Miele diamond floor sample 25% off... That or Bosch?

momto3kiddosJanuary 15, 2013

I have an opportunity to get a floor model that has been used a handful of times in a working kitchen at the showroom. It is a Miele futura diamond series and I love the automatic door opener to dry plastics. The list price is $2499 but I can get it for $1874... It is panelled so I would have to get it panelled to match.

I was planning to get a Bosch integra 800 with cutlery tray for $1302.

Is the Miele worth the extra cost?

Thanks in advance!

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weissman

See if you can get more than 25% off - in fact see if they'll match the Bosch price. Given that it was a "working" floor model, they should offer more than 25%. Do you get a full warranty with it?

    Bookmark   January 15, 2013 at 1:28PM
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nycbluedevil

I love my Miele Diamond. Best features are the 3D cutlery tray, auto open, auto close and the LED lights. It is really quiet too. There are zillions of cycles, but I only use a handful of them.

The 3D cutlery tray is a big improvement on the regular cutlery tray that I had with my last Miele. It lets you put in larger size utensils without fear of breaking off the top spray arm when something gets stuck (like DH did with the last one). Does the Bosch have the 3D or just a flat cutlery tray?

    Bookmark   January 15, 2013 at 2:34PM
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momto3kiddos

Thanks you guys! I was planning to ask for more than 25% off, but asking to match Bosch is a great idea. I am still getting the exact model number of the DW I looked at, but I think I can find a stainless steel door to go on it. I don't need it to be disguised by cabinetry and I am looking forward to using the handle for a hanging towel next to sink. My cabinet guy said a custom panel starts around $150 but depending on the specs of the washer. He has panelled some dishwashers that took 3 hrs to install. Anyone know how difficult it is to install the panel on the Miele?

    Bookmark   January 15, 2013 at 3:37PM
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janemv

The Bosch dw does not have fan assisted drying - which will make a big difference on how dry your items get. Also, the Diamond dw comes with 5 yr warranty, and has some great programs like sensor wash...I have a model a few years older than the Diamond and use the sensor wash and china crystal all the time.

    Bookmark   January 17, 2013 at 12:54PM
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stevegs1

Go with the Miele, we love ours. Bought it last May-was a floor model with stainless steel door- paid 1850 and included the 5 year warranty.
The handle had a couple of small nicks and the dealer agreed to order a new one.
We cook all of the time, everything comes out spotless. I like the tall tub cycle, it allows you to remove the center rack. I can easily fit large stockpots, oven racks, etc. with no issues.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 12:15AM
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nycbluedevil

Janemy

Not to hijack but when do you use the sensor wash?

    Bookmark   January 18, 2013 at 7:12AM
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lee676

> The 3D cutlery tray is a big improvement on the regular cutlery tray that I had with my last Miele. It lets you put in larger size utensils without fear of breaking off the top spray arm when something gets stuck (like DH did with the last one). Does the Bosch have the 3D or just a flat cutlery tray?/

The Bosch has an unadjustable top cutlery tray - lower in the center but not quite tall enough for most teacups. Higher-end Thermador dishwashers (made by Bosch and of similar design) do have articulating cutlery racks, with the far left and far right sections hinged to allow those sections to be lowered to allow taller items. It also has LED interior lighting not found in the Bosch, albeit blue rather than Miele's white. And the bottom rack can be adjusted to hold glasses and wine goblets, stacked two high on the back row, albeit not as elegantly as in the Miele. Perversely given the Thermador's higher price than the top-line Bosch, it isn't as quiet as the 800 series Bosch; more like the 500 series (or Miele), though those are still plenty quiet. Just not near-silent.

The high-end Miele racks as used in the Diamond may be the best designed dishwasher racks I've seen. The top rack has center section that's continuously adjustable for height a full inch or so downward. The left 2/5 or right 2/5 can be slid out of the way or removed entirely to accomodate tall items on the middle rack, which can hold many dinner plates on the right side, and double-decker cups and even taller glasses at the edges. The bottom rack is superb, most of it allowing for either full-height glasses (which again can be double-stacked on the left and right sides and several more rows towards the middle of the rack, or used for plates, or large pots and pans, and the "plateguard" design keeps items from crashing into each other better than the usual pegs found a dishwasher bottom racks. Note how the folding cup racks on the lower rack are continuously adjustable for height

    Bookmark   January 19, 2013 at 4:33AM
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akcorcoran

Also not to hijack but I have a question for those who will read this and have the Miele Diamond. I have an 8 and 10 yr old, and I'm worried about the "pop open to release steam" feature. While they are old enough for me to tell them to avoid it for safety, the fact is that a) they may just be in the vicinity b/c the kitchen is in a great room and they hang out in the kitchen, and b) they may think they can grab a cup or plate then.

Is the steam crazy hot? Could it hurt a child (remember they are closer to the door?)

I know it seems crazy but vs the KA that vents to the side and down, I was just worried about it.

    Bookmark   January 19, 2013 at 10:07AM
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fauguy

The higher end Miele units open at the end of the cycle to help with drying.

Sometimes when my 3 year old Miele Diamante Plus is done washing and drying, I'll open it up to let it "breath" and the first 30 seconds there is some hot air and steam that is released.

My guess it the ones that auto open would have a similar effect, even though they just open about 2".

    Bookmark   January 20, 2013 at 5:43AM
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lee676

I used to have an old Maytag dishwasher that partway during the dry cycle, after the heating element had been on for 10 minutes or so, would turn on a fan that blew hot steam out of a vent placed about 6" below the top of the dishwasher - right at a kid's eye level. Don't know if anyone still uses that design (GE?), and don't think it was quite hot enough to cause injury. With kids, I'd be more concerned about dishwasher that have piping-hot exposed heating elements on the bottom of the tub, easily reachable by a small child if you open the dishwasher when it's still run or has just finished and roll out the lower rack. No recent Bosch has an exposed heating element, and many (all?) Mieles don't either.

    Bookmark   January 21, 2013 at 12:11AM
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momto3kiddos

I have been offered the Miele for $1299 but will have to store it until installation (probably mid April) which won't be a problem for us. What else should I check before I agree? I am still checking to see the length of the warranty available.

Thanks so much for all of your help!

    Bookmark   January 24, 2013 at 6:01PM
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moebus

I don't see a discussion of noise issues here. We use a high level Miele in a vacation residence and it's fine in an enclosed kitchen. At home it would be a disaster because our open plan would have it sitting in the middle of the family room where we watch TV. We use a 38 db machine and wouldn't want any more noise.
May not be an issue for you.

    Bookmark   January 24, 2013 at 9:46PM
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akcorcoran

moebus, which model do you have? I thought the Miele was supposed to be a very quiet dishwasher? Thx!

    Bookmark   January 24, 2013 at 11:39PM
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moebus

akcorcoran - sorry but I don't know the Miele model off the top of my head and I'm about 3000 miles away from it at the moment. It was installed 2 years ago. The house machine is a Gaggenau DF 261 760/21 that is integrated. Basically a rebadged Bosch with upgraded insulation and a few different features. We just don't hear the thing unless we have an ear to it. It surprised us as it came as a freebie in a package.

    Bookmark   January 25, 2013 at 1:44PM
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moebus

akcorcoran - sorry but I don't know the Miele model off the top of my head and I'm about 3000 miles away from it at the moment. It was installed 2 years ago. The house machine is a Gaggenau DF 261 760/21 that is integrated. Basically a rebadged Bosch with upgraded insulation and a few different features. We just don't hear the thing unless we have an ear to it. It surprised us as it came as a freebie in a package.

    Bookmark   January 25, 2013 at 1:45PM
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weedmeister

When I open mine (a KA) at the end, the steam is more like a puff. It's hot, but not crazy hot. The kids will get used to it.

    Bookmark   January 25, 2013 at 2:23PM
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vitra

Don't worry about the auto open drying being a concern to kids. The heat that escapes the machine when it opens is very minimal. I believe the air is even cushioned somehow to prevent damage to the countertop.

The best (and most gorgeous) dishwasher I've ever owned - you will love it!

    Bookmark   January 30, 2013 at 6:33AM
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karenlee56

Hope you got the Miele. We just got the G5575 Futura Dimension off the floor including 3 handles...one that it came with and two from the company, which included the SS panel, too. They wanted $1230 but we negotiated down to $1099. There really wasn't a mark on it. I would gladly have purchased a Diamond for $1299.

    Bookmark   January 30, 2013 at 5:34PM
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fauguy

With all these floor models being sold, I wonder if there are new models coming out already, so the stores need to sell the floor models? This series is only about 2 years old, came out a year after I got the Diamante Plus. I remember saying I wish I waited and would have got the newer model, but of course we didn't know they were a year away.

    Bookmark   January 30, 2013 at 8:02PM
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momto3kiddos

Thanks for all your info, everyone! I have decided to go ahead and get it. The 5 yr warranty is good from date of purchase and I stopped by the showroom to run it to check the noise level,ease of use, etc... It is very quiet!

This particular showroom (a national chain, I think) has decided to drop the Miele from their lineup. It seemed to be due more to corporate conflicts than product standards or service.... But don't know exactly. This is why they are trying to get rid of their entire Line of Miele products. This showroom is putting Electrolux in its place.

I am not sure if I should share the name of the company... What do you think?

    Bookmark   January 30, 2013 at 10:48PM
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breezygirl

Please share the name.

Like Fauguy, I was also wondering if this was a model change year. I'm fed up with my crappy Kenmore and am trying to decide between a KA or a Miele, which wouldn't fit my American size DW hole. Bosch is out due to their blatant misuse of Julia Child's image and nasty behavior towards her foundation. I'd investigate Miele if I could get a good floor model deal, but sounds like this may not be a model change year after all.

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 2:23AM
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momto3kiddos

Ask at your local Ferguson. I am not sure if the entire chain is ditching Miele or if it is a showroom by showroom decision. Good luck!

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 11:11AM
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karenlee56

In the words of a PC R______ manager, "We don't sell too many Miele's." Therefore, they don't stock them, nor do they promote them. They had only one new one on display. I told about 6 people that I bought a Miele dishwasher and they all said they never heard of it. So it seems that many people do not go into chain places to buy higher-end appliances, or they just don't buy higher-end appliances in general. We may be in the minority. Even the manager with whom I negotiated said that he just couldn't see spending that much on a dishwasher! LOL. He said that the price-fixing doesn't help them, and that they make more profit on the domestic models- GE, Maytag and such. So I don't think it has much to do with changes in models. I think some customers order them and change their minds, some places use them as display for a while then change displays, and other places find that they sell too slowly and just aren't profitable enough to keep around.

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 4:22PM
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cj47_gw

I'm really surprised to hear that a higher end Miele is "loud"! I have a second-from-the-bottom of the line Inspira II, which I bought on clearance about 2.5 years ago, and it's very quiet. If the house is empty and silent, you can hear the water swishing if you listen. However, in the course of daily life--people talking, cooking happening, kids dashing through, you wouldn't hear it at all. There is a gurgle when it drains, but I suspect that if I put the stopper in the garbage disposal, you might not notice that, either. :-)

I'm not questioning whether the poster's Miele is loud, perhaps it is for some reason, but it does surprise me. Did you complain to Miele about it, and if so what did they say?

Cj

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 5:58PM
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akcorcoran

Not sure I have all the details but the Ferguson here in Baltimore is also selling off their Mieles and said they are no longer carrying them in the stores - supposedly because Miele is doing most all of their North American distribution via online sales.

I'm not quite sure that could be true in that our local Best Buy is one of the newly remodeled locations that now includes a Pacific Sales area in it for appliance purchase. They carry the ENTIRE line of Miele appliances and have them all on the floor to see - dishwashers to ovens, refrigerators (which are basically thermadors, even their full-size wine cooler. So much for being online!

I was about 3 hours too late to get the Diamond floor model (wait - do you live in Baltimore?!) and I would have bought it in a heartbeat!!!!

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 8:55PM
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akcorcoran

Miele lovers, I have a follow-up question for you - My hubby and I were discussing the merits of spending so much more on a dishwasher for a Miele (because I did miss that floor sample!) and I pointed out that people say that the longevity of a Miele is so much more of a factor. That often you'll have service charges or have to replace other brands while a Miele continues to work for years.

He pointedly asked how that could be because then they would be their own worst enemy and it wasn't a sustainable business model. Right, they wouldn't sell more b/c their original models worked for so long.

I sort of stumbled through an answer about how the US is really just becoming a market for them and that it was much more known in Europe so there was growing demand here, but it got me thinking.

Is it really the case that a Miele Diamond or $2K+ model is going to last that much longer? I said we'd probably go through two Kitchen Aids or the like in that time but is that the case?

I know it cleans well and that it has a unique design to fit lots of things but is it worth so much more money?

I'd love to hear your thoughts - thanks!

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 9:16PM
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momto3kiddos

Ha ha! I am in NC, but you may want to call other stores in your state. I was suprised by the number of stores in the chain. Do it fast... Before this tread goes viral. :)

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 9:29PM
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akcorcoran

Good point! (Are you from Charlotte, NC - I grew up there and my Mom is remodeling her kitchen there - I'm going to send her to their Ferguson to get a floor model if you're not!)

I'll start calling and report back! The Futura Dimension was only $800 here but that Diamond glittered next to it and she said, "It's already sold." Boo.

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 9:34PM
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momto3kiddos

No, just ourside of Raleigh. Good luck finding a floor model for yourself, too. I also was not interested in paying double for the Meile because I knew I would be very happy with the Bosch. My mom and SIL both have the Bosch I was planning. At this point, anything is better than the ~$200 builder grade dishwasher that we are living with in our current house. The only time we ever run it is after bedtime because it is SO loud!

With that said, I am so excited about the open and fan feature... Dry kids cups and lunch boxes. Woo hoo!

    Bookmark   January 31, 2013 at 9:44PM
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fauguy

akcorcoran,

Think of it this way...
US appliance company's try to get people to buy their product by having it at a low attractive price. Because of this, the quality is often sacrificed, also sometimes if the product is 'made in China', or even if it says it's made in the US, the parts could have been made overseas and the unit assembled here.

So say you spend $700 on w dishwasher (I did on a GE Profile in 2006). It had so many issues and repairs that a year later I had Lowes take it back. Replaced it with an Electrolux $1200. It also had several problems from the start, and 6 weeks later it went back. My friends Whirlpool dishwasher only lasted him 3 years before it stopped working, but since he got the extended warranty from the store, they replaced it.

So if a regular dishwasher is $700 and you have to replace it say every 5 years, then in 15 years (or even 10 years) you could have got a Miele from from start and not have to replace it. Since its made better, they charge more for it, and also since they know it will last for many years. If/when it does come time to replace it, they want you to be so pleased with the "older" model that you get a new Miele. So this business model does work.

I've had my Miele Diamante Plus for almost 3 years and have been quite happy with it. I'll be happy if I get at least 10 years of it. But if it lasts 15 years, who knows if I'd even still be living here. Even so, by then you'd want a newer model, even if there's no issues with the old one.

    Bookmark   February 1, 2013 at 4:54AM
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DCJersey

I just called every Ferguson from Baltimore to Northern Virginia. Seems like they have all been cleaned out for the most part. Those that have any Miele remaining only seem to have 1 class or crystal model remaining. If only I had heard about the sale sooner!

    Bookmark   February 1, 2013 at 1:37PM
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karenlee56

fauguy...Same thing I went through with my GE Profile dishwasher. I have the Miele BECAUSE of the GE Profile I bought in 2010. Two years or not, I think I will take your course of action and speak with a manager at HD where I bought it. I am more than entitled to compensation after having lived in dishwasher hell for 2 years. My Miele dishwasher rocks!!

    Bookmark   February 1, 2013 at 7:47PM
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ronaka

I don't think your dishes will come out any cleaner than they do from a 500 series Bosch for about $800.

    Bookmark   February 1, 2013 at 7:59PM
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fauguy

karenlee56,

When I purchased a GE Profile from Lowes in Nov 2006 it was about $700, also got a GE Washer and Dryer that was about $1500 for the pair. After two months I had to have GE send a tech out about the dishwasher. The racks would not close right (had to push them really hard), and there was a loud whistling sound when it would fill with water. They replaced the rollers on the rack and the water line and pump. A week later the whistle sound was back when filling with water, and then the rack rollers started to act up. So within a year the repair tech were here 6-7 times replacing the same parts. So since I had it all documented, I spoke to the manager at Lowes and they gave me an in store credit that I used for an Electrolux $1200. They had issues installing it, as the side springs on the doors kept rubbing the wood cabinets. So after Electrolux sent a repair guy out, and he said the springs were made too large, I again went back to Lowes and they ended up just refunding it back to my credit card. I was then 2 years looking and researching, and decided to go with a Miele Diamante Plus that was about $1500. After using the Miele for a couple months with their detergent tabs, they ended up changing the formula and it was making a lot of suds. So the Miele techs came out and looked at it, agreed it was the newer Miele tabs that was causing the suds, even though I was using half. I then tried the Finish Quantum tabs, but they were discoloring some plastic items. Then changed to Method Smarty tabs (half) and have been using them for two years now.

    Bookmark   February 2, 2013 at 12:23AM
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