Adding toilet to basement

Seamer1February 21, 2006

We are adding a half bath to our basement when we start to finish it. What options do I have to do this? I am hoping there is another option besides the up flushing kind. I hear they are very expensive. Do you have any tips, or information on what the plumbing has to be to avoid this upflushing toilet. Thank You

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rumble_s

The choice might be very simple. You either have a sewer/septic outlet BELOW the level of your basement floor, or you don't. If it is above that floor level the upflush system is your only option. However, even if the outlet is below the basement floor you still have to weight the cost of breaking up that concrete floor in order install sewer pipes beneath it. In such case the upflush system might still be a better choice.

By the way, I just yesterday was in Lowes and they sell the upflush unit for $639. Expensive, but probabably considerably less expensive than ripping out that floor.

1 Like    Bookmark   February 22, 2006 at 9:36AM
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sierraeast

Not your only option.

Here is a link that might be useful: basement toilet

    Bookmark   February 23, 2006 at 10:11AM
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lazypup

There are a number of code issues to be considered here.

First of all, the upflush toilets and sewage ejection pump systems may only be installed in instances when the finsished location of the desired waste receptor is below the level of the structure gravity flow drains, of to put it in simpler terms, if the house main drain is under the basement floor you are required to connect to the main drain by means of gravity flow drains in the normal manner.

Now, while there are dozens of upflush toilets and sewage ejector pump systems available on the market, you may not be permitted to use one in your structure.

The International Residential Code requires all "sewage ejection pumps" to have a minimum capacity of 14.2gal/min. and the output load must be computed as 1.5 DFU's (Drainage Fixture Units) for each gallon per minute from the pump. This means the absolute minimum load is 14.2gal/min x 1.5DFU = 21.3DFU.

The gravity flow line receiving the discharge from the pump MUST BE capable of handling both the existing load on that line plus the additional 21.3DFU's. In most cases residential structures only have a 3" main drain and house sewer line and the IRC limits the load on a 3" horizontal main drain at 42DFU and a 3" horizontal branch line at 20DFU. The bottom line, unless you have a 4" main drain and 4" house sewer you could not install an upflush toilet or sewage ejector pump system without changing the entire main drain and house sewer line to 4".

The Uniform Plumbing code requires the sewage ejection pump to be rated at 20gal/min and the discharge must be computed at 2DFU per gal/min. Thus the minimum load is 40DFU. Here again, in order to connect a sewage ejector pump system you must have a 4" house drain and house sewer line and depending upon the existing load, it may require a 6" line.

    Bookmark   February 24, 2006 at 5:00PM
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sierraeast

The link i posted,(sani-flo) was the wrong link.Sani-flo is a pump system.Here's the link i meant to post. It needs no plumbing.

Here is a link that might be useful: plumbingless toilet

    Bookmark   February 24, 2006 at 7:40PM
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sierraeast

There are also incinerating toilets. Google incinerating toilets.Still leaves your sink drain which takes you back to lazypup's advice.

    Bookmark   February 24, 2006 at 7:50PM
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blue_fastback

I went through this last year. I intalled a toilet, shower, and relocated the laundry room. I broke up the concrete and had a plumber rework the drains and then I installed concrete over the drain pipes.

    Bookmark   February 25, 2006 at 9:39AM
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Seamer1

blue_fastback,
How much did you end up paying for the install of your bathroom in the basement?

    Bookmark   February 25, 2006 at 5:24PM
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blue_fastback

I do almost all my home improvement like framing, drywall, electrical, etc. The drains I did hire out. Once that floor is repoured with concrete you cant take it back up to to make adjustments so that part I hired out. I am also doing a total basement remodel and had to move a vent pipe on the other side of the basement and had the upstairs bathtube drain reworked to increase my ceiling height, tucked the toilet drain over that came down from the upstairs bathroom, and moved a drain for my bar. Like I said before, I did all the hard work of busting up the concrete and halling it up the stairs and had everything laid out for the plumber all he had to do is cut the drains apart and move or add thing around. I first estimate from my dads friend told me $3500 which included doing the copper pipes for the sinks and stuff. I could do that myself but I almost flipped out with that price. I then got another price of $1700which was better but seemed like a lot. That was not with running the copper pipes. I did that work myself. I figured probly 1 days wouth of work. Another plumber I called canceled on me several times so I gave up on him. I called some else who would not give me an estimate. They told me 2 guys at x amount per hour. So I went with yhe $1700 guy. He was there for 6 hours total. He had an assistant with him who was my nephews school teacher who knew about much with plumbing as I did.. I still think it was a lot of money for the time he spent there. I wish I was a licensed plumber.

    Bookmark   February 26, 2006 at 1:56PM
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peiyi

We just started our bathroom project. We probably didn't do a good job shopping around. We are paying $6000 for cutting up the basement floor and hauling away the concrete; installing drain pipes and sewage ejector system; running pipes and final install of shower, toilet, and two sinks; connecting vents. It also includes running a gas line for an unrelated gas stove. Is this reasonable in MA? Anyone know what a sewage ejector pump costs?

    Bookmark   February 28, 2006 at 10:30AM
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oldiron

We paid about $500 for our sewage ejector pump and the plastic basin in which it sits. You might need a bigger (more expensive) one than ours since you have more fixtures to drain -- we just have two sinks and a toilet.
We did all the labor ourselves. We bought it from Grainger (www.grainger.com; search for "sewage system")

    Bookmark   April 10, 2006 at 11:39AM
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lazypup

Installing a conventional sewage ejector pump assembly requires cutting into the concrete which adds considerable cost and labor to your project.

There are a number of "UpFlush" toilets on the market that have a built in sewage ejector pump system however they are very expensive and most have no provision for auxillary drain inputs to serve a lavatory, tub or shower. Another serious drawback is that they have some rather complex internal parts that are often difficult to locate for even the minor maintenance problems associated with waterclosets.

There is another alternative that offers a great compromise. "Low-Pro Series" prouces a complete self contained sewage ejector pump system that has a low pad equipped with a closet flange on which you can install a conventional watercloset. The watercloset sits on the pad and the pump unit is in the space between the back of the watercloset bowl and the wall. It also has provision for auxillary inputs so you can add a tub, shower or lavatory to complete your bathroom.

While I am not offering this as an endorsement, I am attaching a link to allow you opportunity to review the item.

http://www.easycarts.net/ecarts/terrylove/sewage_ejector.html

    Bookmark   April 10, 2006 at 5:18PM
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angelhair

lazypup,
I tried to go to www.easycarts.net/ecarts/terrylove/sewage_ejector.html. and I was rejected...

    Bookmark   April 21, 2006 at 7:50AM
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lazypup

I just now copied and pasted that link into my web browser address line and it went straight through without a problem.

    Bookmark   April 21, 2006 at 9:10AM
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jimc_vt

You can get a "Bur-cam pump" from H.D. or up in canada where they are made,I have one in my basement .....the stool just bolts to it and you can drain a sink and shower into it ,and it will pump it up,I have had mine nearly 2 years now with out any issues....H.D. price was app.$600.00
Good Luck Jim

    Bookmark   April 22, 2006 at 1:59PM
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Seamer1

do you have a toilet connected to this pump also? can you be a lil more specific as to the installation and how it looks after install? Thank you. BTW did you do the install yourself?

    Bookmark   April 24, 2006 at 3:53PM
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tomcat2k01

I'm also installing a basement 1/2 bath in Connecticut and got 2 estimates between $4000 and $4500 to install a sewage ejector system and plumbing for two sinks and toilet. I'm providing the fixtures. So Peiyi you are not too far off with the extra work and generally higher contractor prices in New England.

    Bookmark   April 26, 2006 at 5:32PM
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anthony_difuria_gmail_com

We are finishing our basement and the builder already put the basin, toilet and drain for sink into the ground. Our main is dirctly 3-4 feet above the basin and there is a power outlet attached to the wall for a force pump.

Can someone recommend as sewage force pump that is good quality and wont break the bank. I was looking online and found prices from $199 to $1000. That is a big difference, so any expert help would be appriciated.

Thanks,

    Bookmark   March 15, 2008 at 11:10AM
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acw2004

Since this was written many years ago, does anyone have an update on these kinds of systems? Are they any better? What about a sewage ejector system? Are they still essentially lousy?

Many thanks in advance!

ACW

    Bookmark   November 8, 2014 at 3:05AM
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dccurlygirl

Bumping for updates to this thread...

    Bookmark   January 10, 2015 at 6:22PM
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dwfarr

I installed a Saniflo Turboflush M300 a couple of years ago and it works great. It not only solved my need to install a toilet in the basement but it also handles the drains from a shower and a vanity sink allowing me to install an entire fully functional bathroom in my basement. I was able to use the through the wall option (requires the extension pipe)which put all the components out of sight. From the bathroom side of the wall it looks like a regular toilet. My tank/pump and piping are all behind the wall and in my furnace room for easy access. I bought mine locally but you can view the product details with great videos at saniflostore.com.

    Bookmark   February 20, 2015 at 7:21PM
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