Toilets!

TerriJMFebruary 4, 2012

I never knew I would have so many decisions to make regarding new toilets....which brand, which height, elongated or round. I'd love to hear your opinions and advice! THANKS!

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petesmom

My personal opinion would be elongated (more comfy, more roomy and seem to be more modern, if there is such a trend for a potty) and one that is a bit higher. They are helpful as you age since they are easier to get off of. Brands I cant help with as I cant imagine that flushing hasnt been perfected by all manufacturers.

    Bookmark   February 4, 2012 at 6:12PM
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lynneblack

toto, elongated and ADA height if you have someone who is disabled or elderly in the house.

    Bookmark   February 4, 2012 at 6:38PM
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herring_maven

petesmon: I cant imagine that flushing hasnt been perfected by all manufacturers.

It hasn't. Really. Until a few years ago, when all manufacturers had five gallons or so to work with, flushing had been "perfected." But then came, successively, industry standards, quickly adopted in local, state, and federal codes, to limit the allowable amount of water per flush to 3.5 gallons, then 1.6 gallons (six liters), then 1.28 gallons (4.8 liters). A new toilet should need no more than 1.28 gallons for a full solids flush.

Most United States manufacturers of bathroom fixtures are decidedly low-tech, and as the water-use standards tightened, they redesigned their toilets by trial and error, and there were many errors. Meanwhile, the Japanese, who until very recently had no tradition of making toilets with pools of standing water in the bowl, undertook a crash intensive research regime, starting with (as it were) a clean sheet of paper.

As often happens with technological shifts, a single performance criterion has been seized upon by the uninformed. Remember the horsepower wars in the days of 1950s muscle cars? Remember "total harmonic distortion" and number of speaker cones in the cabinet in the early days of hi-fi/stereo? Remember the pixel wars in digital cameras? Remember CPU speed in personal computers? There is a test (the MaP test) for the number of a standardized size of synthetic turds (miso paste in a condom-like sleeve of plastic) that a toilet can flush in a single pass. Any toilet that can achieve a MaP score of about 400 or above will flush about anything that is likely to happen (a typical 250 gram dump will be flushed by a 250-score toilet), but you still have the uninformed who think a 900 MaP-rated toilet that leaves tracks or streaks on the inside of a bowl is superior to a 700 MaP-rated toilet that diverts and swirls some of the flush water sideways to clean the inside of the bowl and leave it clean.

Without question, the best toilets in the world today are Japanese designs, with the two leading Japanese manufacturers (Toto and Inax) engaged in a very spirited competition in which the current year's top Toto model is better than the last year's top Inax model while the current year's top Inax model is better than the last year's best Toto model, year after year. This is all documented (entertainingly) in Rose George's gripping documentary book, "The Big Necessity."

Speaking of a clean sheet of paper, the best thing you can do for yourself in installing a new toilet is to install an advanced toilet seat -- usually called a Washlet, but "Washlet" is a registered trademark of Toto; and probably the best advanced toilet seat, from a price-to-performance standpoint, is the Inax Clessence. But you need not have an Inax toilet to install an Inax Clessence toilet seat: almost all Inax advanced toilet seats fit almost all Toto toilets, and almost all Toto Washlets fit almost all Inax toilets.

Americans have been slow to adopt advanced toilet seats, a reluctance that any modern Japanese finds simultaneously amusing and perplexing. When you have been working hard outside in the garden and you come back inside dirty, muddy, and sweaty, do you wipe yourself off with a paper towel? No; you take a shower. The same considerations apply exactly to your post-defecation toilet experience.

    Bookmark   February 4, 2012 at 9:02PM
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davessels

On the low budget side.. We love the American Standard Cadet 3 elongated. This is the problem we are having today. As we are remodelling our second bath, 5-6 years later, we purchased the AS cadet 3 and love it, but cannot remember which one we purchased in 2006 as numbers have changed etc. It flushes once, done, is comfortable, no problems in 6-7 years, we do have the old HD number on our receipt, I hope we can figure it out, as we hated the 1.6 flush toilets of the 90's, had to flush twice wasting all that water.

    Bookmark   February 4, 2012 at 10:12PM
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kirkhall

You need not spend a fortune on a toto. I got my toto online, and recommend others do the same.

    Bookmark   February 4, 2012 at 10:47PM
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mydreamhome

Comfort height, definiely. Elongated seems to be favorite especially among men. We went with the new Kohler Wellworth--I believe you still have to go through a plumbing supplier for them as they're not avail at big box stores. Absolutely no problem with flushing even with copious amounts of paper and -er...um...waste.

Here is a link that might be useful: New Kohler Wellworth

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 1:43AM
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springroz

Kirkhall, did you purchase them from the Toto website or an online retailer? Would you mind posting the link?
Thank you!!

Nancy

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 9:18AM
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jssaustintx

Sorry to hijack, but could be helpful for you too, terrijm-

Does anyone know anything about the space saver elongated bowls? We have been looking at round bowls for more clearance because of small space between toilet and tub. Apparently there are new elongateds that the tank/bowl set up is set back so the "width" measures comparable to a round. I haven't found any yet though- anyone know brands that have this option? Thanks! JSS

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 11:28AM
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bill_g_web

Happy with my American Standard Champion 4, 18" high, elongated, 1.6 g flush. $225 at Home Depot. I looked at Totos because I wanted a full skirt for easy cleaning but the models in the showroom all had a sort of medical/clinical look to them.

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 11:34AM
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lynneblack

For our master bath we got a Toto Ultramax from our local plumbing supply store for $388 + tax, that's very competitive with online prices (see link below) When we did our guest bathroom a few years ago we got a Toto Carlyle which was around $450 online.

Here is a link that might be useful: Toto Ultramax

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 4:35PM
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mydreamhome

jssaustintx-I think Kohler makes the space savers in specific styles--they are typically their one piece toilets. Another space saving option we saw was to recess the tank part of the toilet into the wall behind it. You can just pretty much frame the tank from the floor up with enough clearance above to remove the tank lid or you could take the recess all the way to the ceiling or just shy of the ceiling giving it a framed look.

    Bookmark   February 5, 2012 at 4:52PM
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janealexa

This is a common topic on gardenweb. If you google "toilets on gardenweb" you'll find lots of old threads.

We also have the American Standard Champion 4 that bill_g_web mentioned above in all of our baths. Love the soft close seat & the stain resistant finish that it comes with. Also love the price compared to Totos. I originally wanted a full skirt, but I don't like how the full skirts are open in the back. Also with small boys (and even grown men!), if they miss the bowl and urine runs down the sides, the full skirt would result in more of a mess since the urine would end up all over the floor/grout. I know that sounds gross, but worth considering:)

    Bookmark   February 6, 2012 at 2:43PM
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jssaustintx

Thanks dreamhome- you're right about Kholer- its the Santa Rosa. AS has a "compact elogated" version of the Cadet 3, too.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2012 at 9:36PM
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kirkhall

I private messaged you. If you didn't get it, check your spam folder.

    Bookmark   February 7, 2012 at 11:10PM
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