New Miele STILL Leaking - Now in the Middle

djdoggoneJanuary 6, 2014

We bought a new Miele dishwasher in October. Having read enough posts to realize the importance of proper installation, we called the Miele showroom in Wellesley to get a recommendation for a certified installer/sales person.

The new machine leaked from the get-go but Hubby and I spent several days making sure it wasn't a dumb user problem. When we were sure of ourselves we called the sales person/installer. He told us to call Miele service. We did and Miele sent out a technician. He found that the machine leaked through the door on one side and ordered a door seal.

When the door seal came in a second Miele technician came out to install it. He did, but while he was here he said the machine wasn't installed correctly and told us to get back the installer. The machine still leaked.

Having lost confidence in the original installer, we spoke with the Miele area rep and got the name of their top-notch installer. He charged $500 for the installation because he came from afar. He did not shim the dishwasher as the Miele technician had said he must, but he did secure the machine to the sides of the cabinet with screws. (The original installer had only secured the machine to the countertop with a single screw.) It still leaked. The second, top-notch installer said it was nothing he did, call Miele.

We arranged for a third Miele technician to come out and re-re-install the dishwasher, and to bring shims. He did so but the machine continued to leak. He saw that the door and the hinges needed to be replaced because they were out of whack.

While getting our monthly haircuts we shared our trials with the fellow patrons, which of course started the round of appliance stories. But one fellow, who is a big DIY, handy guy offered this advice: get a new machine. His take on it is that we probably got a machine that was damaged in transit. We can go about getting these repairs done by Miele, and it might even stop leaking for a while, but there is probably a host of other things that are slightly out of order now and will present problems eventually, and long before they would if we had a non-lemon.

We thought on it and agreed that he was right so we approached Miele about getting a new machine. The service person we spoke with on the phone said he would approach his boss about it and get back to us. A week passed and we still hadn't heard back so we called again.

Suddenly Miele is saying that the original install ruined the machine, that we should have worked the issue with the original installer (who, though recommended by Miele, did not install the machine correctly, according to Miele. My husband has read the installation instructions and says that it should have been shimmed and secured to the sides of the cabinet.)

Now we are in the middle, with a brand new leaking Miele dishwasher. I convinced my husband to go with the Miele dishwasher because of the company, saying they would stand behind their product. Being seniors on a fixed income, we wanted a dishwasher that would last our final twenty years.

What the heck is the right way to proceed? I'm convinced this machine was bad before it was ever installed but I can't prove that. Do I just give up?

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a2gemini

3 strikes and it should be lemoned.
Ours was and the new one is almost 4 years old and going strong (hopefully did not jinx it)

    Bookmark   January 6, 2014 at 4:31PM
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djdoggone

Was yours a Miele?

    Bookmark   January 6, 2014 at 4:46PM
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kaseki

If fastened to the side cabinets without proper shims then the dishwasher could have become deformed. I am unclear how just using only one screw at the top could deform the unit to the point where it leaks. Perhaps inadequate leveling was involved. Otherwise, I would tend to support the idea of shipping damage, given no other information.

kas

    Bookmark   January 6, 2014 at 6:54PM
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xedos

did you see the original unit?

was it boxed up with it's cardboard, foam and wood crate ?

    Bookmark   January 7, 2014 at 10:36AM
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geoffrey_b

I think your problem is that you got too many people involved, and everyone points their finger at the other guy. So avoid getting anyone else involved.

Leaking at the door seal indicates that the door is not parallel with the front of the DW. Can you tell?

Try the dollar bill trick: Get a new bill and close the DW. See if you can slide the bill - you may be able to find the misalignment.

Alternatively, close the door and measure the distance between the door and the body of the DW - do this top and bottom of each side. It sure sounds like a problem with the hinge.

There's no way sliding the DW into the opening, without screwing it to the cabinets, is gonna cause it to leak. Nor omitting the shims.

I replaced a switch on my Miele recently, and I had to pull it out and lay it on it's side. The DW is quite sturdy.

Get the Miele rep and the top-notch-installer to figure out how to fix the machine, or get a replacement.

    Bookmark   January 7, 2014 at 4:56PM
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a2gemini

DJ
Yes, ours was a Miele
The problem was the installer/repair peeps screwed it up but fortunately I had the extended warranty and when the same issue cropped up 3 times,( plus a leak that Miele said could never happen but it did. - a piece of grit blocked the shut off valve) I received a check for the full purchase price(it was 4.5 years old)
I vowed not to get another Miele but glad I did.
Maybe I had esp as I don't normally purchase the warranties.
Hang in there.

    Bookmark   January 7, 2014 at 11:51PM
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djdoggone

Thanks, everyone. It really helps to get advice. I'll take the questions in order:

kaseki: Machine was leveled and plumed right to left when initially installed. I agree, it seems unlikely that the machine was permanently deformed by securing it into the countertop. That's why we think it arrived "leaky".

Which brings us to xedos's question. When we saw the machine, it was coming through the door. It was without crate or box. It took a few minutes for the installer to bring it in from his truck, so we assume he unboxed then. But it didn't seem long enough to have been uncrated so that probably happened back at his store.

Geoffrey_B: You are absolutely correct. Too many cooks spoil not only the broth, but confuse the issue. Unfortunately the Miele process has forced us into getting so many people involved and two more are scheduled to come next week to make repairs.

And, you're right the door is not aligned with body of dishwasher. The third Miele technician showed us this problem and that was the reason he ordered a new door and hinges. Our top-notch installer does not believe the installation would have racked the machine.

a2gemini: encouraging. We will buy the extended warranty to make sure we are covered if they "fix" the machine and this problem reoccurs.

Miele refuses to replace the machine. A field supervisor is coming out with the Miele tech #2 to install a new door and hinges. I didn't want to allow it, but Miele won't replace the machine at this point. I can't imagine what I'd do if I had already installed my new, wood kitchen floor?!

    Bookmark   January 8, 2014 at 11:32AM
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djdoggone

Thanks, everyone. It really helps to get advice. I'll take the questions in order:

kaseki: Machine was leveled and plumed right to left when initially installed. I agree, it seems unlikely that the machine was permanently deformed by securing it into the countertop. That's why we think it arrived "leaky".

Which brings us to xedos's question. When we saw the machine, it was coming through the door. It was without crate or box. It took a few minutes for the installer to bring it in from his truck, so we assume he unboxed then. But it didn't seem long enough to have been uncrated so that probably happened back at his store.

Geoffrey_B: You are absolutely correct. Too many cooks spoil not only the broth, but confuse the issue. Unfortunately the Miele process has forced us into getting so many people involved and two more are scheduled to come next week to make repairs.

And, you're right the door is not aligned with body of dishwasher. The third Miele technician showed us this problem and that was the reason he ordered a new door and hinges. Our top-notch installer does not believe the installation would have racked the machine.

a2gemini: encouraging. We will buy the extended warranty to make sure we are covered if they "fix" the machine and this problem reoccurs.

Miele refuses to replace the machine. A field supervisor is coming out with the Miele tech #2 to install a new door and hinges. I didn't want to allow it, but Miele won't replace the machine at this point. I can't imagine what I'd do if I had already installed my new, wood kitchen floor?!

    Bookmark   January 8, 2014 at 1:05PM
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kaseki

There is no guarantee that the machine or some other device won't leak in the future. For the benefit of your floor, as well as your cabinets, obtain water sensing shutoffs and insinuate them into the plumbing circuits. Various models at various price points exist.

Kitchens designed to resist leaks have tile floors with drains and stainless steel cabinets.

kas

    Bookmark   January 8, 2014 at 6:32PM
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geoffrey_b

@doggone: "I can't imagine what I'd do if I had already installed my new, wood kitchen floor?! "

When they install the new floor - it better be low enough that you can slide out your DW.

    Bookmark   January 9, 2014 at 3:24PM
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djdoggone

Clearly we can't rely on Miele not to leak -- though that is one of the reasons I bought it. Live and learn.

And you can bet your sweet bippy there will be plenty of room to remove the dishwasher. :-)

    Bookmark   January 9, 2014 at 3:46PM
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djdoggone

a2gemini: Your post gave me hope and, therefore, patience. I think because of that we resolved to go with the flow and believe that eventually all would work out, and it has.

A Miele area person came to the house and decreed the machine out of square and ordered us a new one. It has now been installed and works perfectly. Our faith in Miele is confirmed. What I appreciate most is the fact that no one will ever know how the machine came to be out of kilter so Miele could have opted out but did not.

Other good news is that Miele is working on having their own installers so this won't be an issue in the future.

I thank everyone for their help and insight.

    Bookmark   February 27, 2014 at 10:15AM
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weedmeister

I think the only way it could get 'out of square' is to have been dropped somewhere along the way.

    Bookmark   February 27, 2014 at 11:23AM
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djdoggone

That's the consensus. The question is did it get damaged in transit from Germany or did it happen after the kitchen store took possession. That's why we were in the middle. Thank goodness Miele made good on the machine.

    Bookmark   February 27, 2014 at 11:38AM
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rococogurl

So glad this is resolved for you. Now just forget and enjoy the machine!!

    Bookmark   February 27, 2014 at 1:34PM
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