pattern I D

walkabout1935November 4, 2009

I have a 9 1/2" X 5 3/8" X 1 3/8" high and a 12" X 8" X 1 1/4" high dishes. There is also 8 two handled cups 3 1/2" across X 2" high, and eight 6 1/4" plates. I guess this would be a set for some sort of use. I woud like to track down a pattern name. Can you help?

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lindac

It's a limoges pattern made before 1938 and the company was later bought out by Bernaudaud.
I am sure you can trace the pattern through Replacaments.
Linda C

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 12:11AM
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moonshadow

Here is a brief history of porcelain production in Limoges, France. Some fascinating little factoids there.

Here is a photo of your mark, identifying dates manufactured by Vignaud Freres. The "V" with grape vine is identified as Vignaud's mark V30b, used between dates of 1911 - 1938. However, your photos also shows the "FRANCE VIGNAUD LIMOGES" circular mark, which is identified as mark V30c, used in later years 1938-1970. Wonder why the two marks with conflicting dates? Unless it was made in 1938 so both marks were used...

This is just a personal observation, but your pattern almost immediately struck me as reminiscent of the 'mod' look of the latter 1960's (particularly in the daisy), versus the generally more delicate, ornate look of older pieces. That combined with two marks indicating different manufacture dates makes me wonder if it's newer rather than older...? Do you acquire it in a way that would offer some hint as to the date?

Here is the replacements.com Vignaud pages.

Despite all that, haven't found a pattern name yet...

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 8:19AM
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walkabout1935

Thank you for the links and info. These are part of an estate. I went through the vignaud list. Could not find a listing like the one pictured.

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 9:16AM
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moonshadow

You're welcome ;)

Don't know about you, but going through replacement's photos is not easy on the eyes! (Wish they'd make their thumbnails a tad bigger.)

I like a puzzle, and this one has me puzzled. ;)
Since we know to search for "Vignaud" patterns, hopefully we can locate the name.

I'm not completely convinced it's newer yet. I see wear around the edges at the gold. But that doesn't necessarily indicate age wear, could be user induced wear. Especially if someone like my DH were stacking and putting it away, ha!

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 9:56AM
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lindac

That china isn't new...I believe it dates about 1930....give or take 5 or 10 years.
Send a picture of a plate to Replacements and ask what the pattern is and if they have any tea cups in that pattern.
You will find out all you need to know.
Linda c

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 11:12AM
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moonshadow

lindac, since we can't locate the pattern (yet) and the double marks create a bit of contradiction as far as period of manufacture, I'm curious how you were able to date it within 5-10 yrs. How did you arrive at that conclusion?

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 3:34PM
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lindac

My gut...mainly. I have been looking at, studying and buying such sorts of china for a lot of years....you soon learn to recognize periods.
Also the arrangement of the words on the backstamp is very like the Haviland and the T AND V and the C F Haviland marks.
Also it is hand painted and decorated with 22 karat gold....couldn't afford to do that in 1960 and the pieces which the OP says she has sound to me like a formal boullion set....and the dates they would be popular would be from about 1880 to 1930....but the earlier china was more dainty and floral...so that makes me think later....like 1920 to maybe 35. And the fact that it says "france" not made in also points to earlier 20th century...
Put it all together....and you get somewhere pre-depression.
The double marks don't really mean much...lots and lots of limoges was made for the US market and as backstamps were changed, they didn't all change at once. It is not uncommon at all to see different pieces of what obviously is a set with different backstamps.
I would be curious to know if all the pieces the OP has bear the same stamp.
Linda C

    Bookmark   November 5, 2009 at 7:57PM
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walkabout1935

They all have the same marks, except the cups which have only one mark. This one.

    Bookmark   November 6, 2009 at 12:24PM
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Fori is not pleased

Isn't it this?:

They really do have terrible pictures!

Here is a link that might be useful: replacement.'s listing

    Bookmark   December 8, 2009 at 8:50PM
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moonshadow

Holy cow, fori! Good eyes!
I do believe you found it. Look at this one,
. Gold is thicker on the rim, just like in walkabout's photo above.
Nice work ;)

    Bookmark   December 8, 2009 at 10:01PM
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DLM2000

I'm just shakin' my head - you guys are GOOD. I might even learn something if I keep reading ;-)

    Bookmark   December 8, 2009 at 10:18PM
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Fori is not pleased

O that's cool. MY china pattern doesn't even HAVE a butter dish, let alone one with a lid. Not fair!

Yeah, I've finished the internet pretty much, so now I'm looking up china patterns. Bwahahaha!

    Bookmark   December 8, 2009 at 10:55PM
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moonshadow

HaHA ROFL!
;D

    Bookmark   December 9, 2009 at 6:46AM
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