Bosch Dishwasher Problems...

ronakaJanuary 16, 2013

We have a relatively new (1-2 years old) Bosch dishwasher. Of late it seems to frequently end the cycle with a significant amount of water laying in the bottom of the tub. If you repeatedly start and cancel the cycle it will eventually pump the excess water out. Has anyone else experienced this problem, and if so how have you solved it?

To date I have removed the filter and strainer on the bottom of the tub and cleaned it, but that does not seem to help.

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We had our 7 yr old dishwasher have that problem - turned out it was leaking! And now we are renovating out entire kitchen as we had to pretty well gut the kitchen to get it dry! Fill valve was broken. Good luck'

    Bookmark   January 16, 2013 at 10:37PM
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I checked underneath it, and also the ceiling below it is unfinished, and there is no evidence of any external leak.

Last night I ran it empty. In the wash cycle it seemed to be spraying lots of water, and was actually audible. Normally this dishwasher is so quiet you don't know it is running. The dishes inside must deaden the sound.

However, that said, the flow when it pumps out into the garburator seems pathetic. You can barely hear it. I believe it has always been somewhat low, much less than the Kitchenaid that preceded it. The Kitchenaid sounded like someone flushing the toilet!

When I ran it last night I put a couple of cups of vinegar into the first wash cycle, and ran it in the "Half Load" mode. It went through the complete cycle and was as dry as it ever gets at the end. No water visible even when you looked right down into the plastic filter recess. Appeared normal. However, you could still easily smell vinegar. That was after all the cycles totaling 84 minutes or so.

It makes me wonder if this thing is pumping out fully between cycles of one overall wash. I would have expected the vinegar to have been long gone.

In any case does anyone know how this thing pumps out? Does it use the same pump as in the wash cycle like most dishwashers, and just has a diversion valve when it wants to pump out? Wondering if the diversion valve could be stuck or have something in it? Some food does seem to get by the filter when you remove everything. Wondering how that can happen?

    Bookmark   January 17, 2013 at 12:30PM
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Double check to make sure you have a high loop in your drain line. It's mentioned in the install manual and could cause your d/w not to pump out correctly if it is not high looped.

    Bookmark   January 17, 2013 at 1:39PM
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Have you cleaned the filter?

    Bookmark   January 17, 2013 at 3:17PM
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The drain hose goes about as high as the top of the dishwasher. The filter may be a problem, however, I tested the thing again today, and it did not drain again and is full of water. Can't seem to get it to drain now by using the cancel cycle function. Will have to hand bail it out.

I got really desperate and read the manual. Tough thing for a man to do! I discovered that there is potentially one more filter than I realized. The drawing in the manual shows a large object trap (large plastic grid), cylinder filter (metal grid), a fine filter (large metal plate with medium sized holes, that covers the recess at the bottom of the tub). I was cleaning all of these. However, the manual also shows what they call micro filter. It appears to be metal and cylinder shaped. I have not seen that filter, and haven't cleaned it. Will have to look for it, when I get it bailed out.

Last the manual says there is a separate pump to drain the tub. If the filter issue is a dead end, I will have to check that out further.

Thanks for the suggestions,

    Bookmark   January 17, 2013 at 6:37PM
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Bailed the thing out and the so called micro filter does not seem to be there, and in fact there seems to be no provision for it. Will have to call Bosch tomorrow to see what is going on. The manual is not totally clear.

For anyone that has a Bosch, is the micro filter part of the large object trap assembly?

Will have to check the hose further tomorrow to see if there is any possibility it could be plugged. When it is in drain mode, there is nothing but a small trickle of water being pumped out. Either the flow is being blocked somewhere or the pump is not working.

The good news is that I see it is less than a year old and should be still under warranty.

    Bookmark   January 17, 2013 at 11:16PM
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    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 9:05AM
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If it's less than a year old don't mess with it anymore and just call for service.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 11:48AM
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Sometimes things like pips can work their way through the filter (heaven knows how, that thing is pretty fine mesh) and end up in the bottom. It's happened to me twice, most recently a month ago.

Bale out the water in the bottom. Remove the last of it, in the drain, by soaking it up with a sponge. Check in the grooved area - I found a piece of glass here. If there's nothing there, you can proceed with caution to unscrew the drain cover - Bosch say call an engineer, but thanks to YouTube (can't find it right now, but it was easy to Google) I saw what to do, removed the piece and found a cherry stone stuck the other side. Saved a $200 call-out.

Check the YouTube videos - search for something like 'Bosch dishwasher drain clearing'.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 1:13PM
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"Perhaps this will be somewhat helpful.";

Called Bosch this AM, unfortunately before I read your post. That video is very helpful. It seems consistent with my manual and shows an outer filter which the lady in the video calls a "very fine mesh filter on the outside". I don't have that filter in my dishwasher.

Bosch told me that there should only be the two filters, but now I'm thinking they are not correct. I think I will now call the parts dept of the dealer I bought this thing from to see what they say. I wonder if they put this outer filter in some models and not others??? Mine certainly never had it. I also see from the comments at that site that it appears prone to failure, and cannot be bought separate from the rest of the filter. Ugly trick from Bosch!

And to add more confusion, the dishwasher now seems to be draining again. All I did was jiggle the drain hose around a bit. I'm on the second test of of it now. It drained when I did the half wash cycle, and now I'm trying the full normal wash. It also drains now when you cancel the cycle.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 1:21PM
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I should ask if you have an airgap. I've actually had one of these get plugged on me. But when it did, water went all over the counter.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 1:41PM
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If by airgap you mean a siphon breaker vent, no I don't have one. I believe it is a code requirement in some areas. This is the 4th dishwasher to sit in this same location over the 32 years we have had the house, and I have never used one. I really don't like the idea of it flooding the counter.

It now appears my problem is back again on the second test. Will have to try it a couple of more times, but it seems it will complete and pump out when in the half load mode. But when in the Normal cycle it does not pump out at the end. I saw it pump out once part way through the cycle though.

I'm starting to think the control system in this thing has lost its brains.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 1:59PM
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When you checked your high loop did you check to see if there was anymore hose stuck behind the dishwasher?
Pull on the hose where it comes through he cabinet and see if there is more hose that pulls through then redo your high loop.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 4:13PM
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I spoke too soon on my last post. I had opened the door when it was in the "dry" mode at the end of the cycle - no pump running and no wash or rinse. It showed 14 minutes remaining, and there was lots of water still in the tub. I assumed it would pump out before the "dry" portion of the cycle, and the water would still be there at the end of the cycle.

Wrong. I stood there and watched it, only to find that it goes though that goofy pump out act it does but at the end of the "dry" part of the cycle, drain pump runs for about 3 seconds, stops for 2 seconds, runs for 3 seconds, stops for 2, and then runs for about 20 seconds to actually do the job. Low and behold, the bottom of the tub was dry when the run light finally went off. When you watch what this thing does, it is one weird dishwasher. It is so quiet that I never really knew what it was doing before.

Now I think it may be working "normally" whatever that really is.

About the high loop, yes I pulled on the hose. It comes out a few inches and then goes back. It seems fairly free, and is heavy (full of water). At times I can see a water level in the top of the hose that came with the dishwasher. I would like to pull the thing out of the recess to really check it, but this was one nasty dishwasher to install. It has no room at the bottom to work, and I'm trying to avoid that step.

I checked with the local dealer and they have a replacement filter. I'm going to stop at the shop and see what it looks like. I'm convinced again that I'm missing the outer micro filter part, but not sure that has anything to do with the recent problems.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 5:50PM
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Some Bosch dishwashers don't have all the filters. The micro filter (the fine one) is optional. Sounds like something might have been caught in the hose? Should drain issues come back, here are some more videos:


    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 9:10PM
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I have used an anti-backsiphon air gap on all my dishwashers for 40 years. Only had a small problem when a piece of bone went through the garburator of one of the dishwashers. That just blocked the flow and didn't make a mess. The only thing is you must be aware of the counter top configuration for the location. I once had to put one on a windowsill because there was no room on the counter near the sink.

    Bookmark   January 19, 2013 at 7:58AM
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Alex, thank you for the additional videos. I had already taken the cover off the pump. I assume that is the drain pump and not the circulating pump? The pump was basically clean and turned freely. Did find a bit of an orange stem in it, but I don't think it could have been a problem. I saw the black rubber thing and didn't have the nerve to pull it out. I see from the video it is a flapper type of check valve. I will take it apart again and pull the flapper, just in case. If anyone does this, mine at least takes a T20 tork screw driver. And when you put this cover back in, the close end goes in first and hooks in a slot. It will not go in if you try to push it straight down.

On the video which shows the transparent loop is this at the back or the side? If I get really desperate I will have to check it out. I'm not looking forward to pulling this thing out of the hole though.

And last for today's update I visited the appliance store and looked at all the various Bosch models of dishwasher. None of them have the third outer filter described as a micro filter. I also looked at a spare they had in the parts dept and it was exactly the same as mine. I think that UK video posted by kitchendetective earlier in the thread is for an older model of Bosch. And Bosch has not updated their owners manuals and still describe that outer filter as if it was there. My guess is that they made the hole size in the stainless cylinder filter finer, and eliminated that outer micro filter.

First real load of dirty dishes is washing now, so I will find out if the problem has come back again or not -- at least for today...

    Bookmark   January 19, 2013 at 7:31PM
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Update for the day. The first real load of dishes, in the last post failed the test. No pump out again.

I removed the pump cover and checked the check valve. It was fine, and no evidence of food or crap in the line.

While forcing it to pump out, I had a real "ah-ha" moment. The flow during the forced pump out was a pathetic dribble. The dishwasher location requires that I use a 7 foot extension hose. I moved that extension hose at about the mid point, and there was a gush of water. I didn't find much in the garburator, so I was concerned that whatever it was could still be in the hose, and just moved. Removed the hose and flushed it. Still did not find much, and could not think of any other way to make sure it was clean. I finally decided I had had enough, and bought a new hose. The one I had been using for decades was a 5/8" auto heater hose. Way overkill for the application. I also was using a 1/2" connector at one end, and a 3/4" at the other. I bought a new 3/4" vinyl hose, and used 3/4" connectors at both ends.

The fourth dirty real load is washing now. The flow on pump out is excellent, and no water left in the tub at the end of the cycle. The dishes are coming out perfectly clean. Even when you look down into the course filter tube there is no water visible. I think the problem is solved, touch wood. It would appear the dishwasher itself was not a problem, just something in the hose. Thanks for all the help. I learned quite a bit about how this dishwasher works.

    Bookmark   January 21, 2013 at 11:41AM
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air gap.

Here is a link that might be useful: picture of air gap device

    Bookmark   January 22, 2013 at 2:15PM
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I know the purpose of the air gap and have deliberately chosen to not install one. If your sink drain plugs and fills up your sink with dirty water, this dirty water can siphon back into the dishwasher. Plumbing regulators have decided this is a bad thing, and some jurisdictions require this air gap to be put in to meet local codes. When the water tries to suck back into the dishwasher this gap lets air in and breaks the siphon.

That is the theory. In actual practice other things can happen. The hose can plug between the siphon break device and the sink. Then when the dishwasher pumps out, the water goes all over your counter top and on the floor. We often leave home with the dishwasher running, and would like to not come back to that kind of mess. In our case this hose actually did plug. It keeps the dishwasher from working well, but it does not make a mess on the floor, or worse still in the ceiling on the next level below.

The other thing is that it is non issue with the Bosch dishwasher. They have a silicone check valve at the discharge of the pump. This prevents any water from coming back into the dishwasher. If the sink plugs the discharge hose becomes pressurized and does not allow flow back.

Still the hose will drain from the sink back to the high spot in the transfer hose, so some water can get back part way. I expect that is what happened in our case. Some food from the garburator got back in the hose and stuck there.

    Bookmark   January 23, 2013 at 12:57PM
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This post is a great testament as to why not to buy a Bosch DW. They are like a 4 month old crying baby, they can't tell you what is wrong and they just keep crying. Diagnostics don't work CORRECTLY. You can throw parts at it all day long and go broke?
Imagine if you added up all that time you've spent messing around with it, you could have bought another SERVICEABLE dishwasher. Hint-Hint

    Bookmark   March 15, 2013 at 8:56PM
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We have had our dishwasher for about three months. We have done everything. Now they say use the finish tabs. This is a very quite dishwasher, but the worst dishwasher I have ever owned. Had a Miele in the past, and the only reason I did not buy one this time, is that Miele has decided you have to pay three hundred dollars to have it installed in California, so you can not buy one without having a rip off installer Really )(*& me off. I hate I hate, I hate this dishwasher, their silverware dray is a joke, does not clean or dry the silverware. Nothing ever dries, I even sit in the kitchen for hours waiting for the dishwashing cycle to end, so I can be sure to open the door in time so it can air dry, and everything is still wet. I bought the most expensive model. THE BIGGEST WASTE OF MONEY I HAVE EVER SPENT IN MY LIFE!!

    Bookmark   March 29, 2013 at 9:35PM
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" Nothing ever dries"

Dd you fill the rinse aid dispenser?

    Bookmark   March 30, 2013 at 12:11PM
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vickinbobyo - could you please post a reference to the fact that Miele REQUIRES a $300 install in California. That seems very surprising to me. I know in the past Miele offered a 2nd year warranty if you used a Miele installer but I've never heard about them requiring one. Thanks.

    Bookmark   March 30, 2013 at 12:38PM
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May I know your bosch model?
I want to buy this one:

Is that right in the reviews?

Here is a link that might be useful: bosch dishwasher model

    Bookmark   June 5, 2013 at 8:08PM
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I am so sorry that I did not find these negative comments when I was looking for a dishwaher. I bought a Bosch that cost over $1000. The suds don't disappear. I did not realize it for a month or so. I don't want to think of how much suds my family and I ate. This is a major problem. I have had two repairmen come out, both who said this was a common problem. The first one went through the steps of how to operate the machine!! The second vacuumed the suds out. I talked to the Bosch Co.operator and now am going through her suggestions: running the machine without dishes, using a turkey baster to get rid of the rinse liquid, etc. This is ridiculous. I want to get rid of this machine!!!!

    Bookmark   July 23, 2013 at 5:53PM
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We have been seeing this end of cycle suds issues with ALL brands of dishwashers so what Bosch is telling you is true. The rinse aid seems to be the issue.

We have been flushing out rinse dispensers and it takes care of the problem. My buddy who works as a Sears tech is doing the same with all the d/w's he's working on.

The rinse aid on the shelves right now doesn't seem to have the problem so it must have been some kind of bad batch.

    Bookmark   July 23, 2013 at 6:50PM
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