Moved to a house & have a nasty neighbor

Mia_September 17, 2003

First, I'm really happy that this Apartment Living forum is back up. I didn't understand why the forum was removed when it was so popular.

It's been over a year since I posted on the Apartment Living forum. I had initially started a thread called something like "do you feel physically ill because of noisy neighbors?" This thread received a lot of responses. I had some lousy neighbors at the time who stomped, slammed doors, constantly had company at all hours, etc. And because I spoke to them a couple of times about the noise and then contacted the condo association, they went ahead and had their landlord's attorney (the attorney is the landlord's brother!) send a notice to us that we were harassing these neighbors...oh, yeah right!...they were the ones causing the problems with making all the noise and some of the noise was intentional. It's too bad these days that when you complain just a couple of times about something that someone is doing wrong, they go to an attorney who sends you a letter saying that you are harassing them.

Anyway, since this Apartment forum went down, I finally got a small house that doesn't have much land separating it from the houses next door. If I had more money, I would have opted for much more land! Well, the neighbors on the right of me are friendly, helpful, quiet people. However, the neighbor to the left of me is a witch. From day one I tried to be friendly by saying hi and waving, but she never responded back. She had a boyfriend living with her who she had gotten arrested some months ago for assault, threatening, and disorderly conduct. She has a restraining order against him, so he no longer lives with her and their 2 yr old son. But when he lived there, I could hear them arguing at 4am-5am with the baby crying on and on in response. I thought that when he was gone for good things would improve. But she is still a witch and a loudmouth...I started to wave to her again and she just ignored me. She, her son, and her big dog are often on my property. She does not watch her son very well when they are outside and so he gets into my flower garden where he damaged some of my decorative objects. All she does is yell at him at the top of her lungs and all he does is cry and cry. I would hate to be her son, being yelled at constantly...that is no way to treat a child. I have never witnessed her being loving towards her boy or hugging him...I feel so sorry for the way he is being raised.

Well, it's come down to me having to tell her to keep off of my property, and I've had to tell her three times so far within more than a year's time period...but of course she doesn't seem to care. She has no respect for my property. The last time I confronted her in a friendly manner while she was on my property with her lawn mower parked right against my house, she started yelling at me as if I have no right to ask her to stay off my lawn! "Put up a fence," she says. I'm the one who should be angry, she's the one who should at least say sorry for being on my property. Never once has she apologized for her son taking items from my flower garden and for riding all over my front lawn with his toy car or for her dog jumping on me and my parents many times while were were minding our own business in my yard. I also want to say that I feel for her son, and I know that it is not his fault if he wanders around my yard investigating everything, it is his mother's responsibility to keep a close eye on him and to teach him to stay in her yard. I've even seen him wandering in the middle of the street while she was busy doing yardwork with her back turned. At this point, I can't stand her and I already am thinking of selling this house...I dream of a house with more land separating me from neighbors, because with the house I'm in, there's not much space between houses and so it's too close for my liking because of the witch.

Yes, the situation improved when I moved into a house: no more listening to neighbors slamming doors, stomping feet, banging items, etc...and it is so wonderful to not have to go through the stress of that noise, and now I don't have to worry about waking up the neighbors if I stay up late or get up early, but when you get into a house, you may still end up next to yet another nasty neighbor. I was praying that this wouldn't happen, that I would be blessed with great neighbors...oh well, the bad neighbors seem to be attached to me :(

I still totally relate to your apartment neighbor problems and really feel for you all in my heart.

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It might just be worth it to flip the bill for a nice big privacy fence. It would put an end to your problems! I sure would hate to be that kid as well. The poor thing :( Just bought my first house about 4 months back. Fantastic neighbors all around. We help eachother whenever we can. I hope you find peace in your neighborhood :) Put up the fence! It's your best bet.

    Bookmark   September 17, 2003 at 1:51PM
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I would hate to be her son

you need to call job and family services...human services....
what ever and report this to them.
it may be no big deal...but if she is willing to scream at him in front of you and others...just imagine what may be going on behind closed doors.
Maybe your complaint will save this child.
I called job and family today on my neighbor.
They have some kids.
Trust me...they are being neglected BIG TIME.
It is only a report and the screener takes the info to the boss and she/he comes up with a plan or not.
maybe...just maybe she will get therapy and be a good mom and neighbor.

    Bookmark   September 17, 2003 at 3:56PM
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if you cannot afford a privacy fence just go to home depot and buy some short white picket fence pieces and put them in between your houses.this will at least designate space.

    Bookmark   September 18, 2003 at 12:54AM
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Thanks for the responses so far.

If I put up a fence, it will be a tall privacy fence (as tall as they make em!), however, I think I have to hire a surveyor first to locate the exact property lines. I know this will all be expensive. However, if I put up a short, cheap fence, you can bet that her son will climb over the fence and still run around my property and she will be on my lawn to run after him. So I'd like to block her out as much as possible with a tall fence!

The other stress from this situation with the witch is the noise from her yelling and her boy crying...I hear this even with all of my windows closed. I'm getting tired of hearing her LOUD voice. She is the loudest person on my street, except for the renters across the street (but that is a whole other story--and none of the homeowners on my street are too happy that the "renters" blast their rap music that has obscene lyrics (in front of their little girl), have a dog that yaps all day...and the police have been called by my other neighbors twice so far in September because of their dog yapping constantly. The way I deal with those people is that I just tell myself that they are there temporarily because they rent.

So if it weren't for the witch next door and the renters across the street, my little neighborhood would be peaceful and calm. It's always some bad apple(s) that have to ruin things for the rest of us.

    Bookmark   September 18, 2003 at 3:05AM
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"The other stress from this situation with the witch is the noise from her yelling and her boy crying."

Some tactics ...

1. Call the cops about a "domestic disturbance" evrey time you hear her yelling and the bouy crying.

2. Call child protective services about the constant barrage of verbal abuse directed towards her kid, the lack of supervision that lets him wander into the street.

3. Tape record her best rants, edit them together and BLAST them back at her whenever you feel like it. Let the neighbors know you are deliberately doing this, put in a goodset of earplugs, and crank up the volume on a good boombox. I did this to a neighbor and she was aghast when she was the one hearing her own words.

    Bookmark   September 18, 2003 at 8:35AM
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One issue that hasn't been addressed here is that of liability.

If your foul-mouthed neighbor or her screaming son are on your property and they injure themselves (fall down on a garden hose and twist an ankle, for example), you may be liable for their injuries. Yet another reason to get going on that fence a.s.a.p.

I feel for you. I just don't know what goes through the heads of some people. We seem to have raised a couple of generations of people who have no boundaries or consideration for anyone but themselves. Good grief...I sound like my parents!


    Bookmark   September 20, 2003 at 4:57PM
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Yes, I have definitely had the liability issue on my mind. Maybe I should call the police the next time she, her dog, or her son is on my property just so that there is a report of her trespassing in case something happens in the future like my property gets damaged or her son gets hurt in my yard. Do you think I should call the police the next time, since I've already asked her nicely 3 times in the past to stay off my yard? Or do you think it's a bad idea to involve the police?

I'm going to look into having a stockade fence put up in my front yard (my back yard has a fence), however, a fence won't totally keep them off my property because three times in the past I have witnessed her son and/or dog running up my driveway from the street with the witch following them up my driveway...and the thing is, I can't close off my driveway with a fence. On one occasion, I was sitting on my front steps with my indoor cat laying peacefully on my lap, and suddenly her son runs up my driveway & the dog runs after him. Then the dog starts walking up my walkway towards my front steps because it sees my cat--and my cat is terrified as the dog gets closer--and then the witch slowly walks up my driveway and raises her voice at her dog and then retrieves him. She didn't say one word to me (she saw how tightly I was holding my cat and how frightened my cat was)...this behavior of hers simply states to me that she doesn't give a rat's behind!

One more thing, she shouldn't be letting her dog out without a leash if she cannot be right by his side in control of him at all times...that's what our local ordinances state. I've seen that dog countless times on the front of her property not tied up while she is somewhere else not watching the dog. She lets him outside alone to do his "business," as if he was a cat. She has witnessed the dog jumping against me, and when I told her that I didn't feel comfortable with the dog on the loose, she replied, "He doesn't bite." Wow, I didn't know she could predict her dog's future behavior!

Sorry this message was long, but I needed to vent my frustrations some more.

    Bookmark   September 21, 2003 at 4:36AM
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You MUST call child protective service about the neglect of this child. You can do it anon. -and if you are worried about the call # being known, use a pay phone.
BTW, does she own or rent?

    Bookmark   September 21, 2003 at 10:42AM
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never2late, she owns the house. I am stuck next to her. I don't think she'll be selling any time soon.

I have never seen her physically hit her son, so I'll have to find out what constitutes abuse/neglect in my state.

Of course, this weekend, her son was roaming around again while she was doing yardwork. He was in the street, and in their next door neighbor's yard, and perhaps in my yard, but I wasn't keeping watch over my property. She kept having to yell for him to "get over here!" every few minutes, but he seems to tune her out. I noticed him standing in her yard crying and wiping his eyes, and she never came over to him to comfort him. I cannot imagine that this boy will ever listen to his mother when he grows up, if you know what I mean.

I think this situation is so sad...a child should be cherished and should be given attention and love, and should not be treated like a burden.

    Bookmark   September 22, 2003 at 2:16AM
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I'm sorry to have to tell you Mia, but you need to to be more assertive and aggressive with this neighbour.
If that dog were on my property after the owner had been told to keep him off, I would have pepper sprayed or maced him. You have a right to be afraid of dogs that are not leashed. I would also have yelled at the neighbout in my loudest voice and accused her of endangering her son's health by letting him run on the street It's not in your nature to do this , I know, but bullies just don't respond to gentle behaviour. Don' t wave to her anymore or even acknowledeg she's alive.

I was in a similar position once,in my former apartment and it worked. You seem like a gentle person and bullies pick up on that.

    Bookmark   September 28, 2003 at 12:30AM
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Ah, yes. I too got motivated to buy a house when I had too much noise from apartment neighbors. I had a downstairs neighbor with a huge stereo who was also trying to learn to play drums. The walls were so thin you could hear if someone next door burped.

So I bought my house, moved in, and discovered the neighbors were musicians and they had a garage band! My other neighbors had twin 2 year olds with big lung capacity. My other neighbor, though quiet, was paranoid about the government and always wanted to chat over the fence about it.

So, the grass may be greener when you get out of your apartment, or it may not be. -And owning a house means you have to mow it.

    Bookmark   September 28, 2003 at 7:31AM
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Yes, it's true that I need to be more assertive than I've been in the past with my witch neighbor, so next time I'll not be "gentle" when she, her son, and/or her dog trespasses. I've asked her too many times in the past to keep off my property, and a decent neighbor would have respected my request and my property when spoken to the first (or at least second) time.

When I see her, I do act like she's invisible. She had the opportunity when I first moved in to be friendly neighbors because I would wave and say hello whenever I saw her. But her response was COLD and she would ignore me. I don't know what her problem is. But she did become friendly with another neighbor on my street, and they are trashy people, so I guess she feels more comfortable hooking up with her own kind of people!

Now that I look back, I'm glad that we didn't become friendly because it would have been harder to tell her to keep her son and dog off my property.

    Bookmark   September 29, 2003 at 12:49AM
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So sorry she owns her property.

as to the boy and calling child services on her - neglect is simply that - behavior that endangers the child (whether its living in filthy conditions, allowing a young child to wonder, etc) You can call in in anon.

good luck to you.

    Bookmark   September 29, 2003 at 8:02AM
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I just learned that the police were at the witch's house the other day. All I know is that the police were there for a "Juvenile" matter, and I don't know any more than this. So I am unsure if the witch called the police because of a problem or if a neighbor called the police on her because of her 2 yr old. I'm hoping someone called the police on her.

    Bookmark   October 1, 2003 at 12:04AM
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honestly? I'd plant a nice little raspberry run about a foot shy of your property line- good fences make good neighbors- bad neighbors call for nasty fences.

I'm the neighborhood maven, always have been- in my apartment, I solved the problem of the kids traipsing through the yard by subverting them...forget their parents, they were better off away from their own homes. I installed a bookcase on my front porch, and welcomed the kids to come and read...but they had to use the walk way, and the books had to stay on the porch.

I am a witch... your next door neighbor is obviously a woman with a history of abuse in her own background...and she may not respond to kindness- loike her son has learned not to respond to her yelling- but even if child services DOES split the family up.. maybe it solves part of your problem. maybe it gives her a reason to start drinking, and heaving bottles at your house?

there's a balance between being a dishrag, and being so isolated from the people around you that you only see them in terms of how pleasant they do or don't make your life.

    Bookmark   October 3, 2003 at 2:21PM
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You have every right to keep them off of your property.

The dog is the biggest concern, as he/she could harm you or your cat. Get a spray bottle full of ammonia. Spray it at the dogs face next time he comes near you or on your property. The county animal control officer told me to do that when I was attacked by a dog as a child. It won't harm the dog, but he'll never come near you again!!! :-)

Call Children's Services and report her. Call anonymously, DO NOT give your name!!

Inform you neighbor that the next time she or her son come on your property you WILL file Tresspassing charges with the police and then DO IT!!

Sure, her son is being raised in a poor environment, but you are not responsible for saving all of the children. Unless that is what you WANT to do...

Be aggressive with her, do not let her walk all over you and your flower gardens...

    Bookmark   October 6, 2003 at 9:30AM
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just wanted to vent myself here...... i'm in a similar situation. all i'm going to say is West Virginians for neighbors!!!!!! i apologize if i offend anyone but, everything i've ever heard about them - funny or not - is true i think. this guy is a complete and utter jerk! of course he didn't start off that way. one day he's your best friend, the next day he treats you like you've got a UFO on your head - and I'VE NEVER DONE ANYTHING TO THIS LOSER!!!! - who doesn't work by the way because he claims he can't because of an arm injury. but he sure can push that lawnmower can't he?!!!!! he sure can wash that dang camaro 3 times a week can't he?!!!! he sure can play in that tacky above ground pool now can't he?!!!!! i just don't understand. i think it's mental problems....... i'm sorry but i just needed to vent myself..... again - i apologize if i offended anyone but, i know not all West VA'ers are bad but DAMN!!!, this one is somthing else. the next house i'm in is going to be in the middle of the woods somewhere...... with 40 acres on all four sides.... away from ALL PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Bookmark   October 8, 2003 at 2:33PM
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One reason why I've not called the police so far on the witch for trespassing is because of something that happened when I first moved in that has, as a result, made me a little afraid of taking action because I fear that she may damage my property or try to turn other neighbors against me if I involve the police: The first time I ever complained to her about her dog running loose on my property was over a year ago. The day after I spoke to her, I noticed that my car had been keyed from the driver's side door to the passenger door, and I had not driven my car anywhere between the time I spoke to her and the time I noticed that long scratch. It was during that time that her boyfriend (later arrested for domestic abuse) was living with her. I have always wondered if my car was scratched intentionally by the boyfriend because I complained to the witch about their dog.

    Bookmark   October 14, 2003 at 2:10AM
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PROBABLY!!!! That sounds like the typical bad neighbor type thing! The white trash i was speaking about in the above post decided to return some brush that my roomate and i had disposed of in the woods. now - just for your info..... i live in a house, not an apartment but i have nasty neighbors and need to vent!!!! We had a bad ice storm last winter and come this spring needed to cut some brush out of the trees behind the house. well, this loser (who we got along with before hand) apparantley saw us dispose of this brush in the woods behind his house. this property (where the woods are) borders with another property that belongs to the other neighbors with which we DO get along with. they told us we could toss any brush we had down in their woods. they didn't care. as long as it wasn't regular house trash of course. instead of being an adult about it and coming to our door - the loser drags the trash back up to the house and tops it off by throwing old beer cans (which weren't ours) and even used chewing tobacco (which wasn't ours either)on our deck!!!! What a loser!!! I have not spoken to him since (this happened this past spring by the way), and i hope he gets the gesture! but maybe he can't help it.... he is afterall........ west virginia white trash!!!!!

    Bookmark   October 14, 2003 at 1:06PM
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I would advise against doing anything involving child welfare. It will definitely cause more problems than it solves. Spray the dog with the chemical of your choice if you must. Put up a fence if you must, but dont entangle yourself in legal problems with questionable people who know where you live. Ask your good neighbors how the have endured this over the years and I bet you will get a lot of interesting stories. If the trespassing thing is really what bothers you then send a notice by registered mail stating that any further encroachment by them on your property will be reported as criminal trespassing and will be prosecuted. The best thing to do is try to lower the tension level before this obviously well bred young lady snaps and fire bombs your house. Bad neighbors eventually will go away.Maybe she's from WV and will go home.

    Bookmark   December 16, 2003 at 5:27PM
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And I thought only people in Ohio made fun of folks from WV... :-)

I had a neighbor who'd been pretty nice to us for about 2 years. Then her 16 year old grandson moved in with her because his parents were at the end of their rope with him. Needless to say, Grandma couldn't handle him any better...

We had problem after problem with him... She worked during the day and had no idea what when on when she was gone. Complicating things even more, the houses were very very close together. He and his buddies smoked their pot outside so the smoke blew INTO my open doors and windows if it was warm out. The music was so loud is shook and rattled the windows of MY house. He threw cigarette butts, pop cans and assorted trash over the small fence into my yard... I talked to Gramma about the problems and she agreed to put an end to it. It got a bit better for a while. After that I just called the cops. They only had to come twice. The music quit playing and the pot smoking must have gone elsewhere. The trash still got thrown in my yard though. Grandma never got upset with me too much until...

I got tired of picking up cigarette butts from my yard when I wanted to mow. I'd been doing it for a year and was tired of it. So, I collected them all (there must have been 50) and put them in a nice pile by her door for the delinquent to dispose of. That ticked her off! She was so mad at me, so I tried to nicely explain that I'd left them there for her grandson to throw away but she just yelled and screamed at me... I finally said, "Whatever makes you feel better." She never spoke to me again. I felt bad about making her mad, but what did she expect?!

One time the cops came and talked with her about him after I'd called the police. They told her he'd been smoking weed, skipping school, disturbing the peace and that next time they would arrest him and involve Children's Services. THAT didn't make her mad at me, but picking up cigarette butts did?!?!?

Oh well... I never had to pick up another cigarette butt.

    Bookmark   January 10, 2004 at 6:10PM
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I think you should lay it on the line with her. You shouldn't have to put up a fence to keep her child and dog out of your yard. That is HER responsibility. I think ammonia is too harsh for the dog. Water in a spray bottle is good for a dog or the hose. They just don't like it. Can you imagine if you turned the hose on her son if he was in the yard? Sorry, getting carried away (maybe turn it on the mother..heh). You are being too nice and so she is the type that isn't going to do anything until push comes to shove. Stand up for yourself. There are leash laws where I live and dogs cannot be allowed to run loose. So maybe start with animal control next time you see him loose. You are right about her not saying hello..who needs a neighbor like that? Thank God you didn't strike up a one-sided friendship with her. Are any other neighbors experiencing the same thing? What do they say? I once had a neighbor with 3 kids. The kids put stickers on my new car and would look in my windows, scared me to death. They were bored and of course the mother was not watching them. I went right to her and told her to make sure it did not happen again. You have rights too.

    Bookmark   January 14, 2004 at 3:27AM
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It's me again. I have noticed her dog unleashed on a few occacions this winter, but he was sitting on her front yard watching me closely. It will be interesting to see what happens in the Spring when temps get warmer. I will not let her step all over me any more, though.

Even though my windows are closed, I can still her her loud voice coming from the bedrooms in her house! I can hear her yelling at her son, and I can her her loud voice when she is playing with him. I don't think she knows much about parenting or setting limits for her child, though. I hate to sound pessimistic or selfish, but I'm not looking forward to her little boy (he must be 2 or 3) getting older, as I can picture him throwing footballs, baseballs, etc. and those objects ending up in my yard...and the boy also may be in my yard more often the more mobile he becomes. We live much too close together for comfort.

    Bookmark   January 16, 2004 at 4:05AM
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Oh Dear Mia, such a lovely name.
I feel for you.
I would say NO to the ammonia but I would get out my hose and spay the bugger with super blast!EVERY TIME!
As for the kid, my heart breaks. I would not know what to do but try to take care of the baby everytime he was over, popsycles and stuff like
Thank God I am not in your shoes.
Kill 'em with kindness. Bring over a toy for Christmas or a Valentine Candy and each holiday there after and try to get on the witches good side.
No mom wakes up saying I think I will scream at my kid and ignore them there after. Poor lady must have had it rough to learn such behavior.
Keep your freinds close...but your enemies CLOSER.

    Bookmark   January 16, 2004 at 7:50PM
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Thanks for your kind response. No, I would never spray ammonia at an animal...I love animals and that would be cruel. I don't know about trying to get friendly with her because I already tried that and she simply chose to ignore me as though I was invisible. She never has a happy look on her face, either, so perhaps she is miserable. But that still doesn't give her the right to disrespect me or my property.

She has chosen to be friendly with one neighbor on my street, and she has allowed them on a few occasions last summer to "watch" her boy while she did yard work, however, these people aren't so wonderful (and other neighbors on my street feel the same way I do about them): they are cruel to their dogs (police have been out 7 times regarding the dogs), argue with each other, occasionally disrupt the peace of the neighborhood, have rough-looking visitors, play music that contains swear words and racial slurs (the "N" word) outside in front of their little girl....and this is who my neighbor chooses to be friendly with?!! I guess these are the type of people she wants to associate with, not people like myself who are respectful, decent, kind. I don't know how my other neighbors feel about her, but I've never seen any of them really conversing with her.

Of course, if I had the money right now, I would start immediately looking for a home with more land between houses. I know that more space doesn't guarantee a person won't have neighbor problems, but extra land helps!

    Bookmark   January 17, 2004 at 12:20AM
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As the victim of a canine attack I can tell you that spraying ammonia is not nearly as cruel as undergoing reconstructive surgery at the age of 13 on my leg.

It DOES NOT harm the animal, only scares it away. It's the equivilent of pepper spray on a human.

I am sure you like people too, but if you were attacked on your front porch by a strange man, would you spray him with pepper spray?

    Bookmark   January 18, 2004 at 1:26PM
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I'm really sorry that you had to go through such an awful, painful attack by a dog. I understand your logic, and I agree with you that if you are about to be attacked or are being attacked, you must take defensive action to protect yourself.

Let me clarify: If the neighbor's dog was simply walking on my property and it was not endangering me, I would never spray ammonia on it just to get it to run back to its own yard. But if the dog approached me in an aggressive manner or started attacking me, I would do whatever necessary to defend myself from the dog. Her dog displayed unfriendly behavior to me once, so I am on my guard. I shouldn't have to worry about being on my guard...she should obey the law and have her dog on a leash. Oh, but she says: "He [her dog] doesn't bite."

    Bookmark   January 20, 2004 at 12:42AM
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You sound passive aggressive and very judgemental. I would hate to be your neighbour and you are probably the person that should be ignored because you can't trust a passive aggressive person. Move to the country if you can't hack urban living and everything that goes with it.

    Bookmark   October 22, 2008 at 10:57AM
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Ummm... original message is from 2003

    Bookmark   October 24, 2008 at 6:31PM
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