhall

I like the second staircase idea.

I am not sure your plan to add the 4' to get to the attic play room is actually a viable option. There is a vault on that playroom ceiling, which means the door to it might be limited in height. There are requirements for door/ceiling heights for habitable space...

I live in a cape cod style house, which means our upstairs is under the eaves/we have slanted ceilings. It was very tricky to get a door in not much off center. You are pretty far off center for your door. What is the pitch of that vault?

Also, people will be tempted to call that a bedroom. But, you'll need to meet egress code (maybe even without calling it a bedroom--you'll want to check into that) as soon as it is something other than attic. Your dormer windows will likely need to be operable casements or similar to meet egress...

Other food for thought, and things for you to check on in your municipality.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 7:50PM
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jebrough

Here is a an example of what I am trying to achieve upstairs without adding as much sf as this one. I want to keep the one bathroom, but have the hallway extend to the attic/gameroom. (this pic has the words backwards because I had to flip it so it looked more like my upstairs)
kirkhall the roof pitch is 12:12

    Bookmark   February 7, 2013 at 10:06PM
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kirkhall

Yeah. I can't see the dimension, but it looks to read "5'0" wall... And, it does say 8' ceiling.

A 5' knee wall means your door into the playroom, as drawn, would only be 5' on the hinge side. That will not pass code.

See how, in your inspiration plan, the door is at the 8' ceiling point? It isn't in the pitched/vaulted portion of the ceiling.

If you extended the LENGTH of the house, as LWO did, you could orient the door from the hallway like your inspiration picture. But, now you are extending in 2 directions to achieve this playroom space.

I think if you love this plan, you need to play with the rooms... Cut them apart, literally, and rearrange and set them on top of each other in a number of ways to see if you get an arrangement that might work after reducing this or that dimension...

Not easy to do within the confines of this plan.

    Bookmark   February 8, 2013 at 1:26AM
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kirkhall

The other thing to consider...

Use the "bedroom" as the playroom/hall area (with no wall to divide out the hall area) and put the kids in the "bonus" room. Many cape cods have bedrooms in "attic" spaces and there are many charming rooms/inspiration pics on Houzz...

    Bookmark   February 8, 2013 at 1:33AM
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jebrough

Thanks kirkhall. I have gained a lot of insight and will be implementing your suggestions.

    Bookmark   February 8, 2013 at 10:37AM
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dash3108

I guess I'm surprised that the architect you're working with didn't do more to point out that the family room is too small to be functional? And I agree with a previous poster that the upstairs hallway, as you conceive of it, is not going to give you the door access you want to the extra space because of the roof pitch. Which again, makes me question the architect - does he know about your plan to do this? He should have immediately pointed out to you that it won't work.

Also, with the 4' added the way you're talking about, the master bedroom seems ridiculously long. So much wasted space.

There are SO many stock plans out there - I hate to say this again, since you've already shot it down, but are you sure you can't start over? A 3,000-3,500 sq ft plan should allow for very efficient use of space if laid out well. It just seems like you're having to "force" things here that you will regret once you're in it.

    Bookmark   February 9, 2013 at 8:50AM
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virgilcarter

The "architect" sounds more like an inexperienced drafter than an architect. People seem to use these terms pretty loosely. An architect would be doing more that "drafting" the owner's changes.

I hope the family room can be made habitable and workable. Still seems awfully narrow between the kitchen island and the fireplace hearth.

Good luck on this project.

    Bookmark   February 9, 2013 at 10:22AM
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jebrough

The original architect was going to charge more than the amount for the original plans to make some changes. Therefore, my neighbor, who is an engineer took a stab at it, and he was free. He tried to make the changes on the second floor, but he said it was challenging. We are going to have a local architect look it over, and he can make any additional modifications for an hourly fee. Here are the first floor changes so far. What do you think?

    Bookmark   April 8, 2013 at 10:43PM
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jebrough

2nd Floor Modifications. It was suggested to add shed dormers to the rear of each bedroom in order to give more space. The idea is to have a playroom and 2 bedrooms/bath/closets. (2 girls and 2 boys.) My wife would like to add a washer and dryer up here somewhere as well. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

    Bookmark   April 8, 2013 at 10:53PM
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jebrough

This is a rough sketch by the original architect showing the beginning of what he could do to modify the 2nd floor.

    Bookmark   April 8, 2013 at 11:08PM
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kirkhall

Is that the laundry tossed in the girls closet? (that is a horrible arrangement)

Why not extend the "shed" all the way across and gain the additional eave space by the game room? Then, there will be plenty of room for laundry and appropriate access.

Also, small bathroom rooms should have an outswing door (girls bath vanity area to toilet/tub area should be pocket or outswing).

Finally, I am not seeing a reason to have a "dormer" on the far left end of the upstairs. Do you have hip roof? Why not extend the entire room out to the left wall and push the beds that way too?

    Bookmark   April 9, 2013 at 1:03AM
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jebrough

The upstairs is just an attempt from my neighbor. I will have a local architect finish it out. Thanks for the suggestions.

    Bookmark   April 9, 2013 at 8:09PM
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bird_lover6

Jeb, your back kitchen/sitting room is going to be very dark. I would consider losing some of the upper cabinets and putting a very large window on that back wall since you have a nice size pantry and what looks like enough storage in the kitchen. You might even want to make it a pass through with a bar, if you plan on entertaining in the back. Not only will you gain a lot of light, but your kitchen will also more "updated" with the larger window. That little window with the side cabinets looks like tract housing. :) I think you will be much happier with this arrangement, but - hey! - maybe not. :)

Good luck. I do like your revised plan!

    Bookmark   April 11, 2013 at 2:39PM
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