best way to do this...Pics

andrelaplume2February 17, 2009

I need to frame this 12' section up against the XPS shown. Rafters are running parallel to the wall making it more of a challenge. (Picture 1)

Picture 2 shows a sample of one way I thought of. It essentially screws the front end of a 2 X 12 X 12 to the closest joist and allows the back end to rest on the concrete sill. Pluses here as I see it are it creates a firestop. Negatives...that 2 X 12 X 12 likely costs way more than the a couple of 2 X 4s used in method 2. Once up, that section is complately blocked off and inaccessible...not sure if that is a concern.

Method 2 (picture 3) involves screwing up (perpendicular)some 2 X 4 X 2s to the two closest joists and screwing to top plate of the wall to that. I am unsure how far apart these should be...2 feet? Pluses here, easier, cheaper, can access the area. Negatives...firestop needs to somehow be added.

So, is there a consensus on which way is 1) up to code, 2)sturdiest, 3) easiest, etc etc. or, is there a 3rd way?

Thanks again!

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sparkywannabe

I would use the 2x4's. Here is a link to an article with pictures. They recommend 3 feet spacing, but I would go with 2 feet.
http://www.rd.com/advice-and-know-how/slideshow-how-to-finish-a-basement-framing-and-insulating/article108042-4.html

For pics on how I did this, look at the "XPS and fire blocking" post from a couple weeks ago. I had to attach a 2x4 to the concrete wall because the joists are lower than the top of the concrete foundation. It looks like you can toe nail into the sill plate.

A good reference is Remodeling a Basement by Roger German (Taunton's). This book has many good pictures of details like this. Look for it at your local library.

    Bookmark   February 17, 2009 at 11:53PM
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andrelaplume2

Interesting, Its tight and I am unsure if I can screw thru the side of the joist into the 2 X 4 because then the 2 X 4 piece would have to rest on top the wooden sill to be level and I do not recall if there is room on top the sill. If it worked, perhaps I could use a 2 X 6 as a top plate, recessing it back over the foam to act as a fire block.

    Bookmark   February 18, 2009 at 9:15AM
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andrelaplume2

Ok, I can try the method described above but its going to be tight!

I will screw horizontally thru the rafter into the end of a 2 X 4 about a foot long using 3" primeguard exterior screws. The end of the board will indeed rest on the sill. Nailing will be a real pain. I will use a galavnized 3.25 12D nails; 2 per board. To make it easier I will predrill the 2 X 4, slip the nail in and hammer into the sill. 45 degree angles thru the face of the 2 X 4 into the sill. I should have just enough room to drive the nails.

Is this acceptable? Up to code etc.

BTW--I plan on using these screws for framing too---unless 3" drywall screws are acceptable...doubt it though. 3" is long enough right?

Let me know before I am past the point of no return.

    Bookmark   February 18, 2009 at 9:03PM
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sparkywannabe

"Code" requires nails not screws. Here is what I've been using:
- 16d common
- 8d common for toe nailing (4 nails per joint)
- hot dipped galvanized whenever used in PT lumber
For tight spaces where I can not reach both sides of board for toe nailing I have been using the Simpson Strong Tie A35 framing angles. These require the Simpson hot dipped galvanized 8d x 1-1/2" nails, 12 nails per connector.
http://www.strongtie.com/products/connectors/LTP4-LTP5-A34-A35.asp
They are nice and easy to use. I couldn't imagine doing the whole basement with them, they are $.80 each.

With that said, I know plenty of people who have finished their basements using screws. Their basements are still standing after many years. The walls are not load bearing. Maybe others will chime in on this question as well.

    Bookmark   February 19, 2009 at 12:11AM
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andrelaplume2

Yes, anyone out there...screws not up to code? It would seem they would much better...maybe not drywall screws but deck or outdoor 3" screws.....no? Also, how about 12D 3.25" nails...is 16D necesary?

    Bookmark   February 19, 2009 at 12:38AM
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andrelaplume2

sparky,
looked at your other thread....are you using 16Ds through the bottom of the studs where you do not toenail? I got some but they seam big...like they could split the wood.

Where you toenailed you say you are only using 8D...how long?

    Bookmark   February 19, 2009 at 2:06PM
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sparkywannabe

Where I can't toe nail I am using the Simpson Strong Tie framing anchors, A35. These are brackets that nail on two sides of each board. Look at their web site for details. They are easy to use, just a little expensive if you have to use a lot of them (compared to nails).
As for toe nailing, 8d commons are 2-1/2" long.
I had to practice a little before I got the hang of it. If you search online you can find some good how-to's, I don't have any bookmarked or I would include the links here.

I looked in the IRC 2003 code book tonight (Table R602.3(1) for reference) and they list the following:
- top or sole plate to stud, end nail: 2-16d nails
- Stud to sole plate, toe nail: 3-8d or 2-16d

The easiest way to build the wall, if you can, is to build it on the floor and stand it up. That way you can end nail each board, get everything square, etc. I mounted the plates and cut the studs to fit at each location. My joists are not the same height and I would have had to shim about 1/2" on one end.

-Tom (I'm no sparky, I just enjoy electrical work.)

    Bookmark   February 19, 2009 at 10:07PM
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