Calling fellow manual CC owners

aliris19February 29, 2012

Anyone out there also own one of the "manual" Capital Culinarians? I would like to compare a note or two if you're willing to identify yourselves...

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Emilner

Hi, my name is Ed, and I am a CC owner...

    Bookmark   February 29, 2012 at 9:19AM
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aliris19

Hi Ed -- do you have a "manual" version? I think that's what they call the lower end, without rotisserie and rolling-racks one?

    Bookmark   February 29, 2012 at 11:28AM
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Emilner

Yes, I have a manual clean CC, although I don't consider it a lower end one...

    Bookmark   February 29, 2012 at 3:04PM
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aliris19

Hmmm... are we really the only two with a manual-clean CC?

I'm asking because I'm wondering if others have this problem: my non-rolling metal racks buzz and vibrate when the fan is on. The factory says this is just one of those things. But I'm wondering if it's just one of "my" things or whether others suffer this problem too please?

Thanks for sharing your experience with your non-rolling metal CC racks.

    Bookmark   February 29, 2012 at 11:45PM
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mabeldingeldine_gw

I just bought a "Manual" Capital Precision, to be installed Friday. I'll have to listen for this. Can't wait to try it!

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 7:09AM
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Emilner

I have no vibrations from the racks at all. Sounds like one could be twisted a little. They do make a heck of a screaching noise when opening- similar to all ovens with metal sliding racks...

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 9:44AM
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trevorlawson

Vibrating racks are not acceptable, two options.

1) Tighten the screw on the side walls.
2) Call Capital for service.

Also make sure the cover for the convection fan is nice and tight.

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 10:58AM
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aliris19

Trevor, I emailed you privately. Publicly, I'll pledge to shoutout if/when the problem gets resolved. It's been driving me nuts for months and months and months, but as I understood it was just "one of those thing", I didn't address the issue (apart from fleeing). Knowing that others are not having it, though, changes the picture.

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 1:01PM
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kist1

Do the manual ovens have a fan that blows over the top of the oven door that comes on when oven heats up and continues until it cools off?

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 3:54PM
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aliris19

Nope. There's a convection fan that you push in to turn on manually when you want to blow the air around inside the cavity of the oven. But it's not automatic and you can turn it off. Yeah!!!

It's part of the oven's convection-like capacity, not cooling system. I think it's not a true convection because the oven is not electric, as I understand these terms. But it does the analagous thing for a gas oven -- i.e., keeps hot air circulating.

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 4:40PM
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Caddidaddy55

kist1, Aliris19 is wrong. While the convection fan is manual, there is an automatic fan in front to keep the control panel cool. Mine has never kicked in using regular bake or even broil. It does cycle intermittently when using convection mode, but has never continued to run after the oven is shut off. If yours does, the oven door may not be sealing properly. Maybe the people who delivered/installed your range used the door handle to lift the range thus damaging the door.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 8:20AM
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aliris19

Wow, Caddi -- this is fascinating. I had no idea!

I've never heard mine -- either it's absent (earlier model? damaged?), never kicked in, or -- as I suspect is the case -- is unable to be heard above the din of the rattling racks!

How would I check/know? Is it loud? Where is the fan located - is it physically visible?

This makes sense of course. That is, as I wrote the above out I did start to wonder: why not? Surely there must be some way to cool or vent.... I'm voting for my just never noticing it and I'm looking forward to finding it! This is a good thing, of course, in terms of the concern about a noisy, annoying fan spoiling the ambiance.

Thanks, Caddi.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 9:51AM
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Caddidaddy55

The fan is mandated by consumer safety regulations. The Culinarian is new enough it should have been there from the start. It is not visible, It is under the front panel. it is just to keep the front panel and controls cool, and in the case of the self clean the oven latch and electronics. As I mentioned mine never runs except when I use convection mode. It sounds more like a change in pitch of the convection fan, but not really much louder. Unless your front panel is getting hot I wouldn't worry about not hearing the fan. My CC is manual clean, the racks do not rattle. The rack positions suck, I think maybe you could put a sandwitch steak on the broiler pan in the top position, but who would broil that? The bottom rack position should be lower. I saw where Capital's fix was to add another rack position between the top and second position, and someone on this forum suggested they add a rack in between every position and below the lowest. I agree, that would make this range almost perfect. Now if I could simmer, sigh...............

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 11:04AM
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aliris19

So ... when you use the convection mode does the fan cycle on and off? Otherwise, how would you distinguish it from the convection fan? Though ... we've established my convection fan is abnormally loud.

Agreed about the rack positions. I've removed one of the racks altogether. Short of three massive pans of cookies or granola, it's hard to imagine how you could utilize all three racks at once with that partitioning.

I'd thought about, but haven't yet attempted, stacking racks up inside to get at inbetween positions. Trouble is they're not flat because of the hooks on the bottom -- I was thinking it might be possible to turn them upside down but again, haven't attempted it. Trouble is upside down probably won't gain height.

Actually, I hadn't realized this about the racks when I bought it. One of the things I liked was the prospect of rolling racks. The small print that noted this absence was drawn to my attention after I bought it. Technically my fault, but I was really miffed about it (fair or not).

Back to the fan: one of the things I liked about the non-electronicness of this was the prospect of not having to put up with one of those noisy cooling fans. But if there are no electronics, how does the cooling fan know to cycle while the convection fan is running? And if it isn't cycling then again, how do you know it's running?

Drat, forgot to buy a snazzy screwdriver. But frankly, I'm reluctant to because I don't believe it will help; these are the technicians' settings afterall.... Still, I feel that Trevor at least is trying, as always, so hard to find an extracurricular fix so I owe it to him to dot that i...

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 12:38PM
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Caddidaddy55

The fan just has a thermostatic sensor, when it reaches the preset temp inside the control panel it turns on, when cool enough it turns off. It has nothing to do with the convection fan. The way I see it the convection fan must push enough of the heat out of the front door that the panel warms up enough for the fan to come on. Your door may seal even better than mine, so your fan may not come on at all. When Capital's tech comes out to look at your racks/fan have them adjust your simmer for you. Capital advertises "All burners are capable of turning down to provide True Simmer of 145 degrees." so don't let them leave until they can prove it.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 1:09PM
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trevorlawson

From what i know the Manual range does not have a fan to keep the controls cool. Only the self clean ranges have an extra fan. I could be wrong so I have asked the factory for clarification.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 2:33PM
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aliris19

Hmmm ... but Caddi's is manual and he says he's heard the fan.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 5:20PM
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mangiamo

Hi everyone

I have a self clean model. The fan runs continuously (not intermittently) when ever I use the oven (regardless of whether I use convection or not). I had the service tech check the seal when he came to lower the simmer but I was told that it is a normal function of the range and it should run continuously until the ambient temperature around the controls falls to a set limit. It became an issue for me only because I am sensitive to white noise and the fans runs for the majority of the time we are having dinner.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 8:09PM
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aliris19

Oh dear, mangiamo -- I'm so sorry! That would drive me bonkers. You're helping give me back a spoonful of happiness for having the self-clean :)

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 8:56PM
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mangiamo

aliris XO Anything to say thank you for being a champion in the simmer issue.

    Bookmark   March 2, 2012 at 9:03PM
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Emilner

I have been told there is no cooling fan on manual units since they are not as electronics heavy. I'm quite happy frankly- my Thermador's oven fan was loud as hell and would stay on through dinner....

    Bookmark   March 3, 2012 at 7:05PM
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kist1

That's interesting about the cooling fan.

Not long ago (in the thread "bluestar vs culinarian ovens") Trevor asked someone at Capital's factory about the cooling fans and they responded:

The cooling fan does cool the electronics as you state in no. 1. In the ranges, the only electronics cooled is the door latch. The remainder are
electro-mechanical switches in the valve panel which stay within the operating range of the components during all operations.

And

On the ranges the door does not benefit from the cooling fan which develops a natural draft of heat from the bottom and out the top.

So the manual range has no door latch, the only electronics to cool, so why does it have the cooling fan?

To keep the door cool? Probably. That's not a bad thing in theory, but the trade-off is that it also cools the interior of the oven cavity (the inside of the door) as well. This results in an uneven bake and more gas usuage.

    Bookmark   March 3, 2012 at 8:09PM
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aliris19

Maybe that's why the bake is uneven? Except I don't think the manual *does* have a fan. I don't hear it at least. But I do think the interior cooking is uneven. Capital came out here and spent hours (and lots of fuel!) testing the evenness of the bake and decided it was perfect (using their thermometers as a metric). Only I continue to get uneven baking in practice. I've learned to compensate. I do a lot of rotating and rack swapping.

    Bookmark   March 3, 2012 at 8:21PM
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trevorlawson

the manual clean does not have a cooling fan according the factory person i spoke to, having said that i did email the engineer late Friday.

    Bookmark   March 3, 2012 at 8:43PM
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kist1

trevorlawson--you don't have access to a manual clean?

It shouldn't take a science project to determine if there's air blowing out over the top of the door.

    Bookmark   March 3, 2012 at 9:03PM
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aliris19

Kist - I do have access to one. If there's an internal fan, then, I'll just feel air jetting out the top? I'm pretty sure I don't, but I can check.

I have never seen Trevor's showroom but it would seem plausible that he might not have a manual-clean range on the showroom floor.

    Bookmark   March 4, 2012 at 1:37AM
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trevorlawson

Kist1... I have one in the store.

    Bookmark   March 4, 2012 at 8:46AM
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kist1

aliris19--yes, if there is one, after a period of time with the oven on 400, maybe an hour, a thermal switch will tell the fan to come on and you'll feel the air (and hear it) blowing over the top of the door from the vertical slots on the range body (not the slots at the top of the door as that's a natural convection current).

    Bookmark   March 4, 2012 at 11:19AM
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aliris19

OK, I'll be baking later today, probably -- I'll try to pay attention. Note that Trevor's asked and been told it's absent from the manual, I believe -- or maybe that was a question to one individual, with another individual yet to weigh in.

I actually hate the sound of those fans so I'm fairly confidant that had it been noticeable I would have already. So assume I haven't heard or felt anything, please, unless I report back otherwise, OK?

I'm not sure how to resolve this with Caddi's certitude. But I presume the factory's answer is the final word ... unless there's been a design change, which I suppose is possible. Or that Caddi's machine is somehow aberrant, which seems unlikely.

    Bookmark   March 4, 2012 at 12:24PM
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Aeteus

I'm having the same problem with the vibrating. It seems that the fan starts to vibrate causing the racks to vibrate and then it stops. Kind of like someone slowly turning a volume up and down.
Did tightening the screws fix the problem or do you still have the vibrating?
Thanks...

    Bookmark   September 27, 2012 at 6:55PM
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aliris19

aeteus - I never did tighten those screws. But it's still driving me crazy.

Thing is, Capital was out here and left the oven on for hours and it didn't vibrate -- like going to the doctor and being well whereas earlier you'd been at death's door: annoying! But I've been thinking lately, that the *heavier* the weight I have on the rack, oddly enough, the more it buzzes. I absolutely can't figure this out. I've tried just adjusting the racks to be sure they're not too far back and hitting the back of the oven/fan and buzzing. This helps ... except when it doesn't. And when there's something sensitive (say, souffle), in the oven, the last thing you want to do is open the oven door and fiddle with racks.

So - short answer is, I have not yet found a solution and am still bedeviled by this. It's a real drag. But I just can't even reproduce it enough to call for help.... Still, I could try tightening some screws. That's easy... shoulda done it before.

Keep me posted on your odyssey!

    Bookmark   September 27, 2012 at 7:42PM
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